Any Sci Fi fans? [Archive] - Texas DownLow Forum

Farmersfan

02-13-2009, 04:20 PM

I just finished a Robert Heinlein book called The door into summer and it brings up a point that might be interesting to discuss with some of you deep thinkers. It concerns time travel and the paradox associated with it.
Here's the issue: Say you have a time machine and you decide right now that 1 week from now you will send a white and brown hampster back in time exactly one week. Suddenly a white and brown hampster appears in your time machine.
1. Is it possible to keep this hampster for one week and then send IT back in time one week?
2. Would you still be required to go to the pet store and purchase the original white and brown hampster which would give you two hampsters until you send the second hampster back in time? Can two versions of a single mass co-exist in the same time?
3. If you decide NOT to purchase a white and brown hampster for the original time travel experiment would the existing hampster suddenly cease to exist?
4. Do you subscribe to the idea that each event is a singular event and creates a seperate timeline which would mean once the hampster appears then nothing in the future can alter THAT timeline?
Any insights?

Old Dog

02-14-2009, 11:51 AM

Gees, that will require a lot of deep thinking; not sure I'm capable of that on a Saturday morn!

sinton66

02-25-2009, 07:26 AM

Originally posted by Farmersfan

1. Is it possible to keep this hampster for one week and then send IT back in time one week?
If possible, you would be altering history.

2. Would you still be required to go to the pet store and purchase the original white and brown hampster which would give you two hampsters until you send the second hampster back in time? Can two versions of a single mass co-exist in the same time?
Yes, a hamster cannot be generated from thin air. At some point you would have to acquire it. Until it's actually done, there's no way to know if the same mass can occupy the same space at the same time. It's possible that the two would "merge" into one. It's also possible they might destroy each other.

3. If you decide NOT to purchase a white and brown hampster for the original time travel experiment would the existing hampster suddenly cease to exist?
If you didn't purchase the hamster, you would have never seen it in the first place.

4. Do you subscribe to the idea that each event is a singular event and creates a seperate timeline which would mean once the hampster appears then nothing in the future can alter THAT timeline?
If that idea is correct, then time travel is impossible.

The only exception on these would be if parallel realities exist.

Farmersfan

02-25-2009, 09:50 AM

[QUOTE]Originally posted by sinton66
The only exception on these would be if parallel realities exist. [/B]

I would think that parallel realities don't exist unless they are created by a time changing event such as our example above.

And if time travel creates a alternate reality then it would be useless as a tool for man. Point: If you send a Army back in time to head off Hitler's advance it would change nothing in your reality. It would alter the future events in the alternate reality that is created the moment the Army reaches it's destination in time but those people have no idea about the actions of Hitler in the "other" future so you really aren't altering anything. This idea is pretty easy to understand and follow but what if it isn't possible to create a alternate reality and time is in a singular reality? If sending something/someone back in time changes the existing reality that you are currently in then it gets mind numbing thinking about all the possible parodoxes.
Example:
Once you have the Hampster that came back in time and then go to the pet store for "the original" hampster, don't you actually have 2 hampsters? And then if you again send the hampster back in time one week then you have to say that two hampsters were sent back in time and that would mean that you actually would have had 3 hampsters once you purchased the original one at the store. ( because 2 would have appeared in your machine in the beginning). Have we just created an unavoidable loop in time????

Farmersfan

02-25-2009, 10:02 AM

[QUOTE]Originally posted by sinton66
If you didn't purchase the hamster, you would have never seen it in the first place.

But you did see it. It appeared in your time machine. If you have the hampster in your possession for 4 days and then decide to NOT send it back in time, what then? It is no more likely for matter to simply cease to exist than it is for matter to suddenly exist where it didn't moments before.

crzyjournalist03

02-25-2009, 10:25 AM

I think it's a lot simpler than what's being made out.

You buy the hamster, and have two hamsters until you send the one you buy back, at which point it becomes the hamster that you've suddenly had with your for a week.

Farmersfan

02-25-2009, 10:50 AM

Originally posted by crzyjournalist03
I think it's a lot simpler than what's being made out.

You buy the hamster, and have two hamsters until you send the one you buy back, at which point it becomes the hamster that you've suddenly had with your for a week.

So how can you have a hampster that you sent back in time? Remember there is only 1 hampster. And what if you send the first hampster back in time instead of the one you buy at the store? Would that matter? I think the reality is explained somewhere in the relationship between point A(one week in the past) and point B(one week in the future). We are examining this scenerio from a stand point of seeing both point A and point B. But if you examine it from a point A standpoint only you will have to say that you receive a hampster from the future and in one week you will send it back in time one week and have NO hampster. Or from point B standpoint of purchasing a hampster at the store and sending it back in time one week and having NO hampster. But combining both views creates the parodox.

Farmersfan

02-25-2009, 10:54 AM

Originally posted by crzyjournalist03
I think it's a lot simpler than what's being made out.

You buy the hamster, and have two hamsters until you send the one you buy back, at which point it becomes the hamster that you've suddenly had with your for a week.

But for the sake of discussion: What if you have the two hamsters and you decide to NOT send one back in time???? Will you continue to have the two hamsters? Will they merge into one? Will the universe implode into a blackhole? Would Obama REALLY stand a chance?

Phil C

02-25-2009, 11:24 AM

They sometimes show Back to the Future part 3 on the Encore Western Channel.

Phil C

02-25-2009, 11:26 AM

TCM is also showing a good Sci Fiction movie called Invasion of the Body Snatchers made in 1956. This is about pods from outer space who take over human bodies. This one was the original and in my opinion the best one made. It will be on TCM on 3-31-09 at 8:30 P.M.

crzyjournalist03

02-25-2009, 12:23 PM

Originally posted by Farmersfan
But for the sake of discussion: What if you have the two hamsters and you decide to NOT send one back in time???? Will you continue to have the two hamsters? Will they merge into one? Will the universe implode into a blackhole? Would Obama REALLY stand a chance?

See, now you're messing with the way the world works...

By receiving the hamster at point A, the decision to send the hamster back in the future has already been made. You no longer have the choice to NOT send the hamster back; that choice has already been made for you. You will send the hamster back. It's unavoidable.

Geez...this is starting to sound like a religious debate on Calvinism lol!

Farmersfan

02-25-2009, 04:31 PM

Originally posted by crzyjournalist03
See, now you're messing with the way the world works...

By receiving the hamster at point A, the decision to send the hamster back in the future has already been made. You no longer have the choice to NOT send the hamster back; that choice has already been made for you. You will send the hamster back. It's unavoidable.

Geez...this is starting to sound like a religious debate on Calvinism lol!

Makes sense to me! Since the decision is already made you now become a ZOMBIE who has no choice but to follow the path that the future "you" took. So that's where Zombies come from! But what happens if you get so scared you have a heart attack and die when the hamster appears in your time machine the first time? Have you killed your past self? Would that effect your future self? And have you ever been in a Turkish Prison?

crzyjournalist03

02-25-2009, 04:38 PM

Originally posted by Farmersfan
Makes sense to me! Since the decision is already made you now become a ZOMBIE who has no choice but to follow the path that the future "you" took. So that's where Zombies come from! But what happens if you get so scared you have a heart attack and die when the hamster appears in your time machine the first time? Have you killed your past self? Would that effect your future self? And have you ever been in a Turkish Prison?

Well, if you die in the past, your future is dead as well. Unless you become immortalized in legend as the guy who sent a hamster back in time, in which case your spirit would live on forever...

Joey, have you ever seen a grown man naked?

Farmersfan

02-25-2009, 08:07 PM

Originally posted by crzyjournalist03
Well, if you die in the past, your future is dead as well. Unless you become immortalized in legend as the guy who sent a hamster back in time, in which case your spirit would live on forever...

Joey, have you ever seen a grown man naked?

But if you die when the hamster arrives in the past then you are not alive to send it back in time one week later. And I am serious so stop calling me Shirley!!!!

sinton66

02-25-2009, 11:50 PM

Remember this, it is a SPACE/time continuum. If you send the hamster back, who says it has to appear in your time machine? It might appear in your neighbor's lunch pail.

PPHSfan

02-26-2009, 01:13 AM

Why use a brown and white hamster? Why not send back a blonde with big boobs?

OMG The automatic pilot is deflating.

Farmersfan

02-26-2009, 09:42 AM

Originally posted by PPHSfan
Why use a brown and white hamster? Why not send back a blonde with big boobs?

OMG The automatic pilot is deflating.

Everyone knows silicone can't time travel!!!!!!!

"Joey, do you like movies about gladiators?"

Phil C

02-26-2009, 11:42 AM

I double checked and TCM is also showing other great Sci-Fi movies on March 31 and early April 1. You may want to check your tv guide that day and choose the ones you want to record or watch. One good one is the 1958 movie I Married a Monster From Outer Space. It is a good movie in which aliens take over earth bodies including a newlyweed (Tom Tyron) as well as others including the police chief. It is probably more of a Sci Fi mystery movie type but it is well done and stars Gloria Talbott and Tom Tyron as the young married couple. It starts at 7 P.M. on 3-31-09.
Another fantastic one which was ahead of its' time is the great 1956 Color movie called Forbidden Planet. It introduced Robby the Robot and is well made with a great cast and story and the color is beautiful. There were several great sci-fiction movies made in the 50s that were ahead of their times and just as good today as when first released and this is one of them.
It stars Walter Pidgeon as Dr. Marbius, Anne Frances as Altaira, Leslie Nelson (from Naked Gun movies) as Adams, Jack Kelly (later Bat Masterson) as Farmar. Earl Holiman as the cook, and James Druary (later The Virginian) as Stacy. These are great movies of that type and if you are a Sci-Fi space movie fan you won't be disappointed. It starts at 1 A.M. on 4-1-09.

PPHSfan

02-27-2009, 08:31 AM

Originally posted by Farmersfan
Everyone knows silicone can't time travel!!!!!!!

"Joey, do you like movies about gladiators?"

Two Words...Big Naturals

"It's ok....I speak Jive"

Farmersfan

02-27-2009, 08:57 AM

Originally posted by PPHSfan
Two Words...Big Naturals

"It's ok....I speak Jive"

So now you want to change the subject to your favorite magazine?????

" I've got to concentrate...
concentrate... concentrate... I've got to concentrate... concentrate... concentrate... Hello?... hello... hello... Echo... echo... echo... Pinch hitting for Pedro Borbon... Manny Mota... Mota... Mota... "

crzyjournalist03

02-27-2009, 09:45 AM

Originally posted by Farmersfan
But if you die when the hamster arrives in the past then you are not alive to send it back in time one week later. And I am serious so stop calling me Shirley!!!!

People with weak hearts shouldn't mess around with time machines, just like pregnant women shouldn't get on roller coasters.

"Listen, and you listen close. Flying a plane is no different than riding a bicycle, just a lot harder to put baseball cards in the spokes."

Farmersfan

03-02-2009, 09:41 AM

Originally posted by crzyjournalist03
People with weak hearts shouldn't mess around with time machines, just like pregnant women shouldn't get on roller coasters.

"Listen, and you listen close. Flying a plane is no different than riding a bicycle, just a lot harder to put baseball cards in the spokes."

So what if YOU go back in time one week? Now there are two of you.
So the questions that have plagued mankind for centuries=
Who gets to sleep with your wife for that entire week????? And is it a "LEGAL" double team?

"There's no reason to become alarmed, and we hope you'll enjoy the rest of your flight. By the way, is there anyone on board who knows how to fly a plane?"

piratebg

03-15-2009, 06:01 AM

Originally posted by Farmersfan
So what if YOU go back in time one week? Now there are two of you.
So the questions that have plagued mankind for centuries=
Who gets to sleep with your wife for that entire week????? And is it a "LEGAL" double team?

Now that would be a great story to share with the guys.

"Yeah, this one time I had a three-way with me and my wife." :smoker:

"Do you know what it's like to fall in the mud and get kicked... in the head... with an iron boot? Of course you don't, no one does. It never happens. Sorry, Ted, that's a dumb question... skip that."

Farmersfan

03-15-2009, 08:12 AM

[QUOTE]Originally posted by piratebg
[B]Now that would be a great story to share with the guys.

"Yeah, this one time I had a three-way with me and my wife." :smoker:

Which brings up two great questions.
1. Would you be insulted if your wife showed more interest in you than in you?
2. Would it be gay if you got a little too involved with you?????? :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: