Possible Sorriness From China Spring

[Matthew328]

Let me couch this by first saying its JUST 7 on 7 but still very sorry.

A little background, last year China Spring offered and did host a 7 on 7 State Qualifying Tournament (which they won). China Spring then elects NOT to go attend the State Tournament. Slightly shady since the basic point of hosting a State Qualifying Tournament is to qualify and go to state. OK, so maybe they didn't know what it would take, etc. etc. So they get a mulligan.

2009 rolls around, China Spring decides OK let's play in the Lorena 7 on 7 State Qualifier. Again they win the tournament so they are supposed to go to state right?? Well not so fast...apparently the coaches at China Spring are not real sure if they are going...behind the scenes they are saying no but they refuse to give anything official. Why they are doing this is beyond me, they know they aren't going so why drag it out..all this is doing is affecting other schools who could potentially be out there raising money to go to the State Tournament.

All they are doing is leaving a lot of people hanging because its a lot for a group of kids to raise money for rooms etc. and when China Springs knows good and well they aren't going, just let someone know! This dragging the process out so you can say no at the last minute is flat out sorry.

Why play in a 7 on 7 qualifier if you've got zero intention of going to state? Play in a non-qualifier tournament, there's plenty out there...so now Mexia or Waco Reicher or Lorena will get word next week "ohh China Spring has dropped you guys are the alternate...you've got a week and half to raise the money to go to state" whereas the tournament where China qualified was on May 23..a whole month someone coulda been out doing fund raisers...nice going

[Emerson1]

Whoever runs this things next year needs to put a time limit on you entry for the state tournament.

Who runs it btw?

Why would they NOT want to go?

[rholl]

Lets hear one of you China Springers in heres take on this!!!!

[Matthew328]

Originally posted by Emerson1
Whoever runs this things next year needs to put a time limit on you entry for the state tournament.

Who runs it btw?

Why would they NOT want to go?

State 7 on 7 board runs it, in essence there is no need for a time limit because everyone who plays in State Qualifiers and qualifies WANTS to go...Grapevine is the only team I can think of who qualified and didn't want to go and they knew right away so they held a third place game and immediatley the 3rd place team got the spot.

In China Spring's case the tournament organizer at Lorena knew of their past history and had a third place game w/Mexia winning it..only problem is China Spring is not saying no...they aren't saying anything really...(at least publicly) thats the real issue is the fact they are dragging it out.

[waterboy]

At least China Spring played in a qualifier! I wish a certain other team would at least make an attempt!:thinking:

[Matthew328]

but whats the point of playing in a qualifier with zero intent of going to state?

[Emerson1]

Matt is Forney or N Forney is an STQs?

[Matthew328]

Forney was trying to get into the Tyler tournament this week but dont think they were able to get enough kids..not sure if they are in Rockwall..I bet North Forney won't start til next summer with 7 on 7 SQTs.

[Emerson1]

Originally posted by Matthew328
Forney was trying to get into the Tyler tournament this week but dont think they were able to get enough kids.
That's a promising outlook for this season

[Matthew328]

sounded like Forney waited til the last minute to try and go...which is weird because I spoke to Coach Rush about it in April and gave him the date and contact info..

[Additup]

Playing in a qualifier one saturday ain't a big deal...
Key is they QUALIFIED for state. All kinds of reasons NOT to go if they don't want to mess with it. If they want to go they can. If the alternate team wants a guarantee, let qualify in another tourney.

[Ex-Tiger2005]

where is the state tourney?

[Emerson1]

Originally posted by Ex-Tiger2005
where is the state tourney?
A&M

[Matthew328]

It's not about wanting a guarantee, its about putting other people in a bind because of whatever your own interests are. If China Spring didn't want to mess with it but still wanted to play all they had to do is say "hey we really don't want to go to state" and its over and done with...3rd place team goes, those kids and parents can start raising the money they need to go.

The issue is they aren't saying anything. Let someone know so they can tell Mexia or Reicher (4th place) team to start raising money and reserve hotel rooms. By not letting someone know it gives the state board a lot less time to scramble and find a team...the less time they give the less time someone has to get things organized...what if they wait until the week before the tournament? No one will be able to go and now instead of a 32 team tournament you've got a 31 team tournament so lots of people are affected.

Its just reeks of sorry

[Emerson1]

Why doesn't the board just disqualify them?

[Bullaholic]

Could the team China Spring beat in the qualifier be selected to play instead if China Spring declines or hasn't decided by a certain date?

[Emerson1]

Originally posted by Bullaholic
Could the team China Spring beat in the qualifier be selected to play instead if China Spring declines or hasn't decided by a certain date?
Yes that is what every one of matt's posts has explained

But if they find out a week before, that only leaves 1 week to start raising money for hotel rooms and other stuff.

[pirate4state]

Originally posted by Matthew328
but whats the point of playing in a qualifier with zero intent of going to state? that's why we aren't playing in any. we have too many kids with other committments in July. we are happy to be playing in leagues and non qualifying tourneys. :)

[BILLYFRED0000]

Yeah see I hear ya. I think if ya don't know then don't play. Other ways to get your jollies. If ya play then go or notify. Please. With sugar on top.

[Texas Cougar]

I know that CS decided not to go last year because of a couple of minor injuries and coaches felt that the State Tour. was too close to start of season. Wanted to get everyone healthy prior to when it counts. I think the coaches like the early competetion, but not risking injuries 3 weeks before 2 a days.

From my understanding, CS will not be playing. Source is one of the players.

[sinton66]

Originally posted by Texas Cougar
I know that CS decided not to go last year because of a couple of minor injuries and coaches felt that the State Tour. was too close to start of season. Wanted to get everyone healthy prior to when it counts. I think the coaches like the early competetion, but not risking injuries 3 weeks before 2 a days.

From my understanding, CS will not be playing. Source is one of the players.

Sounds like a reasonable explanation, can't say as I blame them, but they could have announced sooner. Matt makes a good point about the fill in not having much time to raise money.

Maybe the committee should consider advancing the state tourney date so there's more time before 2 a days.

[Bullaholic]

Originally posted by Emerson1
Yes that is what every one of matt's posts has explained

But if they find out a week before, that only leaves 1 week to start raising money for hotel rooms and other stuff.

I was just unclear if he was talking specifically about the runner up team---but I knew I could rely on you to set me straight, Emerson. :D

I think the time delay would be tough on a replacement team to raise funding for the tournament.

[Ex-Tiger2005]

Originally posted by Emerson1
A&M

thanx, i think snyder made it and i think that is a first haha!

[Matthew328]

Originally posted by sinton66
Sounds like a reasonable explanation, can't say as I blame them, but they could have announced sooner. Matt makes a good point about the fill in not having much time to raise money.

Maybe the committee should consider advancing the state tourney date so there's more time before 2 a days.

Snyder has not yet qualified.

As for moving the date up I don't believe thats an option simply because you've got to have time to play all of the qualifying tournaments. With spring football going until the end of May they really can't start the 5A/4A qualifiers until late May. For 3A-Under schools you are dealing with fewer #s and more kids involved in more sports and not specializing so they can't start those til late May either. Kinda a catch 22.

[watz4dinner]

Win a tournament and then you can get in. We play in the state qualifiers to get better. They are local....good competition....and the kids are not on the road all day. I understand where you are coming from...but that is your problem....there are no rules against not going to the State Tourny. If you dont like it....keep us from winning the tournament

[Txbroadcaster]

Originally posted by watz4dinner
Win a tournament and then you can get in. We play in the state qualifiers to get better. They are local....good competition....and the kids are not on the road all day. I understand where you are coming from...but that is your problem....there are no rules against not going to the State Tourny. If you dont like it....keep us from winning the tournament

and we have the jerk response..NICE real NICE

if they want to play in the tourney but not go to State all they have to do is say BEFORE hand we are not going to State, they can still play and the tourney sets up a 3rd place game for the 2nd qualifier

[44INAROW]

Originally posted by Txbroadcaster
and we have the jerk response..NICE real NICE

if they want to play in the tourney but not go to State all they have to do is say BEFORE hand we are not going to State, they can still play and the tourney sets up a 3rd place game for the 2nd qualifier

sounds reasonable to me ;)

[Emerson1]

CS just doesn't want to have that disappointment of losing in the state championship again. They ran out of excuses 2 years ago.

[slingshot]

I hope we get these guys again in the playoffs this year...

[watz4dinner]

who cares about 7 on 7...it is a glorified skills practice. Yes, we lost the state championship two years ago to a better football team....no complaining here....how did you last year and the year before...just curious...i really have no idea

[Electus Unus]

CS is full of nothing but snobbery and elitist. Its not hard to notify the hosting team that your not planning on going to state so they can set up a 3rd place game. Celina plays 7on7 and they go to state and I think they've done a lot better than CS has.

[watz4dinner]

Are you just upset because your team got third?

[watz4dinner]

Got an idea: start saving your money for next year's 7 on 7 state qualifier: PLay China Spring in the semi's...get beat...be the alternate, since we probably won't go.....and you get your wish....a state tourny 7on 7 appearence and plenty of time to save for the trip.

Just for the record: we are not all snobs in CS....just me and my wife!!!:)

[watz4dinner]

ernest t: so you know our school and community members? we are you from?

[Electus Unus]

Originally posted by watz4dinner
Got an idea: start saving your money for next year's 7 on 7 state qualifier: PLay China Spring in the semi's...get beat...be the alternate, since we probably won't go.....and you get your wish....a state tourny 7on 7 appearence and plenty of time to save for the trip.

Just for the record: we are not all snobs in CS....just me and my wife!!!:) Sounds like you and your wife are very ignorant. But I don't know what goes through peoples minds to seperate themself from another human being.

[watz4dinner]

you couple of forum geeks are sensitive. You are right and I am wrong....see you in the playoffs!!!!

[Electus Unus]

Originally posted by watz4dinner
you couple of forum geeks are sensitive. You are right and I am wrong....see you in the playoffs!!!! Pot calling the kettle?

[watz4dinner]

:)

[Electus Unus]

Originally posted by Ernest T Bass
No you won't. We're 5a. You might get to play at our stadium if you get far enough, though. ;) don't you have 3 state rings?

[watz4dinner]

congrats.....another 5a coach that thinks he and his school is so much better than the smaller schools.....good luck to you

[Electus Unus]

Originally posted by watz4dinner
congrats.....another 5a coach that thinks he and his school is so much better than the smaller schools.....good luck to you no his school literally is better than you.

[Matthew328]

Originally posted by watz4dinner
Win a tournament and then you can get in. We play in the state qualifiers to get better. They are local....good competition....and the kids are not on the road all day. I understand where you are coming from...but that is your problem....there are no rules against not going to the State Tourny. If you dont like it....keep us from winning the tournament

No I don't like it and neither does the state board, so what will happen is China Spring will be banned. I promise you they won't be allowed to play in any State Qualifiers after this year. The coaches on the state board do a great thing for Texas High Schools and its def. not cool whats going on

[cshscougar08]

Not a good situation not gonna lie, but come on people. I mean if you think there is a possibility of you going to the state tourney, plan accordingly. Don't wait til you actually qualify. That's poor planning. No doubt we're in the wrong on this one though. But there can be planning ahead for other schools as well. Budgeting, etc.

Electus how dare you judge CS. You don't know this community. Snobbery and elitist my butt. I feel like THAT'S pot calling the kettle black.

[Matthew328]

ETB, I see you guys are playing in Mesquite this week....you gonna be there?

[Matthew328]

good times..now back to ripping China Spring LOL....seriously just call Coach Kemp or Coach Houston and say we aren't going....its very simple.

[44INAROW]

COMMON COURTESY - some folks have it, some don't.
there is alot of planning and organizing done in order to run the state tourney. Kudos to those who make it all happen. :clap:

[captain d]

Just wondering. For years we as football fans bashed AAU basketball, traveling summer baseball teams and so on as being out of control and taking away from the high school experience. We were given the chance to start 7 on 7 and we have become what we used to bash and gripe about. Teams may need to be up front if they enter a qualifier tourney about not wanting to advance but was the entire thing in the begining not suppose to be a way football players could leagally get together and get a little work in during the summer. Seems we missed the boat somewhere?

[Rabid Cougar]

Here is an idea If the aforementioned coaches want to know if CS is going or not have them get on the freaking phone and call. I am pretty damd sure all those coaches have each other on speed dial. I can tell you for sure that the coaching staff pretty much could give a rats sphincter what Ernest T, 328 or EU says or thinks.

I don't care about 7-on 7. It is glorified flag football and is highly political and clickish in regards to who can participate and who gets tournements. Do I know why the CS team is not going , No and I don't care if I do.

Long story short........ Kiss ol' rusty!

[Matthew328]

7 on 7 will NEVER be AAU basketball because the sole purpose of it is to benefit the High School teams...there are no select teams in Texas no Nike or Adidas tournaments in Texas....the High School coaches are in complete control of it and as long as it stays that way it will never turn into the farce AAU basketball is

[BleedOrange]

Originally posted by Rabid Cougar
Here is an idea If the aforementioned coaches want to know if CS is going or not have them get on the freaking phone and call. I am pretty damd sure all those coaches have each other on speed dial. I can tell you for sure that the coaching staff pretty much could give a rats sphincter what Ernest T, 328 or EU says or thinks.

I don't care about 7-on 7. It is glorified flag football and is highly political and clickish in regards to who can participate and who gets tournements. Do I know why the CS team is not going , No and I don't care if I do.

Long story short........ Kiss ol' rusty!

Maybe they should care what those folks think. While I may not always agree with them they at least have knowledge that you folks from CS could learn from but maybe thats too much to ask for. God forbid someone in this day and age could have some common courtesy.

[captain d]

Matt, Is this really what we invisioned to be in the beginning?

[Matthew328]

Originally posted by Rabid Cougar
Here is an idea If the aforementioned coaches want to know if CS is going or not have them get on the freaking phone and call. I am pretty damd sure all those coaches have each other on speed dial. I can tell you for sure that the coaching staff pretty much could give a rats sphincter what Ernest T, 328 or EU says or thinks.

I don't care about 7-on 7. It is glorified flag football and is highly political and clickish in regards to who can participate and who gets tournements. Do I know why the CS team is not going , No and I don't care if I do.

Long story short........ Kiss ol' rusty!

The problem is they have been calling and getting the run around....one coach then tried to ask Bell at league play at Midway last week and guess what....he wasn't there!!! So he asked the DC who said "well you gotta talk to the head man"

China Spring is WRONG in this no matter how you slice it...bottom line....they played in the Lorena AND Gatesville qualifying tournaments so they had not one but TWO chances to let someone know their intentions in person...so tell me why they didn't do that? They could have come up to someone and said something then...instead they play the game of not returning calls etc. It's China Spring's responsibility to let someone know they aren't going not the other way around...they are the ones who played in the tournament and qualified...if they don't want to go its their job to let someone know...not the other way around.

As for what the coaching staff thinks of me or anyone else...well thats their call...can't worry about that...what I worry about is the selfish attitude of some in China Spring who are only worried about themselves and not the effect they are having on others by stringing this process out.

If hosting the 7 on 7 tournaments is so clickish tell me how did China Spring actually host one last year?? LOL I can promise you no one at China Spring is associated with any click on the state board. If you dont think China Spring is 100% wrong on this deal then you either have zero clue or blinded by the baby blue glasses you are wearing

[Matthew328]

Originally posted by captain d
Matt, Is this really what we invisioned to be in the beginning?

I think it is....since the State Tournament has been played since 1998 the first year 7 on 7 was legalized in Texas. In fact the State Tournament has grown into a huge event pumping thousands of dollars into the Bryan-College Station economy and showcasing Texas High School talent playing for their own HS teams. That is a beautiful thing, it may not be a UIL sanctioned activity but the fact those kids are competing for their school team is a great thing.

I have no problem with coaches or those who don't want to deal or mess with the State Tournament and just want to do local league stuff. It's just the way China Spring is handling this is sorry and they need to be ripped.

[captain d]

I gotcha. Football anytime of the year is great. 7 on 7 is what it is but I still think you better have a strong head coach and staff that keeps it under control.

[Matthew328]

I agree and in 90% of the teams who do the State Qualifying tournaments the HS coaching staff is heavily involved and controls everything which IMO is the way it should be....control of this should NEVER be given to anyone but the HS coaches.

[captain d]

Earnest, With summer lifting, multi sport athletes who are suppose to be at everything, camps, summer leagues, 7 on7... what is the limit for kids, parents, coaches? Where is the line for what is good for kids and where is the line for people taking things beyond what they need to be. Don't give me the" thats what you gotta do to compete excuse." What is best for high school kids?

[Matthew328]

In all honesty it is what you gotta do to compete....whatever you don't do there's ten kids who are doing it. Its just the way it is. Whether its best is debatable.

I know I managed to balance summer baseball, basketball and a summer job in HS and I loved every minute of it....if I played football I would have done 7 on 7 also.....

[trojan37]

They are skipping the state tournament to get prepared for the arse whippin that Mexia is going to give them later in the year.

[cshscougar08]

Originally posted by Matthew328
The problem is they have been calling and getting the run around....one coach then tried to ask Bell at league play at Midway last week and guess what....he wasn't there!!!

Just so ya know, Coach Bell was one of the head coaches in the FCA Victory Bowl last week, so he was devoting his full attention to that. So that's no surprise that he wasn't there at Midway.

Ok thank you EVERYONE for pointing out that we're in the wrong. You can go back to your lives now.

Trojan37- I like how you have to talk about how another team besides your own is going to try to beat us. Can we not expect to get a butt-kicking from West? ;)

[rholl]

I hope matt is right about CS being banned next yr.

[Ranger Mom]

After reading this entire thread......I don't see how ANYONE can defend what what CS is doing. And I have nothing whatsoever against China Spring!

If you aren't going, just say you aren't....I don't see what is so hard about that. It's just common courtesy. What are they trying to prove by dragging it out?

I don't understand!!

[Pick6]

From knowing Coach Bell I'm sure there's more to the story then what is being told.

[ccmom]

Originally posted by Rabid Cougar
Here is an idea If the aforementioned coaches want to know if CS is going or not have them get on the freaking phone and call. I am pretty damd sure all those coaches have each other on speed dial. I can tell you for sure that the coaching staff pretty much could give a rats sphincter what Ernest T, 328 or EU says or thinks.

I don't care about 7-on 7. It is glorified flag football and is highly political and clickish in regards to who can participate and who gets tournements. Do I know why the CS team is not going , No and I don't care if I do.

Long story short........ Kiss ol' rusty!

I expected a classy response from you, and you didn't disappoint. :rolleyes:

[cshscougar08]

Originally posted by Pick6
From knowing Coach Bell I'm sure there's more to the story then what is being told.

I totally agree.

And I don't think anyone has DEFENDED CS in this. I along with Rabid said that other measures could be taken by the other schools, but never said that we were not to blame.

[Matthew328]

So what other measures can be taken?? Here is my vision of this:

Coach: "Ok kids we gotta go out and raise some money because we MIGHT go to state depending on if China Spring decides to let someone know they dont want to go"

Kids (with puzzled looks on their faces: "So we need to go out and raise money, just in case? What happens if China Spring decides to go?"

Coach (not sure what to say): "Ummmmmm...look we have to be prepared just in case. So let's meet Saturday at the wal-mart to have a car wash to raise some money"

Kids (mumbling to selves): "ok coach"

Saturday arrives and only 7 kids show up because the other kids don't want to waste their time on a MIGHT go to state.

Signs everywhere "Help Mexia Maybe Go to State" "Hopefully China Spring Backs out of their Commitment" "Go Blackats Win State!! (If we go)

Team Member sees old lady drive up in her buick and seizes the moment (so he thinks)

Old lady: "What are you boys doing out here in this hot sun? What are you raising money for?"

Team Member: "Hello ma'am, we are from Mexia High School. We are trying to raise some money to possibly attend the 7 on 7 State Tournament. If China Spring decides they dont want to attend the State Tournament we'll get to go!"

Old lady (totally confused): "So you are raising money for an event you MIGHT go to?"

Team Member (also totally confused): "Yes ma'am?"

Old lady: "What happens to my money if you don't go to state?"

Team Member: "I'm not too sure? I guess we keep it?"

Old lady: "Umm, I think I'll pass"

Obviously this is way exaggerated, but seriously let's go raise some money for an event we might attend? LOL

[Rabid Cougar]

Originally posted by ccmom
I expected a classy response from you, and you didn't disappoint. :rolleyes:

CCMOM
You don't know me from Adam so you don't have clue as to what to expect from me.

It is one thing to rag a school good naturedly. It is fun and I can take as good as I can dish it out . To get on here and out right drag a school through the mud just because someone has their pantties in wad is totally uncalled for. To get on here and say that the whole town of China Spring are snobs because of some coach ..give me a break.. I will defend my community and its school to no end when unjustly attacked. Anyone esle on here would do the same.


328
Yea I don't have a clue about 7-7 tournements but I got Cougar Blue glasses on and I like them just fine.

Another way to keep us from qualifying......Trojan 37 and any others on here who have tried this year and last..... Beat us!

[Matthew328]

I've never said anyone at China Spring is being snobbish..but I call em like I see em and some people at China Spring are being total douchers.

All I have said is I think its sorry what is going on and that it is China Spring's responsibility to let either Coach Houston at Lorena or Coach Kemp at Arlington Bowie know their intentions to NOT go to state. It's been nearly one month, thats one month of time lost for someone else to try and raise the needed money.

But the fact is China Spring will be banned from 7 on 7 State Qualifying so this will be a non issue starting in 2010 and going forward. If it were me I would have banned them this year but Coach Houston and Coach Cooper were nice enough to let China Spring in again this year only to apparently get burned again

[formercougar18]

i was on the team that qualified last year for state....and i agree that we should not have been playing in those tournaments. But all summer before the tournaments they acted like we were forsure going to go so we all thought "oh cool we get to go to the state tournament" but after the g-ville tournament coach bell decides to tell us no we are not going......I agree why should we take other peoples spots? and i dont think it will hurt anyone here at cs if we get banned because it's not like we would go anyway. The coaches here were to focused on getting ready for the season and now that i see how it ended i would have much rather have had that one more 7 on 7 game. That was pretty much football without all the pressure. And just a lot of fun for all the players. But on the fact that were snobbish and all that...i mean come on now..you probably have never talked to one person from here in person, and just because some people are like that does not mean the entire town is.

[sinton66]

I'm certain Matthew wasn't inferring that upon the entirety of the community. I'm also certain he didn't intend for anyone else to do that either.

[Ranger Mom]

Originally posted by formercougar18
i was on the team that qualified last year for state....and i agree that we should not have been playing in those tournaments. But all summer before the tournaments they acted like we were forsure going to go so we all thought "oh cool we get to go to the state tournament" but after the g-ville tournament coach bell decides to tell us no we are not going......I agree why should we take other peoples spots? and i dont think it will hurt anyone here at cs if we get banned because it's not like we would go anyway. The coaches here were to focused on getting ready for the season and now that i see how it ended i would have much rather have had that one more 7 on 7 game. That was pretty much football without all the pressure. And just a lot of fun for all the players. But on the fact that were snobbish and all that...i mean come on now..you probably have never talked to one person from here in person, and just because some people are like that does not mean the entire town is.

Good post!!! :clap:

[cshscougar08]

Originally posted by sinton66
I'm certain Matthew wasn't inferring that upon the entirety of the community. I'm also certain he didn't intend for anyone else to do that either.

Unfortunately anytime something about China Spring comes up, SOMEONE has to throw their two cents in about us being a very uppity and snobbish community. Intentions or not, it happens in almost every thread that CS is mentioned in. Guess that rule doesn't include the community as a whole. Just the players and coaches.

[Ranger Mom]

Originally posted by cshscougar08
Unfortunately anytime something about China Spring comes up, SOMEONE has to throw their two cents in about us being a very uppity and snobbish community. Intentions or not, it happens in almost every thread that CS is mentioned in. Guess that rule doesn't include the community as a whole. Just the players and coaches.

Greenwood has that reputation of being stuck up and snobby too, and I have never understood that.

Sure. there are some snobby people here, but they would be snobby no matter where they lived. Then....there are some of the most down to earth people I have ever met here too.