No Pass, No Play, Good Or Bad?

[olddawggreen]

I didn't realize until last night that Florida and some other states don't have the No Pass, No Play rule.

What do you think? Is Texas diluting their teams by having the rule and if so, do you think this is good or bad thing?

I personally think it's a good thing to have the rule but I am just curious what everyone's thoughts are on the subject.:confused:

[neck_06]

no pass, no play is a great rule.....education first. STUDENT-athlete...

[charlesrixey]

Originally posted by olddawggreen
I didn't realize until last night that Florida and some other states don't have the No Pass, No Play rule.

What do you think? Is Texas diluting their teams by having the rule and if so, do you think this is good or bad thing?

I personally think it's a good thing to have the rule but I am just curious what everyone's thoughts are on the subject.:confused:

wow!

i didn't know that!

of course, Florida apparently doesn't have the jail-felony/no play rule either

[Astrosdawg07]

Originally posted by charlesrixey
wow!

i didn't know that!

of course, Florida apparently doesn't have the jail-felony/no play rule either

????

[3afan]

Originally posted by neck_06
no pass, no play is a great rule.....education first. STUDENT-athlete...


yep

[necks_c/09]

Originally posted by Astrosdawg07
???? what?

rixey's post made plenty of sense to me.....

Miami with all their players' police problems.....

simply making fun of that i believe.....

[charlesrixey]

Originally posted by necks_c/09
what?

rixey's post made plenty of sense to me.....

Miami with all their players' police problems.....

simply making fun of that i believe.....

yep

[luvhoops34]

no pass, no play is a good thing.:D

[DDBooger]

Originally posted by luvhoops34
no pass, no play is a good thing.:D except when ya play out of state teams who dont follow those rules:( lol oh well, im sure most SLC players have promising futures!

[Bull19]

its a great thing because 25 years down the road the carrol kids will be the attorney's for the miami kids in court.....

[zebrablue2]

a very good thing.

[scotty]

I felt it was too long when a kid had to miss six weeks, but since they shortened it it's much better. I'm sure some schools are stricter than others which can make it an unlevel field, but overall it's good.

[LH Panther Mom]

It's definitely a good thing. It is a requirement that kids attend school. It's not a requirement that they participate in extracurricular activities.

[rangerjoe33]

Florida might have a tough time fielding teams if there was a:

No Class No Play rule.

[JR2004]

Originally posted by Bull19
its a great thing because 25 years down the road the carrol kids will be the attorney's for the miami kids in court.....

Yep...Characterize them as all being bad because of the actions of a few. :rolleyes:

[MarginalTalent]

I don't think it has helped one way or the other. It sounds great and righteous and all, but the reality is that it is unfair to kids who live in homes where there is little support. It doesn't address the social inequalities that students bring to the table. School is easy for Joe Lawyer's son, but Wilma Welfare's kid doesn't have it so great. It's just another way for the Man to keep us down.

[Bull19]

Originally posted by MarginalTalent
I don't think it has helped one way or the other. It sounds great and righteous and all, but the reality is that it is unfair to kids who live in homes where there is little support. It doesn't address the social inequalities that students bring to the table. School is easy for Joe Lawyer's son, but Wilma Welfare's kid doesn't have it so great. It's just another way for the Man to keep us down.


you have got to be joking

[Highschoolfan78]

Originally posted by MarginalTalent
I don't think it has helped one way or the other. It sounds great and righteous and all, but the reality is that it is unfair to kids who live in homes where there is little support. It doesn't address the social inequalities that students bring to the table. School is easy for Joe Lawyer's son, but Wilma Welfare's kid doesn't have it so great. It's just another way for the Man to keep us down.

Wilma Welfare's child has the resources at the school available just as Joe Lawyer's son. While the home environment does affect some students, it does not mean that they are disadvantaged to a public education. In the end, it is the child's choices of which direction in life they want to travel. If the student can not maintain a decent grade point average in order to hold their position and responsibility on the team, then they need some time off to reflect on what they can improve academically. If you want to talk about the "Man" keeping us down, talk about major corporations causing small town stores to dwindle. Do not confuse it with public education that is provided for every student. The majority of the out of school resources Joe Lawyer's son uses are probably provided within the school for the disadvantaged. By the way is Welfare Irish?

[JR2004]

To be honest it's alright if it's actually enforced. (I know this rule kept me out of many athletic contests my last two years of high school...lol.) However No Pass No Play gets swept under the rug if the athlete in question really needs to be out there. I've seen too many kids get a grade change at the last minute so that they'll maintain their eligibility.

The only noteworthy player I've seen this rule keep from playing was former Lincoln basketball player Gary Flowers. (I'm sure there's others, but he's the first example that came to mind.) He actually missed the playoffs his final two years of high school because of this rule. I'm thoroughly convinced that Lincoln didn't change his grades because had they done it, every DISD school in the playoffs both years would've gladly protested and given the UIL a call to make sure the rule was enforced to keep that kid off the court. (He was a 6'8" power forward there during the Byron Eaton years who transferred in from Palo Duro in Amarillo.)

The rule can be good, but in my own experiences it's been largely ignored.

[TheDOCTORdre]

Originally posted by MarginalTalent
I don't think it has helped one way or the other. It sounds great and righteous and all, but the reality is that it is unfair to kids who live in homes where there is little support. It doesn't address the social inequalities that students bring to the table. School is easy for Joe Lawyer's son, but Wilma Welfare's kid doesn't have it so great. It's just another way for the Man to keep us down.

thats the biggest load of crap i have ever heard. I am by no mean Wilma welfares son, but I am a lot closer to being her son than Joe Lawyer's son. # 11 in my class, 97.97 average, and a partitial sholarship to the University of Texas. Not to mention that I slacked through most of the school work and homework and would just turn it on at test time, kinda makes me wonder what I could've done if I had tried. But nonetheless I digress... if this is just a way for "the Man" to keep us down then I just kicked the man's ass and he needs to get better at his job. With the exception of a select few who have learning disabilities, you are as smart as you want to be and you choose how well you do in school. And back to the original subject at hand No pass, No play is an excellent rule.

[bulldogbark]

my first experiance with "no pass, no play" was at home were my father would make sure I had the grades. He also had the NO PASS , NO WORK policy. NO PASS, NO PARTY policy. and the NO PASS, SIT WITH YOUR SCHOOL BOOK policy.

[Old Tiger]

Depends on who ya ask.

If you ask the school and parents...it is good.

If you ask the student who failed...it is bad.

[TheDOCTORdre]

Originally posted by Go Blue
Depends on who ya ask.

If you ask the school and parents...it is good.

If you ask the student who failed...it is bad.

well then the student should open his dang book

[LH Panther Mom]

Originally posted by TheDOCTORdre
well then the student should open his dang book
Bravo!!!!! :clap: :clap: :clap:

[3afan]

there's really no excuse to fail a high school class if you even try a little bit

[Phil C]

I think it is a bad rule. I think anyone can have a bad subject and not pass. Now if you have two failures that is a different thing. I am agin it and wish it was the way it was.

[Highschoolfan78]

Originally posted by Phil C
I think it is a bad rule. I think anyone can have a bad subject and not pass. Now if you have two failures that is a different thing. I am agin it and wish it was the way it was.

I can see having a bad subject and struggling. I definitely was not a fan of science. However, if the student does everything possible and still ends up short then it is the teacher that has failed. The teacher should try new techniques to teach the material..

[Darren]

Its a good rule.

[Bull19]

Originally posted by 3afan
there's really no excuse to fail a high school class if you even try a little bit

agreed....in most school esp. if your an athlete and you give a good effort in that class the teacher will help you out....not neccesarily automatically pass you put i guarntee they would would work you before school, during lunch, maybe give some extra bonus work, etc. to try to help bring up the grade.

[scott Wilson]

NO PASS-NO PLAY. Why would that not be a requirement? What kind of society REWARDS a kid for failing in school (which school is the only reason they get to play the game) by letting them play when they fail? This win at all cost society has got to change. I know some kids only "make the grade" during football season, then go onto fail alot of the rest of the year due to lack of the "athletic" motivation. Maybe if it were NO PASS-NO PLAY EVERY week including into the next year as well, then the grades would always be there, not just when it`s convienent for the kid to pass.

[Phantom Stang]

I'm undecided on this subject, so I'm going to ask for some help by asking what should be a simple question...

Is there any concrete evidence that our schools are delivering a better product to colleges, the armed forces, or society in general, than before "no pass no play" was implemented in the 1980s?
If there is, please provide a source.

[BILLYFRED0000]

The problem with no pass no play is that it is an inequitable rule.
It can be applied differently by the way each school implements it and by the way the loopholes can be used. For example, in some schools the student takes an honors class then fails. Since it is a harder class the student may be given a curve to pass so he can be in line with the kid taking underwater water painting. It is a one size fits all rule where there are many different sizes and issues particularly in poor districts where the parents may work multiple jobs or a single parent may work multiple jobs and be unavailable for their children in the process of trying to feed them.
It has not measurably improved the students. Just reduced the number that is allowed to play. It does not work and needs to be scrapped in favor of some other way to encourage the kids rather than hold a stick over them.

[LH Panther Mom]

We have mandatory tutorials for 75 or below, REGARDLESS of whether the kid participates in extracurricular activities or not. I don't know if it's all athletes or just football, but I do know that beginning with the first 3-week report, football players are required every single week to get their "card" filled out by all teachers with their average for the week. They have to take it to their position coach after getting it signed off. If they don't turn it in, it's not such a good thing.

Why shouldn't they be expected to pass? If the STUDENT-athletes thought about it, they might realize that if they don't pass enough through the year, they get to repeat the grade. They only have 4 years of eligilibility once they hit high school. After that, too bad so sad. It is in their best interest.

[MarginalTalent]

I'm just wondering how many of these kids actually do their own work and how many have mommy and daddy (or sister/brother/friend) doing it for them. A lot of grades don't mean jack.

[TheDOCTORdre]

Originally posted by MarginalTalent
I'm just wondering how many of these kids actually do their own work and how many have mommy and daddy (or sister/brother/friend) doing it for them. A lot of grades don't mean jack.

all im gonna say is that i passed like each class in high schoolo at least 2 or 3 times....and in some occasions i prolly passed classes like 10 or more times or at least i did the work that many times

[Emerson1]

Originally posted by LH Panther Mom
We have mandatory tutorials for 75 or below, REGARDLESS of whether the kid participates in extracurricular activities or not. I don't know if it's all athletes or just football, but I do know that beginning with the first 3-week report, football players are required every single week to get their "card" filled out by all teachers with their average for the week. They have to take it to their position coach after getting it signed off. If they don't turn it in, it's not such a good thing.

Why shouldn't they be expected to pass? If the STUDENT-athletes thought about it, they might realize that if they don't pass enough through the year, they get to repeat the grade. They only have 4 years of eligilibility once they hit high school. After that, too bad so sad. It is in their best interest.
We have to do that to, having a failing grade, a zero or bad conduct gets you punishment.

[BILLYFRED0000]

Originally posted by LH Panther Mom
We have mandatory tutorials for 75 or below, REGARDLESS of whether the kid participates in extracurricular activities or not. I don't know if it's all athletes or just football, but I do know that beginning with the first 3-week report, football players are required every single week to get their "card" filled out by all teachers with their average for the week. They have to take it to their position coach after getting it signed off. If they don't turn it in, it's not such a good thing.

Why shouldn't they be expected to pass? If the STUDENT-athletes thought about it, they might realize that if they don't pass enough through the year, they get to repeat the grade. They only have 4 years of eligilibility once they hit high school. After that, too bad so sad. It is in their best interest.

I agree with all of that. I just don't think a rule makes a difference. All that is common sense and do it and let the kids play. When they run out of eligibility then too bad.

[Phantom Stang]

Originally posted by Phantom Stang
I'm undecided on this subject, so I'm going to ask for some help by asking what should be a simple question...

Is there any concrete evidence that our schools are delivering a better product to colleges, the armed forces, or society in general, than before "no pass no play" was implemented in the 1980s?
If there is, please provide a source.
Well??

[ManuJack]

It is true that high school classes in general are usually fairly easy and all are passable, but some kids, like "Wilma Welfare's" kids, don't have any kind of support from home. Not every child has someone to push them to succeed or make sure they are passing their classes. Also, a lot of students view the tutoring and extra work and assignments as a punishment. Some of these kids' parents couldn't care less whether they are going to school or not, much less what they are doing in school.


Another problem with the "no pass, no play" rule is the small group of teachers that are basically "out to get" the athletes (or band kids or whoever). These teachers sometimes only pick one student or maybe a group of students and grade them on a harder scale or hold them to a higher standard than other students. Though this is sometimes to make the student understand their potential, it is unfair to hold students to different standards just because they are involved in extracurricular activities. Alternatively, there are also the teachers who favor one group or student to another and give a passing grade whether the student earned it or not so the student can still participate in their activity. High school grades tend to be pretty meaningless except to those who are pushed to succeed and/or are supported by their family or close group of peers/role models and who actually care what rank they are in class.