cleveland and/or coldspring in ratings...

[trojandad]

if you'd like to pick a winner, i'd like to see it, for sure, but i see cleveland as high as 6th in some of your polls, so my question is this....

if cleveland squeaks by coldspring, where are they in your poll...

if cleveland blows out coldspring, where are they....

if coldspring squeaks by cleveland, do they break into your poll and where....

and if coldspring blows out cleveland, do they make your poll and where....


especially curious about you guys from the board that came to see coldspring or cleveland last week, if you would....



thanks, all.....

[SintonFan_inAustin]

havent seen neither team obivously and i hadn't noticed them til somebody pointed them out and they have some impressive numbers. so is Coldspring considered a test for Cleveland?

[navscanmaster]

I think Cleveland will beat Coldspring soundly. Cleveland has earned a lot of respect from everybody that takes the time to look around the state and see what is going on before making their polls. Their offense is rolling strong, and their defense has been stout all year long. The 30-0 win over 5A New Caney really caught everybody's attention. If Coldspring were to beat them, I am afraid that both teams would probably not be in the polls. District 22 has always been viewed as lesser in competition, and it is unfair. But when you have Tarkington, Shepherd, Splendora and company to pad stats against every year, it takes a lot for people to take you seriously. Look at last year's winner, Splendora: they roll easily through the district, then are destroyed by a Jasper team that even with several players back has struggled tremendously. I personally know of the history Coldspring has, and their time will come again to rise to the top of 3A football. I think it comes down to the coaching and support in that area of Southeast Texas. There isn't much money out there, and the fanbase and even some of the students can be difficult to deal with. Cleveland should make a lot of noise in the playoffs this year, and they will raise the bar for D-22 next year. I wish you the best, trojandad.

[trojandad]

they play each other pretty close each year, except for two years ago when we put 40-0 on them....a few yrs back we played a great game against them, putting their qb out with a broken leg at the end of the 1st half, and coming back from 3 td down to beat them slightly....

the only team that we have in common that caused both teams some strain is huffman, and we had a slightly easier time with huffman than cleveland, beating them by a td more, both teams giving up the same amount of pts to huffman (30-14, 21-11)...

cleveland has played far weaker competition outside of district than coldspring has, with coldspring losing to diboll 40-36 at their place....so we're prolly the best competition cleveland's gonna see in district, and coldspring their best foe as well....

coldspring isn't chopped liver, but as much as i'd like to homer my team, i never saw either team as state ranked material as the season started....now all of a sudden cleveland is showing up WAY high in the ratings...possibly they are that good but if we're talking records, our record against similar opponents has been similar at worst (we thrashed shepherd and tarkington as they have)...and superior against the better opponents we've had in common....

my whole reason for the thread is i was tryin to see cleveland as others have from a distance.....if someone has cleveland in the top 10, which may be true, does that mean that coldspring would be up that high should we beat them on their turf?

[navscanmaster]

Originally posted by trojandad

coldspring isn't chopped liver, but as much as i'd like to homer my team, i never saw either team as state ranked material as the season started....now all of a sudden cleveland is showing up WAY high in the ratings...possibly they are that good but if we're talking records, our record against similar opponents has been similar at worst (we thrashed shepherd and tarkington as they have)...and superior against the better opponents we've had in common....

my whole reason for the thread is i was tryin to see cleveland as others have from a distance.....if someone has cleveland in the top 10, which may be true, does that mean that coldspring would be up that high should we beat them on their turf?
Simple answer, no. From everything you just typed, basically Cleveland would be viewed by most as overrated. Thus, both would fall from most everyone's favor. Maybe Coldspring would get a vote or two, that would have to depend on how Diboll does against Carthage this week as well. If Coldspring beats Cleveland, and Diboll beats Carthage, then I would sneak Coldspring in there somewhere around 22-23 or so. But many people that post rankings usually mix a little homerism with regional favor, while leaving the high profile 3A's like Celina, LH, Wylie, Cuero and such in there to make it look believable. It is not always there fault - with 90 or so games going on per week, some of them 800 miles away from each other, it is kind of hard to get a gauge on every team in the state. Once again, good luck.

[SintonFan_inAustin]

:) not easy putting polls together as you will always leave out teams, Would any of you consider Rio Hondo a top 25 team? most likely no because you never seen them and will go by the conclussion valley teams are weak.

[trojandad]

makes a lotta sense, especially the east texas and local economical reasons....

one thing to coldspring's advantage is a change in superintendents....we got a former ag guy from splendora in 96 the same year we last went to the semis and almost beat sealy....he really made life hell on athletics and supporting clubs in coldspring (the stories i could tell)....but he was booted last year and just these last two yrs have been far from strife filled toward athletics....in fact, during that run was our 2003 team which played pudlugger's la grange team which many here feel was a far stronger team than even the 1996 team....now our superintendent is a sister to one of the historically athletic families from coldspring and knows the importance of athletics in such a small town....

[navscanmaster]

Originally posted by trojandad
makes a lotta sense, especially the east texas and local economical reasons....

one thing to coldspring's advantage is a change in superintendents....we got a former ag guy from splendora in 96 the same year we last went to the semis and almost beat sealy....he really made life hell on athletics and supporting clubs in coldspring (the stories i could tell)....but he was booted last year and just these last two yrs have been far from strife filled toward athletics....in fact, during that run was our 2003 team which played pudlugger's la grange team which many here feel was a far stronger team than even the 1996 team....now our superintendent is a sister to one of the historically athletic families from coldspring and knows the importance of athletics in such a small town....

Yeah, I lived in Waterwood for a year or so while I was working for the prison, so I got to know the Coldspring ISD attitude towards athletics. They were hungry for success when I moved away in 05, so I know they are busting at the seams with anticipation, trojandad. I think WOS is too powerful a first round opponent, but district 22 should be able to get two wins against a district 21 that is down somewhat this year.

[trojandad]

which is why a win against cleveland gives us hardin jefferson in the first round, a heck of an incentive.....as well as the outright district championship.....

a wo-s team against us should be a big favorite, but wo-s has had problems with barbay teams in the past....lol....

good input, navscanmaster.....

[sahen]

district 22 is always a question mark until the playoffs...normally if any of the teams are ranked then they are over rated due to the traditionally weak competition in the district (have seen this happen a couple times with Liberty even back when 22 was a bit stronger w/ Barber's Hill and Huffman having good teams as well), but every once and a while one of those teams is actually pretty darn good and they show it come playoff time....i dunno if it is cleveland's or coldspring's year or not but we will see come playoff time.....

on a side note...district 22 now has great potential for the future, maybe to be even better than the late 90s to early 2000s era when Barber's Hill, Huffman, and Liberty were going strong...Cleveland is turning it on along with Coldsprings and Huffman...If Liberty can get their act back together and Splendora keep up where they are then thats 5 good teams competiting for 3 playoff spots.......that can be some good football...

[trojandad]

i agree, especially about liberty...i wish i knew how to get tape onto digital, because i have the last 2:00 of the 2002 coldspring-liberty game on tape when it was such a close ending that both teams shook hands at the end of the game thinking they each won, this game along with the 94 tyler-plano game were the best endings ever....liberty seems to always come with big strong linemen every year, INCLUDING a few years back when they beat a state ranked bridge city team early in the year....

as someone said earlier, a tiny bit more investment in each team by their locals would sure reap big benefits....if either town ever takes the example from tiny celina, they sure have some athletes...

[j_dog]

And Coldspring has a new coach named Barbay? That could be making a HUGE difference. :thinking:

[trojandad]

i sure like barbay, i really hope we can make him comfy here....

and i know coach tullos doesn't have a state winning dad like barbay, but MAN has he done a good job at cleveland, a really difficult job for many reasons....if either of these guys won state in the future it wouldn't surprise me in the least.....

[Necks_Fan]

What is coldspring's record?

Opponents and scores?

[trojandad]

Aug 29 Crockett Bulldogs Home 6-21

Sept 5 Madisonville Mustangs Away 52-34

Sept 12 Corrigan-Camden Bulldogs Away canc.

Sept 20 Diboll Lumberjacks Away 36-40

Sept 27 *Huffman Hargrave Falcons Away 30-14

Oct 3 *Shepherd Pirates Homecoming Home 49-18

Oct 10 *Tarkington Longhorns Away 45-19

Oct 24 *Splendora Wildcats Home 42-0

This week *Cleveland Indians Away

Net week *Liberty Panthers Home


coldspring website is:
http://www.angelfire.com/tx2/trojans/index.html


one of the assistant coaches works the page and he gets busy every now and then but overall is a good summary page for us...

[bona fide]

cleveland's slot-t must be really clicking :clap:

[offduty]

how do these teams really matchup? cleveland runs a slot-t from what i've heard to coldsprings' what kind of defense? coldsprings runs what kind of offense to clevelands what kind of defense?

is one team bigger, more powerhouse?
is one team faster, more outrun you kind of team?

[WOS1]

Originally posted by trojandad
a wo-s team against us should be a big favorite, but wo-s has had problems with barbay teams in the past....lol....


WOS is 7-0 against Barbay teams...

[trojandad]

geez at the right fighter....

first, i never said a barbay team won one time.....

second, i would call losing to wo-s by 6 points and wo-s only scoring 12 when wo-s gave up an average of over 22 ppg against 4a competition giving someone "problems"....also when considering they were a class below you guys....98 was a tough game as well....

i give you guys props all over the place....teams that don't have the blessings you guys have look for things to build on...what i said was correct and perfectly supportive to say....geez louise......:hand

let me change the part you obviously missed, wo-s shouldn't be a big favorite against us, they WILL be a big favorite....but i still believe it'll be a big favorite against cleveland....cleveland has nobody faster than scott and he's a half man larger than most of who he plays....and diboll will take carthage, too....lol...

[thepatriot]

I think you are wrong trojandad. Cleveland has about 4 guys that are faster than Scott. Have you seen them play? I have watched both teams and I am inpressed with both but I have to say that Cleveland has the more complete team. Friday will answer a lot of questions, I will give the edge to the Indians in a very good game.

[trojandad]

i was just going by last years track meet, but you may be right...the one thing i do know is i like cleveland's defensive scheme better than coldspring and i believe in defense on games like this....

coldspring's strength has always been their team speed, i don't remember the last team we played that we were just outrun....even in last years playoff game against wo-s (which scott missed), johnson took the corner on wo-s and just left guys behind....they adjusted and shut us down after but speed has never been our problem, line play and good defensive schemes have been....

cleveland has some athletes, man oh man, watching them on the basketball court shows how many pure athletes they have and coach tullos has done a great job of slowly breaking the mindset that has only had the best athletes holding out for roundball...i really like what cleveland has done....

the only game i saw in person was the huffman game for cleveland (and coldspring's game with them, obviously)...can't put too much on one opponent but we took care of business much better against them than cleveland did....we took a two touchdown lead in the first quarter and cleveland was ahead by 3 with 6+ minutes left...against huffman our offense put four offensive touchdowns against them while cleveland had 2 offensive tds with a kickoff return late....i saw tapes of clevelands games with tarkington and shepherd but they handled them as we did....cleveland did a better job of scoring on them than we did because we were shooting off our mouths celebrating and late hitting while 3 tds were getting called back....

thats why i said in a post that i truly believe that cleveland has a better defensive scheme and i know that we can shoot ourselves in the foot with penalties, so we'd have to stay penalty free....but our offense has handled the defense in our district ranked highest much easier than cleveland did....i believe the numbers show we have a better offense, they have a better defense....

what i'm hoping is that our schedule of playing a tougher pre district schedule than cleveland will have us more used to pulling out close games, i've always been a believer in going 0-4 in pre district games against powerhouses than 4-0 against cupcakes....i know people put weight on the new caney win, i did too at the time, i was amamzed, but now that the season is mostly past we see that new caney has had the power numbers in 5a that, say, shepherd does in 3a rankings....i'm hoping playing two state ranked teams in predistrict will reap benefits....

i do know this, the cleveland team i saw in huffman isn't a top 10 team in the state....we played wo-s last yr, THAT was a top 10 (more like top 5) team...i know for certain they are overranked....i'm very proud of them, i went to cleveland with most of the dads of the kids on the team now and if we lose, man am i gonna have a debt to pay.....lol....but some of the dads won't bet with me on the game because they've seen coldspring and the ones that do have admitted that they have gotten overestimated in most polls....

i do think that cleveland might be a top 20-25 team with that defense but if we beat them, that's where i think we belong as well....it'll be the best game this district has to offer...and i'm pretty sure the winner will beat hardin jefferson in the next round, but neither team has a good chance against wo-s.....

[WOS1]

Originally posted by trojandad
geez at the right fighter....

first, i never said a barbay team won one time.....

second, i would call losing to wo-s by 6 points and wo-s only scoring 12 when wo-s gave up an average of over 22 ppg against 4a competition giving someone "problems"....also when considering they were a class below you guys....98 was a tough game as well....

i give you guys props all over the place....teams that don't have the blessings you guys have look for things to build on...what i said was correct and perfectly supportive to say....geez louise......:hand

let me change the part you obviously missed, wo-s shouldn't be a big favorite against us, they WILL be a big favorite....but i still believe it'll be a big favorite against cleveland....cleveland has nobody faster than scott and he's a half man larger than most of who he plays....and diboll will take carthage, too....lol...

EASY now big Pa Pa. Just giving a little history. I know you are new to "Barbays", so I thought I would let you in on the record. Jeez...

By the way, I think that whichever team we play, it will be a tough game.

[trojandad]

i wish i was new to barbays (or anything for that matter...lol)...ive been driving up from cleveland and watchin senior barbay as an asst since 19*&%&^&%...(do i have to tell? geez at my age...lol)....

well everyone be safe, am about to leave for cleveland....be back later to eat crow or lamb....good luck to everyone and their sons tonight....:D