Yao Out

[SHSBulldog00]

Yao Ming is out until next year at the earliest. Reports are McGrady may not be able to play next year (contract years for both players). Houston We Have a Problem. Actually Several. What do you guys think will happen next?

[PPHSfan]

Jerry Jones will buy the team and pay Shaq and Kobe a gazillion dollars to come to Houston.

[carter08]

Andersen should be a capable center. I like Ariza. Scola/Landry combo at PF is pretty good, big season from Brooks and Battier. Team could be a playoff team, 8 seed or so. Hopefully McGrady comes back late in the season.

[SHSBulldog00]

I would like to see Joey Dorsey get some PT. He should help the rockets on the boards and he is a capable scorer.

[buffalo2006]

I think Joey and Chase Biddinger earn their PT during the summer league. Buddinger was a steal, since after his freshman year they said he would be a lottery pick. I want to see James White be in the top 10 rotation next year also.

Brooks/Lowry
Battier/White
Ariza/Taylor
Scola/Landry
Anderson/Dorsey

and McGrady around the all-star break(while he's playing for a contract)

I think as high as 5 and as low as #1 pick in the draft(hopefully not though)

[venomous tat2]

I have never seen a team have more bad luck than the rockets , it's like they have a curse on them . I really think it started when they did not let Hakeem finish career with the team I know it sounds crazy but name another team with this kind of bad luck .:thinking:

[rancher]

Who cares, the NBA is nothing but the THUG BALL LEAGUE. Just look at how they influence the high school and college game these days. SEVERAL ARTICLES ARE OUT HOW 60% OF THE THUG BALL LEAGUE PLAYERS GO BROKE AFTER 5 YEARS. Speaks well for these role models.

[Electus Unus]

I heard the wheel was invented the other day

[Electus Unus]

Originally posted by rancher
Who cares, the NBA is nothing but the THUG BALL LEAGUE. Just look at how they influence the high school and college game these days. SEVERAL ARTICLES ARE OUT HOW 60% OF THE THUG BALL LEAGUE PLAYERS GO BROKE AFTER 5 YEARS. Speaks well for these role models. Where are these articles? It better be littered with factual statistics and not just some blog crap.

[rancher]

Here are two, you might try GOOGLE and find about 90,000 hits.

http://www.thestar.com/Sports/article/299119
http://www.lebasketbawl.com/60-of-nba-players-broke-after-5-years/

[carter08]

that number doesn't surprise me.

come on, in football players need at least 3 years of college to get them ready for the physicality of the NFL. they learn a lot in that time, and it's much easier to get your degree.

in baseball, the minor league system takes awhile to get through, so players have to learn to live without extravagant paychecks.

the NBA is about being young and talented. players declare right after their freshman years, picking money over school because they know a large amount of money is available. it's the sport where players can make the most money early, of course you're going to see the more selfish athletes playing it.

[rancher]

What is even more of a suprise, by the time they have been retired for two years, 78% of former NFL players have gone bankrupt or are under financial stress because of joblessness or divorce.

http://vault.sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1153364/index.htm

[icu812]

Have a cousin who signed a multi million $ baseball contract. Big time pro pitcher back in the mid 70's and he lost it all just a few yrs. after retiring. The guy has a business degree but could keep away from all the investments people offered him. He was also livin large and that didn't help. He's doing fine now as he gets paid to fish and hunt on tv :mad: IMHO it takes a mature person to be able to handle everything todays professional athletes have to deal with. But I don't feel sorry for them.


On topic - I think the Rockets will be fine without Yao. I thought they played almost as good without him. I think they played better without McGrady.

[TexasHSFB]

The Rockets won't be in the playoffs. They just don't have the offensive talent at the C without Yao.


The worst part is they still have to pay McGrady and Yao so they can't sign any more FA's.

[JasperDog94]

Originally posted by TexasHSFB
The Rockets won't be in the playoffs. They just don't have the offensive talent at the C without Yao.


The worst part is they still have to pay McGrady and Yao so they can't sign any more FA's. Due to the injuries they got their mid level exception reinstated by the league.

[icu812]

Even though Orlando matched the Mavs contract for Gortat I wouldn't be surprised so see Houston try to trade for Gortat.

[Bull's-eye]

Originally posted by TexasHSFB
The Rockets won't be in the playoffs. They just don't have the offensive talent at the C without Yao.


The worst part is they still have to pay McGrady and Yao so they can't sign any more FA's.

Only team to take the champions to 7 games and they were without T-Mac & Yao (missed 4 games). This will be a fun team to watch, lots of hustle guys without the big name players. Hopefully, Andersen will be a good fit for Aldeman's offense. It's funny how some posters don't think of Yao as a top center, but then write off the Rockets when he's hurt. Morey is not done tinkering with the roster, they will surprise a few people.

Got the mid level for Yao's injury and both contracts are insured. T-Mac's expiring contract will be attractive to teams having money problems. McGrady is in a contract year, lots of money at stake if he can't recover & be an all-star type player. IMO, the Rockets are hoping he can be the T-Mac of old and will come back to help their team.

[Bull's-eye]

Originally posted by icu812
Even though Orlando matched the Mavs contract for Gortat I wouldn't be surprised so see Houston try to trade for Gortat.

Rules don't allow a trade until mid December, I think the Rockets will go another direction. Morey didn't value Gortat as a player making the full mid level type money, so his bid was much less than what the Magic signed him for. Wouldn't make much sense to trade for him & pay him that extra money.

[TexasHSFB]

Originally posted by Bull's-eye
Only team to take the champions to 7 games and they were without T-Mac & Yao (missed 4 games). This will be a fun team to watch, lots of hustle guys without the big name players. Hopefully, Andersen will be a good fit for Aldeman's offense. It's funny how some posters don't think of Yao as a top center, but then write off the Rockets when he's hurt. Morey is not done tinkering with the roster, they will surprise a few people.

Got the mid level for Yao's injury and both contracts are insured. T-Mac's expiring contract will be attractive to teams having money problems. McGrady is in a contract year, lots of money at stake if he can't recover & be an all-star type player. IMO, the Rockets are hoping he can be the T-Mac of old and will come back to help their team. The Rockets won how many of those games with Yao though? 2 or 3? I'm not sure. The one blowout in Houston was because the Lakers got caught with their pants down after the injury.


The Rockets are just not the same without Yao. They were able to get past T-Mac, but Yao.... not so much.


They have some good pieces, but they're without the man that makes it all go.

I'll just cross my fingers and wait until the contracts go out, or hope they can dump McGrady.

[icu812]

Originally posted by Bull's-eye
Rules don't allow a trade until mid December, I think the Rockets will go another direction. Morey didn't value Gortat as a player making the full mid level type money, so his bid was much less than what the Magic signed him for. Wouldn't make much sense to trade for him & pay him that extra money.

I think he's underestimating Gortat. He's better than the available FA's at the C posisition. I hope the Mavs/Orl. rescind the offers and work a trade (which I believe can be done between these two teams before Dec.). He'd be a good fit in Houston though.

[JasperDog94]

Originally posted by TexasHSFB
The Rockets won how many of those games with Yao though? 2 or 3? I'm not sure. The one blowout in Houston was because the Lakers got caught with their pants down after the injury.

I think it was more a case of the Rockets playing out of their minds for game 4. Either way they won't be able to play at that level all year. We'll see what happens.

[Bull's-eye]

Originally posted by TexasHSFB
The Rockets won how many of those games with Yao though? 2 or 3? I'm not sure. The one blowout in Houston was because the Lakers got caught with their pants down after the injury.


The Rockets are just not the same without Yao. They were able to get past T-Mac, but Yao.... not so much.


They have some good pieces, but they're without the man that makes it all go.

I'll just cross my fingers and wait until the contracts go out, or hope they can dump McGrady.

Only won 1 game with Yao and game 6 they won by the largest margin. Remember they lost Mutombo, so the Rockets didn't have any size to defend the Laker bigs. Houston was even forced to give Brian Cook minutes at center.

Yao can be an awesome weapon on offense, but he does have his flaws. Portland fronted Yao and basically took him out of that series. Yao doesn't jump very well & his lack of mobility can lead to a high number of turnovers. It is almost impossible to lob him a pass or bounce him the ball. He can't handle quick passes in traffic, especially going to the basket. Don't get me wrong, when he gets the ball in the low post, he is extremely hard to stop. Great touch for a big man and money at the free throw line. Good rebounder, but should be better for someone 7-6.

Rockets do have some good team players that really hustlle. Being a huge fan, I probably have higher expectations than most people. I do think they will surprise a lot of folks, especially if Andersen can be a decent player at center. Players like Dorsey & Budinger could help this season based on their showings at the Summer League. I also believe the Rockets aren't finished trading, Morey has done a fantastic job acquiring talent without a lot of assets.

T-Mac's contract will be beneficial in a trade or allow the Rockets the cap space to sign a top player in 2010.

[Bull's-eye]

Originally posted by icu812
I think he's underestimating Gortat. He's better than the available FA's at the C posisition. I hope the Mavs/Orl. rescind the offers and work a trade (which I believe can be done between these two teams before Dec.). He'd be a good fit in Houston though.

Gortat is a good player, but the Rockets weren't about to pay over 5 million per year on a future backup center. With Andersen, they get him for less than half the money and he has the ability to play along side Yao in the 2010 season. Gortat would start this season, but most likely become strictly a backup for Yao. Also factor that the Rockets were able to sign Ariza, a player that they felt was worth the full MLE.

[SHSBulldog00]

If the Rocket's let McGrady's contract run out or trade him. Maybe they could attempt to lure LeBron out of Cleveland.

[Bull's-eye]

Originally posted by SHSBulldog00
If the Rocket's let McGrady's contract run out or trade him. Maybe they could attempt to lure LeBron out of Cleveland.

Probably don't have that kind of money, but heard Bosh or Wade could be on their wish list.

[carter08]

Originally posted by Bull's-eye
Probably don't have that kind of money, but heard Bosh or Wade could be on their wish list.

with yao possibly out long term, i'd rather have bosh. plus, he'd be cheaper than wade (possibly), which would be a plus too.

[Txbroadcaster]

Originally posted by carter08
with yao possibly out long term, i'd rather have bosh. plus, he'd be cheaper than wade (possibly), which would be a plus too.


alot of scouts think Bosh as good as he is has already topped out his talent level..the numbers back that up

he has basically averaged 22 points a game for the last 4 years in a row

If that is true you at least know your getting a 22 pts 10 boards a game guy nothing wrong with that, but I think for the contract he would sign people might expect more

Also Bosh has talked about how much his loves the CITY of Toronto

[TexasHSFB]

Originally posted by carter08
with yao possibly out long term, i'd rather have bosh. plus, he'd be cheaper than wade (possibly), which would be a plus too. I would love to get D-Wade. I think he's a better 2 guard than McGrady anyway.


Brooks/Lowry
Wade/White
Ariza/Battier
Scola/Landry
Andersen/Yao?


That's what we could end up with??? That would be nice.

[carter08]

Originally posted by TexasHSFB
I would love to get D-Wade. I think he's a better 2 guard than McGrady anyway.


Brooks/Lowry
Wade/White
Ariza/Battier
Scola/Landry
Andersen/Yao?


That's what we could end up with??? That would be nice.

of course, it won't look quite like that. i don't expect scola to be back. he's a restricted free agent, but factoring in age, he won't be back with the rocks after this season.

[TexasHSFB]

Originally posted by carter08
of course, it won't look quite like that. i don't expect scola to be back. he's a restricted free agent, but factoring in age, he won't be back with the rocks after this season. Why? H's only like 27 right? No biggie.

[carter08]

Originally posted by TexasHSFB
Why? H's only like 27 right? No biggie.

29.

i think he's going to want a larger contract since he's entering his prime years. if he was a few years younger, he would probably be cheap enough to retain.

[Farmersfan]

Originally posted by Bull's-eye
Only team to take the champions to 7 games and they were without T-Mac & Yao (missed 4 games). This will be a fun team to watch, lots of hustle guys without the big name players. Hopefully, Andersen will be a good fit for Aldeman's offense. It's funny how some posters don't think of Yao as a top center, but then write off the Rockets when he's hurt. Morey is not done tinkering with the roster, they will surprise a few people.

Got the mid level for Yao's injury and both contracts are insured. T-Mac's expiring contract will be attractive to teams having money problems. McGrady is in a contract year, lots of money at stake if he can't recover & be an all-star type player. IMO, the Rockets are hoping he can be the T-Mac of old and will come back to help their team.





Did the Rockets truely "TAKE" the Lakers to 7 games or did the Lakers simply sleep walk through that series? We all watched it and the lakers played about as poorly as a team can play and still win. Don't be fooled into thinking the Rockets can compete without Yao or McGrady. Not having Artest is the last straw. I think the Rockets go to the bottom on the list in the West next season......

[JasperDog94]

Originally posted by Farmersfan
Did the Rockets truely "TAKE" the Lakers to 7 games or did the Lakers simply sleep walk through that series? We all watched it and the lakers played about as poorly as a team can play and still win. Don't be fooled into thinking the Rockets can compete without Yao or McGrady. Not having Artest is the last straw. I think the Rockets go to the bottom on the list in the West next season...... Well considering many commentators said the Lakers slept through the first round and it only went 5 games, and the fact that Phil Jackson said the Rockets played a great series, then yeah...the Rockets TOOK them to 7 games. McGrady was a nonfactor last year. As a matter of fact he hurt the Rockets more than he helped them at the beginning of the year.

Having said that, there's no way the Rockets will be as good as last year without Yao. But to say they go to the bottom of the West is either niave, being a Rockets hater, or just plain dumb. (IMO)

[carter08]

Originally posted by Farmersfan
Did the Rockets truely "TAKE" the Lakers to 7 games or did the Lakers simply sleep walk through that series? We all watched it and the lakers played about as poorly as a team can play and still win. Don't be fooled into thinking the Rockets can compete without Yao or McGrady. Not having Artest is the last straw. I think the Rockets go to the bottom on the list in the West next season......

Ariza replaces Artest. What he lacks on the court, he'll make up in the locker room. I expect him to be a much better team player than Artest ever was. Ariza is still young and has a lot of upside, and I think his willingness to take less money to play in Houston shows that he really wants to help this team, something Artest didn't care about.

As for the loss of McGrady, who cares? Team plays better without him.

Yao always misses games, losing him hurts but its not the end of the world.

I think the thing that hurts the most is not having Deke anymore. No one can replace the wisdom and leadership he brought Houston.

[Farmersfan]

Originally posted by carter08
Ariza replaces Artest. What he lacks on the court, he'll make up in the locker room. I expect him to be a much better team player than Artest ever was. Ariza is still young and has a lot of upside, and I think his willingness to take less money to play in Houston shows that he really wants to help this team, something Artest didn't care about.

As for the loss of McGrady, who cares? Team plays better without him.

Yao always misses games, losing him hurts but its not the end of the world.

I think the thing that hurts the most is not having Deke anymore. No one can replace the wisdom and leadership he brought Houston.



Ariza is a shadow of Ron Artest. Artest is a 16 point, 5 RB career player and Ariza is a 6 point, 3 RB per game player. And the defensive talent of Artest is WAYYYYYY above Ariza. He is a good pickup for Houston but not even close to replacing Artest. And if Yao is out for the season then Houston is sunk. Houston got by on their defense for most of the season but without Yao in the middle that defense can't be maintained over the long haul. Now they won't have Artest and it is unlikely Brooks can duplicate another over-acheivers season. Yes, Houston goes to the bottom of the Western Conference.

[carter08]

Originally posted by Farmersfan
Ariza is a shadow of Ron Artest. Artest is a 16 point, 5 RB career player and Ariza is a 6 point, 3 RB per game player. And the defensive talent of Artest is WAYYYYYY above Ariza. He is a good pickup for Houston but not even close to replacing Artest. And if Yao is out for the season then Houston is sunk. Houston got by on their defense for most of the season but without Yao in the middle that defense can't be maintained over the long haul. Now they won't have Artest and it is unlikely Brooks can duplicate another over-acheivers season. Yes, Houston goes to the bottom of the Western Conference.

You can't compare the stats of Artest and Ariza. ARIZA HAS NEVER STARTED AN ENTIRE SEASON.

what you can compare are the percentages. he's a career 47% shooter, while Artest is a 42% shooter for his career. you put him in a starting spot for an entire season, and his stats will just be slightly worse than Artest.

[Farmersfan]

Originally posted by carter08
You can't compare the stats of Artest and Ariza. ARIZA HAS NEVER STARTED AN ENTIRE SEASON.

what you can compare are the percentages. he's a career 47% shooter, while Artest is a 42% shooter for his career. you put him in a starting spot for an entire season, and his stats will just be slightly worse than Artest.




That's not a logical statement. The minutes played are a direct reflection of the talent of the player. Ariza will do well for Houston but he isn't even close to the caliber of Artest. (or he would have played more minutes).

[Bull's-eye]

Originally posted by Farmersfan
Ariza is a shadow of Ron Artest. Artest is a 16 point, 5 RB career player and Ariza is a 6 point, 3 RB per game player. And the defensive talent of Artest is WAYYYYYY above Ariza. He is a good pickup for Houston but not even close to replacing Artest. And if Yao is out for the season then Houston is sunk. Houston got by on their defense for most of the season but without Yao in the middle that defense can't be maintained over the long haul. Now they won't have Artest and it is unlikely Brooks can duplicate another over-acheivers season. Yes, Houston goes to the bottom of the Western Conference.

We can all agree that Artest has reached his potential, but Ariza still has room to grow. Houston decided not to resign Artest, he doesn't fit the needs of this current team.

Let me tell you about Artest. He is not the defensive player you are making him out to be, bad ankles have really slowed his lateral movement. His shot selection is terrible and he has become a ball stopper on offense. Ron has become a glorified 3 pt shooter, there are times when he doesn't know when to quit chunking the ball. In the last 4 playoff games vs the Lakers, he shot 17-61 from the field & 4-26 on 3 pointers. In a regular season game against the Lakers, he went 4-16 from the field and 0-8 from behind the arc. Houston lost that game by 6 points, but cleary could of won if not for Ron chunking up bad shots during crucial times of the game. Also, same game where he got Kobe mad and Bryant went on to torch him for 37 points. Kobe told Ron "You can't guard me". Why do you think Artest didn't get the job of guarding Kobe in the playoffs?

[Bull's-eye]

I feel sorry for those Laker fans that think Artest is their answer to another championship. With their signing of Artest, the Lakers can't keep Ariza and probably lose Odom. Ron Artest primarily played the 2 guard (same as Kobe) and doesn't really play well at SF. Wait until Kobe gets tired of Ron chunking up all those bad shots or when Ron explodes and is suspended. Didn't the Lakers see this during the playoffs? I'm puzzled that the Lakers think they are better off with Artest. IMO, chances are greater that he will bring the Lakers down.

[Emerson1]

Originally posted by carter08
Ariza replaces Artest. What he lacks on the court, he'll make up in the locker room.
I don't wanna know.

[Txbroadcaster]

Originally posted by carter08
You can't compare the stats of Artest and Ariza. ARIZA HAS NEVER STARTED AN ENTIRE SEASON.

what you can compare are the percentages. he's a career 47% shooter, while Artest is a 42% shooter for his career. you put him in a starting spot for an entire season, and his stats will just be slightly worse than Artest.


u cant say well his points are so low because he is not a starter but man his shooting % is better because it is the same principal. He has taken less shots which gives him a chance at having a better % than someone who has taken more shots.

I like Ariza's potentioal but at this point that is all it is. There is no stat that can prove he will be better or worse than artest because Artest has a body of work that Ariza has not begun building

[carter08]

Originally posted by Farmersfan
That's not a logical statement. The minutes played are a direct reflection of the talent of the player. Ariza will do well for Houston but he isn't even close to the caliber of Artest. (or he would have played more minutes).

Lakers weren't going to give big minutes to someone who still needed to grow.

Houston has that time to give. Ariza is going to blossom in Houston, because he's going to get the PT and shots he didn't get playing on the Kobe/Odom dominated Lakers.

[carter08]

Originally posted by Txbroadcaster
u cant say well his points are so low because he is not a starter but man his shooting % is better because it is the same principal. He has taken less shots which gives him a chance at having a better % than someone who has taken more shots.

I like Ariza's potentioal but at this point that is all it is. There is no stat that can prove he will be better or worse than artest because Artest has a body of work that Ariza has not begun building

also, look at what Ariza did in the playoffs when he did get playing time. And remember, that was with him as the 4th option on the team.

Ariza did put up around 8ppg off the bench last season.

[Txbroadcaster]

Originally posted by carter08
also, look at what Ariza did in the playoffs when he did get playing time. And remember, that was with him as the 4th option on the team.

Ariza did put up around 8ppg off the bench last season.

and almost every play-off season has the one young guy who comes out of nowhere to have a some big games either thru scoring, or defense and they become the next IT guy.

Calvin booth did that for Dallas way back in the first play-off series of the Dirk era and he got BIG BANK for it and never did anything

Tyronn Lue of the Lakers 2000 team is another example..had a couple of big games and played solid D on Iverson and was way overpriced on the FA market by the Wizard

Again, not saying Ariza becomes that at all but until he becomes the 1st or 2nd option we wont know..it is alot easier to score as the 4th option when a team is not game planning agianst you

[Farmersfan]

Originally posted by carter08
Lakers weren't going to give big minutes to someone who still needed to grow.

Houston has that time to give. Ariza is going to blossom in Houston, because he's going to get the PT and shots he didn't get playing on the Kobe/Odom dominated Lakers.




Ariza averaged more minutes per game with the Lakers than he did in either New York or Orlando. So the Lakers obviously gave him more time to grow than the other two did. I hope you are right that he blossoms in Houston but he didn't blossom in a much better team situation in LA and he didn't blossom in New York or Orlando where he could have been one of the stars.......
Why do you think Houston will be different?

Playoff EFF rating for Artest is 12.85 (last 4 years playing in the West)
Playoff EFF rating for Ariza is 12.96 (entire career except last year playing in the much easier East)

[Farmersfan]

Originally posted by carter08
also, look at what Ariza did in the playoffs when he did get playing time. And remember, that was with him as the 4th option on the team.

Ariza did put up around 8ppg off the bench last season.



Regular season: 2008/2009

Ariza:

Games played: 82
Min per game: 24.4
FG%: .46
3pt%: .32
FT%: .71
RPG: 4.3
APg: 1.2
PPG: 8.9


Artest:

Games Played: 69
Min per game: 35
FG%: .40
3pt%: .40
FT%: .75
RPG: 5.2
APG: 3.3
PPG: 17