Holding??????

[bobcat1]

I have thought about this all night, and I was talking to a friend and the only subjective call all night long was in the 4th quarter when we were deep in LH's end of the field driving for a win, the death flag came flying. I don't know if it was holding or not. My point is they had allowed it all night, why throw it then. Yes both sides hold or they are not good linemen. Anyone that knows the game knows that was not the only holding in the game just the only holding penalty called. LH had 2 5 yard penalties that had to be called for IP or motion. I am not saying it cost us the game, but it sure came at a bad time. :confused:

[3afan]

then they should not have held at a bad time ...

:p




congrats to Celina for a tremendous season and to LH for their state title ...

[bobcat1]

Originally posted by 3afan
then they should not have held at a bad time ...

:p




congrats to Celina for a tremendous season and to LH for their state title ... You're right. too funny........

[CenTexSports]

The officials are watching areas for the most part. There is up close holding (two linemen and the offensive man's hands are inside the frame of the man he is blocking) on a lot of plays. The keys to a flag on this type of holding are:

Was it seen by an official?
Was it at the point of attack or did it (or could it) have an impact on that particular play?

Then there are plays where holding will always get a flag:

Takedowns, wrapping up a defender, holding on to a jersy when the defender gets seperation.

But a hugh key to remember is that it has to be seen. The officials are watching areas and as they move through a play they try to catch everything but they can't see everything.

[bobcat1]

3 penalties all night. Come on they were letting them play and you know it. My question was why then?

[3afan]

just the opposite of the Cove-AH game in which there were 23 penalties for over 200 yards

[Pudlugger]

One of the unintended consequences of rule changes in blocking is that holding has become more subjective. I always thought holding penalties tend to come at a bad time. Usually after a big play. Occassionally on a sack when the OL desparate to save the qb grabs a DL who is beating him. Like CenTex says it has to be seen and if it is at the point of attack and matters than it will be called. I like that only 3 penalties were called in this game. Let them play as long as things are in control. The Cove-Alamo Heights officiating was horrendous according to folks I talked to that were there. Hopefully the game will hinge on the players and not on big penalties (e.g. UT-aTm "offensive pass interference" LOL).:)

[Chris Hart]

I noticed several holding infractions on both teams that weren't called myself. But, I do remember the exact play you are talking about Bobcat1. The Celina runner was running around the right end and the DE from Liberty Hill had shed his blocker and WAS going to make the play behind the line of scrimmage, the Celina RT reached out and grabbed him just in time for the runner to go by, that's why it was called it was directly responsible for the play resulting in a success. It was either throw the flag and call adeserved holding call, or allow a blatant hold to possibly determine the outcome of a state title game. There were ALOT of non-calls, but none as blatant and directly in front of the play like that one particular play.The refs let the kids play for the most part, and both teams FOUGHT in the trenches...

[Old Tiger]

There was only like 2 or 3 flags thrown the refs did a great job of letting the kids play. Hats off to theam

[Matthew328]

The referees especially in state title games will not throw the flag unless it is a blatant hold or the penalty directly affects the play.....which it sounds like on that play the hold prevented the player from making a play behind the line of scrimmage..

[VAMike]

Originally posted by Tiger WR
There was only like 2 or 3 flags thrown the refs did a great job of letting the kids play. Hats off to theam

That is the way it should be all year. It may look lke it is just because it is the title game but I suspect if you watched any game this year involving teh same officials, that would be what you see. They are the better officials from their particular Chapters and that is how the better officials work a game, regardless of the Chapter they are from.

[bobcat1]

Originally posted by Chris Hart
I noticed several holding infractions on both teams that weren't called myself. But, I do remember the exact play you are talking about Bobcat1. The Celina runner was running around the right end and the DE from Liberty Hill had shed his blocker and WAS going to make the play behind the line of scrimmage, the Celina RT reached out and grabbed him just in time for the runner to go by, that's why it was called it was directly responsible for the play resulting in a success. It was either throw the flag and call adeserved holding call, or allow a blatant hold to possibly determine the outcome of a state title game. There were ALOT of non-calls, but none as blatant and directly in front of the play like that one particular play.The refs let the kids play for the most part, and both teams FOUGHT in the trenches...
Thanks Chris, I will look for what you described on the CD or maybe the coaches film. I too had noticed a lot of non-calls that sprung certain plays and that was my question as to why it was called then. But if he was guilty then it will show on film or CD. At any rate I again appreciate your answer and whatever I see will not change the score at all. Congrats LH on your win!

[Who-dun-it!!?]

Who cares?

My hats off to Celina for showing up as a powerhouse in 3A. And Congrats to LH on a well deserved State Championship!!

Watch out for those Snyder Tigers in 2007!!