Small Highschool Sex Scandal

[Bullaholic]

I debated about putting the link for the following story up on the board, but as it happened very close to Bridgeport, and I know most of you to be caring parents or persons who care very much about kids and I would just like to review your opinions. I personally felt that this story did not rise to the news worthiness level of a major metroplex TV station broadcasting it on their 10:00 news, as several young lives will probably be scarred for a long time. There will be no winners in this and my heart goes out to all the children and families involved.

http://www.wfaa.com/sharedcontent/dws/wfaa/localnews/news8/stories/wfaa090507_mo_sexpact.45cf9b5.html

[Ranger Mom]

Originally posted by Bullaholic
I debated about putting the link for the following story up on the board, but as it happened very close to Bridgeport, and I know most of you to be caring parents or persons who care very much about kids and I would just like to review your opinions. I personally felt that this story did not rise to the news worthiness level of a major metroplex TV station broadcasting it on their 10:00 news, as several young lives will probably be scarred for a long time. There will be no winners in this and my heart goes out to all the children and families involved.

http://www.wfaa.com/sharedcontent/dws/wfaa/localnews/news8/stories/wfaa090507_mo_sexpact.45cf9b5.html

Sadly, I think this kind of thing goes on quite a bit!!!

[44INAROW]

I have no idea the full details but having raised 3 boys and dealt with many 13 and 14 year old girls, ..... nevermind - I will probably upset some folks so I'll just say it's a sad situation all around..

ps I don't condone ASSAULT in any shape or form and if the girls were FORCED to have sex - it's a crime.

[Sweetwater Red]

Originally posted by Ranger Mom
Sadly, I think this kind of thing goes on quite a bit!!!

I agree. What surprised me was that the victim is a 13 year old
freshman. When I was 13 I was in the 7th grade with everyone else my age.:confused:

[Ranger Mom]

Originally posted by 44INAROW
I have no idea the full details but having raised 3 boys and dealt with many 13 and 14 year old girls, ..... nevermind - I will probably upset some folks so I'll just say it's a sad situation all around..

ps I don't condone ASSAULT in any shape or form and if the girls were FORCED to have sex - it's a crime.

I know EXACTLY where you are coming from!!

:thumbsup: :thumbsup:

[Pick6]

If children would only think of the consequences before their choices, alot of this stuff wouldn't be happening. Children need to be reminded that with choices comes consequences. Think before you act.

[Bullaholic]

One of the most terrible parts of this will be the examination and cross-examination of these kids if they have to take the stand. If the girls involved in this had not been as young as 13 and one of the boys as old as 18, there probably would not be a story or a case.

[44INAROW]

Originally posted by Pick6
If children would only think of the consequences before their choices, alot of this stuff wouldn't be happening. Children need to be reminded that with choices comes consequences. Think before you act.
Amen Pick6........... :)

[Ranger Mom]

It is amazing (and sad) the amount of girls in middle school that are sexually promiscuous and/or sexually active these days!!

[pirate4state]

Originally posted by Ranger Mom
It is amazing (and sad) the amount of girls in middle school that are sexually promiscuous and/or sexually active these days!! x100

tragic

[Bullaholic]

Back in the day, the greatest fear for a girl was for the whole world outside of the highschool community finding out that she had engaged in pre-martial sex. That fear alone, coupled with the prospect of pregancy, was enough to keep most kids from engaging in sex until they were at least 16, and usually older, if at all. That fear seems to have subsided in the modern era and presents a tremendous new additional burden to the parents of teenagers today.

[pirate4state]

Originally posted by Bullaholic
Back in the day, the greatest fear for a girl was for the whole world outside of the highschool community finding out that she had engaged in pre-martial sex. That fear alone, coupled with the prospect of pregancy, was enough to keep most kids from engaging in sex until they were at least 16, and usually older, if at all. That fear seems to have subsided in the modern era and presents a tremendous new additional burden to the parents of teenagers today.

Just had this same conversation with someone not to long ago. Can't remember who. Young girls these days want people to know what or who they are doing! :eek:

[DaHop72]

It's sad the number of high school girls that are pregnant and will raise their child by themself or expect the grandparents to do it while they run around and finish their high school years.:(

[44INAROW]

Originally posted by DaHop72
It's sad the number of high school girls that are pregnant and will raise their child by themself or expect the grandparents to do it while they run around and finish their high school years.:(

heck, here in Cuero, they have a flipping day care for school and more than 1 girl has 2 babies in there, don't get me started :doh: and before some bleeing heart jumps on me, I had a baby at 17 and with my husband, raised him, along with his 2 brothers and have 2 college graduates and the 3rd one working on it. It's possible to become a productive member of society. my parents "encouraged" us to be on our own and raise our own children instead of doing it for us. That's the problem, too many 'babies having babies" and momma and daddy taking on the responsibility. There again, no consequences to the actions.......... ok, I better get off my soapbox now.

[DaHop72]

Originally posted by 44INAROW
heck, here in Cuero, they have a flipping day care for school and more than 1 girl has 2 babies in there, don't get me started :doh: and before some bleeing heart jumps on me, I had a baby at 17 and with my husband, raised him, along with his 2 brothers and have 2 college graduates and the 3rd one working on it. It's possible to become a productive member of society. my parents "encouraged" us to be on our own and raise our own children instead of doing it for us. That's the problem, too many 'babies having babies" and momma and daddy taking on the responsibility. There again, no consequences to the actions.......... ok, I better get off my soapbox now. :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: I think they have something like that here too where they can bring the baby and all the girls think it's so neat to see them with the baby in the halls. I think there are around 33 that are pregnant and in school right now. :(

[Pick6]

Originally posted by Ranger Mom
It is amazing (and sad) the amount of girls in middle school that are sexually promiscuous and/or sexually active these days!!

If the girls are sexually active, so are the boys. Can't just blame one sex over the other.

[Ranger Mom]

Originally posted by Pick6
If the girls are sexually active, so are the boys. Can't just blame one sex over the other.

Wow...it's amazing how many people are in my head today telling me what I should be saying!!!

I never blamed one sex over the other....but it is the girls whose reputations are bandied about and you hear about, not so much the boys!!!

AND....it's usually the younger girls WITH the older guys!! And...since we are talking about 13/14 year old girls, that's why I only mentioned the girls!! I don't hear that much about 13/14 year old boys.

WOW...:doh:

[mustang04]

Originally posted by Ranger Mom
Wow...it's amazing how many people are in my head today telling me what I should be saying!!!

I never blamed one sex over the other....but it is the girls whose reputations are bandied about and you hear about, not so much the boys!!!

AND....it's usually the younger girls WITH the older guys!! And...since we are talking about 13/14 year old girls, that's why I only mentioned the girls!! I don't hear that much about 13/14 year old boys.

WOW...:doh:

it's ok...Pick6 has already proven himself to not be one of the sharpest knives in the box when it comes to arguing over anything that has to do with common sense:p



i bet the girls were worried about their parents finding out and then turned around and started making it seem like they were "sexually assaulted"....its sad whenever people make choices yet have no regard for the future of someone else in fear of hurting their own reputation, I am not saying that guys are always innocent cuz I know MANY times they aren't...I'm just saying that girls aren't that innocent either

[Farmersfan]

I've heard all my life that Girls use sex to get love and boys use love to get sex!!! I think the same is true with popularity. Girls use sex to try to get popularity and boys use popularity to get sex.
But how do we address this? Perhaps it would help the situation if we attempted to remove the "Class Structure" in our schools. Maybe we need to make ALL kids equal at least during school. Perhaps uniforms would help to stop the "popular Kids" vs the "unpopular Kids" heirarchy. Maybe we could stop high school kids from driving to school in their own vehicles. Nothing creates status more than a vehicle. Just some thoughts......

[Bearkat]

Originally posted by 44INAROW
That's the problem, too many 'babies having babies" and momma and daddy taking on the responsibility. There again, no consequences to the actions..........


I agree with you 100%!!!

[pancho villa]

Boys just can't say no to them sweet things!

[Ranger Mom]

Originally posted by Farmersfan
I've heard all my life that Girls use sex to get love and boys use love to get sex!!! I think the same is true with popularity. Girls use sex to try to get popularity and boys use popularity to get sex.
But how do we address this? Perhaps it would help the situation if we attempted to remove the "Class Structure" in our schools. Maybe we need to make ALL kids equal at least during school. Perhaps uniforms would help to stop the "popular Kids" vs the "unpopular Kids" heirarchy. Maybe we could stop high school kids from driving to school in their own vehicles. Nothing creates status more than a vehicle. Just some thoughts......

I don't what can be done. Back when my daughter was younger, one of her classmates mother put her daughter on the pill, some other mothers were SHOCKED...saying it just gave her daughter a license to "screw around."
I wasn't sure how I felt about it....I look back though and the 2 mothers who made the biggest noise about it each have daughters who have a kid now. One was 9 months pregnant at graduation and the other one had hers a few months later....neither one was married.

The girl who was on the pill has no children yet!!

Do any of you oldtimers remember when the AIDS scare first came around.....promiscuity seemed to come to a grinding halt for a while!!! Sex wasn't even worth it!!!

[Ranger Mom]

Originally posted by Ernest T Bass
In Texas, someone over the age of 16 having sex with someone under the age of 16 is classified as sexual assault under the Texas Penal Code. Anyone under the age of 17 cannot give consent, so it matters not if it was consentual.

There is a window though...that "law" has a huge loophole.

Believe me, I know...I lived it!!

[Pick6]

Originally posted by 44INAROW
heck, here in Cuero, they have a flipping day care for school

Kerrville had one in the mid 90's, don't know if they still do. That was one of the reasons we left there.

[pancho villa]

Where were these girls when I was in school?

[Bullaholic]

Originally posted by pancho villa
Where were these girls when I was in school?

Because you were a dirt waterer then, Pancho, they knew you wouldn't have time for them so they stayed away.

[Ranger Mom]

Originally posted by Ernest T Bass
Common law, or less than 2 years difference?

Between 14 and 17 if they are within 3 years of the other party...it is legal consent if the parents don't press charges....the court won't touch it on their own.

After 17 it is legal consent no matter what the age......UNLESS you are a student in high school and the other party is a teacher/coach, etc.

__________________

[Ranger Mom]

Originally posted by Ernest T Bass
I thought it was 2 years, but maybe it's 3. The court CAN prosecute, but they won't unless the parents choose to.
And yes, if you're a school employee, it doesn't matter if the student is 25, it's illegal.

It is 3 years...between that magic age of 14 and 17.

I am one of those grandmothers whose grandchild was born to "WAY TOO YOUNG" parents.

At the time of her birth, the mother was 16 and my son 19....they are 2-1/2 years apart in age.

When they first started dating....she was 14 and he was 16.

The odds are against them....but he is now 21, she will be 19 next month, and the baby is now 2....and they are still together.

[GreenMonster]

Originally posted by mustang04

i bet the girls were worried about their parents finding out and then turned around and started making it seem like they were "sexually assaulted"....its sad whenever people make choices yet have no regard for the future of someone else in fear of hurting their own reputation

From what I've been told by one of the coaches there it isn't the girls claiming sexual assault it's the Daddy's of the girls. I for one would be filing charges as well. When I was 17 or 18 I knew better than to mess around with a jr hi girl and that is what happened here. It doesn't matter if the sex was concentual or not, a 13 year old (minor) cannot concent to having sex in Texas. It is against the law. It is a big screwed up mess down there. There was a group of jr hi girls that made a pact at the end of school last year to sleep with/ have relations with a list of boys at the high school over the summer in order to get themselves immediately into the "in" crowd at the high school. One of the girls involved in the pact and one of the boys on the list are siblings. There are even school board member kids involved. It's a big widespread issue that is tearing this small community apart. Right now it looks like this one kid is going to take the fall for the whole ordeal.

[Sweetwater Red]

Originally posted by GreenMonster
From what I've been told by one of the coaches there it isn't the girls claiming sexual assault it's the Daddy's of the girls. I for one would be filing charges as well. When I was 17 or 18 I knew better than to mess around with a jr hi girl and that is what happened here. It doesn't matter if the sex was concentual or not, a 13 year old (minor) cannot concent to having sex in Texas. It is against the law. It is a big screwed up mess down there. There was a group of jr hi girls that made a pact at the end of school last year to sleep with/ have relations with a list of boys at the high school over the summer in order to get themselves immediately into the "in" crowd at the high school. One of the girls involved in the pact and one of the boys on the list are siblings. There are even school board member kids involved. It's a big widespread issue that is tearing this small community apart. Right now it looks like this one kid is going to take the fall for the whole ordeal.

Am I missing reading this link. Why is a 13 year old freshman
in high school at that age? IMO that's too young to be put in a
HS environment.

"Hale, a football player at the school, was arrested on campus last week and is accused of sexually assaulting a 13-year-old freshman, according to police reports. He is accused of assaulting the teen at her home, in his truck and in the parking lot of the school."

[garciap77]

Originally posted by GreenMonster
From what I've been told by one of the coaches there it isn't the girls claiming sexual assault it's the Daddy's of the girls. I for one would be filing charges as well. When I was 17 or 18 I knew better than to mess around with a jr hi girl and that is what happened here. It doesn't matter if the sex was concentual or not, a 13 year old (minor) cannot concent to having sex in Texas. It is against the law. It is a big screwed up mess down there. There was a group of jr hi girls that made a pact at the end of school last year to sleep with/ have relations with a list of boys at the high school over the summer in order to get themselves immediately into the "in" crowd at the high school. One of the girls involved in the pact and one of the boys on the list are siblings. There are even school board member kids involved. It's a big widespread issue that is tearing this small community apart. Right now it looks like this one kid is going to take the fall for the whole ordeal.

My take on this: No bailout; put the persons who broke the law in jail and hope other kids in the USA are made aware of this. Bad move on the older kids, but by this time they should have know better.

:(

[garciap77]

Originally posted by Sweetwater Red
Am I missing reading this link. Why is a 13 year old freshman
in high school at that age? IMO that's too young to be put in a
HS environment.

"Hale, a football player at the school, was arrested on campus last week and is accused of sexually assaulting a 13-year-old freshman, according to police reports. He is accused of assaulting the teen at her home, in his truck and in the parking lot of the school."

My daughter was 13 year when she was a freshman in high school! We were station overseas in Okinawa, Japan. They start school at an earlier age in Japan, so we had no choice. It's hard getting used to attending classes with kid that are up to two years older than you. College was different too! Remarks like: Aren't you supposed to be in high school? HaHaHa Good thing she is an Elementary school teacher and not high school.

[Ranger Mom]

Originally posted by Sweetwater Red
Am I missing reading this link. Why is a 13 year old freshman
in high school at that age? IMO that's too young to be put in a
HS environment.

"Hale, a football player at the school, was arrested on campus last week and is accused of sexually assaulting a 13-year-old freshman, according to police reports. He is accused of assaulting the teen at her home, in his truck and in the parking lot of the school."

I wondered that myself. My daughter was always the youngest in her class, as she had a summer birthday. But when she was 13, she was in 8th grade.

[bandera7]

Firstly, how can the older brother be ok with this? it said two on the list were siblings...I personally know, if somebody in high school even my sisters age was having sex with my baby sister, they would be in a world of hurt. Call me old fashioned, but that is the way I was taught.

Secondly, kids need to use their brains. Period.

[Pick6]

Originally posted by Ranger Mom
I wondered that myself. My daughter was always the youngest in her class, as she had a summer birthday. But when she was 13, she was in 8th grade.

It's Chico, a 2A or 1A school. They probably have 7-12 in the high school.

[GreenMonster]

Originally posted by Pick6
It's Chico, a 2A or 1A school. They probably have 7-12 in the high school. Chico is 2A until next re-alignment when they should drop to 1A and no, it is not a 7-12 school. There is a seperate Jr hi across town. I do believe the sex acts started when she was 13 in the summer, I think she is indeed 14 now. RM has it correct on the 3 year window, and that is why this boy is being charged with a fellony, he was the only one that messed around with a 13 year old. The rest of the 17 year old boys were messing with 14 year olds.

[Farmersfan]

Originally posted by garciap77
My take on this: No bailout; put the persons who broke the law in jail and hope other kids in the USA are made aware of this. Bad move on the older kids, but by this time they should have know better.

:(



My two cents worth:
I raised two boys and having seen the way the 13 year old girls acted and dressed around my boys I would have to say anyone who thinks a high school boy should be held more accountable than the girls is living in a dream world. These girls played the boys like grown women would and used their sexuality to get their way. It is completely natural for the boys to accept whatever the girls offers and to expect otherwise is not normal. Just from a Natural and normal standpoint the male of almost all species on the planet tries to mate with any and every female he encounters and it's the female who is selective and evasive. So by all means lets pass laws that go against the natural way of things......And then wonder why they don't work!!!!!

[garciap77]

Originally posted by Farmersfan
My two cents worth:
I raised two boys and having seen the way the 13 year old girls acted and dressed around my boys I would have to say anyone who thinks a high school boy should be held more accountable than the girls is living in a dream world. These girls played the boys like grown women would and used their sexuality to get their way. It is completely natural for the boys to accept whatever the girls offers and to expect otherwise is not normal. Just from a Natural and normal standpoint the male of almost all species on the planet tries to mate with any and every female he encounters and it's the female who is selective and evasive. So by all means lets pass laws that go against the natural way of things......And then wonder why they don't work!!!!!

My problem is the age difference between 13 and 17 or older! If a person 17 years old or older does not know that having sex with a minor is illegal, then they have a problem!

[vet93]

While I agree with you that this young man was entrapped in a set of circumstances that made it very difficult...I have to say that the ability to discern right from wrong and to control our emotions and "instincts" is what seperates us from animals. Otherwise, we are nothing more than animals that live only to eat and have sex.


Originally posted by Farmersfan
My two cents worth:
I raised two boys and having seen the way the 13 year old girls acted and dressed around my boys I would have to say anyone who thinks a high school boy should be held more accountable than the girls is living in a dream world. These girls played the boys like grown women would and used their sexuality to get their way. It is completely natural for the boys to accept whatever the girls offers and to expect otherwise is not normal. Just from a Natural and normal standpoint the male of almost all species on the planet tries to mate with any and every female he encounters and it's the female who is selective and evasive. So by all means lets pass laws that go against the natural way of things......And then wonder why they don't work!!!!!

[Sweetwater Red]

Originally posted by vet93
Otherwise, we are nothing more than animals that live only to eat and have sex.

And this is a bad thing because...?????:confused:



j/k

[Farmersfan]

Originally posted by vet93
While I agree with you that this young man was entrapped in a set of circumstances that made it very difficult...I have to say that the ability to discern right from wrong and to control our emotions and "instincts" is what seperates us from animals. Otherwise, we are nothing more than animals that live only to eat and have sex.


Perfectly stated vet93. But the same applies for the 13 year old girls. I don't claim that the boys should NOT be held accountable for this. I am simply saying the girls are at least equally responsible. If it is your contention that the girls are too young and too imature to be held responsible then the same would have to apply with all crimes. We punish "KIDS" all the time for crimes. Why is this any different? They either are able to be held responsible for their actions or they aren't. And if we decide that they are NOT able to make up their own minds as to when, how, who and what if sex is concerned then we have basically taken away the fundemental rights of a whole segment of people. Do the parents have the right to decide? Perhaps the school has the right to decide? Seems to me that the parents have been decideing for young girls for many 1000's of years in the middle east and most Americans freak about it.

[garciap77]

Originally posted by Farmersfan
Perfectly stated vet93. But the same applies for the 13 year old girls. I don't claim that the boys should NOT be held accountable for this. I am simply saying the girls are at least equally responsible. If it is your contention that the girls are too young and too imature to be held responsible then the same would have to apply with all crimes. We punish "KIDS" all the time for crimes. Why is this any different? They either are able to be held responsible for their actions or they aren't. And if we decide that they are NOT able to make up their own minds as to when, how, who and what if sex is concerned then we have basically taken away the fundemental rights of a whole segment of people. Do the parents have the right to decide? Perhaps the school has the right to decide? Seems to me that the parents have been decideing for young girls for many 1000's of years in the middle east and most Americans freak about it.

OK! So should there be an age limit to when it would NOT be a crime to have sex with a minnor?

[Pick6]

Originally posted by garciap77
OK! So should there be an age limit to when it would NOT be a crime to have sex with a minnor?

You're wasting your time with him.

[garciap77]

Originally posted by Pick6
You're wasting your time with him.

I'm bored!:D


;)

[Sweetwater Red]

Originally posted by garciap77
I'm bored!:D


;)

Bored? Go take some pictures of the stadium upgrades and post
them.:thinking:

[BEAST]

Originally posted by Farmersfan
Perfectly stated vet93. But the same applies for the 13 year old girls. I don't claim that the boys should NOT be held accountable for this. I am simply saying the girls are at least equally responsible. If it is your contention that the girls are too young and too imature to be held responsible then the same would have to apply with all crimes. We punish "KIDS" all the time for crimes. Why is this any different? They either are able to be held responsible for their actions or they aren't. And if we decide that they are NOT able to make up their own minds as to when, how, who and what if sex is concerned then we have basically taken away the fundemental rights of a whole segment of people. Do the parents have the right to decide? Perhaps the school has the right to decide? Seems to me that the parents have been decideing for young girls for many 1000's of years in the middle east and most Americans freak about it.


I actually agree with Framersfan. The boys are wrong, but so are the girls. Look at it like this, if these same 2 kids got caught purchasing marijuana from an undercover cop, would just the boy get in trouble? If so, is that right? An old saying, "It takes 2 to tango" holds true. That girl wanted to have sex. Therefore she did. Yes the boy should have known better but like most 17 year old boys, he was thinking with the wrong head. Not saying he should not get into trouble, but why should she get off without anything?




BEAST

[garciap77]

Originally posted by Sweetwater Red
Bored? Go take some pictures of the stadium upgrades and post
them.:thinking:

:thinking:


Good idea, RED! Maybe I can get one of Bogey handing out $100 at the stadium. He does that once in awhile when his bank is over flowing with money!



;)

[garciap77]

Originally posted by BEAST
I actually agree with Framersfan. The boys are wrong, but so are the girls. Look at it like this, if these same 2 kids got caught purchasing marijuana from an undercover cop, would just the boy get in trouble? If so, is that right? An old saying, "It takes 2 to tango" holds true. That girl wanted to have sex. Therefore she did. Yes the boy should have known better but like most 17 year old boys, he was thinking with the wrong head. Not saying he should not get into trouble, but why should she get off without anything?




BEAST

Fine! But, should there be an age limit?

[BEAST]

Originally posted by garciap77
Fine! But, should there be an age limit?


An age limit would be tough. One might say 16 but if a 15 year old did it then they would bitch about that.

Heres an idea, how about put GOD back in school. That way maybe the kids from parents who dont give a damn still have a chance to learn morals and values.




BEAST

[waterboy]

Originally posted by BEAST
An age limit would be tough. One might say 16 but if a 15 year old did it then they would bitch about that.

Heres an idea, how about put GOD back in school. That way maybe the kids from parents who dont give a damn still have a chance to learn morals and values.




BEAST
:clap: Amen, Brother! Amen!:clap:

[Pick6]

Originally posted by BEAST

Heres an idea, how about put GOD back in school. That way maybe the kids from parents who dont give a damn still have a chance to learn morals and values.




BEAST

:clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:

[BEAST]

The moral decay of our country started when our brilliant elected leaders saw it fit to evict God from schools. The problem is, they forgot about the devil. When kids started growing up without literally having The Fear of God in them, well we all see where we are now. Problem is, it isnt reversible. Parents have to teach it to there young, which leads to another problem, alot of parents do not think getting there children in Sunday School on Sunday morning is important. I could go on and on.




BEAST

[Pick6]

Originally posted by BEAST
The moral decay of our country started when our brilliant elected leaders saw it fit to evict God from schools. The problem is, they forgot about the devil. When kids started growing up without literally having The Fear of God in them, well we all see where we are now. Problem is, it isnt reversible. Parents have to teach it to there young, which leads to another problem, alot of parents do not think getting there children in Sunday School on Sunday morning is important. I could go on and on.




BEAST

Beast is speaking the Truth.

[waterboy]

Originally posted by BEAST
The moral decay of our country started when our brilliant elected leaders saw it fit to evict God from schools. The problem is, they forgot about the devil. When kids started growing up without literally having The Fear of God in them, well we all see where we are now. Problem is, it isnt reversible. Parents have to teach it to there young, which leads to another problem, alot of parents do not think getting there children in Sunday School on Sunday morning is important. I could go on and on.




BEAST
:clap: Amen! Preach on Brother Man!:clap: I've agreed with everything you've said so far.

waterboy

[waterboy]

Originally posted by Pick6
Beast is speaking the Truth.
:clap: Amen! Yes he is! Beast is speaking the Truth, and the Truth shall set you free!:clap:

[garciap77]

Originally posted by BEAST
An age limit would be tough. One might say 16 but if a 15 year old did it then they would bitch about that.

Heres an idea, how about put GOD back in school. That way maybe the kids from parents who dont give a damn still have a chance to learn morals and values.




BEAST

I agree with you!:clap::clap: :clap:GOD needs to be put back in school! In addition, parents need to put GOD back in the home. But, we still need to have a law to punish 17 and above for having sex with minors. I would not want a 17 or 21 or 50 year old person having sex with say a 10 year old person just because the 10 year old person wanted to have sex.

[Pick6]

Originally posted by garciap77
I agree with you!:clap::clap: :clap:GOD needs to be put back in school! In addition, parents need to put GOD back in the home. But, we still need to have a law to punish 17 and above for having sex with minors. I would not want a 17 or 21 or 50 year old person having sex with say a 10 year old person just because the 10 year old person wanted to have sex.

Can this thread possibly get any better. :thumbsup:

[LH Panther Mom]

Originally posted by Farmersfan
Perfectly stated vet93. But the same applies for the 13 year old girls. I don't claim that the boys should NOT be held accountable for this. I am simply saying the girls are at least equally responsible. If it is your contention that the girls are too young and too imature to be held responsible then the same would have to apply with all crimes. We punish "KIDS" all the time for crimes. Why is this any different? They either are able to be held responsible for their actions or they aren't. And if we decide that they are NOT able to make up their own minds as to when, how, who and what if sex is concerned then we have basically taken away the fundemental rights of a whole segment of people. Do the parents have the right to decide? Perhaps the school has the right to decide? Seems to me that the parents have been decideing for young girls for many 1000's of years in the middle east and most Americans freak about it.
If it were a 17-year old girl and 13-year old boy, the girl would be in trouble. (And some would be calling the boy a stud. :rolleyes: )

[Txbroadcaster]

All this put God back in school talk( which I would be ok with) BUT

you make it like teens in the past NEVER had sex and all this just started in the past 20 years

only thing that just started was stats being kept on teens having sex and teens having kids.

one of the biggest myths is more kids today have kids compared to say the 50's....when the actual AVERAGE is always around the same..just in the 50's it was not splashed on the news


Most statutory rape laws were not even around in the 50's as the early 70's is when alot of these type of laws were being constructed so we dont have any idea how many 13 year olds were having sex with 17 year olds and so on

again I have no problem if prayer is allowed in school or whatever..but to act like once prayer ended kids THEN became normal teens is misguided IMO

[garciap77]

Originally posted by LH Panther Mom
If it were a 17-year old girl and 13-year old boy, the girl would be in trouble. (And some would be calling the boy a stud. :rolleyes: )

Now, Now, LH Panther Mom. Not one male on 3ADL would say that!:D




;)

[LH Panther Mom]

Originally posted by garciap77
Now, Now, LH Panther Mom. Not one male on 3ADL would say that!:D




;)
You're right! There would not be one, but dozens. ;)

[Txbroadcaster]

Originally posted by LH Panther Mom
You're right! There would not be one, but dozens. ;)

kinda funny..just watched a southpark rerun on this exact issue and it was pretty much everyone saying..what is the problem? LOL

[garciap77]

Originally posted by Txbroadcaster
All this put God back in school talk( which I would be ok with) BUT

you make it like teens in the past NEVER had sex and all this just started in the past 20 years

only thing that just started was stats being kept on teens having sex and teens having kids.

one of the biggest myths is more kids today have kids compared to say the 50's....when the actual AVERAGE is always around the same..just in the 50's it was not splashed on the news


Most statutory rape laws were not even around in the 50's as the early 70's is when alot of these type of laws were being constructed so we dont have any idea how many 13 year olds were having sex with 17 year olds and so on

again I have no problem if prayer is allowed in school or whatever..but to act like once prayer ended kids THEN became normal teens is misguided IMO

I cannot remember even one girl being pregnant in my 1977 senior class of 850.

[LH Panther Mom]

Originally posted by garciap77
I cannot remember even one girl being pregnant in my 1977 senior class of 850.
There was one in mine in a class of 42 in '77. Baby was born just a few days after graduation.

[Txbroadcaster]

Originally posted by garciap77
I cannot remember even one girl being pregnant in my 1977 senior class of 850.

honestly..one reason I think is before the 80's if a girl became pregnant she usually "moved" and did not stay in the school

Now days they stay in school for the most part or at least stay around the town so they are more visible

[garciap77]

Originally posted by Txbroadcaster
honestly..one reason I think is before the 80's if a girl became pregnant she usually "moved" and did not stay in the school

Now days they stay in school for the most part or at least stay around the town so they are more visible

Makes since!:)

[Farmersfan]

Originally posted by garciap77
OK! So should there be an age limit to when it would NOT be a crime to have sex with a minnor?



It should not be a crime to have sex with a minor when you are a MINOR!!!!!! And I don't advocate letting 17 year olds have sex with 13 years olds. I advocate teaching our children that they are responsible for their actions and BOTH are equally at fault...................

[garciap77]

Originally posted by Farmersfan
It should not be a crime to have sex with a minor when you are a MINOR!!!!!! And I don't advocate letting 17 year olds have sex with 13 years olds. I advocate teaching our children that they are responsible for their actions and BOTH are equally at fault...................


:confused:


Is 17 a minor?

[BEAST]

Again I ask, what if these same 2 kids got caught buying dope from an undercover cop, who would get in trouble? Just the boy? If so, is that ok? They both did the crime. Just like they both did the crime in sex case. Not saying he should get off with nothing but she is making out like a victim. Please.

As for the God in school issue, you are correct bad things happened then as well. The difference is it is much more out of hand these days. How much speed and other HARD drugs were sold in good schools those days. To heck with weed, you can get that anywhere, Im talking about hard drugs. How about Columbine style massacres? How many went down back in those days? There is no morale compass for these kids inside the school building. If parents dont do it, the students wont ever get it. It is the parents responsibility, but we all know that a big percentage of parents are abstract failures.




BEAST

[Farmersfan]

Originally posted by BEAST
I actually agree with Framersfan. The boys are wrong, but so are the girls. Look at it like this, if these same 2 kids got caught purchasing marijuana from an undercover cop, would just the boy get in trouble? If so, is that right? An old saying, "It takes 2 to tango" holds true. That girl wanted to have sex. Therefore she did. Yes the boy should have known better but like most 17 year old boys, he was thinking with the wrong head. Not saying he should not get into trouble, but why should she get off without anything?




BEAST


If the girls aren't mature enough to make THIS decision then they should not be mature enough to be held responsible for any other decisions either. We can't prosecute kids younger than 13 if we follow this line of thought. Besides, based on the girls my boys brought around the house the 13 year old girls were more mature than 90% of the 17 year old boys in the school. Physically and emotionally...............

[Farmersfan]

Originally posted by garciap77
:confused:


Is 17 a minor?


17 is considered a minor in every single aspect of life except this one. That's why we are having this discussion. And you still don't understand that I am saying it is wrong. But it's just as wrong on the part of the girl.......... There is NO justification for making the 17 year old solely responsible.

[Farmersfan]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by BEAST
[As for the God in school issue, you are correct bad things happened then as well. The difference is it is much more out of hand these days. How much speed and other HARD drugs were sold in good schools those days. To heck with weed, you can get that anywhere, Im talking about hard drugs. How about Columbine style massacres? How many went down back in those days? There is no morale compass for these kids inside the school building. If parents dont do it, the students wont ever get it. It is the parents responsibility, but we all know that a big percentage of parents are abstract failures.




The population of teenagers has more than doubled over the last 50 years. The number of schools have quadrupled in that time frame. The amount of media has increased 10 fold. All the situations that you claim are the result of "NO MORALE COMPASS" have been happening since the beginning of time. 50 or 75 years ago you just never heard about it. As for Columbine I don't think GOD in school would have helped in that situation. And I think the most popular "Billy the Kid" was actually a teenager who went on a long killing spree. Based on current statistics, the kids today aren't any worse than they have always been. IN a lot of cases they are actually better kids than we were...........

[BEAST]

Originally posted by Farmersfan
[QUOTE]Originally posted by BEAST
[As for the God in school issue, you are correct bad things happened then as well. The difference is it is much more out of hand these days. How much speed and other HARD drugs were sold in good schools those days. To heck with weed, you can get that anywhere, Im talking about hard drugs. How about Columbine style massacres? How many went down back in those days? There is no morale compass for these kids inside the school building. If parents dont do it, the students wont ever get it. It is the parents responsibility, but we all know that a big percentage of parents are abstract failures.




The population of teenagers has more than doubled over the last 50 years. The number of schools have quadrupled in that time frame. The amount of media has increased 10 fold. All the situations that you claim are the result of "NO MORALE COMPASS" have been happening since the beginning of time. 50 or 75 years ago you just never heard about it. As for Columbine I don't think GOD in school would have helped in that situation. And I think the most popular "Billy the Kid" was actually a teenager who went on a long killing spree. Based on current statistics, the kids today aren't any worse than they have always been. IN a lot of cases they are actually better kids than we were...........


You had to resort back to Billy the Kid? I thought we were talking about school issues? Dont think the wild west gun slingers spent much time in school. Now, how about something from the time frame in question.




BEAST

[garciap77]

Originally posted by BEAST
Again I ask, what if these same 2 kids got caught buying dope from an undercover cop, who would get in trouble? Just the boy? If so, is that ok? They both did the crime. Just like they both did the crime in sex case. Not saying he should get off with nothing but she is making out like a victim. Please.

As for the God in school issue, you are correct bad things happened then as well. The difference is it is much more out of hand these days. How much speed and other HARD drugs were sold in good schools those days. To heck with weed, you can get that anywhere, Im talking about hard drugs. How about Columbine style massacres? How many went down back in those days? There is no morale compass for these kids inside the school building. If parents dont do it, the students wont ever get it. It is the parents responsibility, but we all know that a big percentage of parents are abstract failures.




BEAST

In case of Dope! One is 13 and the other 17; the 17 year old person would be facing more punishment! I was the oldest in the family and if my brothers and I got in trouble the punishment was worst for me, because I was the oldest and should have known better!

[garciap77]

Originally posted by Farmersfan
17 is considered a minor in every single aspect of life except this one. That's why we are having this discussion. And you still don't understand that I am saying it is wrong. But it's just as wrong on the part of the girl.......... There is NO justification for making the 17 year old solely responsible.

I understand what you are saying. My disagreement with you is the there is a 4 year difference between the boy and the girl. Most 13 year old girls are just not mature enough to make these kinds of choices. How many times do you hear, "Well, officer I did not know she was only 14, she looks at least 18"! Bullbutter!!!

[Farmersfan]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by BEAST
[B]You had to resort back to Billy the Kid? I thought we were talking about school issues? Dont think the wild west gun slingers spent much time in school. Now, how about something from the time frame in question.




You claimed taking God out of school is responsible for the problems in our schools now. That's nonsense. The problems were happening a long time before "GOD was taken out of schools".
Billy the Kid was just a more well known example.

http://www.trutv.com/library/crime/serial_killers/weird/kids2/index_1.html

[Farmersfan]

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by garciap77
[B]I understand what you are saying. My disagreement with you is the there is a 4 year difference between the boy and the girl. Most 13 year old girls are just not mature enough to make these kinds of choices.


So if we agree on this then why are they ALLOWED to make the choices?????? As a society we tell 13 year old girls they are not mature enough to make these choice but when they do anyway we prosecute the other kid and let the 13 year old girl walk away free and clear. If it is wrong for a 17 year old to have sex with a 13 year old then it is just as wrong for the 13 year old to have sex with the 17 year old. Prosecute the 17 year old as a adult but at least prosecute the 13 year old as a juvenile. And a 17 year old high school boy should not carry the sex offender label for the rest of his life because he had consentual sex with another high school student.

[carter08]

if you want your children to have god in school, send them to christian school.

public schools are for everyone, not just the majority. we are not a 100% christian nation, so putting religion in schools would segregate the christians from non-christians.

"oh, but we don't want our nice christian children hanging around heathens!"

the thing is, how many of these "nice christian children" go out on weekends and drink and have sex with other "nice christian children"?

talking about god in school isn't going to change that. a good moral home life, regardless of what religion one believes in, is the only way you're going to instill morality in a child. but not TOO strict, because that will drive your children into immorality too. geez, such a fine line to tread.

[44INAROW]

Originally posted by carter08
if you want your children to have god in school, send them to christian school.

public schools are for everyone, not just the majority. we are not a 100% christian nation, so putting religion in schools would segregate the christians from non-christians.

"oh, but we don't want our nice christian children hanging around heathens!"

the thing is, how many of these "nice christian children" go out on weekends and drink and have sex with other "nice christian children"?


I can't believe I am getting into this..

so you're saying if you drink and have sex your not a "good Christian":thinking:

so I am understanding this right - 97% of the public should have to confirm to accomodate 3%? (made up figures of course) I am not saying anything is right or wrong, I am just trying to get some understanding through my thick head

[carter08]

Originally posted by 44INAROW
I can't believe I am getting into this..

so you're saying if you drink and have sex your not a "good Christian":thinking:

so I am understanding this right - 97% of the public should have to confirm to accomodate 3%? (made up figures of course) I am not saying anything is right or wrong, I am just trying to get some understanding through my thick head

no.
i'm talking about teenagers. Half the kids who claim to be Christians spend their weekends getting drunk, smoking pot, and having lots of sex.

It takes more than church and God to give a kid strong morals. They need a strong family life that instills values in them.

[Bullaholic]

Originally posted by 44INAROW
so you're saying if you drink and have sex your not a "good Christian":thinking:



Then I've been a better Christian every year since I was 40 or so, 44', and now I think I'm up for cannonization....:D

(Sorry to joke on this serious thread, but I had to see if I could get 44' to spit tea on her monitor, again----back to the issue at hand which I am sure will heat up considerably now that the religion in schools issue has been raised.)

[44INAROW]

Originally posted by Bullaholic
Then I've been a better Christian every year since I was 40 or so, 44', and now I think I'm up for cannoization....:D

(Sorry to joke on this serious thread, but I had to see if I could get 44' to spit tea on her monitor, again----back to the issue at hand which I am sure will heat up considerably now that the religion in schools issue has been raised.)

:D :D I probably won't comment anymore on this thread - politics and religion - no way to win or lose in those discussions :cool: That's cool.. Like I said, I can't believe I even got into it. - ;)
(Oh and I do have a full glass of tea - waiting to be consumed) :)

[Ranger Mom]

Originally posted by 44INAROW
:D :D I probably won't comment anymore on this thread - politics and religion - no way to win or lose in those discussions :cool: That's cool.. Like I said, I can't believe I even got into it. - ;)
(Oh and I do have a full glass of tea - waiting to be consumed) :)

If it keeps up like this...you might get to close your first thread!!:D

[Bullaholic]

I'm like 44'---I am very reluctant to wade in on the religion in schools issue, although I don't mind stating that I call myself a Christian and have very strong personal religious convictions.

I will just simply state that I think there should be equal time during each school day set aside when every student could practice the tennets of their religion alone, or in groups with leaders, or not at all. I don't think that would be harmful to or discriminatory to anyone. Our culture has become just too diverse spiritually and ethnically to use a "one size fits all" religious regimen in our schools, even as much as I would love to see Christianity taught and practiced.

Home is an entirely different matter. I think each parent, regardless of their religious beliefs, ethnictity, or cultural heritage should teach their children that taking the "high road" morally is always the way to go, and if they don't, utilize proper discipline to insure that this is instilled in their children in order that they will become self-practicing in every situation based on a firm moral foundation because they want to, not because they have to.

[waterboy]

........and I haven't even gotten into this one yet!:clap:

:D

[CHS_CG]

I think some parents are scared to talk to their kids about sex nowadays... I will be totally honest.. I dont remember a single time my mom or dad talked to me about it.. I knew the risks with it and yet I got pregnant 2 1/2 months after I graduated high school.. at 18 years old I was on my way to being a single mother.. at 19 I had Taylor.. WAY TO YOUNG.. would I change my life now.. no way.. but parents just dont alway do enough to prevent things..

On the other hand I do remember being talked to about drugs and I have never nor will I ever touch drugs.

[waterboy]

Originally posted by Bullaholic
I'm like 44'---I am very reluctant to wade in on the religion in schools issue, although I don't mind stating that I call myself a Christian and have very strong personal religious convictions.

I will just simply state that I think there should be equal time during each school day set aside when every student could practice the tennets of their religion alone, or in groups with leaders, or not at all. I don't think that would be harmful to or discriminatory to anyone. Our culture has become just too diverse spiritually and ethnically to use a "one size fits all" religious regimen in our schools, even as much as I would love to see Christianity taught and practiced.
:ditto: What he said!

I think the responsibility ultimately lies with the parents to teach their kids about sex, religion, and life in general. Religion in school certainly wouldn't hurt, but the real problem is too many parents ain't doing their job. What do we do in cases where the parents are not teaching their kids anything? If a kid isn't being disciplined at home, chances are the parents won't allow them to be disciplined in school, either. We, as a society, end up with a grown-up kid with no moral compass. That's the real reason we see deterioration in today's society.

[Pick6]

Originally posted by carter08
if you want your children to have god in school, send them to christian school.

public schools are for everyone, not just the majority. we are not a 100% christian nation,

We're not a 100% Republican or Democrat country either. It seems the majority gets its way there.

[carter08]

Originally posted by Pick6
We're not a 100% Republican or Democrat country either. It seems the majority gets its way there.

there is still opposition from each party that affects politics and decision making.

[Pick6]

Originally posted by carter08
there is still opposition from each party that affects politics and decision making.

There may be discussion, but majority still wins in the end.

[Bullaholic]

I am very surprised that neither BBDE nor R80 has posted on this thread-----yet....:D

[waterboy]

Originally posted by Bullaholic
I am very surprised that neither BBDE nor R80 has posted on this thread-----yet....:D
I'm sure it'll be closed by then. If not, shortly thereafter!:D

[carter08]

Originally posted by Pick6
There may be discussion, but majority still wins in the end.

and every 2 years theres a change in majority and new policies take effect.

with religion, there isn't. christianity will be the majority, and other groups will never have fair treatment if we institute some type of majority religion is taught in school policy.

[BEAST]

Originally posted by carter08
and every 2 years theres a change in majority and new policies take effect.

with religion, there isn't. christianity will be the majority, and other groups will never have fair treatment if we institute some type of majority religion is taught in school policy.

I am the one who brought the God in school a few pages back. All I said was they took God out of school. All that was was a morning prayer. Not a Bible class, although I think it would be great elective. But hell, they dont even teach true history anymore so how could we expect them to teach the Bible? After all, it is truly a historical book




BEAST

[Pick6]

Originally posted by carter08
and every 2 years theres a change in majority and new policies take effect.

with religion, there isn't. christianity will be the majority, and other groups will never have fair treatment if we institute some type of majority religion is taught in school policy.

So majority rules is only good when it benefits your views :rolleyes:

[CHS_CG]

Again it has nothing to do with the Morning prayer or teaching God in school.. why should it be up to the school to do a parents job?? It shouldnt... PERIOD! Its not up to the school to each our kids morals.. or about God.. its the parents.. Thats part of the problem some parents think they can ignore things and the schools and teachers will take care of it.

[carter08]

Originally posted by Pick6
So majority rules is only good when it benefits your views :rolleyes:

thank you for twisting my words.

do you understand that NOT ALL AMERICANS ARE CHRISTIANS.

religion is NOT as simple as politics. you can force someone to accept they are ruled by a different political group. you aren't going to make a person be okay with having a religious view they don't agree with shoved down their throats.

[carter08]

Originally posted by BEAST
I am the one who brought the God in school a few pages back. All I said was they took God out of school. All that was was a morning prayer. Not a Bible class, although I think it would be great elective. But hell, they dont even teach true history anymore so how could we expect them to teach the Bible? After all, it is truly a historical book




BEAST

we have the moment of silence in schools. you can pray then. at columbia high school, there were christian meetings once a week. it was voluntary and worked.

actually TEACHING religion is where the problem will come in.

[waterboy]

Originally posted by BEAST
I am the one who brought the God in school a few pages back. All I said was they took God out of school. All that was was a morning prayer. Not a Bible class, although I think it would be great elective. But hell, they dont even teach true history anymore so how could we expect them to teach the Bible? After all, it is truly a historical book




BEAST
Hey, Beast, in my alma mater, Gilmer, they offer an elective course in Bible History. They don't teach religion, just Bible History. There's no doubt in my mind that there is definitely more FACT in the Bible than in any science book.:clap: It's amazing how people will go out of their way to deny that taking God out of school and government had anything to do with the problems we face today. If nothing else, the Bible provides a moral compass for society to live by, even if you don't believe in it.

[44INAROW]

I think it's time.............. ;) It's been real and it's been fun but it hasn't been "real fun" :D we'll all just have to agree to disagree on this.. so, just "CAUSE I CAN" this thread is officially CLOSED :devil: