1/3 of americans, or approximately 50%, say high schools dont prep kids for college

[jason]

Poll: Schools not properly preparing kids

By NANCY ZUCKERBROD and TREVOR TOMPSON
Associated Press Writers


WASHINGTON (AP) -- It's not much of a report card.

Half of Americans say U.S. schools are doing only a fair to poor job preparing kids for college and the work force. Even more feel that way about the skills kids need to survive as adults, an Associated Press poll released Friday finds.

"A lot of kids, when they get out school, are kind of lost," said Jamie Norton, a firefighter in Gridley, Calif. "When you get out of high school, what are you educated to do?"

The views of the general population echo concerns from business and college leaders, who say they have to spend a lot of time and money on remedial education for people who completed high school but don't have the skills to succeed at work or in higher education.

Education ranks behind the economy and gas prices as a top issue for Americans, the survey said. However, nearly all those polled said the quality of a country's education system has a big impact on a country's overall economic prosperity.

Education was generally viewed to be as important as health care and slightly ahead of the Iraq war. Among minority parents, education is just as important an issue as the economy.

Minorities and whites rate schools differently. Fifty-nine percent of whites rate their local school as good or excellent, compared with 42 percent of minorities.

Minority parents are more likely to think their children are getting a better education than they received as children. Overall, the majority of those surveyed said the quality of U.S. schools has declined over the past 20 years.

Three-fourths of those surveyed believe schools place too much emphasis on the wrong subjects. Asked what subjects should be given more time in school, more than a third said math. English was a distant second, at 21 percent. A tiny fraction picked art, music and the sciences, such as biology and chemistry.

Parents may want more math in school because they feel unprepared to help at home, said Janine Remillard, who teaches math-related courses at the University of Pennsylvania's education school.

"Math is the subject that parents are often intimidated by," she said. "We've allowed a lot of kids to just say, 'I'm not good at math,' .... and those kids become parents."

Most think the United States is just keeping up or falling behind the rest of the world in education. On some recent international tests, U.S. students have posted flat scores and landed in the middle to bottom of the pack when compared with other nation's children.

Americans have mixed views about standardized tests, which have grown in importance. The 2002 federal No Child Left Behind law judges schools based on math and reading tests taken by their students. Schools face increasingly tough consequences for scores that miss the mark.

About half of those polled said standardized tests measure the quality of education offered by schools well, while the rest disagree.

The vast majority think classroom work and homework - not standardized tests - are the best ways to measure how well students are doing.

Larry Michalec, a computer programmer in San Deigo, called the testing a waste of time. "They're standardized and people aren't standardized," he said. "Children get taught to the test. They get taught to take the test. They don't get taught to learn."

School districts are increasingly tying student performance to teacher pay. Americans seem to support that trend. Sixty percent said the amount of pay teachers receive should be based at least in part on the performance of their students.

The nation is split over whether teachers should be allowed to strike, with half thinking strikes should be allowed. Whether strikes are allowed is governed by state law.

The AP survey of 833 adults and 854 parents of school-aged children was conducted June 18-23 and had a margin of sampling error of plus or minus 3.4 percentage points for each sample.

The poll was conducted over the Internet by Knowledge Networks, which initially contacted people using traditional telephone polling methods and followed with online interviews. People chosen for the study who had no Internet access were given it for free.

The research was financially supported by the Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation. The Associated Press had sole editorial responsibility for the design of the survey questionnaire and the analysis of the survey results.

---

Associated Press writer Christine Simmons contributed to this report.



LINK (http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/A/AP_POLL_EDUCATION?SITE=AP)

[Necks_Fan]

1/3 of Americans, or approximately 50%?



:confused: :thinking:

[GreenMonster]

Here's a novel idea, stop allowing legislators to dictate what gets taught in school, and start teaching your kids to have a little initiative at home. I am a teacher that fully agrees that we send entirely too many students out into the real world without the skills needed to survive much less prosper. Between being forced to teach to a test so that the school can get high ratings and more money and fighting parents that think their children shouldn't be held responsible for their own actions or in many cases inactions, it is becoming harder and harder to prepare these kids for life. At my school we were given a directive to give much less homework and spend more class time on what would usually be homework because of the large amounts of kids refusing to do homework. The parents were upset that little Johnny and Little Jane were having to eat lunch in lunch detention while working on past due homework. Hello!!! Take care of this problem at home instead of complaining that we are being unfair because lunch is supposed to be time for them to unwind and relax from the stresses of school for 30 minutes.

[Necks_Fan]

Originally posted by GreenMonster
Here's a novel idea, stop allowing legislators to dictate what gets taught in school, and start teaching your kids to have a little initiative at home. I am a teacher that fully agrees that we send entirely too many students out into the real world without the skills needed to survive much less prosper. Between being forced to teach to a test so that the school can get high ratings and more money and fighting parents that think their children shouldn't be held responsible for their own actions or in many cases inactions, it is becoming harder and harder to prepare these kids for life. At my school we were given a directive to give much less homework and spend more class time on what would usually be homework because of the large amounts of kids refusing to do homework. The parents were upset that little Johnny and Little Jane were having to eat lunch in lunch detention while working on past due homework. Hello!!! Take care of this problem at home instead of complaining that we are being unfair because lunch is supposed to be time for them to unwind and relax from the stresses of school for 30 minutes. I don't know if it was because I finally made it to the high er level courses and so the amount went down and difficulty up, or because the school said so, but either way, it was very nice.:)

[AP Panther Fan]

The core subject tests (or whatever they are called) are supposed to replace taks tests with the freshman of 2011.....

Now, my question to some of you teachers, does that mean that you start your freshman year in 2011 or end it in 2011? I have a daughter going into 7th grade.

[STANG RED]

I know that my daughter and many of her classmates went on to college and have done extremely well. But I also know of many that have not done so well, and yet they came out of the very same classes my daughter did. It seems to me that the school did a fine job, but for some reason some just didnt get it. But I dont know what more the school could have done, or done differentley. Some get it and some dont for whatever reason. And when I was in school 30+ years ago, guess what,,,,,,,,,,,,it was the same back then. And my bet is, it will be the same 30 years from now. But education is a political football that someone is always going to be kicking around, and claiming they have the answers to fix it all. But the problem isnt as much in the system, as it is in the home. And nobody has found a fix to that one yet.

[SWMustang]

I have come to find that college doesn't properly prepare kids for the job world.

[LH Panther Mom]

Originally posted by STANG RED
I know that my daughter and many of her classmates went on to college and have done extremely well. But I also know of many that have not done so well, and yet they came out of the very same classes my daughter did. It seems to me that the school did a fine job, but for some reason some just didnt get it. But I dont know what more the school could have done, or done differentley. Some get it and some dont for whatever reason. And when I was in school 30+ years ago, guess what,,,,,,,,,,,,it was the same back then. And my bet is, it will be the same 30 years from now. But education is a political football that someone is always going to be kicking around, and claiming they have the answers to fix it all. But the problem isnt as much in the system, as it is in the home. And nobody has found a fix to that one yet.
Very true! In some cases, it may not be the "not getting it" as much as the "not getting to class" once they get there. ;)

[mustang04]

i never studied in highschool and have only twice in college....and that was including the 2 and a half years of pre-med...now i have about 140 hours...taking 13 in the fall...sitting with a 3.4 i believe along with making the dean's list multiple times....school is a joke in general ha....buuuut then again im not one of those taking quamtum physics...but it sounds interesting!

[easttexas3a]

Education in general is a tough thing to accomplish with a big % of kids getting a college degree. I mean lets be honest from Kindergarten to the end of College their are so many outside issues that can keep you from making it out. And like someone else said, even after you get your degree most arn't ready for the job world. Their are many factors, most importantly being that the kids understand self responsibility and living up to what needs to be done in class. I'm not so sure people should modle themselfes to help kids pass college. Colleges many times have a mid term a final, and a project or paper thrown in between. Very hard to prepare yourself for this other then just opening a book up and studying, and occasionally visiting wikipedia :)

But do not ever forget these teachers 95% of the time are wanting to do everything in their power to help educate your kids, and for about 50% of the kids they are the only "Adults" in their lives, especially with coaches which we are all familiar with as high sources of giving kids character. Sometime when you get a chance, thank your son or daughters teacher, they will appreciate it.

[garciap77]

Originally posted by easttexas3a
Education in general is a tough thing to accomplish with a big % of kids getting a college degree. I mean lets be honest from Kindergarten to the end of College their are so many outside issues that can keep you from making it out. And like someone else said, even after you get your degree most arn't ready for the job world. Their are many factors, most importantly being that the kids understand self responsibility and living up to what needs to be done in class. I'm not so sure people should modle themselfes to help kids pass college. Colleges many times have a mid term a final, and a project or paper thrown in between. Very hard to prepare yourself for this other then just opening a book up and studying, and occasionally visiting wikipedia :)

But do not ever forget these teachers 95% of the time are wanting to do everything in their power to help educate your kids, and for about 50% of the kids they are the only "Adults" in their lives, especially with coaches which we are all familiar with as high sources of giving kids character. Sometime when you get a chance, thank your son or daughters teacher, they will appreciate it.

I say it's the parents that can really make the difference. The teachers can only do so much.

[BEAST]

Originally posted by Necks_Fan
1/3 of Americans, or approximately 50%?



:confused: :thinking:

Proof of poor math teaching going on.

BEAST

[RiverRat19]

It starts at home... If my parents had not ridden me to do well and insisted that I would go to some kind of training after HS (college/trade school/etc) then I probably wouldn't have been so determined to do it.

The POLITICAL emphasis on standardized testing is also hurting students. Yes, there's data to say that kids are or aren't being taught from these tests BUT does it really help them? Not as much as a good vocational and well-rounded (which includes character or leadership) education in the schools. Why are the PE, shop, AG and Fine Arts classes being eliminated all over the place?... The schools don't have the funds to support them OR their math and science scores aren't as good as they "should be"... Get the politicans out of the education business if we really want MORE quality learning going on in public schools.

And parents need to stop expecting the teachers and schools to "fix" their kids and start to try to do it more themselves...

[pirate4state]

Originally posted by RiverRat19
It starts at home... If my parents had not ridden me to do well and insisted that I would go to some kind of training after HS (college/trade school/etc) then I probably wouldn't have been so determined to do it.

The POLITICAL emphasis on standardized testing is also hurting students. Yes, there's data to say that kids are or aren't being taught from these tests BUT does it really help them? Not as much as a good vocational and well-rounded (which includes character or leadership) education in the schools. Why are the PE, shop, AG and Fine Arts classes being eliminated all over the place?... The schools don't have the funds to support them OR their math and science scores aren't as good as they "should be"... Get the politicans out of the education business if we really want MORE quality learning going on in public schools.

And parents need to stop expecting the teachers and schools to "fix" their kids and start to try to do it more themselves...

:iagree:

Also, some kids just aren't cut out for college, for whatever reason, so the schools should keep the shop, ag and other type(s) of vocational courses to prepare these kids to enter the job force.

I hate standardized testing.

I'll leave you with a quote from Llyod Dobler:

I don't want to sell anything, buy anything, or process anything as a career. I don't want to sell anything bought or processed, or buy anything sold or processed, or process anything sold, bought, or processed, or repair anything sold, bought, or processed. You know, as a career, I don't want to do that. ;)

[sotxrat]

my wife and i have had the pleasure of 4 boys, 3 have graduated from high school, the last will be a senior this year in high school this coming year. all three of the boys that have done high school have been to college and/or are still in attendence. all three that have graduated were not prepared for college in any subject accept english. we have made arrangements the last two years and have had our last child in high school attend special tutoring classes for certain subjects. now he is scoring better than his older brothers on all of his tests for college and the taks (bs test), we are not perfect as parents but our society has let the government take over most high school education and the teachers now have no one to answer to but themselves and that is not right......ok, i will shut up

[Necks_Fan]

For a bunch of grown folks talking about education, there sure is a lot of gramatical errors in this thread. Makes me wonder if the adults in society "were'nt prepped for college."


:thinking:

[LH Panther Mom]

Originally posted by Necks_Fan
"were'nt prepped for college."


:thinking:

Maybe they weren't. :thinking: :thinking:

[Ranger Mom]

I like to pick on "grammar" as well as the next person, but it is SO easy to mistype something on here.

If I am handwriting something, my spelling and punctuation is normally SPOT ON, but it is easy to get ahead of yourself here and transpose letters or misplace punctuation.

My name is Ranger Mom, and sometimes I misspell words on here....even WITH the spell checker. :D

[BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END]

I see this as another excuse as to why someone didn't make it in college. High school teachers care more about you learning and succeeding than college professors ever will, and you get into it what you get out. There were students who graduated ahead of me who put the time and effort into studying when I didn't, and while I personally don't believe they were any smarter than I am, they did better because they put the effort into studying and preparing. These were the same people who do well in college because they disciplined themselves at a previous time to study hard and not procrastinate. It was something that I had to learn the hard way simply because I relied on my natural intelligence to carry me through school, and I don't blame it on my high school, my teachers, or my parents, but instead on myself for screwing off a great opportunity to get myself ready. I'm sorry but you're not going to learn in high school what you're going to learn in college, that is why it is the next step in the education of an individual and not a redundant process. It's more about you sitting down and trying to learn the material without Mom and Dad telling you when to sit down and study or when to go to bed or when to not go out. If you can't take Engineering Calculus the first rattle out of the box, then take Pre-Cal and strengthen your foundation and understanding of mathematical concepts. Anything aside from a math class or a specialized class that is associated with your degree and specialty, every college class is about you sitting down and studying and reading the material; I know, I was a Petroleum Engineering major for three semesters until I had a change of heart. Sure, the TAKS test is a joke and is politically driven to an extent, but don't try to blame the teachers trying to keep their jobs on your kids not studying enough or doing well in college, because it's their fault, and I know for one I'm willing to take the blame for my academic successes or failures because it's not like I didn't have the opportunities given to me along the way.

[Necks_Fan]

Originally posted by LH Panther Mom
Maybe they weren't. :thinking: :thinking: You got me. :clap:

I messed up.:)

[BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END]

Originally posted by Necks_Fan
there sure is a lot of gramatical errors


Actually LHPM, I think this is something that he needed to be quoted on...because there sure are a lot of grammatical errors on here, not to mention spelling as well. ;)

[Necks_Fan]

Originally posted by BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END
Actually LHPM, I think this is something that he needed to be quoted on...because there sure are a lot of grammatical errors on here, not to mention spelling as well. ;) Hey, I'm not a part of the "grown folks" yet.

I never said mine was perfect either, but well, ya.... um....ok.

[LH Panther Mom]

Originally posted by Necks_Fan
Hey, I'm not a part of the "grown folks" yet.

I never said mine was perfect either, but well, ya.... um....ok.
That's all fine and good, until you start commenting about the poor grammar of others. :p

[Old Tiger]

Originally posted by BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END
I see this as another excuse as to why someone didn't make it in college. High school teachers care more about you learning and succeeding than college professors ever will, and you get into it what you get out. There were students who graduated ahead of me who put the time and effort into studying when I didn't, and while I personally don't believe they were any smarter than I am, they did better because they put the effort into studying and preparing. These were the same people who do well in college because they disciplined themselves at a previous time to study hard and not procrastinate. It was something that I had to learn the hard way simply because I relied on my natural intelligence to carry me through school, and I don't blame it on my high school, my teachers, or my parents, but instead on myself for screwing off a great opportunity to get myself ready. I'm sorry but you're not going to learn in high school what you're going to learn in college, that is why it is the next step in the education of an individual and not a redundant process. It's more about you sitting down and trying to learn the material without Mom and Dad telling you when to sit down and study or when to go to bed or when to not go out. If you can't take Engineering Calculus the first rattle out of the box, then take Pre-Cal and strengthen your foundation and understanding of mathematical concepts. Anything aside from a math class or a specialized class that is associated with your degree and specialty, every college class is about you sitting down and studying and reading the material; I know, I was a Petroleum Engineering major for three semesters until I had a change of heart. Sure, the TAKS test is a joke and is politically driven to an extent, but don't try to blame the teachers trying to keep their jobs on your kids not studying enough or doing well in college, because it's their fault, and I know for one I'm willing to take the blame for my academic successes or failures because it's not like I didn't have the opportunities given to me along the way. two of the smartest people in our grade didn't even try....

[Gontex]

Thank you, well said. I had a long response to you post, but decided these four words cover it nicely.



Originally posted by GreenMonster
Here's a novel idea, stop allowing legislators to dictate what gets taught in school, and start teaching your kids to have a little initiative at home. I am a teacher that fully agrees that we send entirely too many students out into the real world without the skills needed to survive much less prosper. Between being forced to teach to a test so that the school can get high ratings and more money and fighting parents that think their children shouldn't be held responsible for their own actions or in many cases inactions, it is becoming harder and harder to prepare these kids for life. At my school we were given a directive to give much less homework and spend more class time on what would usually be homework because of the large amounts of kids refusing to do homework. The parents were upset that little Johnny and Little Jane were having to eat lunch in lunch detention while working on past due homework. Hello!!! Take care of this problem at home instead of complaining that we are being unfair because lunch is supposed to be time for them to unwind and relax from the stresses of school for 30 minutes.

[mustang04]

i might type crappy sometimes cuz i dont really care! like the word dont that i just typed twice haha ....i KNOW it is don't and even more proper do not...but i type whatever is faster at the time because i like to make my messages very succinct THANK YOU!

[SintonFan]

Originally posted by Necks_Fan
1/3 of Americans, or approximately 50%?



:confused: :thinking:




Originally posted by BEAST
Proof of poor math teaching going on.

BEAST
.
Don't you realize that the difference of those two numbers reflect how many illegals and their kids live here now? Now THAT'S beastly...
read it again... :D :D :D