Click it or Ticket

[S_Tex_3A_Fan]

Isn't this the biggest croc of smelly stuff ever? Corpus wrote almost 1400 tickets at ($149 - $200 a pop). Someone riding a motorcycle can go without a helmet, but I can't, by my own choosing, not wear a seatbelt. They need to allow someone who doesn't wear a seatbelt to buy extra insurance like the motorcycle people who don't wear a helmet do.

No I didn't get a ticket, the law just makes me mad!!!

[BreckTxLonghorn]

What's so wrong/hard with wearing a seatbelt?

[eppy 12]

Originally posted by S_Tex_3A_Fan
Isn't this the biggest croc of smelly stuff ever? Corpus wrote almost 1400 tickets at ($149 - $200 a pop). Someone riding a motorcycle can go without a helmet, but I can't, by my own choosing, not wear a seatbelt. They need to allow someone who doesn't wear a seatbelt to buy extra insurance like the motorcycle people who don't wear a helmet do.

No I didn't get a ticket, the law just makes me mad!!! but you are more intelligent than the non-helmet rider? wear a belt man, we always read tradgedy on these boards.:thinking:

[kaorder1999]

yeah, I hate that the police are enforcing a law that is meant to save your life! :D

[S_Tex_3A_Fan]

My car should be my choice.

Have seen wrecks go both ways one death because of no belt. Two saved lives because they weren't wearing a belt.

Just doesn't make sense to me, they make people in a car wear a belt but let some moron on a motor cycle without a helmet.

[Emerson1]

He has a point

[ronwx5x]

Originally posted by Emerson1
He has a point

That they should both be morons?

[3afan]

getting worked up over nothing IMO ... wear your seatbelt, it will increase your odds if you are in a wreck ... its just stupid not to

find something more important to spend your energy ....

[BreckTxLonghorn]

Originally posted by S_Tex_3A_Fan
My car should be my choice.

Have seen wrecks go both ways one death because of no belt. Two saved lives because they weren't wearing a belt.

Just doesn't make sense to me, they make people in a car wear a belt but let some moron on a motor cycle without a helmet.

But they moron on the motorcycles pays a lot more for insurance, and pays a lot more when he/she crashes.

[rockdale80]

Why is it not your choice? Because it saves insurance companies money! It was not lobbied for by people interested in self preservation, or groups that truly care about the overall welfare of the average citizen. It was pushed by insurance companies to save them money. I love it when a government makes up my mind for me on an issue that does not effect them one way or another. I also feel like it should be my choice. 99.9% of the time I wear my seatbelt, but on the off chance I forget I dont want to be ticketed for it. Pretty ridiculous.

[rangerjim]

I for one don't care if you choose not to wear your belt and you end up horribly mangled for life in an accident. I do mind when my insuarnace rates as a seat belt wearer is increased to pay for the morons who get mangled for life....................

IT IS your choice to wear one or not - IT IS your choice to be a ding-dong - IT IS your choice to drink out of a IV and pee in a bag next to your bed and have loved ones change your Depends the rest of your life. LIFE IS CHOICES!!!!! Enough said.

[ronwx5x]

Originally posted by rockdale80
Why is it not your choice? Because it saves insurance companies money! It was not lobbied for by people interested in self preservation, or groups that truly care about the overall welfare of the average citizen. It was pushed by insurance companies to save them money. I love it when a government makes up my mind for me on an issue that does not effect them one way or another. I also feel like it should be my choice. 99.9% of the time I wear my seatbelt, but on the off chance I forget I dont want to be ticketed for it. Pretty ridiculous.

The point you're missing here is that wearing seat belts is a win, win, win, win situation. Insurance companies save on claims, drivers save on injuries and even death, families don't have to mourn, and my taxes don't go up to cover uninsured motorists or cyclists who wind up in the hospital and leave us with the bills.

It's not all me, me, me, me. Others (family, friends, taxpayers) are affected by one's poor choices even though they have done nothing wrong.

[rockdale80]

Originally posted by ronwx5x
The point you're missing here is that wearing seat belts is a win, win, win, win situation. Insurance companies save on claims, drivers save on injuries and even death, families don't have to mourn, and my taxes don't go up to cover uninsured motorists or cyclists who wind up in the hospital and leave us with the bills.

It's not all me, me, me, me. Others (family, friends, taxpayers) are affected by one's poor choices even though they have done nothing wrong.

Wrong and I disagree. It should be MY CHOICE. Your rates are affected by YOUR driving record. Did your rates go down when the seat belt law passed? Is that a No I hear you mutter? You say that they save you money, but show me where rates were decreased because of this miracle law. Like I said. It benefits insurance companies and that is why it was passed. As I said earlier, I wear my seatbelt from a practical and safety standpoint, but ultimately I feel like the decision should belong to me and no one else.

[pirate4state]

Originally posted by rockdale80
Wrong and I disagree. It should be MY CHOICE. Your rates are affected by YOUR driving record. Did your rates go down when the seat belt law passed? Is that a No I hear you mutter? You say that they save you money, but show me where rates were decreased because of this miracle law. Like I said. It benefits insurance companies and that is why it was passed. As I said earlier, I wear my seatbelt from a practical and safety standpoint, but ultimately I feel like the decision should belong to me and no one else.

Well you just aren't smart enough to know your own mind! DUH! :p :p :p HAHA

[3afan]

he didnt say rates went down - he said insurance companies save on claims and that most certainly affects the rates we ALL pay ..... not just our own driving records

yeah it should be your choice, no doubt ... but the law is, as ronwx5x states, a win, win, etc.

[rockdale80]

Originally posted by 3afan
he didnt say rates went down - he said insurance companies save on claims and that most certainly affects the rates we ALL pay ..... not just our own driving records

yeah it should be your choice, no doubt ... but the law is, as ronwx5x states, a win, win, etc.

If it saves insurance companies money because of less claims, but that saving is not passed on to the insured, then how is that a win? Unless you are an advocate of the insurance companies winning then it is not. Sure it saves lives and I think as a personal choice people should wear them, but it should not be mandated by the government. That should be a Personal Choice, and not a law.

[kaorder1999]

the choice of whether or not to wear a seatbelt has never been taken away from you. You get to make that choice everyday.

I dont care if someone chooses to break the law as long as #1, it doesnt affect me and #2, they are willing to accept the consequences of their wrongdoing....

[3afan]

anything that keeps MY rates down is a win .....

[rockdale80]

Originally posted by kaorder1999
the choice of whether or not to wear a seatbelt has never been taken away from you. You get to make that choice everyday.

I dont care if someone chooses to break the law as long as #1, it doesnt affect me and #2, they are willing to accept the consequences of their wrongdoing....

I think it is stupid to not wear one, but personally I feel like it is a personal choice. That is all. Sorry some disagree.

[kaorder1999]

Texas says you have to follow posted speed limits, Texas says you have to have your car inspected, Texas says you have to register your vehicle. Texas says you have to stop at stop signs even if there are no other cars around. Texas says you have to signal to change lanes. Texas says you have to park on he correct side of the road in front of your house going with traffic. Texas says you have to play your radio/stereo at a reasonable volume. Some parts of Texas say you have to cease using a cell phone in School Zones.

All of this is done for the safety of the driver and the safety of those around them. The same goes for seatbelts. They arent trying to take away your rights as a citizen.

[kaorder1999]

Originally posted by rockdale80
I think it is stupid to not wear one, but personally I feel like it is a personal choice. That is all. Sorry some disagree.

i totally understand where you are coming from but I also think, like 3Afan, that its a cause not worth fighting because there are other things to use your energy on! haha

[ronwx5x]

Originally posted by rockdale80
Wrong and I disagree. It should be MY CHOICE. Your rates are affected by YOUR driving record. Did your rates go down when the seat belt law passed? Is that a No I hear you mutter? You say that they save you money, but show me where rates were decreased because of this miracle law. Like I said. It benefits insurance companies and that is why it was passed. As I said earlier, I wear my seatbelt from a practical and safety standpoint, but ultimately I feel like the decision should belong to me and no one else.

Rates are regulated by the state insurance commission. They are set based on history. If what the insurance company pays out goes up, they are allowed to raise rates. If historical loss rates don't go up, rates don't go up.

Sure, you're free to disagree, but you admit you use common sense and wear your seatbelt. If there were no law, I believe the incidence of people wearing seatbelts would go way down. You have the choice and you seem to have made the correct one for the right reasons. Wearing a seatbelt is also an FAA rule when aircraft take off and land, but I don't hear anyone complaining.

[CenTexSports]

I thought this argument was over 30 years ago. My dad used to bitch like crazy when this was first introduced into law.

Heck when we were kids we rode in the back window just waiting on him to hit the brake. We rode on the tailgate of the pickup after baseball practice all over town. We would get 20 kids in the back of the truck and jump around while he was driving.

Talk about the "Good old days".

[ronwx5x]

Originally posted by CenTexSports
I thought this argument was over 30 years ago. My dad used to bitch like crazy when this was first introduced into law.

Heck when we were kids we rode in the back window just waiting on him to hit the brake. We rode on the tailgate of the pickup after baseball practice all over town. We would get 20 kids in the back of thetruck and jump around wile he was driving.

Talk about the "Good old days".

Probably did help to clean up the gene pool! j/k

[eagles_victory]

Originally posted by kaorder1999


All of this is done for the safety of the driver and the safety of those around them. The same goes for seatbelts.. How does rather you wear your seat belt of not effect others around you? I dont disagree with the law but 150-200 dollar fine for not wearing it is ridiculous.

[rangerjim]

I agree it is cheaper for insurance companies to pay for a funeral than for a hospital stay. BUT I get to come home from a hospital and continue posting on the 3ADownLow if I wear my belt.

I have no idea how any of you can think that my insurance rates don't go up because you don't wear a seat belt!!!!! Your $500,000 hospital without a seat belt bill versus a $50,000 bill with a seat belt WILL raise my rates!

Again YOUR choice - no one is forcing you to wear one - BUT you will get a ticket if caught. It's called a law. Don't like the law? Run for office and get it changed. Does no good to just sit and bi%%h about it.

[rockdale80]

Originally posted by ronwx5x
Rates are regulated by the state insurance commission. They are set based on history. If what the insurance company pays out goes up, they are allowed to raise rates. If historical loss rates don't go up, rates don't go up.

Sure, you're free to disagree, but you admit you use common sense and wear your seatbelt. If there were no law, I believe the incidence of people wearing seatbelts would go way down. You have the choice and you seem to have made the correct one for the right reasons. Wearing a seatbelt is also an FAA rule when aircraft take off and land, but I don't hear anyone complaining.

So either there was no change in the number of claims based on the lack of rate change when the law came into effect, or the savings is not passed on to the consumer. Sure it is a common sense thing, but I think it should be my decision. It does not adversely affect any other driver on the road. It saves me and me only.

[eppy 12]

Originally posted by rangerjim
I agree it is cheaper for insurance companies to pay for a funeral than for a hospital stay. BUT I get to come home from a hospital and continue posting on the 3ADownLow if I wear my belt. :clap: :clap: :clap:

[rockdale80]

Originally posted by rangerjim
I agree it is cheaper for insurance companies to pay for a funeral than for a hospital stay. BUT I get to come home from a hospital and continue posting on the 3ADownLow if I wear my belt.

I have no idea how any of you can think that my insurance rates don't go up because you don't wear a seat belt!!!!! Your $500,000 hospital without a seat belt bill versus a $50,000 bill with a seat belt WILL raise my rates!

Again YOUR choice - no one is forcing you to wear one - BUT you will get a ticket if caught. It's called a law. Don't like the law? Run for office and get it changed. Does no good to just sit and bi%%h about it.

Dang. You really told me. Obviously you are too ignorant to see what should be a law and a personal choice.

[ronwx5x]

Originally posted by rockdale80
So either there was no change in the number of claims based on the lack of rate change when the law came into effect, or the savings is not passed on to the consumer. Sure it is a common sense thing, but I think it should be my decision. It does not adversely affect any other driver on the road. It saves me and me only.

I would have to say you are wrong and I disagree, as per not only my previous posts but the post of a number of others. It saves your family and friends most of all.

[pirate4state]

Originally posted by rockdale80
Dang. You really told me. Obviously you are too ignorant to see what should be a law and a personal choice. Alright, that's enough. You two will just have to agree to disagree & move on.

[rockdale80]

Originally posted by eppy 12
:clap: :clap: :clap:

Then wear a seat belt. That should be your decision. NOT A LAW. I think people are arguing the wrong point. Yes it saves lives. Yes it is the smart thing to do. No it should not be a law. You are adults. You dont have to have the big teachers tell you what to do. :rolleyes:

[rockdale80]

Originally posted by ronwx5x
I would have to say you are wrong and I disagree, as per not only my previous posts but the post of a number of others. It saves your family and friends most of all.

Show me the amount in savings on insurance the law has brought you. You stated something about rate caps, not actual savings.

[kaorder1999]

Originally posted by eagles_victory
How does rather you wear your seat belt of not effect others around you? I dont disagree with the law but 150-200 dollar fine for not wearing it is ridiculous.

one way....

Passenger doesnt have seat belt on and is moving around in vehicle distracting the driver....

[44INAROW]

we need a "sitting on fingers" smiley :D

[rockdale80]

Originally posted by kaorder1999
one way....

Passenger doesnt have seat belt on and is moving around in vehicle distracting the driver....


Umm....that is a stretch but if that is all you have then I concede. You guys win. The government should make laws that cover every single aspect of our lives. I am sorry I believed otherwise.
And I apologize to everyone that I have ever put in danger by not wearing a seat belt the few times I went to the corner store without one on. I also apologize in advance if I am ever driving without a seat belt, have a wreck, and cost any of you money.

My apologies guys. I didnt mean to think for myself.

Carry on.

[kaorder1999]

Originally posted by rockdale80
Umm....that is a stretch but if that is all you have then I concede. You guys win. The government should make laws that cover every single aspect of our lives. I am sorry I believed otherwise.
And I apologize to everyone that I have ever put in danger by not wearing a seat belt the few times I went to the corner store without one on. I also apologize in advance if I am ever driving without a seat belt, have a wreck, and cost any of you money.

My apologies guys. I didnt mean to think for myself.

Carry on.

man...you HATE it when people disagree with you. OR....you just hate the government and want everyone else to also!! Because you do not believe the way i do I don't lose sleep at night.

[ronwx5x]

Originally posted by rockdale80
Show me the amount in savings on insurance the law has brought you. You stated something about rate caps, not actual savings.

I guess I miss the point of your statement on rate caps. You surely don't expect a dollar quote from me on how much savings I receive from having a law requiring the wearing of a seatbelt? That's a pretty lame way of proving anything since you know the answer is not coming from me. But does that make you right? Prove that it doesn't save money then. I believe the law saves lives and money, but that's only my opinion.

I am glad for you, your family, and my own selfish life that you do choose to wear a seatbelt. Should it be a law rather than a choice? My opinion is it should be law, yours is that it should be a choice. I honestly believe that by being a law compliance is much better.

[rockdale80]

Originally posted by kaorder1999
man...you HATE it when people disagree with you. OR....you just hate the government and want everyone else to also!!

Everyone is entitled to their opinion. I hate that the government makes up my mind for me. This is a matter of personal decision and I think the government is overstepping it's boundaries. It gets old. I wear a seatbelt, but sometimes I just flat out forget. Does that mean I am purposely imposing danger or cost to anyone? Should I be fined? It just irks me. But as I said earlier I concede. I apologized and I will no longer believe that I should have the ability to think for myself or make a decision.

[kaorder1999]

Originally posted by rockdale80
Everyone is entitled to their opinion. I hate that the government makes up my mind for me. This is a matter of personal decision and I think the government is overstepping it's boundaries. It gets old. I wear a seatbelt, but sometimes I just flat out forget. Does that mean I am purposely imposing danger or cost to anyone? Should I be fined? It just irks me. But as I said earlier I concede. I apologized and I will no longer believe that I should have the ability to think for myself or make a decision.

i just think the "since you dont understand my line of thinking or dont agree with me I'm just going to take my toys and go home" attitude and sarcasm gets old. But hey...thats just me...

[pirate4state]

You are still "talking"??? :D :D

[DaHop72]

Since I can't find the sitting on my fingers smilie has it not struck many of you that since the day you were born and probably until the day you die someone is going to be making decisions for you.:thinking: :thinking:


Carry on.

[crzyjournalist03]

Originally posted by rockdale80
Everyone is entitled to their opinion. I hate that the government makes up my mind for me. This is a matter of personal decision and I think the government is overstepping it's boundaries. It gets old. I wear a seatbelt, but sometimes I just flat out forget. Does that mean I am purposely imposing danger or cost to anyone? Should I be fined? It just irks me. But as I said earlier I concede. I apologized and I will no longer believe that I should have the ability to think for myself or make a decision.

Do you believe that you shouldn't be ticketed if you're driving 65 in a 50 if it's late at night and nobody else is around because it was your person choice to go faster than you probably should?

[Chief Woodman]

Originally posted by rockdale80
Why is it not your choice? Because it saves insurance companies money! It was not lobbied for by people interested in self preservation, or groups that truly care about the overall welfare of the average citizen. It was pushed by insurance companies to save them money. I love it when a government makes up my mind for me on an issue that does not effect them one way or another. I also feel like it should be my choice. 99.9% of the time I wear my seatbelt, but on the off chance I forget I dont want to be ticketed for it. Pretty ridiculous.

Actually I agree with Rockdale on this in a way. People should have the right to not wear that ole belt. After all they can are responsibile adults and should under the pureist form of a democracy have the right to choose. A sound management and spiritual principle is that authority and accountablity must be balanced.Those who take the authority upon themselfs to not wear a seatbelt must also bear the responsibilty for any loss caused by this. That would mean that no one, not even insurance companies are even remotely responsible to pay ANY medical, death or long term hospice costs. Of course that means their families will go bankrupt, but cie le vie!! After all, they chose, now let them and them alone pay for their choice.

[rangerjim]

Rockdale - life is 100% personal choice - we can all do whatever we want - but if our choice violates a law - then there can be consequences. Whether we agree with that law or not. I, like you I'm sure, are good drivers - it's the other dingbats on the road that I wear my seatbelt for - the drunk drivers, people on cell phones, people with figdegty passengers.

[Txbroadcaster]

Originally posted by crzyjournalist03
Do you believe that you shouldn't be ticketed if you're driving 65 in a 50 if it's late at night and nobody else is around because it was your person choice to go faster than you probably should?

That really is not what he is saying IMO..He is saying seatbelt laws infringe on personal rights

a better analogy is..Should their be a law saying we MUST lock our doors to our house when gone or at night, and if we dont then we will be fined and given a ticket

Commone sense is one thing, wearing a seatbelt is that..But I personally do not like laws TELLING me to wear one and face a money fine if I dont

None of this is about being safe, it is another revenue stream for cities, counties and the DPS

[crzyjournalist03]

Originally posted by Chief Woodman
Actually I agree with Rockdale on this in a way. People should have the right to not wear that ole belt. After all they can are responsibile adults and should under the pureist form of a democracy have the right to choose.

And if you want to get technical, we don't live in a democracy. We live in a democratic republic. We choose the people that we want to make choices for us. We don't have a right to make our own choices. That would be an anarchy or a pure democracy as you mentioned, and contrary to popular belief, that's not what our country believes in.

[crzyjournalist03]

Originally posted by Txbroadcaster
That really is not what he is saying IMO..He is saying seatbelt laws infringe on personal rights

a better analogy is..Should their be a law saying we MUST lock our doors to our house when gone or at night, and if we dont then we will be fined and given a ticket

Commone sense is one thing, wearing a seatbelt is that..But I personally do not like laws TELLING me to wear one and face a money fine if I dont

None of this is about being safe, it is another revenue stream for cities, counties and the DPS

But couldn't you say the exact same thing about speed limits?

Driving 65 in a 50 probably isn't going to hurt anybody any more than someone not wearing a seatbelt.

[kaorder1999]

Originally posted by Chief Woodman
Actually I agree with Rockdale on this in a way. People should have the right to not wear that ole belt. After all they can are responsibile adults and should under the pureist form of a democracy have the right to choose. A sound management and spiritual principle is that authority and accountablity must be balanced.Those who take the authority upon themselfs to not wear a seatbelt must also bear the responsibilty for any loss caused by this. That would mean that no one, not even insurance companies are even remotely responsible to pay ANY medical, death or long term hospice costs. Of course that means their families will go bankrupt, but cie le vie!! After all, they chose, now let them and them alone pay for their choice.

and isnt this already the case with motorcycle riders that choose to not wear a helmet. Dont they lose most if not all medical help from insurance companies. And if life support is needed they do not give the families the choice to keep them on life support do they, dont they automatically cease life support because of the cost unless the family is willing to incur all costs? Someone told me that recently. Sucky deal!

[Txbroadcaster]

Originally posted by crzyjournalist03
But couldn't you say the exact same thing about speed limits?

Driving 65 in a 50 probably isn't going to hurt anybody any more than someone not wearing a seatbelt.

no you really cant..you go to fast and you kill others..meaning you infringe on there rights...Seatbelts are meant to save yourself, not others

[Chief Woodman]

Originally posted by crzyjournalist03
And if you want to get technical, we don't live in a democracy. We live in a democratic republic. We choose the people that we want to make choices for us. We don't have a right to make our own choices. That would be an anarchy or a pure democracy as you mentioned, and contrary to popular belief, that's not what our country believes in.

You are absoluty correct!! We are a republic, not a true democracy. But we do have a certain thing called abill of rights. Any law passed must not violate tthese rights or the trhird branch can strike it down as unlawful. Therefore, is a seatbelt law unlawful, or are those who refuse to follow the law just whiners?

[pirate4state]

Originally posted by crzyjournalist03
But couldn't you say the exact same thing about speed limits?

Driving 65 in a 50 probably isn't going to hurt anybody any more than someone not wearing a seatbelt. Heck, you can be driving 35 mph and hurt someone if they are at a stand still!

Y'all are all just being stubborn and "discussing" this just to have something to "discuss".

Must be a slow day at the office! :nerd:

[crzyjournalist03]

Originally posted by Chief Woodman
You are absoluty correct!! We are a republic, not a true democracy. But we do have a certain thing called abill of rights. Any law passed must not violate tthese rights or the trhird branch can strike it down as unlawful. Therefore, is a seatbelt law unlawful, or are those who refuse to follow the law just whiners?

Well, I've never read "freedom of choice" under any of the bill of rights, so I'm going with the latter! ;) :thumbsup:

[crzyjournalist03]

Originally posted by pirate4state
Heck, you can be driving 35 mph and hurt someone if they are at a stand still!

Y'all are all just being stubborn and "discussing" this just to have something to "discuss".

Must be a slow day at the office! :nerd:

exactly!

Speeding doesn't kill anybody.

Accidents kill people.

[Chief Woodman]

Originally posted by kaorder1999
and isnt this already the case with motorcycle riders that choose to not wear a helmet. Dont they lose most if not all medical help from insurance companies. And if life support is needed they do not give the families the choice to keep them on life support do they, dont they automatically cease life support because of the cost unless the family is willing to incur all costs? Someone told me that recently. Sucky deal!

Not really. If they made the coice, then be adult enough to accept the outcome. I am a pilot. I know that some things are beyond my control, and I accept that. If I could not get insurance to cover the costs of my choice, I would chose differently. However since I pay the premium and stay within the rules of the policy, I am willing to take the risk. I even have ALL passengers sign a waiver of liability before they ride with me. It does not protect me if I am negligent, but then again I follow the rules completely and even greatly err on the side of caution when deciding when and wher to fly. Afetr all it is better to be on the ground wishing you were in the air than to be in the air wishing you were on the ground.

[rockdale80]

Originally posted by kaorder1999
i just think the "since you dont understand my line of thinking or dont agree with me I'm just going to take my toys and go home" attitude and sarcasm gets old. But hey...thats just me...


If you dont like the attitude or sarcasm, then feel free to add me to your ignore list. I am sorry I got everyone so worked up and I am sorry you get offended by sarcasm. It is not meant to be malicious. It is just being a smart....


I listened to all of the arguments and I agree that it is alway a good idea to wear a seatbelt. I disagree that it should be a law though. Not a single person has offered any detail as to how "ME" wearing or not wearing a seatbelt affects their life. Ergo my reasoning for this being a personal decision. But this argument is going no where so I digress.

[pirate4state]

Originally posted by rockdale80
If you dont like the attitude or sarcasm, then feel free to add me to your ignore list. I am sorry I got everyone so worked up and I am sorry you get offended by sarcasm. It is not meant to be malicious. It is just being a smart....


I listened to all of the arguments and I agree that it is alway a good idea to wear a seatbelt. I disagree that it should be a law though. Not a single person has offered any detail as to how "ME" wearing or not wearing a seatbelt affects their life. Ergo my reasoning for this being a personal decision. But this argument is going no where so I digress.

HAHA

You said ergo :p

[3afan]

its an interesting discussion though ............. and I'm really bored at work this week - they've taken our systems to perform "upgrades"

[rockdale80]

Originally posted by crzyjournalist03
But couldn't you say the exact same thing about speed limits?

Driving 65 in a 50 probably isn't going to hurt anybody any more than someone not wearing a seatbelt.

Interesting point and I see where you are going with it, but it still can cause property damage which effects other people if you lose control and crash into a house, fence, yard ornament, horse pasture, etc. I can understand a law that protects other people's lives and property, but I dont understand one set up to protect only mine. That would fall into the scope of personal choice to me.

[rockdale80]

Originally posted by pirate4state
HAHA

You said ergo :p


:D

[DaHop72]

Originally posted by rockdale80
Interesting point and I see where you are going with it, but it still can cause property damage which effects other people if you lose control and crash into a house, fence, yard ornament, horse pasture, etc. I can understand a law that protects other people's lives and property, but I dont understand one set up to protect only mine. That would fall into the scope of personal choice to me.

I think maybe "fencepost" run in the family. :devil: :devil:


:D :D

[rockdale80]

Originally posted by DaHop72
I think maybe "fencepost" run in the family. :devil: :devil:


:D :D

Well rick, he got it from somewhere. ;)

[Ranger Mom]

Originally posted by DaHop72
I think maybe "fencepost" run in the family. :devil: :devil:


:D :D

Most definitely!!!:p

[DaHop72]

Originally posted by rockdale80
Well rick, he got it from somewhere. ;)
http://img240.imageshack.us/img240/5809/roflsmiliemn4.gifhttp://img240.imageshack.us/img240/5809/roflsmiliemn4.gifhttp://img240.imageshack.us/img240/5809/roflsmiliemn4.gifhttp://img240.imageshack.us/img240/5809/roflsmiliemn4.gif

And honestly.;)

[garciap77]

Originally posted by rangerjim
I agree it is cheaper for insurance companies to pay for a funeral than for a hospital stay. BUT I get to come home from a hospital and continue posting on the 3ADownLow if I wear my belt.

...................

I agree with you! And in addition, the 3ADownLow membership continues to stay about about 1500. :clap: :D

[BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END]

Originally posted by crzyjournalist03
Do you believe that you shouldn't be ticketed if you're driving 65 in a 50 if it's late at night and nobody else is around because it was your person choice to go faster than you probably should?


That's a whole different situation all together, as speed limits are enacted to promote safety for everyone on the road and the properties of the people who neighbor our streets and highways. There are people's homes and personal belongings that are all along the roads that we drive on, so speed limits are supposed to be obeyed not to just protect the other cars on the road, but the property of others who live beside it. You're pushing a flawed argument as a seatbelt is used to protect only one person and that is the person who decides to use it or not...You're also missing the point that there is no benefit from wearing a seatbelt (aside from personal safety) other than the government telling you to and reaping benefits for when you do not and you are caught. Rockdale80's basic premise is just that and at the same time he's warning that the more little nit-picky rights and privileges that you let the government take away, the more and more they are going to continue to take away.

[BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END]

Originally posted by rockdale80
Well rick, he got it from somewhere. ;)

Yeah, we both like to call him "Dad."

[Txbroadcaster]

Originally posted by BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END
Yeah, we both like to call him "Dad."

I told you not to call me that on here

[ronwx5x]

Originally posted by pirate4state
Heck, you can be driving 35 mph and hurt someone if they are at a stand still!

Y'all are all just being stubborn and "discussing" this just to have something to "discuss".

Must be a slow day at the office! :nerd:

This is probably true of 90% of our threads this time of year. Boys will be boys, and the only violence available to us right now is "verbal fisticuffs". Just having some fun.:kiss:

[rockdale80]

Originally posted by BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END
Yeah, we both like to call him "Dad."


BINGO!

Well....Mom is just as stubborn. :)

[BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END]

Originally posted by Txbroadcaster
I told you not to call me that on here

Funny...:rolleyes:

Hahaha, that was rather timely. :clap:

[SintonFan]

Originally posted by BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END
That's a whole different situation all together, as speed limits are enacted to promote safety for everyone on the road and the properties of the people who neighbor our streets and highways. There are people's homes and personal belongings that are all along the roads that we drive on, so speed limits are supposed to be obeyed not to just protect the other cars on the road, but the property of others who live beside it. You're pushing a flawed argument as a seatbelt is used to protect only one person and that is the person who decides to use it or not...You're also missing the point that there is no benefit from wearing a seatbelt (aside from personal safety) other than the government telling you to and reaping benefits for when you do not and you are caught. Rockdale80's basic premise is just that and at the same time he's warning that the more little nit-picky rights and privileges that you let the government take away, the more and more they are going to continue to take away.
.
Incrementalism...
.
it's a bad thing.

[SintonFan]

Originally posted by S_Tex_3A_Fan
Isn't this the biggest croc of smelly stuff ever? Corpus wrote almost 1400 tickets at ($149 - $200 a pop). Someone riding a motorcycle can go without a helmet, but I can't, by my own choosing, not wear a seatbelt. They need to allow someone who doesn't wear a seatbelt to buy extra insurance like the motorcycle people who don't wear a helmet do.

No I didn't get a ticket, the law just makes me mad!!!
.
I still drive in Corpus occasionally. They should make everyone riding in a car where helmets and install roll cages.

[trojan37]

I had a wreck back in 1988, just out of high school. I lost control coming around a corner on a road the county was doing construction on. I rolled the truck out in an open field, and was ejected from the truck. The DPS officer knew I wasn't wearing my seatbelt, and stated that if I had it on, I might have been trapped in the truck and could have died because the cab was crushed. But guess what, I got a ticket for no seatbelt. Bottom line, I've worn it ever since, it does save lives and it's the law, plain and simple.

[S_Tex_3A_Fan]

Man I didn't realize i was going to get everyone this fired up. Sorry for the ulsers.

[eppy 12]

Originally posted by SintonFan
.
I still drive in Corpus occasionally. They should make everyone riding in a car where helmets and install roll cages. RIGHT?

[bandera7]

I agree with BBDE and Rockdale80. This is something I have discussed with my dad multiple times. I have come to the conclusion that seatbelts are a huge infringement on my rights as an individual. How can the government honestly feel like they have the right to tell an adult they must wear a seatbelt? Its not something that damages society, its not something that puts other people at risk. Not wearing your seatbelt will not kill somebody else. I can understand a seatbelt law for minors. But once you are a legal adult then you should be able to make your own choice, similar to drinking beer and smoking cigarrettes. Whether I think smoking cigarrettes is stupid or not, the government cannot regulate that because it is a persons choice.

[eppy 12]

Originally posted by bandera7
I agree with BBDE and Rockdale80. This is something I have discussed with my dad multiple times. I have come to the conclusion that seatbelts are a huge infringement on my rights as an individual. How can the government honestly feel like they have the right to tell an adult they must wear a seatbelt? Its not something that damages society, its not something that puts other people at risk. Not wearing your seatbelt will not kill somebody else. I can understand a seatbelt law for minors. But once you are a legal adult then you should be able to make your own choice, similar to drinking beer and smoking cigarrettes. Whether I think smoking cigarrettes is stupid or not, the government cannot regulate that because it is a persons choice. so your thoughts on beer are fairly positive then?

[bandera7]

Well, you should be allowed to drink beer. Now being publicly intoxicated is different...that can affect others and lead to their injury. Same with smoking in public places, other people dont want their lungs ruined. But in the privacy of your home, you should be allowed to smoke cigarrettes/drink beer.

[ronwx5x]

Originally posted by bandera7
Well, you should be allowed to drink beer. Now being publicly intoxicated is different...that can affect others and lead to their injury. Same with smoking in public places, other people dont want their lungs ruined. But in the privacy of your home, you should be allowed to smoke cigarrettes/drink beer.

I think most of us would extend this to agree you don't have to wear a seatbelt at home either. :D

[eppy 12]

Originally posted by bandera7
Well, you should be allowed to drink beer. Now being publicly intoxicated is different...that can affect others and lead to their injury. Same with smoking in public places, other people dont want their lungs ruined. But in the privacy of your home, you should be allowed to smoke cigarrettes/drink beer. i like beer and i am allowed to drink it, in moderation of course.

[Old Green]

Originally posted by kaorder1999
and isnt this already the case with motorcycle riders that choose to not wear a helmet. Dont they lose most if not all medical help from insurance companies. And if life support is needed they do not give the families the choice to keep them on life support do they, dont they automatically cease life support because of the cost unless the family is willing to incur all costs? Someone told me that recently. Sucky deal! I ride a motorcycle and I wear a helmet. I agree with both side of this argument . Enfringement of your rights not to wear a seat belt ? Yes most definitely. I hate some one telling me to wear a helmet or a seatbelt but it's the law and it's better than being a vegetable.

[eppy 12]

Originally posted by Old Green
I ride a motorcycle and I wear a helmet. I agree with both side of this argument . Enfringement of your rights not to wear a seat belt ? Yes most definitely. I hate some one telling me to wear a helmet or a seatbelt but it's the law and it's better than being a vegetable. ahh the sanity of wisdom:clap:

[ronwx5x]

Originally posted by eppy 12
ahh the sanity of wisdom:clap:

How can we work up a good argument in the face of common sense? Unfair post!:)

[eppy 12]

Originally posted by ronwx5x
How can we work up a good argument in the face of common sense? Unfair post!:) http://i97.photobucket.com/albums/l239/eppy12/hanky3.jpg

[rockdale80]

Originally posted by eppy 12
ahh the sanity of wisdom:clap:

I never said I did or would do differently regardless of it being a law. I do hate it being a law though.

[bandera7]

And I am agreed. The fact is they have no right to enforce it. Whether it would change my seatbelt wearing habits is a different story.

[AP Panther Fan]

Texas Department of Public Safety....

we are all still members of the public...sometimes it is for the safety of others and sometimes for our own.

They are simply trying to help me, help myself....:D




(or that's what I keep telling myself)

[DU_stud04]

i remember having to run bowls when we got pulled over for not having seatbelts in the bed of a truck (we were going to athletic inbetween classess and everyone piles in to a few trucks on the way to the field house). cop let us go to our coaches....only to run.

[bandera7]

but see AP, thats what I dont like. When it comes to me and my personal things, I dont like the government touching those rights. Unless it affects the safety of somebody else, why should they worry?

[DU_stud04]

Originally posted by bandera7
but see AP, thats what I dont like. When it comes to me and my personal things, I dont like the government touching those rights. Unless it affects the safety of somebody else, why should they worry? i dont want your dead body flying through the windshield and landing on my car.... might scar me for life. thats harm to me :(

[LH Panther Mom]

Originally posted by bandera7
but see AP, thats what I dont like. When it comes to me and my personal things, I dont like the government touching those rights. Unless it affects the safety of somebody else, why should they worry?
At what point do you determine that it is your safety or mine? Your seatbelt should keep you safer. It also should prevent you from flying through your windshield, then through mine, not causing me to run into the telephone pole.


The use of many drugs is illegal. Why? It's just YOUR body, right? It's your choice, isn't it? Why should there be a law that says you can't screw up your life? :thinking:

[LH Panther Mom]

Originally posted by DU_stud04
i dont want your dead body flying through the windshield and landing on my car.... might scar me for life. thats harm to me :( :mad: :mad: Get out of my head! :p

[eppy 12]

Originally posted by ronwx5x
I think most of us would extend this to agree you don't have to wear a seatbelt at home either. :D while drinking beer, unless in a loft that has no rail..

[bandera7]

the use of illegal drugs is different. Statistics show that a society high in drug use shows increases in suicide, murder and violence. Therefore it affects other people. What kind of statistics could you show for people who do or dont wear their seatbelts that affect others? And maybe if seatbelts were not mandatory then parents would teach their children better instead of assuming they would wear them because it is a law.

[DU_stud04]

my dad doesnt like wearing his seat belt.... untill it beeps, he doesnt like being annoyed so he buckles up....mad. haha

[crzyjournalist03]

I think that a lot of people like the law because it "makes" them buckle up.

I have a friend who smokes quite a bit who has always said that he kept hoping that the sin tax on cigarettes would get higher or that they'd be outlawed, because he KNEW it was better for him, but given the choice, he'd keep on doing it because he knew that he wasn't disciplined enough to just decide to stop. As long as he could afford it and do it legally, he was going to keep doing it.

[bandera7]

My dad is the same way. And not only that, he is a very big guy with a huge chest, and the seat belts never fits well.

[DU_stud04]

Originally posted by LH Panther Mom
:mad: :mad: Get out of my head! :p http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g115/mexmustangs04/Sign-Cow-1.gif

[DU_stud04]

another thing to conciser guys...... without the seat belt....there wouldn't be the seat belt cleavage..... it just saddens me. :(



(couldn't find an appropriate picture that wouldn't get me in trouble...search yourself ) :D

[Ranger Mom]

Originally posted by DU_stud04
another thing to conciser guys...... without the seat belt....there wouldn't be the seat belt cleavage..... it just saddens me. :(



(couldn't find an appropriate picture that wouldn't get me in trouble...search yourself ) :D

ROFL!!! Only you Reuben!!:doh:

[AP Panther Fan]

I am pretty much of the opinion that things that are too far fetched don't become laws...there would be way too many people saying "that's just wrong, blah, blah, blah" and it would never happen...

on the other hand, if it makes sense and is for the common good of "most" everyone, it becomes pretty hard to argue.

:)

[rockdale80]

It goes back to the basics of lobbyists pushing laws that assist companies in raising their bottom line. This should be an issue of personal choice. If they want to hammer people with increased rates that do not wear a seat belt then I am okay with that, but I do not think it should be a mandatory law. That is overstepping some boundaries and it is just another gouge into people's personal choices.

I agree wholeheartedly that wearing a seat belt is the right thing to do, but I vehemently disagree with it being a law.

[crzyjournalist03]

Originally posted by rockdale80
It goes back to the basics of lobbyists pushing laws that assist companies in raising their bottom line. This should be an issue of personal choice. If they want to hammer people with increased rates that do not wear a seat belt then I am okay with that, but I do not think it should be a mandatory law. That is overstepping some boundaries and it is just another gouge into people's personal choices.

I agree wholeheartedly that wearing a seat belt is the right thing to do, but I vehemently disagree with it being a law.

I'm wondering how an insurance company would be able to hammer people with fees for not wearing it...how is the company going to know whether or not their customers wear the belt?

[DU_stud04]

Originally posted by Ranger Mom
ROFL!!! Only you Reuben!!:doh: http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g115/mexmustangs04/a_happyme.gif

[LH Panther Mom]

Originally posted by crzyjournalist03
I'm wondering how an insurance company would be able to hammer people with fees for not wearing it...how is the company going to know whether or not their customers wear the belt?
Spy cameras will be posted on every corner which will feed pictures into the statewide insurance database. :nerd:

[pirate4state]

Originally posted by LH Panther Mom
Spy cameras will be posted on every corner which will feed pictures into the statewide insurance database. :nerd: Those are up already! Well, maybe not EVERY corner, but enough. Not to mention at various other locations. Don't you watch L&O: SVU.

[espn1]

Originally posted by Txbroadcaster
That really is not what he is saying IMO..He is saying seatbelt laws infringe on personal rights

a better analogy is..Should their be a law saying we MUST lock our doors to our house when gone or at night, and if we dont then we will be fined and given a ticket

Commone sense is one thing, wearing a seatbelt is that..But I personally do not like laws TELLING me to wear one and face a money fine if I dont

None of this is about being safe, it is another revenue stream for cities, counties and the DPS Thank you for not making me type. It's funny how sheeple think. They want Government in all aspects of their lives. It amazes me. This is exactly as you said yet another way to keep cities, counties and the DPS in the fortune 500 rankings. :confused: :confused: :confused:

[Hupernikomen]

Originally posted by rockdale80
Show me the amount in savings on insurance the law has brought you. You stated something about rate caps, not actual savings.

Cars with automatic seatbelts used to get an insurance discount. Don't know if that is still true.

[rockdale80]

Originally posted by Hupernikomen
Cars with automatic seatbelts used to get an insurance discount. Don't know if that is still true.

But that is not an example of how the "LAW" has saved anyone money on insurance. That is an example of a car feature that saves you money:)

How are you doing these days? Havent seen you lurking around in awhile.

[crabman]

A few years ago I was at the state capitol with some kids and we walked in on a committee hearing on motorcycle helmets. The guy representing the motorcycle lobby was about 6'-4", 280 and had the best mohawk you have ever seen. Sleeveless black leather jacket. His name was Sputnik. I heard that he had it legally changed but I don't know if that is true or not.

He had the most eloquent, researched, and thought out arguments that I have ever heard. He was giving breakdowns of how your head snaps in a crash and how much force it takes to separate your skull from the vertabrae. The bottom line on helmets was that while they may prevent scratches and abrasions, they do not prevent major head and neck injuries. He had all of the proof and documentation and refuted everything the committee threw at him.

Seat belts on the other hand keep you from hitting the windshield and steering wheel and breaking your neck.

[JasperDog94]

If it is really about safety (just like they say about red light cameras) then stop issuing fines and start suspending people's licenses. Until then, this is nothing more than a revenue generating scheme.

[Txbroadcaster]

Originally posted by JasperDog94
If it is really about safety (just like they say about red light cameras) then stop issuing fines and start suspending people's licenses. Until then, this is nothing more than a revenue generating scheme.

Heck in Dallas they have stopped using the red light cameras in alot of areas..reason...The fines were not as much as they thought it would be so the smaller revenue stream caused them to just stop it

Pure money

[slpybear the bullfan]

Originally posted by crabman
A few years ago I was at the state capitol with some kids and we walked in on a committee hearing on motorcycle helmets. The guy representing the motorcycle lobby was about 6'-4", 280 and had the best mohawk you have ever seen. Sleeveless black leather jacket. His name was Sputnik. I heard that he had it legally changed but I don't know if that is true or not.

He had the most eloquent, researched, and thought out arguments that I have ever heard. He was giving breakdowns of how your head snaps in a crash and how much force it takes to separate your skull from the vertabrae. The bottom line on helmets was that while they may prevent scratches and abrasions, they do not prevent major head and neck injuries. He had all of the proof and documentation and refuted everything the committee threw at him.

Seat belts on the other hand keep you from hitting the windshield and steering wheel and breaking your neck.



Would love to have listened to this. Not buying in but would be open to the other view.

[LH Panther Mom]

Originally posted by pirate4state
Those are up already! Well, maybe not EVERY corner, but enough. Not to mention at various other locations. Don't you watch L&O: SVU.
:p :p This wouldn't be like the ones for tickets. It would only be to see if you're wearing your seatbelt, then let your insurance company know so they can jack your rates up. :nerd: ;)

[rockdale80]

Originally posted by LH Panther Mom
:p :p This wouldn't be like the ones for tickets. It would only be to see if you're wearing your seatbelt, then let your insurance company know so they can jack your rates up. :nerd: ;)


i was saying theoretically. It shouldn't be a lawmakers decision. :)

[LH Panther Mom]

Originally posted by rockdale80
i was saying theoretically. It shouldn't be a lawmakers decision. :)
It was just another feeble attempt at humor on my part. :(

[rockdale80]

Originally posted by LH Panther Mom
It was just another feeble attempt at humor on my part. :(

I am sorry :(

[LH Panther Mom]

Originally posted by rockdale80
I am sorry :(
It's okay. I should be used to it by now. :D ;)

[JasperDog94]

Originally posted by Txbroadcaster
Pure money Word.:thmbdwn: