2008 Voter Turnout

[BreckTxLonghorn]

I may end up regretting posting this, but I'm a numbers geek and I found this extremely interesting.

http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0781453.html


There was much talk leading up to the election how a record number of voter registration forms were being filled out & sent in, speculating how explosive voter turnout would be.

Turns out, everything was roughly the same. There were more voters in this election; however, there was also a larger pool of eligible voters. I find the percentages quite intriguing. It did go up, but at only 1.5% I'd say that's within the margin of error (if you don't agree, fair enough, I just got that from seeing many elections with a 3% margin of error). And the craziest thing; it still has not come close to ANYTHING from the 60s.

Just an observation overall. Hope others can find it interesting as well, and not try to turn it into fight against one side or the other.

[rockdale80]

Originally posted by BreckTxLonghorn
I may end up regretting posting this, but I'm a numbers geek and I found this extremely interesting.

http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0781453.html


There was much talk leading up to the election how a record number of voter registration forms were being filled out & sent in, speculating how explosive voter turnout would be.

Turns out, everything was roughly the same. There were more voters in this election; however, there was also a larger pool of eligible voters. I find the percentages quite intriguing. It did go up, but at only 1.5% I'd say that's within the margin of error (if you don't agree, fair enough, I just got that from seeing many elections with a 3% margin of error). And the craziest thing; it still has not come close to ANYTHING from the 60s.

Just an observation overall. Hope others can find it interesting as well, and not try to turn it into fight against one side or the other.

There were 11 million new voters. I only said there was a record number of people that voted in this election. I wish we had 100% participation. :( The process is as important as the results...to me anyway.

[BuffyMars]

regretfully, i voted.

next election i will not be bullied by the 2 parties.

i will vote independent if i have to.

[TexMike]

What this shows is that a bunch of folks did NOT vote and my guess is it is the folks who felt they had nothing to gain by either candidate and were blind to what they had to lose (and are now actually in danger of losing). That is good news for those who think things need to be turned around as it shows the potential support is there. All they have to do is figure out how to get it to come out.

[Txbroadcaster]

I have ALWAYS hated the

If you dont vote you dont have a voice

That is not true..if I decide at the end of the day I dont care for any of the candidates, then I will NOT vote. I am not going to vote just to say woohoo I voted

I also wont vote for one side just so the other side does not get my vote

I would rather a low percentage actually vote as long as they are voting what they truly believe over a higher percenatge voting, just to vote

[STANG RED]

Originally posted by TexMike
What this shows is that a bunch of folks did NOT vote and my guess is it is the folks who felt they had nothing to gain by either candidate and were blind to what they had to lose (and are now actually in danger of losing). That is good news for those who think things need to be turned around as it shows the potential support is there. All they have to do is figure out how to get it to come out.

Personally I think way too many people vote. Many dont have a clue about the real issues, and are only voting for votings sake, or because they like the way a candidate looks or sounds. I DONT want those people voting at all myself.

[BreckTxLonghorn]

Originally posted by STANG RED
Personally I think way too many people vote. Many dont have a clue about the real issues, and are only voting for votings sake, or because they like the way a candidate looks or sounds. I DONT want those people voting at all myself.

Very interesting point. In our country, the eligibility to vote is a very loose concept. In your opinion, if you wanted to raise voter education (which short term would lower numbers but hopefully long term increase educated voting), what bi-partisan requisites do you think would need to be placed on voting eligibility?

Obviously, this cannot happen because as a country we have a right to vote, but still, let's play on that thought.

[Farmersfan]

Originally posted by BreckTxLonghorn
Very interesting point. In our country, the eligibility to vote is a very loose concept. In your opinion, if you wanted to raise voter education (which short term would lower numbers but hopefully long term increase educated voting), what bi-partisan requisites do you think would need to be placed on voting eligibility?

Obviously, this cannot happen because as a country we have a right to vote, but still, let's play on that thought.



The first step would have to be to institute a accountability clause in politics. Even those people who would be deemed as "knowing what they were voting for" actually didn't know becuase the canidates simply tell us what they think we want to hear. They then proceed to do what the hell they want even if it conflicts what they said they would do in the first place. So with the existing system it doesn't really matter because none of the people "REALLY" know anyway. They simply vote for the one they feel will lie the least.............

[crzyjournalist03]

Originally posted by Txbroadcaster
I have ALWAYS hated the

If you dont vote you dont have a voice

That is not true..if I decide at the end of the day I dont care for any of the candidates, then I will NOT vote. I am not going to vote just to say woohoo I voted

I also wont vote for one side just so the other side does not get my vote

I would rather a low percentage actually vote as long as they are voting what they truly believe over a higher percenatge voting, just to vote

If you do not like candidates on the ballot, you're more than welcome to write in a vote for someone that you do like.

[Farmersfan]

If we were to put in a truthfullness law in campaigning and politics overall it would solve a lot of the problems. I watched our elected President flat out lie on National TV last night in the form of a very, very obvious stretch of the facts and everyone is afraid to question him on it.

[BreckTxLonghorn]

Originally posted by Farmersfan
If we were to put in a truthfullness law in campaigning and politics overall it would solve a lot of the problems. I watched our elected President flat out lie on National TV last night in the form of a very, very obvious stretch of the facts and everyone is afraid to question him on it.


Don't turn this into political grandstanding. The question was what you do to voters to raise their education before they voted. Politician accountability may or may not help; many voters will vote on hearsay. Many will vote because their family has always been 'republican' or 'democrat'. Some will vote simply because it's the trend, and some will vote for the incumbent just because. How do you ensure the voter is making an educated vote?

[ronwx5x]

All your questions beg the question, why should there be a "test" in order to vote?

Who will decide what the test is and who will decide who gets to vote? Think that wouldn't be biased? (Notice all the question marks). Voting is a right guaranteed to every citizen, educated or not. As much money as is spent on electioneering, and with all the media and exposes, those who do not educate themselves will not become educated, no matter how much information is available.

We have a system, with all its inherent flaws, that is transparent, fair, and the envy of many. Why change it?

[BreckTxLonghorn]

Originally posted by ronwx5x
All your questions beg the question, why should there be a "test" in order to vote?

Who will decide what the test is and who will decide who gets to vote? Think that wouldn't be biased? (Notice all the question marks). Voting is a right guaranteed to every citizen, educated or not. As much money as is spent on electioneering, and with all the media and exposes, those who do not educate themselves will not become educated, no matter how much information is available.

We have a system, with all its inherent flaws, that is transparent, fair, and the envy of many. Why change it?

Totally agree with you on that. It's one of the rights our country was founded on.

I'm just playing Devil's Advocate in a way without trying to lean to one side or another. There was a comment saying that too many are voting. That's fair if that's your opinion, but then what is the best way to correct this? Enforce a higher standard to lower the number of voters? Find a process to educate voters more? Etc Etc.

No right, wrong, favorable opinion, unfavorable opinion, etc. Just used to trigger deeper thought without asking people to take sides, hence me being insistent on trying to make it bipartisan.

[TexasHSFB]

I'd vote for the candidate that sucks less, because no candidate is ever going to please the masses.

Unless we're coming off a Jimmy Carter type era. :doh:

[STANG RED]

Originally posted by BreckTxLonghorn
Very interesting point. In our country, the eligibility to vote is a very loose concept. In your opinion, if you wanted to raise voter education (which short term would lower numbers but hopefully long term increase educated voting), what bi-partisan requisites do you think would need to be placed on voting eligibility?

Obviously, this cannot happen because as a country we have a right to vote, but still, let's play on that thought.

I think you read more into my post than was there. I'm not advocating a test. I just simply think many voters have no idea about who or what their voting on. I had rather those people not vote at all. Simple as that. Just a statement of how I feel. I agree that any type of test would be slanted towards the biases of whomever draws it up.
Isnt it interesting though, we are all born with the same rights in this country, but can have many of them taken away for various reason. Doesnt a fellon lose his right to vote? Not that I disagree with it, but how does commiting a felony impair your voting judgement? Felonies come in all degrees of severity, but if I'm not mistaken, all fellons lose the right to vote, no matter the offense. But I know many non fellons whos judgement may not be a bit better.

[Farmersfan]

Originally posted by BreckTxLonghorn
Don't turn this into political grandstanding. The question was what you do to voters to raise their education before they voted. Politician accountability may or may not help; many voters will vote on hearsay. Many will vote because their family has always been 'republican' or 'democrat'. Some will vote simply because it's the trend, and some will vote for the incumbent just because. How do you ensure the voter is making an educated vote?



This was a serious post in answer to your question. I made the point that you CANNOT raise the education level of voters before they are allowed to vote if the canidates (both parties) don't get held accountable for their campaign promises. The statement was made that most people really don't know what they are voting for. I said even those who believe they know really don't because they have been led to believe the lies of the canidates. So in short it really doesn't matter because uninformed voters are voting for a canidate without knowing the issues and informed voters are voting for a canidate believing falsely. I don't see a real difference. Am I too critical of the system?

[LionKing]

Originally posted by TexasHSFB
I'd vote for the candidate that sucks less, because no candidate is ever going to please the masses.

Unless we're coming off a Jimmy Carter type era. :doh: Very true, I knew before this last election that which ever canidate won, they were gonna get hammered for everything they plan or try to do.

[PPHSfan]

I think we should scrap the whole process, and appoint me King.

[waterboy]

There's a lot of disillusionment by voters nowadays. It is frustrating when you keep hearing all these promises from the candidates while on the election trail, then get let down again and again because they can't, or won't, follow through with their promises. I've voted in enough elections to realize that politicians always make promises they either can't, or have no intention of keeping. So, the only thing to do is vote your conscience, aligning yourself with the candidate that holds some of the same values as you do.

[JasperDog94]

I know I'll get blasted for saying this, but here goes:

I think in order to vote you must pay taxes. If you don't pay into the system, then you don't get a say in what happens in the system. The minute 51% of the population doesn't pay taxes, they can just elect representatives that will take from the other 49% and give them the money....oh wait....never mind.:doh: :doh: :doh:

[JasperDog94]

Originally posted by Farmersfan
The first step would have to be to institute a accountability clause in politics. That clause, just like the laws protecting our borders, will just be ignored too.

[Farmersfan]

Originally posted by JasperDog94
I know I'll get blasted for saying this, but here goes:

I think in order to vote you must pay taxes. If you don't pay into the system, then you don't get a say in what happens in the system. The minute 51% of the population doesn't pay taxes, they can just elect representatives that will take from the other 49% and give them the money....oh wait....never mind.:doh: :doh: :doh:




You have my vote for smartest person on the planet!!!!!!

[BwdLions]

Originally posted by JasperDog94
I know I'll get blasted for saying this, but here goes:

I think in order to vote you must pay taxes. If you don't pay into the system, then you don't get a say in what happens in the system. The minute 51% of the population doesn't pay taxes, they can just elect representatives that will take from the other 49% and give them the money....oh wait....never mind.:doh: :doh: :doh:

You're definitely on to something here. It'll never happen in this country, but it should.

[Phantom Stang]

Originally posted by BreckTxLonghorn
And the craziest thing; it still has not come close to ANYTHING from the 60s.

The drop off in voter turnout seems to coincide with the ratification of the 26th Amendment, which lowered the legal voting age from 21 to 18.

[BreckTxLonghorn]

Originally posted by Phantom Stang
The drop off in voter turnout seems to coincide with the ratification of the 26th Amendment, which lowered the legal voting age from 21 to 18.

Really good point. Never thought about that - maybe because it was before my time?:p

[rockdale80]

Originally posted by STANG RED
I think you read more into my post than was there. I'm not advocating a test. I just simply think many voters have no idea about who or what their voting on. I had rather those people not vote at all. Simple as that. Just a statement of how I feel. I agree that any type of test would be slanted towards the biases of whomever draws it up.
Isnt it interesting though, we are all born with the same rights in this country, but can have many of them taken away for various reason. Doesnt a fellon lose his right to vote? Not that I disagree with it, but how does commiting a felony impair your voting judgement? Felonies come in all degrees of severity, but if I'm not mistaken, all fellons lose the right to vote, no matter the offense. But I know many non fellons whos judgement may not be a bit better.

Some of the very people that are saying the uneducated vote should not count are so biased and ignorant that they have no idea how each candidate's actual stance on points affects them and their family. Not saying you in particular, but you know I am right. Too many people on both sides get partisan news and not the unslanted version. Sad, but true.

[STANG RED]

Originally posted by rockdale80
Some of the very people that are saying the uneducated vote should not count are so biased and ignorant that they have no idea how each candidate's actual stance on points affects them and their family. Not saying you in particular, but you know I am right. Too many people on both sides get partisan news and not the unslanted version. Sad, but true.

Damn I hate to admit when your right, but yes I agree with your statement.:(

But here is one I think you'll have to agree with, even though you may not want to.
Many voters that voted for Obama only voted for him for one reason, and the issues didnt mean squat to them. Your a smart guy, so I know you know what I'm talking about.;)

[BuffyMars]

2012 i am voting for myself.

[waterboy]

Originally posted by BuffyMars
2012 i am voting for myself.
I'd vote for you, Buffy. Only thing is that age requirement of 35. You want me to hide your birth certificate?:D

[BreckTxLonghorn]

Originally posted by STANG RED
Damn I hate to admit when your right, but yes I agree with your statement.:(

But here is one I think you'll have to agree with, even though you may not want to.
Many voters that voted for Obama only voted for him for one reason, and the issues didnt mean squat to them. Your a smart guy, so I know you know what I'm talking about.;)

Sadly, I think you could say the same about many McCain voters as well:(

[slingshot]

Originally posted by JasperDog94
I know I'll get blasted for saying this, but here goes:

I think in order to vote you must pay taxes. If you don't pay into the system, then you don't get a say in what happens in the system. The minute 51% of the population doesn't pay taxes, they can just elect representatives that will take from the other 49% and give them the money....oh wait....never mind.:doh: :doh: :doh: Hmmm....:thinking:

[Farmersfan]

From Gary G. Kreep:


"According to published reports, Barack Obama's legal team has been paid over one million dollars, so far, to STOP anyone from seeing ANY of his actual identification documents, or many other documents:
Actual long-form birth certificate (NOT an easily-forged electronic copy of a short-form document that is not even officially accepted in Hawaii)
Passport files
University of Chicago Law School scholarly articles
Harvard Law Review articles
Harvard Law School records
Columbia University records
Columbia University senior thesis, "Soviet Nuclear Disarmament"
Occidental College records, including financial aid that he may have received
Punahou School records, where Mr. Obama attended from the fifth grade until he finished high school
Noelani Elementary School records, where Barack Obama attended kindergarten (according to the Hawaii Department of Education, students must submit a birth certificate to register -- but parents may bring a passport or student visa if the child is from a foreign country)
Complete files and schedules of his years as an Illinois state senator from 1997 to 2004
Obama's client list from during his time in private practice with the Chicago law firm of Davis, Miner, Barnhill and Gallard
Illinois State Bar Association records
Baptism records
Obama/Dunham marriage license
Obama/Dunham divorce documents
Soetoro/Dunham marriage license
Soetero/Dunham Adoption records
By the way, the issue of the Occidental College records is especially pertinent. The United States Justice Foundation (USJF) served officials at Occidental College with a subpoena to produce records concerning Barack Obama's attendance there during the 1980's, because those records could document whether he was attending as a foreign national. You see, Mr. Obama attended the school on a scholarship -- and there are questions as to whether the financial aid he received was reserved for foreign students. The Obama attorneys have bent over backward to block us. He doesn't want anyone to see those records. He's STILL trying to hide them; those financial records STILL have not been released.

WHAT is Barack Obama trying to hide? WHAT is he afraid of? WHY doesn't he just release these documents to prove that he is a natural-born citizen and, therefore, qualified to serve as President -- especially his actual birth certificate? "

Any thoughts?

[rancher]

I guess you also believe in Black Helicopters and aliens from another planet about to take over. I also forgot about the moon landing conspiracy.

[mwynn05]

Originally posted by Farmersfan
From Gary G. Kreep:


"According to published reports, Barack Obama's legal team has been paid over one million dollars, so far, to STOP anyone from seeing ANY of his actual identification documents, or many other documents:
Actual long-form birth certificate (NOT an easily-forged electronic copy of a short-form document that is not even officially accepted in Hawaii)
Passport files
University of Chicago Law School scholarly articles
Harvard Law Review articles
Harvard Law School records
Columbia University records
Columbia University senior thesis, "Soviet Nuclear Disarmament"
Occidental College records, including financial aid that he may have received
Punahou School records, where Mr. Obama attended from the fifth grade until he finished high school
Noelani Elementary School records, where Barack Obama attended kindergarten (according to the Hawaii Department of Education, students must submit a birth certificate to register -- but parents may bring a passport or student visa if the child is from a foreign country)
Complete files and schedules of his years as an Illinois state senator from 1997 to 2004
Obama's client list from during his time in private practice with the Chicago law firm of Davis, Miner, Barnhill and Gallard
Illinois State Bar Association records
Baptism records
Obama/Dunham marriage license
Obama/Dunham divorce documents
Soetoro/Dunham marriage license
Soetero/Dunham Adoption records
By the way, the issue of the Occidental College records is especially pertinent. The United States Justice Foundation (USJF) served officials at Occidental College with a subpoena to produce records concerning Barack Obama's attendance there during the 1980's, because those records could document whether he was attending as a foreign national. You see, Mr. Obama attended the school on a scholarship -- and there are questions as to whether the financial aid he received was reserved for foreign students. The Obama attorneys have bent over backward to block us. He doesn't want anyone to see those records. He's STILL trying to hide them; those financial records STILL have not been released.

WHAT is Barack Obama trying to hide? WHAT is he afraid of? WHY doesn't he just release these documents to prove that he is a natural-born citizen and, therefore, qualified to serve as President -- especially his actual birth certificate? "

Any thoughts? this is a kindergarten concept....YOU LOST!!!!! grow up be man take it....im quite sure the government checked this out well before the election

[Emerson1]

I would rather people not vote, then vote for a candidate based on skin color which is what happened in this last election.

youtube "howard stern harlem"

[rancher]

Topic Review (Newest First)


Emerson1 I would rather people not vote, then vote for a candidate based on skin color which is what happened in this last election.


In the America I know, you can vote on who you want no matter what there color of skin or belief. What does color of skin have to do with it? Most of the whites voted for the loser. Is this intented to be a racist comment?

[Emerson1]

Originally posted by rancher
s this intented to be a racist comment?
Nope just a general statement.

What are you trying to imply?

[TexMike]

Originally posted by rancher
Topic Review (Newest First)


Emerson1 I would rather people not vote, then vote for a candidate based on skin color which is what happened in this last election.


In the America I know, you can vote on who you want no matter what there color of skin or belief. What does color of skin have to do with it? Most of the whites voted for the loser. Is this intented to be a racist comment?

Obama would NOT have been elected without white voters. But the interesting question is how many of those white voters voted for him precisely because he IS black. And that one is one that many folks prefer not to confront. As many of those white voters (and those of other colors as well) are learning, this one ain't much different than those who preceded him. What you got is not what you voted for.

[OldBison75]

I think the key to accountability on the politician side would require a change in the funding system. Make it where each candidate has a set amount of funding before the national convention. Have all donations and campaign contributions be made to a party and divided evenly to all candidates in that party. Each candidate will decide how to spend that money, but when it is gone, they have no more advertising and everyone is on even ground with commercials, ads, and such. There is also no accountability to special interests beyond thier party. All political contributions will be capped at a reasonable amount for individuals and corporations or special interest groups. No group can donate more than another. If the contributions to a party are in excess of the cap level for the election year period, those funds will then be applied to any party representatives in other races at the national level, which will also have limits and like rules. Any extra contributions will be placed in a special fund that will be turned over to a special fund that can only be tapped for the purposes of providing relief assistance in a major disater emergency, like hurricanes, floods, etc.

After the national convention, when a party candidate is selected, there is an additional amount of funding to carry the campaign to the elections in November. This funding is again funnelled through the political party and is equal for each candidate, whether Democrat, Republican, or whatever. To insure that candidates are serious candidates, they must be elected at a convention and have been on the ballot in at least 75 % of the state primaries.

All candidates will participate in at least three head to head debates that are nationally televised and broadcast on radio.

The final winner is totally funded through the party and because each contribution is funnelled by that method, the individual candidate is not beholden to a particular special interest.

As for educating the voters, it will never happen because the media would have to be totally unbiased and give complete equal time to each party and not endorse or criticise any position and that will never happen. Since the inception of television, the media has become more apt to take on the political leanings of its parent company and therefore slant its reporting to favor those parties that agree with them. Because of the freedom of press, that I totally agree with, there will never be truly free and equal reporting of political issues.

[rockdale80]

I wonder how many people didnt vote on race, but voted against the "path" the country was going down...

[Farmersfan]

Originally posted by mwynn05
this is a kindergarten concept....YOU LOST!!!!! grow up be man take it....im quite sure the government checked this out well before the election




Your probably right! After all the Government has been right on top things so far.....................;)

[Farmersfan]

Originally posted by rancher
I guess you also believe in Black Helicopters and aliens from another planet about to take over. I also forgot about the moon landing conspiracy.




So are you saying these records are available?????? If these records were not being purposely withheld then wouldn't we have the information? Perhaps you need to wake up! Just a suggestion. Of course sleep walking is why the man got the presidency in the first place. Carry on!

[rockdale80]

Originally posted by Farmersfan
So are you saying these records are available?????? If these records were not being purposely withheld then wouldn't we have the information? Perhaps you need to wake up! Just a suggestion. Of course sleep walking is why the man got the presidency in the first place. Carry on!

Some info (http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/citizen.asp)


More info (http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/birthcertificate.asp)

[Farmersfan]

Originally posted by rockdale80
Some info (http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/citizen.asp)


More info (http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/birthcertificate.asp)





Center of page about 1/4 way up from botton shows a date stamp showing through from the other side. June 6, 2007.
Wonder what thats all about?


http://i305.photobucket.com/albums/nn227/Polarik/BO_Birth_Certificate.jpg

[rockdale80]

Originally posted by Farmersfan
Center of page about 1/4 way up from botton shows a date stamp showing through from the other side. June 6, 2007.
Wonder what thats all about?


http://i305.photobucket.com/albums/nn227/Polarik/BO_Birth_Certificate.jpg

Maybe his is a fake?:rolleyes:

I dont know what it is all about, then again I dont really care. All the evidence points to him being a citizen. Newspaper announcements, certificate of live birth, etc... I would like to think that our intelligence gathering departments would be thorough, but maybe it is just more conspiracy.