News of choice! [Archive] - Texas DownLow Forum

ASUFrisbeeStud

04-26-2007, 10:01 PM

I can see this getting political.

I don't like how far right Fox can be and I don't like CNN for the way they report things from Israel. It amazes me how a suicide bomber can blow up a school bus in Gaza and then the Israelis make a military strike and kill a couple innocent people in the process and that's what gets reported.

Now that this thread is getting political, it will be promptly closed.

SintonFan

04-26-2007, 10:02 PM

24 votes in 15 minutes...:thinking:

Keith7

04-26-2007, 10:02 PM

Originally posted by JR2004

I usually only watch Fox mainly because they'll brings on morons like Al occasionally. It's always fun to watch guys like him look like completely inept fools.

lol look like fools?? seriously?? do you watch fox news?? I think you have who looks like fools backwards

injuredinmelee

04-26-2007, 10:02 PM

Originally posted by Keith7
CNN by far is the best.. sure biased at time, but not nearly as bad as Fox News..

anystation that has Bill O'Reilly on has got to be the worst station in the world

you cant really count O'Reilly as a newscaster can you? A lot of libs hate someone who speaks the truth without concern for political correctness so I can see why you dont like him.

Keith7

04-26-2007, 10:03 PM

Originally posted by SintonFan
24 votes in 15 minutes...:thinking:

awww it isn't going the way you planned?? :)

SintonFan

04-26-2007, 10:03 PM

Originally posted by ASUFrisbeeStud
Now that this thread is getting political, it will be promptly closed.
.
Hey!!!
Stop being all "CNN-like" on my fun poll!:mad: :p

Keith7

04-26-2007, 10:04 PM

SintonFan

04-26-2007, 10:05 PM

Originally posted by Keith7
awww it isn't going the way you planned?? :)
.
Let's see Keith. There were like 25 members online when I started this poll.
But there were around 40 votes?:thinking:
lol
You tell me...:p

injuredinmelee

04-26-2007, 10:06 PM

Originally posted by SintonFan
.
Let's see Keith. There were like 25 members online when I started this poll.
But there were around 40 votes?:thinking:
lol
You tell me...:p
pretty obvious huh?

SintonFan

04-26-2007, 10:06 PM

Keith, how did 20 something votes get logged in about 2 minutes?:inlove:

Keith7

04-26-2007, 10:09 PM

Originally posted by SintonFan
Keith, how did 20 something votes get logged in about 2 minutes?:inlove:

I guess the downlow has spoken

SintonFan

04-26-2007, 10:09 PM

Originally posted by SintonFan
.
Let's see Keith. There were like 25 members online when I started this poll.
But there were around 40 votes?:thinking:
lol
You tell me...:p
.
OK...
my poll got "jacked".:o :o :o

Keith7

04-26-2007, 10:11 PM

maybe it was the hanging chads in florida, that always helps conservatives win, when a democrat gets more votes

SintonFan

04-26-2007, 10:12 PM

Originally posted by Keith7
I guess the downlow has spoken
.
lol
Go to the bottom of the poll and explain to me where it shows "Total votes". It is currently at 13 votes... lol
Sure, "the downlow has spoken".
I allowed on this poll for folks to vote more than once on choices... not meaning more than one vote for the same choice.:doh:

injuredinmelee

04-26-2007, 10:14 PM

Originally posted by Keith7
maybe it was the hanging chads in florida, that always helps conservatives win, when a democrat gets more votes

hard to cry when your constituents arent intelligent enough to use a punch card...

Keith7

04-26-2007, 10:14 PM

Originally posted by SintonFan
.
lol
Go to the bottom of the poll and explain to me where it shows "Total votes". It is currently at 13 votes... lol
Sure, "the downlow has spoken".
I allowed on this poll for folks to vote more than once on choices... not meaning more than one vote for the same choice.:doh:

I don't get it.. are you saying I hacked this poll??

SintonFan

04-26-2007, 10:15 PM

Originally posted by Keith7
I don't get it.. are you saying I hacked this poll??
.
Did I blame you? Really dude...:eek:

bhtrainer

04-26-2007, 10:15 PM

Keith7

04-26-2007, 10:16 PM

Originally posted by SintonFan
.
Did I blame you? Really dude...:eek:

I guess not but thats the way I understood it.. I wish I knew how to do that.. i'm sure alot of threads would have ended up alot differently

injuredinmelee

04-26-2007, 10:17 PM

Originally posted by Keith7
I don't get it.. are you saying I hacked this poll??
I am saying you DID it.

DDBooger

04-26-2007, 10:17 PM

Originally posted by injuredinmelee
you cant really count O'Reilly as a newscaster can you? A lot of libs hate someone who speaks the truth without concern for political correctness so I can see why you dont like him. lol well most of the time except when he implicates americans in crimes 60+ years ago, and when those crimes were committed against THEM! lol Bill's a crazy guy, good for some yelling and stuff, but the man has his facts backwards, case in point lol. (WWII malmady massacre) i remember hearing about this, just found it. wonder if his assistant was canned?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QHUGCkROwJE

SintonFan

04-26-2007, 10:18 PM

Originally posted by DDBooger
lol well most of the time except when he implicates americans in crimes 60+ years ago, and when those crimes were committed against THEM! lol Bill's a crazy guy, good for some yelling and stuff, but the man has his facts backwards, case in point lol. (WWII malmady massacre) i remember hearing about this, just found it. wonder if his assistant was canned?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QHUGCkROwJE
.
Come on Boog... you and I both know that Al Gore owns a major stake in youtube.:doh:

injuredinmelee

04-26-2007, 10:20 PM

Now here is a funny Billy Boy clip.

Just plain funny (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QTGFxV1NqJQ)

surely someone knew what was happening on the crew...

Keith7

04-26-2007, 10:20 PM

Originally posted by DDBooger
lol well most of the time except when he implicates americans in crimes 60+ years ago, and when those crimes were committed against THEM! lol Bill's a crazy guy, good for some yelling and stuff, but the man has his facts backwards, case in point lol. (WWII malmady massacre) i remember hearing about this, just found it. wonder if his assistant was canned?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QHUGCkROwJE

good post.. just goes to show that O'Reilly is a right wing extremist who makes outragous claims to boost ratings and further make himself look like a jack***

DDBooger

04-26-2007, 10:21 PM

Originally posted by SintonFan
.
Come on Boog... you and I both know that Al Gore owns a major stake in youtube.:doh: hahaha yeah he works wonders with cgi getting Bill O to say the things he does!

BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END

04-26-2007, 10:22 PM

Originally posted by injuredinmelee
you cant really count O'Reilly as a newscaster can you? A lot of libs hate someone who speaks the truth without concern for political correctness so I can see why you dont like him.

If you call that the truth, then you're completely mistaken. O'Reilly lied in the beginning about his political affiliation, and that lie has been snowballing ever since.

Keith7

04-26-2007, 10:23 PM

oh no o'reilly looks dumb again :( (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-wOpbUgAwBE)

DDBooger

04-26-2007, 10:23 PM

Originally posted by Keith7
good post.. just goes to show that O'Reilly is a right wing extremist who makes outragous claims to boost ratings and further make himself look like a jack*** well that or his staff isn't worth **** he's entertaining and sometimes he attacks people justifiably who show leniency to sexual offenders as such. but otherwise the guy is laughable

injuredinmelee

04-26-2007, 10:25 PM

Originally posted by BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END
If you call that the truth, then you're completely mistaken. O'Reilly lied in the beginning about his political affiliation, and that lie has been snowballing ever since.

yes your right he has never ever spoken a true word... I like the way he refuses to sugar coat anything. Of course that makes him far from a lib since their entire party is built on sugar coating and a refusal for self accountability.

bhtrainer

04-26-2007, 10:26 PM

would any of you who do not like O'reilly happen to be clinton supporters...just wondering?

SintonFan

04-26-2007, 10:26 PM

Originally posted by DDBooger
hahaha yeah he works wonders with cgi getting Bill O to say the things he does!
.
lol
O'Reilly speaks the truth and common sense but why do leftists try to silence him? Maybe it's because they can't stand an opposing view against their own? .
.
Would you say this might be true... That leftist do tend to silence those who oppose their view?
.
At least with Fox News they let everyone talk and talk and talk and talk...:cool:

DDBooger

04-26-2007, 10:29 PM

DDBooger

04-26-2007, 10:29 PM

Originally posted by bhtrainer
would any of you who do not like O'reilly happen to be clinton supporters...just wondering? naw just supporters of factual info! ;)

Keith7

04-26-2007, 10:30 PM

Originally posted by SintonFan
.

.
Would you say this might be true... That leftist do tend to silence those who oppose their view?

I don't understand where you get this from, these "lefists" you speak of have had O'Reilly himself on their shows, and have been on his show as well.. how can you say they are trying to silence him??

DDBooger

04-26-2007, 10:31 PM

Originally posted by SintonFan
.
lol
O'Reilly speaks the truth and common sense but why do leftists try to silence him? Maybe it's because they can't stand an opposing view against their own? .
.
Would you say this might be true... That leftist do tend to silence those who oppose their view?
.
At least with Fox News they let everyone talk and talk and talk and talk...:cool: lol yeah truth like american victims of german atrocites being blamed of commiting atrocities:clap: O'reilly I salute ya! keep it real pard! cause clouding the truth but doing it with a loud voice is COMMON SENSE! lol you know its crazy the last time i read anything about politics that was common sense, was the book! COMMON SENSE! lol

DDBooger

04-26-2007, 10:33 PM

Originally posted by Keith7
I don't understand where you get this from, these "lefists" you speak of have had O'Reilly himself on their shows, and have been on his show as well.. how can you say they are trying to silence him?? no see, when libs correct its seen as they are "PICKING ON US:( " haha and how many times have libs been called treasonous for not agreeing with the war? goes both ways! SF you are smart enough to know that!

injuredinmelee

04-26-2007, 10:34 PM

wow i am disappointed that we havent gotten this thread shut down yet...

SintonFan

04-26-2007, 10:34 PM

Originally posted by DDBooger
lmao yes he forcefeeds the **** and calls it a sundae! lol
.
Boog, you make my point. Leftist, when they can't argue their socialist policies in a fair setting, do nothing but "character assassination".
.
Basically, if they can't win the war of ideas, leftists try harder to discredit those who have opposing views. That's more than wrong and against the tenets on what this great nation was founded upon.:o :o :o

SintonFan

04-26-2007, 10:37 PM

Originally posted by DDBooger
lol yeah truth like american victims of german atrocites being blamed of commiting atrocities:clap: O'reilly I salute ya! keep it real pard! cause clouding the truth but doing it with a loud voice is COMMON SENSE! lol you know its crazy the last time i read anything about politics that was common sense, was the book! COMMON SENSE! lol
.
lol
I'm smart enough to know you never answered my question.;) :p

DDBooger

04-26-2007, 10:37 PM

Originally posted by SintonFan
.
Boog, you make my point. Leftist, when they can't argue their socialist policies in a fair setting, do nothing but "character assassination".
.
Basically, if they can't win the war of ideas, leftists try harder to discredit those who have opposing views. That's more than wrong but against the tenets on what this great nation was founded upon.:o :o :o socialist party? hahaha and when a con can't he begins to sound like Ray Cohn or Sen. McCarthy! haha awww come on SF you are better than that. are you fitting me with a argument to ease your point! buddy im center right with regards to social issues. now re: foreign affairs, well hell, just good 'ol common sense! wait character assasination? what did you call what happend to valerie plame? career assasination?

DDBooger

04-26-2007, 10:38 PM

Originally posted by SintonFan
.
lol
I'm smart enough to know you never answered my question.;) :p sorry was it a question or a political diatribe slanted from your point of view? regardless i'll back track, probably got thrown off

BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END

04-26-2007, 10:39 PM

Originally posted by injuredinmelee
yes your right he has never ever spoken a true word... I like the way he refuses to sugar coat anything. Of course that makes him far from a lib since their entire party is built on sugar coating and a refusal for self accountability.

Man, you don't even want to get this started with me, because I am more than capable to make you eat every word that you have said. If only I had the time, but go ahead, go watch Bill O'Reilly and Fox News and keep buying into the propaganda. I'll start watching Fox News when the Republicans step up and take responsibility for the mistake in Iraq and for sitting around while the WTC was attacked, the unconstitutional usurpation of individual rights, and the piss-poor economy. The Republicans have had the power for the last seven years and look at what has happened to our country, and I have yet to hear a Republican leader step up and take fault for what has been happening to our economy and to our troops.

Keith7

04-26-2007, 10:40 PM

too bad fox news can't just build a wall between them and CNN that seems to be the answer to all of the Republican's problems..

BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END

04-26-2007, 10:40 PM

Originally posted by SintonFan
.
Boog, you make my point. Leftist, when they can't argue their socialist policies in a fair setting, do nothing but "character assassination".
.
Basically, if they can't win the war of ideas, leftists try harder to discredit those who have opposing views. That's more than wrong and against the tenets on what this great nation was founded upon.:o :o :o

I find it funny how conservatives boast about how bad abortion is, but then turn around and want to do away with programs that put food in the mouths of our citizens and clothes on their backs. Starving our citizens to death and forcing them into poverty is just as bad as supporting abortion, if not worse.

DDBooger

04-26-2007, 10:41 PM

Originally posted by SintonFan
.

.
At least with Fox News they let everyone talk and talk and talk and talk...:cool: REALLY? haha check this out! took the lady taking Combs place to return the favor and give whats her name a taste as well
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AZLfLmncPEc

SintonFan

04-26-2007, 10:45 PM

Originally posted by DDBooger
socialist party? hahaha and when a con can't he begins to sound like Ray Cohn or Sen. McCarthy! haha awww come on SF you are better than that. are you fitting me with a argument to ease your point! buddy im center right with regards to social issues. now re: foreign affairs, well hell, just good 'ol common sense! wait character assasination? what did you call what happend to valerie plame? career assasination?
.
Valerie Plame?
That whole argument has two very distinct different sides to it and I know we'll never agree on that. lol
.
Let me ask you another question...
how many TV news programs, shows, channels et EVERYTHING that is on cable(TV or everything) might have a leftists-leaning slant to it? Can you put a percentage on it?
Maybe 95%? No that's not right because I must be just "insane in the brain".
But here comes along FOX NEWS and they present a different view...
suddenly Fox News and O' Reilly and Hannity and many on that network are "trying to brainwash America"...
lol
Well HELLO!!!!!
The opposite is true for leftists for decades on the major networks and now we gripe about an opposing view and name it "brainwashing"....
I'd say that is the pot calling the kettle black.:D :p

DDBooger

04-26-2007, 10:47 PM

Originally posted by BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END
I find it funny how conservatives boast about how bad abortion is, but then turn around and want to do away with programs that put food in the mouths of our citizens and clothes on their backs. Starving our citizens to death and forcing them into poverty is just as bad as supporting abortion, if not worse. while I don't agree with everything ya say DE, im not calling ya socialist or communist! lol wait, isn't that character assasination? the closest thing i come to as far as the left is concerned would be the argument that the globally coordinated elite and multi-national conglomerates are preventing growth in developing nations. while many choose to susbcribe to Modernization Theory, Dependence theory really begins to make a lot of sense.

SintonFan

04-26-2007, 10:48 PM

DDBooger

04-26-2007, 10:48 PM

Originally posted by SintonFan
.
Valerie Plame?
That whole argument has two very distinct different sides to it and I know we'll never agree on that. lol
. lol not when one side claims righteousness over the next! like i said the DEUCE flows both ways!

bhtrainer

04-26-2007, 10:49 PM

Originally posted by BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END
I'll start watching Fox News when the Republicans step up and take responsibility for the mistake in Iraq.

what mistakes do you see have been made in Iraq...dont flip on me im just asking...

BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END

04-26-2007, 10:49 PM

Originally posted by SintonFan
.
How many starving folks do you personally know?:thinking: :p

We don't, thanks to domestic programs that the government maintains.

big daddy russ

04-26-2007, 10:50 PM

Bill O'Reilly, Greta Van Sustern, and Sean Hannity are no different than Keith Olbermann, Alan Colmes, and Stuart Small... errr... Al Franken.

THEY ARE NOT NEWS PROGRAMS!!!

The most "fair" news programs I've seen are on the three major networks, but no TV news program is going to be fair and balanced. They have, on average, about two minutes for a lead segment. Not nearly enough time to give you a fair and balanced report.

Hell, most print news isn't fair and balanced, and that's the best place to get your news.

Honestly, if you're looking for fair and balanced, watch Fox and CNN, then read the NY Times and Houston Chronicle, then do your own background research.

As a former member of the media, I know better than anyone that if you're looking for the whole story, you do the research on your own. The internet is only a click away... it's not like we're limited to info the way we were a mere 15 years ago.

DDBooger

04-26-2007, 10:51 PM

Originally posted by SintonFan
.
Valerie Plame?
That whole argument has two very distinct different sides to it and I know we'll never agree on that. lol
.
Let me ask you another question...
how many TV news programs, shows, channels et EVERYTHING that is on cable(TV or everything) might have a leftists-leaning slant to it? Can you put a percentage on it?
Maybe 95%? No that's not right because I must be just "insane in the brain".
But here comes along FOX NEWS and they present a different view...
suddenly Fox News and O' Reilly and Hannity and many on that network are "trying to brainwash America"...
lol
Well HELLO!!!!!
The opposite is true for leftists for decades on the major networks and now we gripe about an opposing view and name it "brainwashing"....
I'd say that is the pot calling the kettle black.:D :p now see SF looking at it from a skew is the reasoning behind what you are saying! now i ask this question how much of what they are saying is opinion and how much of it is fact? I don't watch enough news to gauge something like that. But the other side of the spectrum, WHO CONTROLS RADIO? and if im not correct i'll accept being corrected, cause i don't have the numbers, but how many more peole listen to talk radio then watch the news? i thought it was significantly more? (sincere question) i'd like those numbers

BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END

04-26-2007, 10:51 PM

Originally posted by bhtrainer
what mistakes do you see have been made in Iraq...dont flip on me im just asking...

I'm not going to waste my time explaining it to you. Either you care enough to learn the truth on your own, or you watch Fox News and Bill O'Reilly and get your propaganda from there, and obviously you've already bought into the propaganda.

SintonFan

04-26-2007, 10:52 PM

Originally posted by Keith7
too bad fox news can't just build a wall between them and CNN that seems to be the answer to all of the Republican's problems..
.
You didn't capatalize "Fox News" yet you did CNN...
biased?:thinking:
.
When I get a chance Keith, I do watch both channels. It does make you more well-rounded. Maybe that's why my back-side has become so big...:confused: :D

SintonFan

04-26-2007, 10:53 PM

Originally posted by BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END
We don't, thanks to domestic programs that the government maintains.
.
How many folks have you seen starved by the Republicans and how many Rebuplicans have you overheard saying they want to "starve folks".:thinking: :thinking: :thinking:

injuredinmelee

04-26-2007, 10:53 PM

Originally posted by BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END
I find it funny how conservatives boast about how bad abortion is, but then turn around and want to do away with programs that put food in the mouths of our citizens and clothes on their backs. Starving our citizens to death and forcing them into poverty is just as bad as supporting abortion, if not worse.

tell us please how the government is starving people to death? Oh please tell us. But be sure and tell us how right it is also for perfectly capable people should be allowed to sit at home refusing to work instead living off your tax dollars? Tell us how right it is that we should support them. Tell us hwy they shouldnt be held responsible for theirs and their own. Tell us why we should keep paying taxes to feed the kids these slackers are producing simply so they can get a bigger welfare check every month and more food Stamps. Tell us why they shouldnt be held responsible to feed and support financially what they produce?

bhtrainer

04-26-2007, 10:53 PM

Originally posted by BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END
We don't, thanks to domestic programs that the government maintains.

thats another things that just rubs me the way wrong way...i dont understand why we have welfare i can see maybe for the elderly or handicapped but just giving money and food stamps to people who have all these kids...in my opinion if you cant support yourself...you shouldnt put yourself in the position to support other people...and if you want to live a life you should work for it... it should not be handed to you and paid for by the poeple who do work for their own money

DDBooger

04-26-2007, 10:54 PM

Originally posted by BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END
I'm not going to waste my time explaining it to you. Either you care enough to learn the truth on your own, or you watch Fox News and Bill O'Reilly and get your propaganda from there, and obviously you've already bought into the propaganda. BBDE, see its liberal media when ya point out problems! lol i don't agree with the damn war but as I've said before I think leaving prematurely may destabilize the middle east much worse than it is already. In case no one has paid attention. Turkey is ratcheting up its military hardware and making some huge purchases. Iran is also doing some REARRANGEMENT of priorities. WHEN and if Iraq is reconstituted into 3 countries the **** will hit the fan! damn brits had no vision! ;) lol

injuredinmelee

04-26-2007, 10:54 PM

SintonFan

04-26-2007, 10:55 PM

Originally posted by DDBooger
lol not when one side claims righteousness over the next! like i said the DEUCE flows both ways!
.
Which side do you see as claiming to be "more righteous"?:confused:

DDBooger

04-26-2007, 10:56 PM

Originally posted by SintonFan
.
You didn't capatalize "Fox News" yet you did CNN...
biased?:thinking:
. like your poll? pmsnbc and C.ommunist NN? lol sensing a bit of hypocracy here?

bhtrainer

04-26-2007, 10:57 PM

Originally posted by BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END
I'm not going to waste my time explaining it to you. Either you care enough to learn the truth on your own, or you watch Fox News and Bill O'Reilly and get your propaganda from there, and obviously you've already bought into the propaganda.

excuse me while i say...just because im a 16 year old girl does not mean i buy into what im told...a lot of my family bat from the left side of the plate...i however bat from the right... i think goin into Iraq was a good thing...maybe they didnt have nuclear weapons but they had a dictator who needed to be removed...and wouldnt you rather us find nuclear weapons and help the Iraqi people then just be blown up...im not sayin bush is perfect...but i do support him because i dont think that what he did was wrong in any way...so i will continue to watch O'reilly and read his books...

DDBooger

04-26-2007, 10:57 PM

Originally posted by SintonFan
.
Which side do you see as claiming to be "more righteous"?:confused: WELL DUH! the one listening to GOD when it acts! ;) j/k um well you must mean the right never attempts character assasination if it has the freedom to claim others do! or does that argument only benefit the right?

Keith7

04-26-2007, 10:57 PM

Originally posted by SintonFan
.
How many folks have you seen starved by the Republicans and how many Rebuplicans have you overheard saying they want to "starve folks".:thinking: :thinking: :thinking:

of course they don't say they want to starve folks, that would ruin their political careers, but I thought that was common sense..

They do want to do away with some government programs that help people who live paycheck to paycheck put food on the table for their families..

bhtrainer

04-26-2007, 10:57 PM

Originally posted by injuredinmelee
your one to talk. He asked you a comment you made you dont seem to have the facts to back up your claims either???

why does everyone call me a HE....IM A FREAKIN GIRL!!!!

DDBooger

04-26-2007, 10:58 PM

Originally posted by injuredinmelee
your one to talk. He asked you a comment you made you dont seem to have the facts to back up your claims either??? facts like Iraq's WMD? or connection to Al Queda?

injuredinmelee

04-26-2007, 10:59 PM

As an American citizen NO ONE OWES YOU ANYTHING! There are opportunities to be had EVERYWHERE. You are responsible for your own decisions and actions. Its not Uncle Sam's fault, its not your parents fault, it isn't anyones fault but your own! The opportunities are the same for everyone in this country. Your life will be what you make it. DO not rely on anyone else for your well being, do not rely on anyone else for your happiness. To sit back and wait for the world to come to you is begging for failure and a life of unhappiness.

DDBooger

04-26-2007, 10:59 PM

and guys before this gets out of hand! i love this stuff and I have the up most respect for SF! while we sure ideological differences on some issues, he's a stand up guy! ;) now back to the punches! :)

injuredinmelee

04-26-2007, 11:00 PM

Originally posted by bhtrainer
why does everyone call me a HE....IM A FREAKIN GIRL!!!!

your right my bad...

BILLYFRED0000

04-26-2007, 11:00 PM

Originally posted by BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END
I'm not going to waste my time explaining it to you. Either you care enough to learn the truth on your own, or you watch Fox News and Bill O'Reilly and get your propaganda from there, and obviously you've already bought into the propaganda.

Bunch of mistakes have been made. The big one was listening to
Rumsfeld. I always thought he was too much like Mcnamara.
Always saying you could do more with less and much more interested in counting the beans than fighting the war. There was enough controversy about his numbers that I think he was flat wrong. But do not forget that Turkey did not let us launch anything from there which pretty much exempted the northern areas from attack and left the terrorists and baathists a place of retreat and regroup. Once we finally got there they had their act more or less together. But the real mistake was believing that Iran would not try to help the Shi'ites gain control so Iran could gain control.

SintonFan

04-26-2007, 11:01 PM

Originally posted by DDBooger
now see SF looking at it from a skew is the reasoning behind what you are saying! now i ask this question how much of what they are saying is opinion and how much of it is fact? I don't watch enough news to gauge something like that. But the other side of the spectrum, WHO CONTROLS RADIO? and if im not correct i'll accept being corrected, cause i don't have the numbers, but how many more peole listen to talk radio then watch the news? i thought it was significantly more? (sincere question) i'd like those numbers
.
You never answered my question again. You can throw out a "ballpark" number just like I did on TV. I don't claim to be accurate but heck "ballpark" numbers are there just fun to allow us to engage in fruit full conversation. Come on boog! You're better and smarter than that... not answering the question.:doh: lol
.
I'll answer your question on radio. It(Talk Radio) is dominated by conservative talk. Period. There's a market for it and it is filled by those on the radio-waves.
Do you propose we REGULATE AM radio opinions?:thinking: :thinking: :thinking:

SintonFan

04-26-2007, 11:02 PM

Originally posted by DDBooger
like your poll? pmsnbc and C.ommunist NN? lol sensing a bit of hypocracy here?
.
I capatalized all of them... lol
I did add that part of CNN didn't I? :D
just for fun...:nerd:
got some juices flowin, huh?:p

DDBooger

04-26-2007, 11:03 PM

Originally posted by BILLYFRED0000
Bunch of mistakes have been made. The big one was listening to
Rumsfeld. I always thought he was too much like Mcnamara.
Always saying you could do more with less and much more interested in counting the beans than fighting the war. There was enough controversy about his numbers that I think he was flat wrong. But do not forget that Turkey did not let us launch anything from there which pretty much exempted the northern areas from attack and left the terrorists and baathists a place of retreat and regroup. Once we finally got there they had their act more or less together. But the real mistake was believing that Iran would not try to help the Shi'ites gain control so Iran could gain control. yes that TURKEY thing did F things up for us regarding intitial front line troops but in the end the numbers were still too low! while i don't agree with the war, if it was going to be carried out anyway, THEY SHOULD HAVE LISTENED to COLIN instead of RUMMY! the powel doctrine! OVERWHELMING FORCE! we used 500,000 plus to remove iraq from a tiny country, did rummy really think 125,000 men could occupy a nation of over 20 million?

mistanice

04-26-2007, 11:03 PM

Originally posted by injuredinmelee
As an American citizen NO ONE OWES YOU ANYTHING! There are opportunities to be had EVERYWHERE. You are responsible for your own decisions and actions. Its not Uncle Sam's fault, its not your parents fault, it isn't anyones fault but your own! The opportunities are the same for everyone in this country. Your life will be what you make it. DO not rely on anyone else for your well being, do not rely on anyone else for your happiness. To sit back and wait for the world to come to you is begging for failure and a life of unhappiness.

sorry man, i've been using federal grants to recieve an education the last 4 years. I hope you're not mad at me.

injuredinmelee

04-26-2007, 11:04 PM

you now back in the good old days of World War I and World War II we didnt have to worry about the hippie protesters and we could fight war the way it was intended to be... with death involved! Kill em all let God sort em out. Now we have to worry about fighting the politically correct way. You think the Terrorist will ever stop? DO you think they will listen to reason? Do you think they will agree to a peace treaty? Do you think they care if they kill innocents? Do you think we can rehabilitate them?

DDBooger

04-26-2007, 11:04 PM

Originally posted by SintonFan
.
You never answered my question again. You can throw out a "ballpark" number just like I did on TV. I don't claim to be accurate but heck "ballpark" numbers are there just fun to allow us to engage in fruit full conversation. Come on boog! You're better and smarter than that... not answering the question.:doh: lol
.
I'll answer your question on radio. It(Talk Radio) is dominated by conservative talk. Period. There's a market for it and it is filled by those on the radio-waves.
Do you propose we REGULATE AM radio opinions?:thinking: :thinking: :thinking: well darnit SF, if you are interested in the question you go find it! lol its important to you and had no basis for anything i said prior! you are just on the whole liberal conspiracy trip! lol now if ya want me to get a quantitative study going on the issue you may have to give me a few years to get approved by the IRB! but i'll get it to ya! :)

bhtrainer

04-26-2007, 11:05 PM

Originally posted by mistanice
sorry man, i've been using federal grants to recieve an education the last 4 years. I hope you're not mad at me.

education is a different story...you are using money for good use... some people on welfare...have all these kids...and do not take responsibility...they expect money to be handed to them because they are here...

BILLYFRED0000

04-26-2007, 11:05 PM

Originally posted by BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END
If you call that the truth, then you're completely mistaken. O'Reilly lied in the beginning about his political affiliation, and that lie has been snowballing ever since.

I will tell you you are wrong about Bill. He is much more liberal than you think. But he never really claimed to be anything. He just went to work with what he had. You cannot really call a man a liar without the right to hear his explanation. It is probably closer to a misunderstanding. So be careful with what you say. Someone can just as easily call you a liar on any given day because we all truthfully tend to shade things towards our personal beliefs. Life is full of questions, and usually the answers bring more questions. It is more important how you navigate between the two.

SintonFan

04-26-2007, 11:05 PM

Originally posted by BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END
Either you care enough to learn the truth on your own, or you watch Fox News and Bill O'Reilly and get your propaganda from there, and obviously you've already bought into the propaganda.
.
Calling Fox News "propaganda" is character assasination.
Just like me calling CNN "Communist News Network"... lol
.
I'm guilty!:doh:

DDBooger

04-26-2007, 11:06 PM

Originally posted by injuredinmelee
you now back in the good old days of World War I and World War II we didnt have to worry about the hippie protesters and we could fight war the way it was intended to be... with death involved! Kill em all let God sort em out. Now we have to worry about fighting the politically correct way. You think the Terrorist will ever stop? DO you think they will listen to reason? Do you think they will agree to a peace treaty? Do you think they care if they kill innocents? Do you think we can rehabilitate them? yeah cause in those wars the aggressors were the countries we were fighting! lol its not about being politically correct its about killing the RIGHT people! im still waiting for someone to point out the iraqi involved in 9/11. hell just 1! 1 would be suffice to invade iraq!!

BILLYFRED0000

04-26-2007, 11:07 PM

Originally posted by DDBooger
yes that TURKEY thing did F things up for us regarding intitial front line troops but in the end the numbers were still too low! while i don't agree with the war, if it was going to be carried out anyway, THEY SHOULD HAVE LISTENED to COLIN instead of RUMMY! the powel doctrine! OVERWHELMING FORCE! we used 500,000 plus to remove iraq from a tiny country, did rummy really think 125,000 men could occupy a nation of over 20 million?

Yep, but we can thank the Clintons for the state of the military because the "peace" doctrine said we did not need the numbers anymore. We could not field much more than we did.

injuredinmelee

04-26-2007, 11:07 PM

Originally posted by mistanice
sorry man, i've been using federal grants to recieve an education the last 4 years. I hope you're not mad at me.

you know what, programs liek that are well needed and well used. Its a reward for trying to obtain a better life for yourself. Isnt it sickening thinking about how much more money that could be in the college grant coffers if we werent feeding and supporting the ones that are sitting on their porches all day drinking cheap beer and philosphizing about how the world needs to make it easier for them?

Keith7

04-26-2007, 11:07 PM

Originally posted by mistanice
sorry man, i've been using federal grants to recieve an education the last 4 years. I hope you're not mad at me.

same here.. My parents can't afford to pay my full tuition and I would have to work full time and save for years to be able to pay by myself, I guess I don't deserve to be educated and have a chance to succeed...

There are people who have nothing and live on the minimum wage, their families don't deserve to eat either, they shoulda worked harder, screw helping them so they can get better jobs

DDBooger

04-26-2007, 11:08 PM

Originally posted by SintonFan
.
You never answered my question again. You can throw out a "ballpark" number just like I did on TV. I don't claim to be accurate but heck "ballpark" numbers are there just fun to allow us to engage in fruit full conversation. Come on boog! You're better and smarter than that... not answering the question.:doh: lol
.
I'll answer your question on radio. It(Talk Radio) is dominated by conservative talk. Period. There's a market for it and it is filled by those on the radio-waves.
Do you propose we REGULATE AM radio opinions?:thinking: :thinking: :thinking: oh well hell if we are talking generalizations and no empiricals sure, im pretty confident in agreeing a lot of tv media is slanted to the left but if you want accurate numbers that crap just doesn't mean anything to me! im not worried that the libs are gonna destroy my way of life with their damn progressive attitudes! damn gay marriage!:thinking: lol

bhtrainer

04-26-2007, 11:08 PM

Originally posted by SintonFan
.
Calling Fox News "propaganda" is character assasination.
Just like me calling CNN "Communist News Network"... lol
.
I'm guilty!:doh:

we dont even have CNN at my house...all we have is fox news...my mom calls it the Clinton News Network and had it taken off our satellite

injuredinmelee

04-26-2007, 11:09 PM

DDBooger

04-26-2007, 11:10 PM

Originally posted by injuredinmelee
you dont believe at all that Saddam and his regime financially supported terrorism esp Alqeida(sp). well let me pose this to you, can you produce the evidence suggesting it? cause the saudi elites outright brag about it yet they are safe and nestled away in their magical kingdom!

Keith7

04-26-2007, 11:10 PM

Originally posted by injuredinmelee
you know what, programs liek that are well needed and well used. Its a reward for trying to obtain a better life for yourself. Isnt it sickening thinking about how much more money that could be in the college grant coffers if we werent feeding and supporting the ones that are sitting on their porches all day drinking cheap beer and philosphizing about how the world needs to make it easier for them?

oh so because a few abuse government policies we should just do away with all of them?? seems like a double standard to me (http://bbs.3adownlow.com/vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=63358)

BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END

04-26-2007, 11:11 PM

Originally posted by injuredinmelee
you dont believe at all that Saddam and his regime financially supported terrorism esp Alqeida(sp).

Al Queda hated Saddam Hussein, his country, and what he stood for, so yes, I do not believe that, and neither did United States intelligence officials after the WTC attacks and after we invaded Iraq.

BILLYFRED0000

04-26-2007, 11:11 PM

Originally posted by DDBooger
yeah cause in those wars the aggressors were the countries we were fighting! lol its not about being politically correct its about killing the RIGHT people! im still waiting for someone to point out the iraqi involved in 9/11. hell just 1! 1 would be suffice to invade iraq!!

I will lay your burden down on this one. Zarquawi was in Afghanistan training up his Al-Queda connected group along side other Taliban assisted terrorists. When we kicked the Taliban around where did Zarquawi go? Iraq..... But please don't get 911
confused with Iraq..... Iraq was already in violation of international treaty and had been for ever. 17 UN resolutions were passed and still Saddam shot at our plans and kept the weapons inspectors guessing. No WMD was found. But Saddam kept acting like a playa and so he was treated like a playa. Only problem I have is we should have finished this the first time. W was having to clean up his father's mess. And Rummy screwed it up by the numbers.

SintonFan

04-26-2007, 11:12 PM

Originally posted by Keith7
of course they don't say they want to starve folks, that would ruin their political careers, but I thought that was common sense..

They do want to do away with some government programs that help people who live paycheck to paycheck put food on the table for their families..
.
Are you crazy Keith?!? lol don't answer that...;):)
Let me say you got my whole question wrong in your understanding.
.
CONSERVATIVES(at least I do) BELIEVE WE SHOULD ALL PROSPER IN THIS GREAT NATION... SOMETIMES IT TAKES "GETTING OFF THE COUCH OR GRAVY-TRAIN OR OFF YOU FAT BUTT TO DO SO"...
.
I believe that folks who spend their whole lives on welfare are just taking advantage of us all. These great socialist programs yall flaunt should be "helping hands" not frikkin "hammocks".:mad:

injuredinmelee

04-26-2007, 11:12 PM

Originally posted by Keith7
same here.. My parents can't afford to pay my full tuition and I would have to work full time and save for years to be able to pay by myself, I guess I don't deserve to be educated and have a chance to succeed...

There are people who have nothing and live on the minimum wage, their families don't deserve to eat either, they shoulda worked harder, screw helping them so they can get better jobs
no one said you didnt deserve the right to succeed. No one said that the people that are willing to work their butts off to make a better life for themselves shouldnt succeed. You are simply twisting it to martyr yourselves. you have been trained well my little liberal friend.

DDBooger

04-26-2007, 11:12 PM

and that turns my stomach!! and every tough talking conservative who acts like they been there before forgets that. well i can't say all but i don't hear anything about those fat cats SOBs. hell even the saudi king is turning against bush for this war. F it, lets start giving ultimatums and finding these wahabi's collecting cash from our burbs and lacs! ;)

SintonFan

04-26-2007, 11:13 PM

Originally posted by DDBooger
well darnit SF, if you are interested in the question you go find it! lol its important to you and had no basis for anything i said prior! you are just on the whole liberal conspiracy trip! lol now if ya want me to get a quantitative study going on the issue you may have to give me a few years to get approved by the IRB! but i'll get it to ya! :)
.
Ehh...
I'd rather talk about quantitive(is that spelt rite? lol) physics.:doh:

BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END

04-26-2007, 11:14 PM

Originally posted by injuredinmelee
tell us please how the government is starving people to death? Oh please tell us. But be sure and tell us how right it is also for perfectly capable people should be allowed to sit at home refusing to work instead living off your tax dollars? Tell us how right it is that we should support them. Tell us hwy they shouldnt be held responsible for theirs and their own. Tell us why we should keep paying taxes to feed the kids these slackers are producing simply so they can get a bigger welfare check every month and more food Stamps. Tell us why they shouldnt be held responsible to feed and support financially what they produce?

They are held responsible, but federal programs need to be enacted when Americans are living below the poverty line even with a full-time job. I'm not making excuses for anyone, but people do have disabilities and circumstances, which is why these programs are in place. Are you telling me that in the 1920s, thousands of Americans were unemployed because they were lazy, and many traveled to California so they could sit on their ass? Get real, you act like the economy is perfect right now and a man can raise a family on minimum wage. I never said the government was starving anyone, but the social programs that everyone bashes and calls the Democrats Socialists for are what help our fellow people get by.

injuredinmelee

04-26-2007, 11:15 PM

Originally posted by Keith7
oh so because a few abuse government policies we should just do away with all of them?? seems like a double standard to me (http://bbs.3adownlow.com/vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=63358)

a few abuse it? Come on. take off the liberal shades my friend and get a clue about the real world. Who said ALL the government programs? I didnt. Did anyone else say it? Are you simply sensationalizing the topic in order to draw out the emotions of those around you? Wow you are a true dem little buddy.

DDBooger

04-26-2007, 11:15 PM

Originally posted by BILLYFRED0000
I will lay your burden down on this one. Zarquawi was in Afghanistan training up his Al-Queda connected group along side other Taliban assisted terrorists. When we kicked the Taliban around where did Zarquawi go? Iraq..... But please don't get 911
confused with Iraq..... Iraq was already in violation of international treaty and had been for ever. 17 UN resolutions were passed and still Saddam shot at our plans and kept the weapons inspectors guessing. No WMD was found. But Saddam kept acting like a playa and so he was treated like a playa. Only problem I have is we should have finished this the first time. W was having to clean up his father's mess. And Rummy screwed it up by the numbers. well geez, did you suggest he act like a wimp with iran sitting there? now you can't claim they aren't a threat cause our adm. sure thinks they are! and guess who made them the big kid in the middle east block! yes he was in violation of this or that, but did he pose a bigger threat than the actual conspirators? was it worth losing our standing in the world, who no matter how arrogant we perceive ourselves we ABSOLUTELY need to win this war on terror. w/o cooperation from other nations we are as good as beaten! we can threaten all we want, but with one leg stuck in iraq and the other in Afghanistan(where we should be concentrating) how serious can someone take us? besides the threat of nukes, im beginning to think our bluff will get called

SintonFan

04-26-2007, 11:16 PM

A total of 23 votes taken by those who have voted but yet 25 votes for CNN.:thinking:
I'd say yalls "hanging chads" have struck back.:p
.
FoX News is slowly creeping up.:D

bhtrainer

04-26-2007, 11:16 PM

you guys are so frustrating....i have said the same things as some of the "older more wiser" people on here yet it takes someone else to say it before yall have anything to say back...im goin to bed

injuredinmelee

04-26-2007, 11:16 PM

Originally posted by BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END
They are held responsible, but federal programs need to be enacted when Americans are living below the poverty line even with a full-time job. I'm not making excuses for anyone, but people do have disabilities and circumstances, which is why these programs are in place. Are you telling me that in the 1920s, thousands of Americans were unemployed because they were lazy, and many traveled to California so they could sit on their ass? Get real, you act like the economy is perfect right now and a man can raise a family on minimum wage. I never said the government was starving anyone, but the social programs that everyone bashes and calls the Democrats Socialists for are what help our fellow people get by.

the 20"s How does that apply to today? we were in the middle of a depression then. The opportunities are there for the taking now. Earn it you dont deserve it because you were born.

BILLYFRED0000

04-26-2007, 11:16 PM

Originally posted by DDBooger
and that turns my stomach!! and every tough talking conservative who acts like they been there before forgets that. well i can't say all but i don't hear anything about those fat cats SOBs. hell even the saudi king is turning against bush for this war. F it, lets start giving ultimatums and finding these wahabi's collecting cash from our burbs and lacs! ;)

That one I agree with. However, you know why their country works the way it does. The Saudi's made a deal with the Wahabi's. Most of the direct Saudi family does not really necessarily agree. But enough do to keep it interesting and there really is nothing else for them to do since the little people by and large do agree with the Wahabists.

DDBooger

04-26-2007, 11:17 PM

Originally posted by SintonFan
.
Ehh...
I'd rather talk about quantitive(is that spelt rite? lol) physics.:doh: haha yes you would this quantitative stuff is all math and i will be using alot of it in the coming years! got any suggestions for my dissertation! BESIDES politics!

BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END

04-26-2007, 11:17 PM

Originally posted by injuredinmelee
no one said you didnt deserve the right to succeed. No one said that the people that are willing to work their butts off to make a better life for themselves shouldnt succeed. You are simply twisting it to martyr yourselves. you have been trained well my little liberal friend.

It's the government's fault that college is getting more and more expensive. Under the current administration, the cost of tuition has risen substantially. But I guess that it's not their fault, now is it?

injuredinmelee

04-26-2007, 11:17 PM

Originally posted by bhtrainer
you guys are so frustrating....i have said the same things as some of the "older more wiser" people on here yet it takes someone else to say it before yall have anything to say back...im goin to bed

hey your still a girl... lol

DDBooger

04-26-2007, 11:19 PM

Originally posted by BILLYFRED0000
That one I agree with. However, you know why their country works the way it does. The Saudi's made a deal with the Wahabi's. Most of the direct Saudi family does not really necessarily agree. But enough do to keep it interesting and there really is nothing else for them to do since the little people by and large do agree with the Wahabists. something about living under dictatorial monarchies that makes less appealing options look like gourmet!

bhtrainer

04-26-2007, 11:19 PM

Originally posted by BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END
It's the government's fault that college is getting more and more expensive. Under the current administration, the cost of tuition has risen substantially. But I guess that it's not their fault, now is it?

he NEVER said anything about helpin out with college! he said that people who sit on their arse all day and dont lift a DANG FINGER...should not be on any government program until they stop bein lazy...geez people read!!!

DDBooger

04-26-2007, 11:20 PM

Originally posted by injuredinmelee
hey your still a girl... lol girls are allowed in here?:eek: lol j/k!

bhtrainer

04-26-2007, 11:20 PM

Originally posted by DDBooger
girls are allowed in here?:eek: lol j/k!

o please dont even start that i will bust a cap...

BILLYFRED0000

04-26-2007, 11:21 PM

Originally posted by DDBooger
well geez, did you suggest he act like a p*ssy with iran sitting there? now you can't claim they aren't a threat cause our adm. sure thinks they are! and guess who made them the big kid in the middle east block! yes he was in violation of this or that, but did he pose a bigger threat than the actual conspirators? was it worth losing our standing in the world, who no matter how arrogant we perceive ourselves we ABSOLUTELY need to win this war on terror. w/o cooperation from other nations we are as good as beaten! we can threaten all we want, but with one leg stuck in iraq and the other in Afghanistan(where we should be concentrating) how serious can someone take us? besides the threat of nukes, im beginning to think our bluff will get called

Yes but even that proves that Iran has always been the issue and is today. We should have ignored Afghanistan at the outset.
The Russians and Brits proved that before. Iraq should have been the primary target. Once pacified then the rest of the region could be controlled or at least intimidated. But the real issue, and you also know this, is the fundamental problems of Sunni vs shia. Iran wants the oil and is and has always used it's religious influence in Iraq. That and it's more strategic control of the Gulf of Hormuz. In the end Iran was always going to be the issue. And they are the true suppliers along with other rich arabs
of the terrorist networks in the world.

injuredinmelee

04-26-2007, 11:21 PM

Originally posted by BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END
It's the government's fault that college is getting more and more expensive. Under the current administration, the cost of tuition has risen substantially. But I guess that it's not their fault, now is it?
it rises every single year for decades and decades. How is it the governments fault? Maybe its the institution of learnings fault. maybe if you didnt have to pay 2500 dollars to take a class on French Impressionist Art and its affect on the ozone layer to get a degree to be an engineer then cost would be better huh? Please explain how it is the governments fault that your tuition has risen?

SintonFan

04-26-2007, 11:21 PM

Originally posted by injuredinmelee
you now back in the good old days of World War I and World War II we didnt have to worry about the hippie protesters and we could fight war the way it was intended to be... with death involved! Kill em all let God sort em out. Now we have to worry about fighting the politically correct way. You think the Terrorist will ever stop? DO you think they will listen to reason? Do you think they will agree to a peace treaty? Do you think they care if they kill innocents? Do you think we can rehabilitate them?
.
I think we should finish the war we started and get it done good. The leftists(who seem like they sympathize more with the enemies than our President) policies will leave us open to more attacks on our home soil than they choose to ever admit.
Those "news programs" like CNN and CBS would have you think we'd be OK by pulling out our troops now. It's boggling just how short-sighted they are.:eek: :(

DDBooger

04-26-2007, 11:21 PM

Originally posted by bhtrainer
he NEVER said anything about helpin out with college! he said that people who sit on their arse all day and dont lift a DANG FINGER...should not be on any government program until they stop bein lazy...geez people read!!! I agree but I wonder why all this hate for the little people isn't transcended to the corporate bailouts(welfare) and subsidies which like SF is fond of using a socialist ideal! seems awfully one sided!

BILLYFRED0000

04-26-2007, 11:22 PM

Originally posted by DDBooger
something about living under dictatorial monarchies that makes less appealing options look like gourmet!

Ain't that the truth...... Things that make you go HMMMMMMMM.

bhtrainer

04-26-2007, 11:23 PM

Originally posted by DDBooger
I agree but I wonder why all this hate for the little people isn't transcended to the corporate bailouts(welfare) and subsidies which like SF is fond of using a socialist ideal! seems awfully one sided!

how is it one sided...you shouldnt be aided if u dont work for your own money...why should the government hand people our money....if they do nothin to help themselves...

injuredinmelee

04-26-2007, 11:24 PM

his is taken from the website highereducation.org :

In 1980, tuition at public four-year colleges and universities consumed 13% of family income for low-income families; by 2000, that figure had risen to 25%. At two-year colleges, tuition increased from 6% to 12% of family income during the same time period.

From 1992 through 2001, tuition at four-year public colleges and universities rose faster than family income in 41 states. Tuition at two-year colleges rose faster than family income in 34 states.

from 1992 to 2001... lets see who was in office???

DDBooger

04-26-2007, 11:24 PM

Originally posted by SintonFan
.
I think we should finish the war we started and get it done good. The leftists(who seem like they sympathize more with the enemies than our President) policies will leave us open to more attacks on our home soil than they choose to ever admit.
Those "news programs" like CNN and CBS would have you think we'd be OK by pulling out our troops now. It's boggling just how short-sighted they are.:eek: :( well while i disagree with your assertions I agree with your suggestion of finishing the war. inevitably we will return when the natural resources we are dependent on are threatened. either through turkish aggression against the kurds. iranian intervention in part of the shia or al-queda backed sunni's devasting surrounding nations from the sovereignty of iraq! that hodgepodge of a country the brits threw together is sure biting us in the ace many years later

injuredinmelee

04-26-2007, 11:25 PM

SintonFan

04-26-2007, 11:26 PM

Originally posted by DDBooger
yeah cause in those wars the aggressors were the countries we were fighting! lol its not about being politically correct its about killing the RIGHT people! im still waiting for someone to point out the iraqi involved in 9/11. hell just 1! 1 would be suffice to invade iraq!!
.
If we leave before the job is done then that place will be a haven for terrorists. It doesn't matter if it was right to go there in the first place; which I'll remind you, everyone in the House, Senate and Executive Office voted to go to war there in the first place. Those people want us there now. Shouldn't we give them our support instead of listening to CNN and there one-sided news coverage?

BILLYFRED0000

04-26-2007, 11:26 PM

Originally posted by DDBooger
I agree but I wonder why all this hate for the little people isn't transcended to the corporate bailouts(welfare) and subsidies which like SF is fond of using a socialist ideal! seems awfully one sided!

But the problem with that is this is the market in operation. As long as the market will pay it it will happen. Alot like a baseball
player with a career average of .250 getting millions to play a game. If you want a piece of that pie find a way to get it or get some of your own. That is not the same as someone sitting on their fat ass because it's easier to punch out kids than a time clock.

DDBooger

04-26-2007, 11:26 PM

Originally posted by bhtrainer
how is it one sided...you shouldnt be aided if u dont work for your own money...why should the government hand people our money....if they do nothin to help themselves... lol slow down there Rush! i agree to an extent my point if you read carefully is that why should countries ran poorly be bailed out and have the people working for them layed off, then either subsidized to be competitive in the world market or move its mode of production overseas with my bucks! get the point

bhtrainer

04-26-2007, 11:26 PM

Originally posted by injuredinmelee
wait wait wait guys i think we need to let this one particular girl speak...

thank you.

DDBooger

04-26-2007, 11:27 PM

Originally posted by SintonFan
.
If we leave before the job is done then that place will be a haven for terrorists. who is disagreeing? i agree! and i too believe hilary and the rest who voted dem or rep are as responsible for the war as anyone else! had the adm. or representatives or senators had bother to do their homework they'd have known the reaction from a long chained pop. would be sectarian backlash after years of domination! haven't we learned anything from the past?

mistanice

04-26-2007, 11:28 PM

I want a recount on this poll!!! My vote didn't show up for "OTHER." Who's behind this atrocity? RECOUNT!

BILLYFRED0000

04-26-2007, 11:29 PM

BTW,

I voted for other because I tend to listen to them all and form my own opinion.

While Fox leans a little right of center, CNN is left of left. However,
they both get some things right. But by and large I laugh more at the Clintonista News Network than not. Fox at least lets allan
colmes open his mouth. And he is pretty good IMHO.

DDBooger

04-26-2007, 11:29 PM

Originally posted by mistanice
I want a recount on this poll!!! My vote didn't show up for "OTHER." Who's behind this atrocity? RECOUNT! damn liberal media:rolleyes: :cool: ;)

bhtrainer

04-26-2007, 11:29 PM

Originally posted by DDBooger
lol slow down there Rush! i agree to an extent my point if you read carefully is that why should countries ran poorly be bailed out and have the people working for them layed off, then either subsidized to be competitive in the world market or move its mode of production overseas with my bucks! get the point

yeah i get the point...we went to iraq to take out sadam and find nuclear weapons...it took a while but we took out sadam...we didnt find any nuclear weapons but if we believed strongly that they had them wouldnt you rather spend your money tryin to find them then not worry and be blown up...and if people need help then we should help them...iraq needed to build a new foundation of government...that takes time people and money

DDBooger

04-26-2007, 11:30 PM

Originally posted by BILLYFRED0000
BTW,

I voted for other because I tend to listen to them all and form my own opinion.

While Fox leans a little right of center, CNN is left of left. However,
they both get some things right. But by and large I laugh more at the Clintonista News Network than not. Fox at least lets allan
colmes open his mouth. And he is pretty good IMHO. well of course he's the host! sean hannity on the other hand has never interviewed a single person, because the guests never finish a sentance! hahahahaha

mistanice

04-26-2007, 11:31 PM

Keith7

04-26-2007, 11:32 PM

Originally posted by bhtrainer
he NEVER said anything about helpin out with college! he said that people who sit on their arse all day and dont lift a DANG FINGER...should not be on any government program until they stop bein lazy...geez people read!!!

Thats not everybody, why should the people who don't abuse the welfair system have to suffer?? and they have made restrictions on welfair and other government programs to help weed out some of these people who are abusing these systems.. sure its not perfect but it has been getting better.. we can't turn our back on our own citizens

BILLYFRED0000

04-26-2007, 11:32 PM

Originally posted by DDBooger
well of course he's the host! sean hannity on the other hand has never interviewed a single person, because the guests never finish a sentance! hahahahaha

Yes, I think Sean is funny. He makes some good points and is a bright guy tho. But Rush is better at the stuff that he does than anyone. He is not attacking just stating and laughing and then getting outraged once in a while. Sean gets almost nasty. Ann is Nasty. But they are right enough to get a listen. And that is really to me the scary part. The Left stays in attack mode. But when the right does everybody puts them down. Liberal bias?

mistanice

04-26-2007, 11:34 PM

Originally posted by BILLYFRED0000
Yes, I think Sean is funny. He makes some good points and is a bright guy tho. But Rush is better at the stuff that he does than anyone. He is not attacking just stating and laughing and then getting outraged once in a while. Sean gets almost nasty. Ann is Nasty. But they are right enough to get a listen. And that is really to me the scary part. The Left stays in attack mode. But when the right does everybody puts them down. Liberal bias?

Doesn't anybody like Bill Mahr? he's quite entertaining, notice I said entertaining. Makes his good points too.

DDBooger

04-26-2007, 11:34 PM

Originally posted by bhtrainer
yeah i get the point...we went to iraq to take out sadam and find nuclear weapons...it took a while but we took out sadam...we didnt find any nuclear weapons but if we believed strongly that they had them wouldnt you rather spend your money tryin to find them then not worry and be blown up...and if people need help then we should help them...iraq needed to build a new foundation of government...that takes time people and money yup and it takes them to want it to happen. did france come over here and fight the war FOR us. or did we do our share! democracy is no different then communism in the fact that both are political ideals! ISLAM does not mesh with either if you haven't noticed. While turkey is pretty liberal in comparison to other muslim nations they still abide by the quran's teachings. as far as iraq goes. sweetheart, do you punch someone because they look mean standing in the corner? or do you punch someone who punches you? i know its metaphorically speaking but was 3000 + of some of the worlds best trained troops worth gambling on a HUNCH rather than cold hard facts! at least JFK had photos before he almost took us to the brink!

bhtrainer

04-26-2007, 11:34 PM

Originally posted by mistanice
help their people before a little more help for me? rising tuition is killing me, and I wish there was a little bit more to help me get my education. how about we take care of the ones here first who want to get an education!!! i'm half-serious.

well if we werent helping people who have 10 kids and sit on their arse all day we would have more money now wouldnt we...then maybe we could help more with people here...but i think helping iraq is fine because after we took out sadam we couldnt leave them there in utter chaos now could we...we took out their leader its our job to fix it...

DDBooger

04-26-2007, 11:35 PM

Originally posted by BILLYFRED0000
Yes, I think Sean is funny. He makes some good points and is a bright guy tho. But Rush is better at the stuff that he does than anyone. He is not attacking just stating and laughing and then getting outraged once in a while. Sean gets almost nasty. Ann is Nasty. But they are right enough to get a listen. And that is really to me the scary part. The Left stays in attack mode. But when the right does everybody puts them down. Liberal bias? dude, anything the left says is labeled attack dog, how over generalized is that?

DDBooger

04-26-2007, 11:36 PM

Originally posted by mistanice
Doesn't anybody like Bill Mahr? he's quite entertaining, notice I said entertaining. Makes his good points too. i can't get enough of his show! the guys crazy! and he really don't give a damn what anyone thinks! i don't agree with everything he says but he's a sharp tonged fella! and rattles a lot of cages

BILLYFRED0000

04-26-2007, 11:37 PM

Originally posted by mistanice
Doesn't anybody like Bill Mahr? he's quite entertaining, notice I said entertaining. Makes his good points too.

He is a comedian who is so far left on politics that he has to take
four right turns just to see the center. He is funny. Just too far out to take seriously.

SintonFan

04-26-2007, 11:37 PM

Originally posted by Keith7
Thats not everybody, why should the people who don't abuse the welfair system have to suffer?? and they have made restrictions on welfair and other government programs to help weed out some of these people who are abusing these systems.. sure its not perfect but it has been getting better.. we can't turn our back on our own citizens
.
Answer my question Keith. Is a person who has been on welfare there whole life abusing the system?
.
I'd say yes...:nerd:

DDBooger

04-26-2007, 11:38 PM

Originally posted by bhtrainer
well if we werent helping people who have 10 kids and sit on their arse all day we would have more money now wouldnt we...then maybe we could help more with people here...but i think helping iraq is fine because after we took out sadam we couldnt leave them there in utter chaos now could we...we took out their leader its our job to fix it... maybe if we weren't attack people who had no role in 9/11 we'd have billions to fund other programs? or hell finish afghanistan

bhtrainer

04-26-2007, 11:38 PM

Originally posted by DDBooger
yup and it takes them to want it to happen. did france come over here and fight the war FOR us. or did we do our share! democracy is no different then communism in the fact that both are political ideals! ISLAM does not mesh with either if you haven't noticed. While turkey is pretty liberal in comparison to other muslim nations they still abide by the quran's teachings. as far as iraq goes. sweetheart, do you punch someone because they look mean standing in the corner? or do you punch someone who punches you? i know its metaphorically speaking but was 3000 + of some of the worlds best trained troops worth gambling on a HUNCH rather than cold hard facts! at least JFK had photos before he almost took us to the brink!

yes your right democracy is a watered down less harsh communism...and as far as punchin someone in the corner...like i said would you rather be blown up...or take the chance of finding nothing?...yeah i think gambling troops was ok because...risk taking is wut its about...if we played safe all the time...we would be suseptible(spell check) to more than if we took the risks to find things out...

ASUFrisbeeStud

04-26-2007, 11:38 PM

Originally posted by BILLYFRED0000
He is a comedian who is so far left on politics that he has to take
four right turns just to see the center. He is funny. Just too far out to take seriously.

I watch his show on HBO all the time, it's great.

I agree with you on the out there part but he does have some good insight on some things.

DDBooger

04-26-2007, 11:39 PM

Originally posted by SintonFan
.
Answer my question Keith. Is a person who has been on welfare there whole life abusing the system?
.
I'd say yes...:nerd: agreed! but can we all agree there are circumstances where welfare does help pick someone up! do you believe in eliminating welfare or limiting it?

BILLYFRED0000

04-26-2007, 11:39 PM

Originally posted by DDBooger
dude, anything the left says is labeled attack dog, how over generalized is that?

You just mentioned Mahr. Does he not always attack? Is he liberal? I am sorry to say but the left does always attack or close enough to it to be no never mind. I am libertarian by nature, liberal socially, and conservative on governmental issues. What is more is that I genuinely enjoy the give and take and will readily
argue either point of view because I love to play the devils advocate. If it walks like a duck and talks like a duck it is probably a lib.

SintonFan

04-26-2007, 11:39 PM

Originally posted by mistanice
Doesn't anybody like Bill Mahr? he's quite entertaining, notice I said entertaining. Makes his good points too.
.
He's not funny and not very smart. He says so himself...:p

injuredinmelee

04-26-2007, 11:42 PM

Originally posted by mistanice
Doesn't anybody like Bill Mahr? he's quite entertaining, notice I said entertaining. Makes his good points too.

he is just so hard to look at. What happened to television only using good looking people.

bhtrainer

04-26-2007, 11:42 PM

Originally posted by DDBooger
agreed! but can we all agree there are circumstances where welfare does help pick someone up! do you believe in eliminating welfare or limiting it?

i think there should be more certain requirements... eliminating it wouldnt be right...but limiting it would help the people who do work for their money...and it would make people have to stop bein lazy

DDBooger

04-26-2007, 11:42 PM

Originally posted by bhtrainer
yes your right democracy is a watered down less harsh communism...and as far as punchin someone in the corner...like i said would you rather be blown up...or take the chance of finding nothing?...yeah i think gambling troops was ok because...risk taking is wut its about...if we played safe all the time...we would be suseptible(spell check) to more than if we took the risks to find things out... id rather tell my boys that their lives are being spent for the protection of its country not the freedom of iraqi's! there are plenty of enemies out there who are urging for a spankin! now with us in a compromised position how serious do you think they'll take us? "stop or we'll invade your country, completely ignore your history, do it with inadequate forces and then quibble about staying or leaving! all based on a hunch! educated guess, gamble!" talk about ultimate backfire! but hell it was redirected to being about spreading freedom to the masses!

BILLYFRED0000

04-26-2007, 11:43 PM

Originally posted by DDBooger
agreed! but can we all agree there are circumstances where welfare does help pick someone up! do you believe in eliminating welfare or limiting it?

You should know that I believe in eliminating it. Let the public take over. They would. I have faith in that issue. It is not the governments job to feed the people. Read the constitution and show me where you find it. Then get back to me. I am all for helping someone out. And have been helped out in return. But never by welfare. Church groups and civics organizations are much more efficient and controlled at the local level where they are connected. Not some fruitcake bean counter in DC that cannot even spell milk or the price of it at Wal-Mart.

DDBooger

04-26-2007, 11:44 PM

Originally posted by bhtrainer
i think there should be more certain requirements... eliminating it wouldnt be right...but limiting it would help the people who do work for their money...and it would make people have to stop bein lazy i agree. here's a story, and it doesn't characterize all on welfare but my mother called me and we got to talking about some school children in her class. well one of the mothers had enrolled her child in school and demanded her child be placed in Spec. Ed. come to find out, you collect a lil stipend when you have a "handicapped child" nauseating!

bhtrainer

04-26-2007, 11:44 PM

Originally posted by DDBooger
id rather tell my boys that their lives are being spent for the protection of its country not the freedom of iraqi's! there are plenty of enemies out there who are urging for a spankin! now with us in a compromised position how serious do you think they'll take us? "stop or we'll invade your country, completely ignore your history, do it with inadequate forces and then quibble about staying or leaving! all based on a hunch! educated guess, gamble!" talk about ultimate backfire! but hell it was redirected to being about spreading freedom to the masses!

we wanted to take out sadam...freedom for the people just came with it...

SintonFan

04-26-2007, 11:45 PM

Originally posted by DDBooger
yup and it takes them to want it to happen. did france come over here and fight the war FOR us. or did we do our share! democracy is no different then communism in the fact that both are political ideals! ISLAM does not mesh with either if you haven't noticed. While turkey is pretty liberal in comparison to other muslim nations they still abide by the quran's teachings. as far as iraq goes. sweetheart, do you punch someone because they look mean standing in the corner? or do you punch someone who punches you? i know its metaphorically speaking but was 3000 + of some of the worlds best trained troops worth gambling on a HUNCH rather than cold hard facts! at least JFK had photos before he almost took us to the brink!
.
Flawed logic Boog. France doesn't even fight there own wars!:p
And FYI...
I'd die fighting FOR our Representative Republic and AGAINST communism. It's not that both are "political ideas" at all.
It's all about the fact communism is flat-out WRONG and America is right in it's pursuit of happiness and the American way!
Don't bring that "moral relativism" crap in here.:p

DDBooger

04-26-2007, 11:46 PM

Originally posted by BILLYFRED0000
You should know that I believe in eliminating it. Let the public take over. They would. I have faith in that issue. It is not the governments job to feed the people. Read the constitution and show me where you find it. Then get back to me. I am all for helping someone out. And have been helped out in return. But never by welfare. Church groups and civics organizations are much more efficient and controlled at the local level where they are connected. Not some fruitcake bean counter in DC that cannot even spell milk or the price of it at Wal-Mart. dude i've seen public work first hand in regards to welfare like situations. worked at a privately owned adolescent treatment center! PURE CRAP!!!! it was about collecting the worst kids because they fetch 250 dollars a day! now we had a collection of the worst of the worst, being watched by people paid minimum wage! well you can guess the kind of atmosphere surrounding that place! oh and this place was a church organization

BILLYFRED0000

04-26-2007, 11:47 PM

Originally posted by DDBooger
id rather tell my boys that their lives are being spent for the protection of its country not the freedom of iraqi's! there are plenty of enemies out there who are urging for a spankin! now with us in a compromised position how serious do you think they'll take us? "stop or we'll invade your country, completely ignore your history, do it with inadequate forces and then quibble about staying or leaving! all based on a hunch! educated guess, gamble!" talk about ultimate backfire! but hell it was redirected to being about spreading freedom to the masses!

You guys really ought to pay attention in civics. We are not a democracy. We are a republican democracy. Does anybody here understand the difference?

SintonFan

04-26-2007, 11:47 PM

Originally posted by DDBooger
dude, anything the left says is labeled attack dog, how over generalized is that?
.
Maybe if the leftists news corporations actually proposed new ideas that weren't socialist they might not be seen as "attack dog".:nerd:

BILLYFRED0000

04-26-2007, 11:47 PM

Originally posted by DDBooger
dude i've seen public work first hand in regards to welfare like situations. worked at a privately owned adolescent treatment center! PURE CRAP!!!! it was about collecting the worst kids because they fetch 250 dollars a day! now we had a collection of the worst of the worst, being watched by people paid minimum wage! well you can guess the kind of atmosphere surrounding that place! oh and this place was a church organization

But what were they being treated for?

SintonFan

04-26-2007, 11:49 PM

Originally posted by DDBooger
agreed! but can we all agree there are circumstances where welfare does help pick someone up! do you believe in eliminating welfare or limiting it?
.
Go a couple of pages back and you'll see my response. I feel like this was "Rapid-Fire" night...
I'm still reading page 4.:D

DDBooger

04-26-2007, 11:50 PM

Originally posted by SintonFan
.
Flawed logic Boog. France doesn't even fight there own wars!:p
And FYI...
I'd die fighting FOR our Representative Republic and AGAINST communism. It's not that both are "political ideas" at all.
It's all about the fact communism is flat-out WRONG and America is right in it's pursuit of happiness and the American way!
Don't bring that "moral relativism" crap in here.:p haha yeah but they did help us win ours! HELP not fight it for us! ;) oh SF you remind me of Hacksaw jim Duggan swinging the flag! ;) i hear ya man, i don't agree with communism, but when either is thrust upon a people who cannot identify with it culturally, its doomed

SintonFan

04-26-2007, 11:51 PM

Originally posted by DDBooger
id rather tell my boys that their lives are being spent for the protection of its country not the freedom of iraqi's! there are plenty of enemies out there who are urging for a spankin! now with us in a compromised position how serious do you think they'll take us? "stop or we'll invade your country, completely ignore your history, do it with inadequate forces and then quibble about staying or leaving! all based on a hunch! educated guess, gamble!" talk about ultimate backfire! but hell it was redirected to being about spreading freedom to the masses!
.
Stop the 2nd guessing! Are you saying we should pull out of Iraq now and make it worse????:confused:

SintonFan

04-26-2007, 11:52 PM

DDBooger

04-26-2007, 11:52 PM

Originally posted by BILLYFRED0000
But what were they being treated for? sexual abuse, torture, mental abuse, physical abuse, drug addiction, gang affiliation, mental illness. etc, etc. and this place was far from the worst! problem with privatization is lack of GOOD regulation!

DDBooger

04-26-2007, 11:55 PM

Originally posted by SintonFan
.
Stop the 2nd guessing! Are you saying we should pull out of Iraq now and make it worse????:confused: dude!!!! read my darn posts!!!! hell NO im not suggesting pull out! this thread must be flying if you missed my diatribe! In fact had this war been fought as some had suggested. (I find it funny when bush states politicians should not make military decisions, yet the strategy going into iraq obviously was) no fewer than 500,000 should have been mobilized! i still think in order to subjegate that country we will need those numbers be them american, un or various middle eastern countries lending a hand!

SintonFan

04-26-2007, 11:57 PM

Originally posted by DDBooger
haha yeah but they did help us win ours! HELP not fight it for us! ;) oh SF you remind me of Hacksaw jim Duggan swinging the flag! ;) i hear ya man, i don't agree with communism, but when either is thrust upon a people who cannot identify with it culturally, its doomed
.
I caught up! lol
.
?Either is thrust upon a people???
.
Dude you were born into a representative republic! I'd say "communism" is now being thrust onto you. And to make things worse... you seem to think that is OK.:( :confused:
.
Stop the whole moral relativism crap...:hand:

BILLYFRED0000

04-26-2007, 11:59 PM

Originally posted by DDBooger
sexual abuse, torture, mental abuse, physical abuse, drug addiction, gang affiliation, mental illness. etc, etc. and this place was far from the worst! problem with privatization is lack of GOOD regulation!

Yes, and none of those were welfare cases. They were prison issues, legal issues, and psychiartric issues. All those are provided for in most states already. These people did not need money for food. They need true help related to health insurance and the law. Apples and Oranges. I have the same issues. I have no insurance. I do the best I can. My children have no insurance. I don't make alot of money. And you know what. When something happens, I WORK HARDER.

DDBooger

04-27-2007, 12:00 AM

Originally posted by SintonFan
.
I caught up! lol
.
?Either is thrust upon a people???
.
Dude you were born into a representative republic! I'd say "communism" is now being thrust onto you. And to make things worse... you seem to think that is OK.:( :confused:
.
Stop the whole moral relativism crap...:hand: ahh SF i'll stop it when you get out of the narrow hallway! if you don't think we are force feeding democracy to the iraqi's then im sorry man but we just aren't going to agree

SintonFan

04-27-2007, 12:00 AM

Originally posted by DDBooger
dude!!!! read my darn posts!!!! hell NO im not suggesting pull out! this thread must be flying if you missed my diatribe! In fact had this war been fought as some had suggested. (I find it funny when bush states politicians should not make military decisions, yet the strategy going into iraq obviously was) no fewer than 500,000 should have been mobilized! i still think in order to subjegate that country we will need those numbers be them american, un or various middle eastern countries lending a hand!
.
The leftist media seem to be controling the new Congress. They have set a date for us to pull-out this October. If this happens, we will be in a world of $#!#! Period! How's them apples for media bias????:p :nerd:

SintonFan

04-27-2007, 12:02 AM

Originally posted by DDBooger
ahh SF i'll stop it when you get out of the narrow hallway! if you don't think we are force feeding democracy to the iraqi's then im sorry man but we just aren't going to agree
.
They want our freedoms bad. If we pull out now, we deny them that choice imho.:)

DDBooger

04-27-2007, 12:02 AM

Originally posted by BILLYFRED0000
Yes, and none of those were welfare cases. They were prison issues, legal issues, and psychiartric issues. All those are provided for in most states already. These people did not need money for food. They need true help related to health insurance and the law. Apples and Oranges. I have the same issues. I have no insurance. I do the best I can. My children have no insurance. I don't make alot of money. And you know what. When something happens, I WORK HARDER. hahaha they were 13-17. unless they commit murder or are tried as adults, yes it is a form of welfare because the state is paying for them to live there and paying fosters to raise em! medicaid pays their bills(my tax money). so not apples and oranges, but what SOMETIMES happens when privatization occurs.

SintonFan

04-27-2007, 12:03 AM

Work harder and smarter is what I try to teach my kids.:clap:

SintonFan

04-27-2007, 12:04 AM

DDBooger

04-27-2007, 12:04 AM

Originally posted by SintonFan
.
The leftist media seem to be controling the new Congress. They have set a date for us to pull-out this October. If this happens, we will be in a world of $#!#! Period! How's them apples for media bias????:p :nerd: lol do you live in a bomb shelter. dude its ok come out, no need to be so darn paranoid about the liberal conspiracy! geez you sound like the clintons re the right! ;) but yes not just we, THE WORLD! remember with china having interests in iran, us in S.A. and various other countries dependent on their oil. if that place goes up, the world market would be severely hit! then it becomes a battle for resources! you wanna see china increase its military spending more than it is already, watch what happens if their resources are threatened

DDBooger

04-27-2007, 12:05 AM

Originally posted by SintonFan
.
I'd still take Churches in charity than government programs anyday.:p if ran right, we agree partner

BILLYFRED0000

04-27-2007, 12:07 AM

Originally posted by DDBooger
hahaha they were 13-17. unless they commit murder or are tried as adults, yes it is a form of welfare because the state is paying for them to live there and paying fosters to raise em! medicaid pays their bills(my tax money). so not apples and oranges, but what SOMETIMES happens when privatization occurs.

So now I see you are talking about orphans or children with state
custody. This is one area that I happen to believe it does not matter who runs it, it will never be fair, just, or done properly.
BTW, I am in favor of Medicaid as it pertains to health. When I refer to elimination of Welfare, that is not included. I think we all have a basic inalienable right to a happy life in the pursuit of liberty. Well it cant be very happy if you are sick all the time. I am just not certain we can fix our health care system. The insurance companies have turned it into high crimes and misdemeanors because of the money they can make. Too much
graft and corruption involved. Way too much money.

SintonFan

04-27-2007, 12:08 AM

DDBooger

04-27-2007, 12:09 AM

Originally posted by BILLYFRED0000
So now I see you are talking about orphans or children with state
custody. This is one area that I happen to believe it does not matter who runs it, it will never be fair, just, or done properly.
BTW, I am in favor of Medicaid as it pertains to health. When I refer to elimination of Welfare, that is not included. I think we all have a basic inalienable right to a happy life in the pursuit of liberty. Well it cant be very happy if you are sick all the time. I am just not certain we can fix our health care system. The insurance companies have turned it into high crimes and misdemeanors because of the money they can make. Too much
graft and corruption involved. Way too much money. fact is, insurance companies are businesses 1st and foremost

BILLYFRED0000

04-27-2007, 12:10 AM

Originally posted by DDBooger
lol do you live in a bomb shelter. dude its ok come out, no need to be so darn paranoid about the liberal conspiracy! geez you sound like the clintons re the right! ;) but yes not just we, THE WORLD! remember with china having interests in iran, us in S.A. and various other countries dependent on their oil. if that place goes up, the world market would be severely hit! then it becomes a battle for resources! you wanna see china increase its military spending more than it is already, watch what happens if their resources are threatened

Booger, even you have to see that the far left control the congressional agenda. Fortunately for us, they still have to have some votes from the middle to get elected or they would have defunded the war already. This way, they can make it look like Bush is the problem when if fact, the congress has no right to impede the executive when it comes to military issues. The president is the commander in chief and the military will go where it is told. For the Congress to tie strings to the money is the height of treason. IMHO.

DDBooger

04-27-2007, 12:11 AM

Originally posted by SintonFan
.
China=Iran
Free market=Iraq(hopefully)
China is not our friend just because they sell lots of stuff all over the globe(here mainly).
:p don't know what ya meant, but no matter what political idealization they follow, if iran can't produce the Red Dragon will want to come and find out why! and the last thing we want is Chinese Military stomping around the middle east. but if need be to protect THEIR way of life, they'll increase their spending and commit to building machines that will help them expand their arm of influence. dude i cant remember the name of the book i read, dammit, but it was about china's growth and future. great book, while lots of assertions and opinion the guy connected as best he could.

BILLYFRED0000

04-27-2007, 12:12 AM

Originally posted by DDBooger
fact is, insurance companies are businesses 1st and foremost
Yes but now they are run to maximize profit. At first they were run to protect their insured. If run as orignally designed, still an excellent business. But now we have companies that keep your money and force you to sue for it. That is not business. That is extortion.

SintonFan

04-27-2007, 12:12 AM

Originally posted by BILLYFRED0000
So now I see you are talking about orphans or children with state
custody. This is one area that I happen to believe it does not matter who runs it, it will never be fair, just, or done properly.
BTW, I am in favor of Medicaid as it pertains to health. When I refer to elimination of Welfare, that is not included. I think we all have a basic inalienable right to a happy life in the pursuit of liberty. Well it cant be very happy if you are sick all the time. I am just not certain we can fix our health care system. The insurance companies have turned it into high crimes and misdemeanors because of the money they can make. Too much
graft and corruption involved. Way too much money.
.
An economist I had in college once said to me, "If all medical insurance was banned overnight, we'd see drugs and office visits(even surgery) go down 200% overnight... if the government takes over health care everything will go up up 200% overnight!
I tend to believe his economics. Smart smart guy he was.:cool:

DDBooger

04-27-2007, 12:13 AM

Originally posted by BILLYFRED0000
Booger, even you have to see that the far left control the congressional agenda. Fortunately for us, they still have to have some votes from the middle to get elected or they would have defunded the war already. This way, they can make it look like Bush is the problem when if fact, the congress has no right to impede the executive when it comes to military issues. The president is the commander in chief and the military will go where it is told. For the Congress to tie strings to the money is the height of treason. IMHO. well duh they control congress and the senate, but only as recently as this last election. i agree, they shouldn't impede military issues, but as the constitution is always alluded to who grants the power to make war, who funds those wars! must remember the ingenius forefathers who instilled these checks and balances! do i agree with how they are being imposed now, probably not. however politics shouldn't dictate how we begin a war either! catch my drift

BILLYFRED0000

04-27-2007, 12:14 AM

Originally posted by SintonFan
.
An economist I had in college once said to me, "If all medical insurance was banned overnight, we'd see drugs and office visits(even surgery) go down 200% overnight... if the government takes over health care everything will go up up 200% overnight!
I tend to believe his economics. Smart smart guy he was.:cool:

I agree too. Like I said. I have been doing pretty good without it for 7 years. The telecom crash did me in and now I just get by. But I have a good wife and kids and consider myself lucky. It all depends on how you look at it I suppose.

DDBooger

04-27-2007, 12:14 AM

SintonFan

04-27-2007, 12:16 AM

Originally posted by BILLYFRED0000
Booger, even you have to see that the far left control the congressional agenda. Fortunately for us, they still have to have some votes from the middle to get elected or they would have defunded the war already. This way, they can make it look like Bush is the problem when if fact, the congress has no right to impede the executive when it comes to military issues. The president is the commander in chief and the military will go where it is told. For the Congress to tie strings to the money is the height of treason. IMHO.
.
Harry Reid should be tried for Treason imho. Congress has no authority to fight a war or dictate it's policy(especially those governed by the Executive Office). They have waaaaay overstepped their boundaries but they won't as long as they are fueled by CNN and those corporations.:(

SintonFan

04-27-2007, 12:17 AM

Originally posted by DDBooger
lol you just love dem extemes sf! ;)
.
It is all for perspective boog.:p

DDBooger

04-27-2007, 12:19 AM

Originally posted by BILLYFRED0000
I agree too. Like I said. I have been doing pretty good without it for 7 years. The telecom crash did me in and now I just get by. But I have a good wife and kids and consider myself lucky. It all depends on how you look at it I suppose. true that! you're a good man! my father came here LEGALLY with my grandparents. grandfather worked the railroad, grandmother was a nurse! they did this during wwII. my father followed my g/f into the railroad biz, and retires in a few years. my mother came here LEGALLY! her parents were poor but never asked the govt for a dime! my mother never even took out a loan for school, my father paid for it! she has been a teacher for 32 years and has won several teacher of the year awards including the caller's! now both will retire with FAT FAT Pockets! a dream is a dream when realized. when people who are ALREADY here dream of not working and collecting a check it gives so many a bad name! im so proud of my family and its background. perserverence is easy to admire

BILLYFRED0000

04-27-2007, 12:20 AM

Originally posted by DDBooger
well duh they control congress and the senate, but only as recently as this last election. i agree, they shouldn't impede military issues, but as the constitution is always alluded to who grants the power to make war, who funds those wars! must remember the ingenius forefathers who instilled these checks and balances! do i agree with how they are being imposed now, probably not. however politics shouldn't dictate how we begin a war either! catch my drift

Yes but I say politics had little to do with Iraq in the beginning. Just W having to clean up the mess his father made. And because we could not afford another country in the middle east that would begin to resort to terrorism. Iraq had finally gotten to the point where Saddam understood that he would never beat the west with military means. Terrorism was all that he had left if he wanted to be a player in Arab circles. Hard to call that a bad move. Maybe it could have waited. But at least, there is something more than politics behind it.

IMHO, the current situation actually supports W and his fears. And since the Iraqi war began, no terrorists attacks have been excecuted against american targets outside the war zone. Kinda hard to argue with that as well. I am not happy about Iraq. But I believed then and now that it was necessary. Saddam would have tried to get back what he wanted in the long run. No matter what, he wanted to be the leading Arab in the Middle East and he only understood the gun.

SintonFan

04-27-2007, 12:22 AM

BOOGER! YOU CHANGED YOUR CELL PHONE NUMBER!!!
:mad: :mad: :mad:
I just woke up some poor lady trying to call you.:( :o

DDBooger

04-27-2007, 12:22 AM

Originally posted by SintonFan
.
Harry Reid should be tried for Treason imho. Congress has no authority to fight a war or dictate it's policy(especially those governed by the Executive Office). They have waaaaay overstepped their boundaries but they won't as long as they are fueled by CNN and those corporations.:( it was STUPID. thats just something you don't say while the boys are fighting. like a asst coach saying his players can't win! the guy needed to control his barbs. but when he said that inherently the troops are brought into the mix! unfortunately this war is so damn unpopular, liberal motivated or not, that he may not feel the repercussions

BILLYFRED0000

04-27-2007, 12:23 AM

Originally posted by DDBooger
true that! you're a good man! my father came here LEGALLY with my grandparents. grandfather worked the railroad, grandmother was a nurse! they did this during wwII. my father followed my g/f into the railroad biz, and retires in a few years. my mother came here LEGALLY! her parents were poor but never asked the govt for a dime! my mother never even took out a loan for school, my father paid for it! she has been a teacher for 32 years and has won several teacher of the year awards including the caller's! now both will retire with FAT FAT Pockets! a dream is a dream when realized. when people who are ALREADY here dream of not working and collecting a check it gives so many a bad name! im so proud of my family and its background. perserverence is easy to admire

At least you can see the trees and call it a forest. I will never complain about my lot. Just like you. It is a dream and a good one at that. I just wish more people could see this for what it is.
People taking care of their business and helping those they can along the way.

DDBooger

04-27-2007, 12:24 AM

Originally posted by BILLYFRED0000
Yes but I say politics had little to do with Iraq in the beginning. Just W having to clean up the mess his father made. And because we could not afford another country in the middle east that would begin to resort to terrorism. Iraq had finally gotten to the point where Saddam understood that he would never beat the west with military means. Terrorism was all that he had left if he wanted to be a player in Arab circles. Hard to call that a bad move. Maybe it could have waited. But at least, there is something more than politics behind it.

IMHO, the current situation actually supports W and his fears. And since the Iraqi war began, no terrorists attacks have been excecuted against american targets outside the war zone. Kinda hard to argue with that as well. I am not happy about Iraq. But I believed then and now that it was necessary. Saddam would have tried to get back what he wanted in the long run. No matter what, he wanted to be the leading Arab in the Middle East and he only understood the gun. how many years between the 1st WTC bombing and the last? trust me, they are planning, we aren't dealing with dime store hustlers, these guys are improvisers and patient! we won't know the true effects of this war for some time later

DDBooger

04-27-2007, 12:27 AM

Originally posted by BILLYFRED0000
helping those they can along the way. and nothing brings a man closer to god than that! I could go to church the rest of my life and never be as righteous as my father. entirely selfless. lived for his family and friends. never said no to helping another!

BILLYFRED0000

04-27-2007, 12:28 AM

Originally posted by DDBooger
how many years between the 1st WTC bombing and the last? trust me, they are planning, we aren't dealing with dime store hustlers, these guys are improvisers and patient! we won't know the true effects of this war for some time later

Yes but do not forget the attacks on US embassies and the USS Cole. There were 6 or 7 attacks including 911 that were planned
on Clinton's watch and all were executed on said watch save 1.
And Bush had a but a very slim chance of stopping that one it was so well executed and operated inside the country while slick
was staining Monica's dress.

SintonFan

04-27-2007, 12:28 AM

I do see how many choices we have to prosper. I try to live my life that way. I make a point to tell those around me that yes we can all live our dream to the fullest, but dangit certain attitudes and all keep some folks from seeing what they can actually do. Those attitudes are called Jesse and Sharpton. And they have major voices on CNN and co.:( :mad:

DDBooger

04-27-2007, 12:29 AM

im out fellas, have to critique some neo-functionalisms! :) FUN! :rolleyes: great talk fellas! and it stayed polite!

DDBooger

04-27-2007, 12:30 AM

Originally posted by BILLYFRED0000
Yes but do not forget the attacks on US embassies and the USS Cole. There were 6 or 7 attacks including 911 that were planned
on Clinton's watch and all were executed on said watch save 1.
And Bush had a but a very slim chance of stopping that one it was so well executed and operated inside the country while slick
was staining Monica's dress. yes but you specified within the country did you not? maybe i didn't read correctly. what goes on outside of the U.S. is rather hard for us to control, when those conspiring against us are aided by govts. we TRUST

DDBooger

04-27-2007, 12:32 AM

Originally posted by SintonFan
I do see how many choices we have to prosper. I try to live my life that way. I make a point to tell those around me that yes we can all live our dream to the fullest, but dangit certain attitudes and all keep some folks from seeing what they can actually do. Those attitudes are called Jesse and Sharpton. And they have major voices on CNN and co.:( :mad: as bill maher says, there are some people who make a career of destroying others. these two characters are becoming the civil rights hatchet men and are in danger of creating severe backlash

SintonFan

04-27-2007, 12:36 AM

Originally posted by DDBooger
as bill maher says, there are some people who make a career of destroying others. these two characters are becoming the civil rights hatchet men and are in danger of creating severe backlash
.
You gotta get the last word or what? lol
gni man...
Let the games begin anew after sunrise!:D
.
frikkin bill maher...:mad: :D

DDBooger

04-27-2007, 12:37 AM

haha always! send ya the # tommorrow man! take it easy everyone

SintonFan

04-27-2007, 12:40 AM

Originally posted by DDBooger
haha always! send ya the # tommorrow man! take it easy everyone
.
*SintonFan took game 1 in the best of 7 series with Boog tonight*:p :D

BILLYFRED0000

04-27-2007, 12:41 AM

Originally posted by DDBooger
yes but you specified within the country did you not? maybe i didn't read correctly. what goes on outside of the U.S. is rather hard for us to control, when those conspiring against us are aided by govts. we TRUST

Yes which further proves my point. They are now fearful and worried that they might just make us mad. That is why the Saudis
have jumped on us and everyone else for that matter. If we are going to stand up for ourselves, who wants to be on the other side? And I did specify the american targets outside the war zone.

All that you have said leads me to side with W. No one wants to mess with us head to head. The Iranians and Syrians are lovin fightin us in Iraq. That is why W was right and why we must win.

JR2004

04-27-2007, 12:49 AM

I talked to a kid today at Madison who wants to be a radiologist, but also wants to get at least a minor in political science because he finds government and things like that interesting. He'll be attending Arkansas Pine-Bluff this fall and is supposed to get to work as an intern in the office of one of the senators from Arkansas which I think is cool.

After listening to his views and talking to him about the varying views of political parties and how they're both full of it, I think he'll become an independent whenever he decides to run for Dallas city council many years down the road (He wants to help fix his neighborhood eventually and he thinks he can make a difference so good for him.)...God help the kid though if he winds up like some of y'all who have posted in this thread. Threads like this is why political topics get shut down here just as they should!

SintonFan

04-27-2007, 12:51 AM

Originally posted by JR2004
I talked to a kid today at Madison who wants to be a radiologist, but also wants to get at least a minor in political science because he finds government and things like that interesting. He'll be attending Arkansas Pine-Bluff this fall and is supposed to get to work as an intern in the office of one of the senators from Arkansas which I think is cool.

After listening to his views and talking to him about the varying views of political parties and how they're both full of it, I think he'll become an independent whenever he decides to run for Dallas city council many years down the road (He wants to help fix his neighborhood eventually and he thinks he can make a difference so good for him.)...God help the kid though if he winds up like some of y'all who have posted in this thread. Threads like this is why political topics get shut down here just as they should!
.
You root for the Lakers. You have no say here!:nerd: :mad: :p :p

DDBooger

04-27-2007, 12:51 AM

Originally posted by BILLYFRED0000
Yes which further proves my point. They are now fearful and worried that they might just make us mad. That is why the Saudis
have jumped on us and everyone else for that matter. If we are going to stand up for ourselves, who wants to be on the other side? And I did specify the american targets outside the war zone.

All that you have said leads me to side with W. No one wants to mess with us head to head. The Iranians and Syrians are lovin fightin us in Iraq. That is why W was right and why we must win. head to head! buddy the iranians and syrians love us fighting in iraq because direct threats are empty! do you realize putting those aircraft carriers any where near Iran is death sentance for a few of em! Iranians have great anti-ship missiles(thank you china). in fact we saw one in use when lebanon was invaded by israel! knocked out a cruiser i believe! you can side with who ya want. if fit hits the shan we have a limited answer right now! and when al queda attacks one consistency was our guard was down! this includes attacks on our allies(spain and england, oh and aussies in indonesia) what better way to isolate us then attack our alies. hell who's left in iraq with us? our cuzins from over yonder! bout it! who's buying most the casualties? you can look at if from your perspective but one thing even rightwingers and generals agree on is we are severely spread thin and our ability to handle any act of aggression by iran, north korea or any said enemy would be hampered by what else than your god send answer to terrorism!

DDBooger

04-27-2007, 12:51 AM

couldn't help it! :p

DDBooger

04-27-2007, 12:52 AM

Originally posted by SintonFan
.
*SintonFan took game 1 in the best of 7 series with Boog tonight*:p :D he thinks he won, give him a hand so he won't get confused no further:clap: ;) I'LL JUST HAVE TO MULTI-TASK

JR2004

04-27-2007, 12:52 AM

Originally posted by SintonFan
.
You root for the Lakers. You have no say here!:nerd: :mad: :p :p

You root for the drive-by boys! You have no say! :p

SintonFan

04-27-2007, 12:54 AM

Originally posted by DDBooger
head to head! buddy the iranians and syrians love us fighting in iraq because direct threats are empty! do you realize putting those aircraft carriers any where near Iran is death sentance for a few of em! Iranians have great anti-ship missiles(thank you china). in fact we saw one in use when lebanon was invaded by israel! knocked out a cruiser i believe! you can side with who ya want. if fit hits the shan we have a limited answer right now! and when al queda attacks one consistency was our guard was down! this includes attacks on our allies(spain and england, oh and aussies in indonesia) what better way to isolate us then attack our alies. hell who's left in iraq with us? our cuzins from over yonder! bout it! who's buying most the casualties? you can look at if from your perspective but one thing even rightwingers and generals agree on is we are severely spread thin and our ability to handle any act of aggression by iran, north korea or any said enemy would be hampered by what else than your god send answer to terrorism!
.
Don't go there Boog. Those microchips on those Iranian missiles were our design.
We know how to "deflect" those kinda land-to-ship(ship-to-ship) missiles. Come on! Have some faith in your country. Iran isn't all that powerful, besides their power of brainwashing their own folks with their religion and of course CNN.:inlove: :p

SintonFan

04-27-2007, 12:55 AM

Originally posted by JR2004
You root for the drive-by boys! You have no say! :p
.
Who are the "drive-by boys"???:confused:

DDBooger

04-27-2007, 12:58 AM

Originally posted by SintonFan
.
Don't go there Boog. Those microchips on those Iranian missiles were our design.
We know how to "deflect" those kinda land-to-ship(ship-to-ship) missiles. Come on! Have some faith in your country. Iran isn't all that powerful, besides their power of brainwashing their own folks with their religion and of course CNN.:inlove: :p lol buddy i haven't watched cnn since first gulf war, and actually the missiles are traveling at supersonic speed. method of attack is saturation not infiltration. we will hit 6 but 4 will get through, it follows the russian mode of attack against our carriers. and yes, it will work. i have entire faith in my military. but faith has nothing to do with capability. its just 21st century gunboat policy

BILLYFRED0000

04-27-2007, 12:58 AM

But no one wanted us to go head to head. They all have ties that make them look bad except the Brits and Aussies. And oh
BTW, the Iranians have some missiles. But taking out their defenses would be no more difficult that Iraq's. Because it all comes down to planes puttin bombs on x's. You have to realize that with our ability to tank we do not have to get that close to Iran and that limits their ability. Believe me when I say this, tactically, the Iranians are no match for us. Technically is even a worse matter. They will get off a few shots and then it will all be over. They are not even as good as Saddams Army was. I am not saying it is difficult and dangerous. But they are not as good as you seem to believe. The simple truth is they lack the training time in their equipment. They cannot maintain their army like we can and most of it is conscript which we both understand to mean
half ass. That is why we have such good techinical merit. Volunteers attempting to get ahead by means of a military education.

SintonFan

04-27-2007, 12:59 AM

Originally posted by DDBooger
lol buddy i haven't watched cnn since first gulf war, and actually the missiles are traveling at supersonic speed. method of attack is saturation not infiltration. we will hit 6 but 4 will get through, it follows the russian mode of attack against our carriers. and yes, it will work. i have entire faith in my military. but faith has nothing to do with capability. its just 21st century gunboat policy
.
Have you ever watched the "Military Channel"?:D :p

DDBooger

04-27-2007, 01:04 AM

Originally posted by SintonFan
.
Have you ever watched the "Military Channel"?:D :p hahaha yeah, but inaccuracies are rampant. they should stick to history! ;) seriously though, janes is privy to plenty of our enemies capabilities. but i'll provide you with what im talking bout tommorrow. a man who puts you to shame with regards of his hate of the left worked military intel for hell i don't know how many years. The man is addicted to quoting me the capabilities of our enemies to justify our aggressive methods. i must say he has some interesting things to say regarding ours and others capabilities.

DDBooger

04-27-2007, 01:07 AM

Originally posted by BILLYFRED0000
But taking out their defenses would be no more difficult that Iraq's. eww who told you that? buddy these guys have state of the art crap. good enough for bunch of pajama wearing lebanese to turn back israeli's with U.S. weaponry! yes we would overwhelm them in a confrontation, i don't doubt that. but if you do some homework you'll see that pushbutton is severely hampered when we have to answer for collateral damage! israeli's lost a lot of face and faith in their military after their little endeavor. and rest assured iran was making a statement in that lil quasi war! when we stop assuming war is as easy as we talk about it I think we'll see a significant shift in our policies

BILLYFRED0000

04-27-2007, 01:07 AM

Originally posted by DDBooger
hahaha yeah, but inaccuracies are rampant. they should stick to history! ;) seriously though, janes is privy to plenty of our enemies capabilities. but i'll provide you with what im talking bout tommorrow. a man who puts you to shame with regards of his hate of the left worked military intel for hell i don't know how many years. The man is addicted to quoting me the capabilities of our enemies to justify our aggressive methods. i must say he has some interesting things to say regarding ours and others capabilities.

He is right. But you have to understand that Intel's job is to place the worst place scenario on the plate so you go in prepared.
Has to be that way. That is why our training is the toughest in the world. You have to master your job to a degree that is unheard of in the arab worlds. Their top players may be close to some of ours but the drop off is tremendous. In the first 10 days
of any conflict top on top is on. But then the depth of the bench comes in. The Arabs and Persians have no bench.

DDBooger

04-27-2007, 01:12 AM

Originally posted by BILLYFRED0000
He is right. But you have to understand that Intel's job is to place the worst place scenario on the plate so you go in prepared.
Has to be that way. That is why our training is the toughest in the world. You have to master your job to a degree that is unheard of in the arab worlds. Their top players may be close to some of ours but the drop off is tremendous. In the first 10 days
of any conflict top on top is on. But then the depth of the bench comes in. The Arabs and Persians have no bench. buddy as of last year, neither do we! we no longer have a emergency reserve. we have guys rotated back but we are just about fully committed. and airwar will not meet our aims! and if you think 125,000 was enough for iraq, my god Iran is exponentially bigger land wise and pop. problem with your thinking is that is cold war based. of course we win quick! is how our military is trained to fight most effective. out in the open. what do you think others have learned from iraq? WE'LL BE LUCKY TO SEE A "OPEN BATTLEFIELD" IN OUR LIFETIME

SintonFan

04-27-2007, 01:16 AM

BILLYFRED0000

04-27-2007, 01:17 AM

Originally posted by DDBooger
buddy as of last year, neither do we! we no longer have a emergency reserve. we have guys rotated back but we are just about fully committed. and airwar will not meet our aims! and if you think 125,000 was enough for iraq, my god Iran is exponentially bigger land wise and pop. problem with your thinking is that is cold war based. of course we win quick! is how our military is trained to fight most effective. out in the open. what do you think others have learned from iraq? WE'LL BE LUCKY TO SEE A "OPEN BATTLEFIELD" IN OUR LIFETIME

Beep wrong. In Iran we probably would not use the same strategy that you see in Iraq. Iraq is an attempt to subdue and restore. Iran would be just an ariel assault to limit their ability to wage war and create nuclear weapons. Just hit their strategic targets and let them attempt to continue. All we really have to do is deter their ability to fight a long distance fight such as against Israel with WMD's. Not the same kind of war. And when I say bench, since we won't be invading the ground forces are not at issue.

DDBooger

04-27-2007, 01:17 AM

Originally posted by SintonFan
.
Who said I hate the "left"? Can't simple despise work instead?:D i suppose ;)

DU_stud04

04-27-2007, 01:18 AM

yahoo? hahaha, whatever channel i get to first usually.

DDBooger

04-27-2007, 01:22 AM

Originally posted by BILLYFRED0000
Beep wrong. In Iran we probably would not use the same strategy that you see in Iraq. Iraq is an attempt to subdue and restore. Iran would be just an ariel assault to limit their ability to wage war and create nuclear weapons. Just hit their strategic targets and let them attempt to continue. All we really have to do is deter their ability to fight a long distance fight such as against Israel with WMD's. Not the same kind of war. And when I say bench, since we won't be invading the ground forces are not at issue. BEEP wrong! lol if you haven't heard their nuke capability is not within reach of our air weaponry. if you weren't privy to the news release but a leak was purposely let go to gauge the publics response to the possible use of nuclear weapons to dig out the infrastructure which is deep below ground and scattered around the country! needless to say spec ops and small units would have to recon the locations. paint em and then either pray we can penetrate or sand goes to glass because thats about the only way we are reaching our AIMS! come on, any military afficianado knows air wars are limited. again, israel fought a country with no air force, yet what was accomplished? smashed buildings and a rejuvanated hezbollah. your thinking to simplistically. iran is divided right now. the mullahs have the power but age is steadily changing that. we commit to air war and see similar collataral damage as the israelis did, well buddy we have a rejuvanated enemy and needless to say a 3rd muslim state attacked. right or wrong, what better calling card.

Ray_BearKat

04-27-2007, 01:23 AM

I like to watch TXCN Texas Cable News :D...keeps me informed on the rest of the state.

SintonFan

04-27-2007, 01:23 AM

Originally posted by DDBooger
buddy as of last year, neither do we! we no longer have a emergency reserve. we have guys rotated back but we are just about fully committed. and airwar will not meet our aims! and if you think 125,000 was enough for iraq, my god Iran is exponentially bigger land wise and pop. problem with your thinking is that is cold war based. of course we win quick! is how our military is trained to fight most effective. out in the open. what do you think others have learned from iraq? WE'LL BE LUCKY TO SEE A "OPEN BATTLEFIELD" IN OUR LIFETIME
.
Back to the original topic. As long as we have CNN draining our public support and openly rooting for the enemy, how can we win? Do you dislike Fox News for giving a different point-of-view or for some other reason?
.
Iranians, for the most part, really hate where the direction of their government has brought them. I know more than a few Iranians and all have expressed that to me. I love to talk politics to those guys.:)

DDBooger

04-27-2007, 01:25 AM

Originally posted by SintonFan
.
Back to the original topic. As long as we have CNN draining our public support and openly rooting for the enemy, how can we win? Do you dislike Fox News for giving a different point-of-view or for some other reason?
.
Iranians, for the most part, really hate where the direction of their government has brought them. I know more than a few Iranians and all have expressed that to me. I love to talk politics to those guys.:) no just a singular one that you chastize cnn for! ;0 and you are right about iranians. in fact i work for a doctor in the College of Business. he's a spokesperson for the U.N. regarding international trade! he hates ahmenijad for his pushing back iranian advancements in society. smart man

BILLYFRED0000

04-27-2007, 01:30 AM

Originally posted by DDBooger
BEEP wrong! lol if you haven't heard their nuke capability is not within reach of our air weaponry. if you weren't privy to the news release but a leak was purposely let go to gauge the publics response to the possible use of nuclear weapons to dig out the infrastructure which is deep below ground and scattered around the country! needless to say spec ops and small units would have to recon the locations. paint em and then either pray we can penetrate or sand goes to glass because thats about the only way we are reaching our AIMS! come on, any military afficianado knows air wars are limited. again, israel fought a country with no air force, yet what was accomplished? smashed buildings and a rejuvanated hezbollah. your thinking to simplistically. iran is divided right now. the mullahs have the power but age is steadily changing that. we commit to air war and see similar collataral damage as the israelis did, well buddy we have a rejuvanated enemy and needless to say a 3rd muslim state attacked. right or wrong, what better calling card.

But they do not have any nukes. All you do is take out their plants that purify uranium. Israel was against a guerrilla fight. Not the proper use of air war. Iran's strategic targets are over open bomb sights. Destroy their capability to manufacture, move(logistically), and hide. I am saying there are chains in the process than can be taken out and they can be delayed and deterred. Not stopped. However, I also believe that in the long run this will not be necessary. The people in Iran are much more like their Iraqi counterparts. They are really not ready nor willing to fight a war. That is why Iran has been so heavy in the terrorism trade. The Iranians had all of war they want from Saddam. Which BTW, was why we built him up. To take on our enemies. Not our allies i.e. Kuwait.

SintonFan

04-27-2007, 01:33 AM

Originally posted by DDBooger
BEEP wrong! lol if you haven't heard their nuke capability is not within reach of our air weaponry. if you weren't privy to the news release but a leak was purposely let go to gauge the publics response to the possible use of nuclear weapons to dig out the infrastructure which is deep below ground and scattered around the country! needless to say spec ops and small units would have to recon the locations. paint em and then either pray we can penetrate or sand goes to glass because thats about the only way we are reaching our AIMS! come on, any military afficianado knows air wars are limited. again, israel fought a country with no air force, yet what was accomplished? smashed buildings and a rejuvanated hezbollah. your thinking to simplistically. iran is divided right now. the mullahs have the power but age is steadily changing that. we commit to air war and see similar collataral damage as the israelis did, well buddy we have a rejuvanated enemy and needless to say a 3rd muslim state attacked. right or wrong, what better calling card.
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BEEP! Wrong!
Where do you get your "info"? I live in between 3 major US bases and have some friends in the military and nothing your said comes close to what I have heard. First, you are wrong to say our "air weaponry"(on ground or below) can't reach anywhere in Iran. Flat out wrong buddy. We have the ability to fuel mid-air and make safe zones for those refueling tankers. Second, the Mullahs are on the verge of losing their power because the Iranian people are FED UP with their suicidal war-mongering.
We can win this war! It's not gonna be easy, but us pulling out of Iraq now is the worst thing we could do for this country!:doh: :(

DDBooger

04-27-2007, 01:34 AM

Originally posted by BILLYFRED0000
But they do not have any nukes. All you do is take out their plants that purify uranium. Israel was against a guerrilla fight. Not the proper use of air war. Iran's strategic targets are over open bomb sights. Destroy their capability to manufacture, move(logistically), and hide. I am saying there are chains in the process than can be taken out and they can be delayed and deterred. Not stopped. However, I also believe that in the long run this will not be necessary. The people in Iran are much more like their Iraqi counterparts. They are really not ready nor willing to fight a war. That is why Iran has been so heavy in the terrorism trade. The Iranians had all of war they want from Saddam. Which BTW, was why we built him up. To take on our enemies. Not our allies i.e. Kuwait. partner the issue is preventing, they are not within reach of our weaponry. they have the centrifuges well hidden. who told you iran's strategic targets are over bomb sights? seriously, i'd love to read that stuff! lol do you realize iran builds mock complexes in order to deceive. DUDE WE HAVE NO IDEA where or what they have. all we know is they have something. and an air war is just the kind of war that unites the masses. we'll have to agree to disagree, but w/o intel we won't get what we are after. we can slow down production by air surveillance, but how long would that last?

DDBooger

04-27-2007, 01:37 AM

Originally posted by SintonFan
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BEEP! Wrong!
Where do you get your "info"? I live in between 3 major US bases and have some friends in the military and nothing your said comes close to what I have heard. First, you are wrong to say our "air weaponry"(on ground or below) can't reach anywhere in Iran. Flat out wrong buddy. We have the ability to fuel mid-air and make safe zones for those refueling tankers. Second, the Mullahs are on the verge of losing their power because the Iranian people are FED UP with their suicidal war-mongering.
We can win this war! It's not gonna be easy, but us pulling out of Iraq now is the worst thing we could do for this country!:doh: :( actually i got it from the administration who proposed the use of nuclear weapons to reach the bunkers underground! lol come on SF did you really think i meant distance? EVERYONE knows we can maintain constant round the clock readiness in the air. we did it for 30 plus years in the cold war! there is no place on earth we can't reach, but that wasn't what i was talkin about i meant depth partner! i know its late but you need to get some rest!

SintonFan

04-27-2007, 01:38 AM

SintonFan

04-27-2007, 01:41 AM

Originally posted by DDBooger
actually i got it from the administration who proposed the use of nuclear weapons to reach the bunkers underground! lol come on SF did you really think i meant distance? EVERYONE knows we can maintain constant round the clock readiness in the air. we did it for 30 plus years in the cold war! there is no place on earth we can't reach, but that wasn't what i was talkin about i meant depth partner! i know its late but you need to get some rest!
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I must have missed that "memo" from the administration. Can you find it for me?:D
Proof is good when you make claims like that.
Back it up!;) Don't make statements like that unless you can prove it.:inlove:

DDBooger

04-27-2007, 01:41 AM

Originally posted by SintonFan
.
So are you saying IRAN is to tough or smart for us? Or are you saying you and others don't have the stomach to fight for our rights to live as we deserve to?
*Judge, I'll stop leading the witness now*:D haha uh oh the with us or against us argument! no dumbo, im saying the methods billy is suggesting is inadequate. w/o solid intel provided by israeli mossad or u.s. delta, seal or AF specs we won't have a clue where to start! and about the only way we'll b sure of where these things are located will be to monitor troop movements and look for what are they trying to protect! even then, the russians and chinese have keep knowledge of our capacities so who better to advise them on how defend against our capabilities

BILLYFRED0000

04-27-2007, 01:42 AM

Originally posted by DDBooger
partner the issue is preventing, they are not within reach of our weaponry. they have the centrifuges well hidden. who told you iran's strategic targets are over bomb sights? seriously, i'd love to read that stuff! lol do you realize iran builds mock complexes in order to deceive. DUDE WE HAVE NO IDEA where or what they have. all we know is they have something. and an air war is just the kind of war that unites the masses. we'll have to agree to disagree, but w/o intel we won't get what we are after. we can slow down production by air surveillance, but how long would that last?

It would take time. But as you said and I agree, I do not think this will be necessary. If Iran uses a WMD, the world will fix the issue. But the people will not be a part of the decision. Over the long run, any concern about Iran fades just as North Korea fades.
While partially controlled by fanatics, their reach is only so long.
The question then becomes one of deterence. Which is where the anti-missile defence comes in. Which BTW today an AEGIS
class cruiser took out an inbound ballistic target and an inbound
cruise missile in the same attack. Why do you think the Navy and DOD is working so hard on anti-missile defense? To give countries like North Korea and Iran pause. Which then leaves the true lunatics. And if the system works you get the chance to prove it. If it had not been for al zarquawhi going to Iraq, we probably would not be having this discussion any way.

And the reference to open sights. Remember that there is a logistics chain for any manufacturing facility. While it is hard to be sure which is which, it would not be hard to take them all out if necessary. Just an appropriate amount of time and bombs. Would this be smart? Probably not. Which is why it would never happen anyway.

SintonFan

04-27-2007, 01:43 AM

DDBooger

04-27-2007, 01:44 AM

Originally posted by SintonFan
.
I must have missed that "memo" from the administration. Can you find it for me?:D
Proof is good when you make claims like that.
Back it up!;) Don't make statements like that unless you can prove it.:inlove: you must have missed alot lol its no secret SF, maybe you should think before you use sarcasm sometimes its snippyness bites ya back. we currently possess nuclear bunker busters! its no secret. in fact they are actually neutron bombs

DDBooger

04-27-2007, 01:46 AM

DDBooger

04-27-2007, 01:47 AM

Originally posted by SintonFan
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I say that there are enough Iranians who hate their own government we can get that kind of intelligence pretty easy...
if we don't already have it.:nerd: well hell how many iraqi's hated saddam. how did intelligence serve us there ;)

BILLYFRED0000

04-27-2007, 01:47 AM

Originally posted by DDBooger
haha uh oh the with us or against us argument! no dumbo, im saying the methods billy is suggesting is inadequate. w/o solid intel provided by israeli mossad or u.s. delta, seal or AF specs we won't have a clue where to start! and about the only way we'll b sure of where these things are located will be to monitor troop movements and look for what are they trying to protect! even then, the russians and chinese have keep knowledge of our capacities so who better to advise them on how defend against our capabilities

And this is where I am coming from. What we know is what we know. But we do not know what the Mossad knows. They won't tell us because they don't want the devil they know to change. I believe that the Mossad is securely in Iran as they do not have a
system like Iraq. They have a clue and probably will do nothing unless forced because they also see a moderating Iran. Interfere
now and you will probably make it worse. If it became necessary,
I believe the Israeli's would probably ask for our help this time unlike when they destroyed them last time.

SintonFan

04-27-2007, 01:49 AM

Originally posted by DDBooger
you must have missed alot lol its no secret SF, maybe you should think before you use sarcasm sometimes its snippyness bites ya back. we currently possess nuclear bunker busters! its no secret. in fact they are actually neutron bombs
.
Look Boog, you did say "administration". I just assumed you knew you knew someone from a specific administration since it did sound like you knew someone. I'm not being facetious all the time so why do the same here? Answer the question...
which administration?
It a very simple question...:)

DDBooger

04-27-2007, 01:50 AM

Originally posted by BILLYFRED0000
It would take time. But as you said and I agree, I do not think this will be necessary. If Iran uses a WMD, the world will fix the issue. But the people will not be a part of the decision. Over the long run, any concern about Iran fades just as North Korea fades.
While partially controlled by fanatics, their reach is only so long.
The question then becomes one of deterence. Which is where the anti-missile defence comes in. Which BTW today an AEGIS
class cruiser took out an inbound ballistic target and an inbound
cruise missile in the same attack. Why do you think the Navy and DOD is working so hard on anti-missile defense? To give countries like North Korea and Iran pause. Which then leaves the true lunatics. And if the system works you get the chance to prove it. If it had not been for al zarquawhi going to Iraq, we probably would not be having this discussion any way.

And the reference to open sights. Remember that there is a logistics chain for any manufacturing facility. While it is hard to be sure which is which, it would not be hard to take them all out if necessary. Just an appropriate amount of time and bombs. Would this be smart? Probably not. Which is why it would never happen anyway. well at present i have no opinion regarding defense system, don't have enough info. but im sorry zarqawi justified attacking iraq? he also attended some prayers in pakistan waziristan region do we go after them. he was one guy. we are fascinated with creating a singular enemy in our society. as if it gives us an aim or justification. al queda is larger than one man and one man's presence in its country is not an issue, but a countries population in support of them is

DDBooger

04-27-2007, 01:51 AM

Originally posted by SintonFan
.
Look Boog, you did say "administration". I just assumed you knew you knew someone from a specific administration since it did sound like you knew someone. I'm not being facetious all the time so why do the same here? Answer the question...
which administration?
It a very simple question...:) did you read the memo i provided?

DDBooger

04-27-2007, 01:53 AM

Originally posted by BILLYFRED0000
And this is where I am coming from. What we know is what we know. But we do not know what the Mossad knows. They won't tell us because they don't want the devil they know to change. I believe that the Mossad is securely in Iran as they do not have a
system like Iraq. They have a clue and probably will do nothing unless forced because they also see a moderating Iran. Interfere
now and you will probably make it worse. If it became necessary,
I believe the Israeli's would probably ask for our help this time unlike when they destroyed them last time. good observation, and quite possible, they are still superb intel agents! we have fallen off since the end of the cold war! too afraid to risk lives. israelis understand its the risking of those lives that SAVE THEM

SintonFan

04-27-2007, 01:53 AM

Originally posted by DDBooger
well hell how many iraqi's hated saddam. how did intelligence serve us there ;)
.
How many factions live in Iraq who hated each other to begin with? Iran is less divided by ethnicity than that. Poor analogy on you part.:p

BILLYFRED0000

04-27-2007, 01:56 AM

Originally posted by DDBooger
a memo
http://www.lewrockwell.com/prather/prather42.html

If that is your source I would chuck it. The guy is a Bush hater.
And anyone that openly anti-Bush would spin the tale any number of ways. The Slant is there no doubt.

The key paragraph showing the issue is this.
You may recall that the principal rationale Bush gave for launching a pre-emptive war – neither authorized by Congress or sanctioned by the U.N. Security Council – against Iraq in 2003 was that he had "intelligence" that the Iraqis had a secret nuke-oriented uranium-enrichment program, unknown and undetected by the IAEA.

Not at all is that the truth. First, the Executive can command the troops with or with out Congress approval and the Congress did approve eventually. Lie number one.
Second. The UN council passed res. 1771 which stated that force could be used to get Iraq to comply with the treaty they had signed at the end of the gulf war and nuclear weapons were not mentioned in the resolution. In fact, WMD was not the only p reason althought the CIA, Russians, Security Council, Democrats and Republicans all believed that Saddam had the weapons.

I would call that tainted at best.