You Think Your Guy Runs 4.5? Educate Yourself

[Emerson1]

http://www.usoc.org/11611_32384.htm

I think the 40 has always been overrated. VY ran something like a 4.67 in the combine, but he isn't nearly that slow.

[Boosty_Hondo]

40's are overated the 10 should be more important cause that tests endurance as well

[smustangs]

Originally posted by Boosty_Hondo
40's are overated the 10 should be more important cause that tests endurance as well

The 10?

[Boosty_Hondo]

oops 100 lol

[BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END]

Originally posted by Boosty_Hondo
oops 100 lol

I can run under a 4.0 in the 100.

[Boosty_Hondo]

lol ya whatever u would be a record world holder

[handNthedirt]

that's a bunch of track & field crap.

[BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END]

Originally posted by Boosty_Hondo
lol ya whatever u would be a record world holder

I was talking about in the 100 foot sprint. :D

[Boosty_Hondo]

haha ok i see...

[BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END]

Originally posted by Boosty_Hondo
haha ok i see...

I did run in the mid to low 11s back in the day, though.

[Boosty_Hondo]

Originally posted by BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END
I did run in the mid to low 11s back in the day, though.

very nice wish i could do that haha

[RMAC]

Originally posted by handNthedirt
that's a bunch of track & field crap.

The 40 IS overrated.

[handNthedirt]

it's one of many tests of athleticism. there isn't a single test that measures one's football ability. how bout the verticle? nfl shuttle? repping 225 on bench? the freakin wonderlick(?)?

[Boosty_Hondo]

Originally posted by handNthedirt
it's one of many tests of athleticism. there isn't a single test that measures one's football ability. how bout the verticle? nfl shuttle? repping 225 on bench? the freakin wonderlick(?)?

wonderlick???

[handNthedirt]

it's nfl's iq and decision making test....the same one that VY scored a record low on....and he revitalized a sorry ass titan team...those tests by themselves are pointless...but scoring them altogether makes football sense....believe it or not, the nfl is pretty successful...they know what they're doing. did you know they also take pics of you in your tighty whiteys?

[Boosty_Hondo]

Originally posted by handNthedirt
it's nfl's iq and decision making test....the same one that VY scored a record low on....and he revitalized a sorry ass titan team...those tests by themselves are pointless...but scoring them altogether makes football sense....believe it or not, the nfl is pretty successful...they know what they're doing. did you know they also take pics of you in your tighty whiteys?

wow that is ridiculous i cant believe that and the tighty whiety thing is horrible

[Old Tiger]

40 is just how explosive a player is

[handNthedirt]

cleans are a better measure of explosiveness...imo.

[Old Tiger]

Originally posted by handNthedirt
cleans are a better measure of explosiveness...imo. Explosion off the line. I should have mentioned that and also a means of speed.

[handNthedirt]

speed...nothing more.

[Boosty_Hondo]

Originally posted by Tiger WR
Explosion off the line. I should have mentioned that and also a means of speed.

well the line people are slow well most of them..including me

[handNthedirt]

line people?

[handNthedirt]

any relation to the village people?

[Old Tiger]

But some of them are explosive. That is why the forty varies. Say a 6'5 316 lbs. linemen runs a 4.9 or 5.00 forty. That is explosive for the position.

[Boosty_Hondo]

ya that is true very explosive for his size and position

[handNthedirt]

that's fast...not explosive. verticle is explosive...cleans are explosive.

[Old Tiger]

Originally posted by handNthedirt
that's fast...not explosive. verticle is explosive...cleans are explosive. Being that big you're not going to run a 4.9 forty not being explosive. It's how you get off the line. Cleans help with explosiveness.

[Boosty_Hondo]

Originally posted by handNthedirt
that's fast...not explosive. verticle is explosive...cleans are explosive.

cleans are explosive but ive only done those in the 7th grade but i was still very explosive off the line always the first one off

[g$$]

Wonderlich Test is what you were talking about earlier. Basically an IQ/reasoning test (VY made a 5 then a 15; 40 pt. scale so 20 is considered avg. intelligence).

VY ran below a 4.6, around 4.57 if I remember right. Track speed & football speed are often way different. VY has run 4.5 many times.

Just like a radar gun in baseball measures arm strength (able to throw hard, etc.), the 40 yd. dash in football measures foot speed. It's a measuring stick only. You still have to play the game.

40 yd. dash, repping 225, shuttle, cone drill, & other drills are done at the combine. It's a meat market, thus the guys are paraded around in underwear to get a look at physical appearance/specimen. They are investing lots of $$ in these guys & want all the info. they can get. Personal interviews are conducted too.

[Who-dun-it!!?]

Originally posted by BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END
I was talking about in the 100 foot sprint. :D

I'm too old and to slow. I could run the 100 in 4.3!!!

hours, minuets

[rgn4fb]

Originally posted by Boosty_Hondo
40's are overated the 10 should be more important cause that tests endurance as well The 100. That make no sense for football. Very few times does a player run a 100 in a game. The 40 gives a good example as to how football fast someone is. There are several track fast guys who just can't make it on a football field.

[BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END]

Originally posted by rgn4fb
The 100. That make no sense for football. Very few times does a player run a 100 in a game. The 40 gives a good example as to how football fast someone is. There are several track fast guys who just can't make it on a football field.

But in the same token, when does a player make a straight up 40 yard run? I think that the 20 yard shuttle is the best timed running event because it measures both quickness, lateral movement, and footwork. That's just me, though. My favorite thing to do were the reps at 225. :D

[Dogman_1969]

I think for football the 20 yd speed is more important. nearly every position is based off of the 20 yd distance. A RB can be really effective if his 20 yd time is good.

I've seen several great high school, college and more pro rb's that couldn't go sub 4.7. But by their second step they were at top speed.

for defense it takes athletes that are flexible and quick. Those guys that can't touch below their knees sure look slow on Saturday's.......

[BTEXDAD]

Originally posted by handNthedirt
it's nfl's iq and decision making test....the same one that VY scored a record low on....



Where did you get this info about it being a record low??


Dave Campbell's Texas football mag will often have reports on teams (furnished by the team) that has 10-12 players who run 4.4 to 4.6 forties. When I see that, I just assume the team has some fast players, but I know they aren't that fast. If so, there are several high school teams that have more team speed than the pros.

[Boosty_Hondo]

Originally posted by BTEXDAD
Where did you get this info about it being a record low??


Dave Campbell's Texas football mag will often have reports on teams (furnished by the team) that has 10-12 players who run 4.4 to 4.6 forties. When I see that, I just assume the team has some fast players, but I know they aren't that fast. If so, there are several high school teams that have more team speed than the pros.

alot of high school teams ahve that much speed i know hondo has atleast 8-9 kids that have there 40 time around there

[handNthedirt]

Originally posted by BTEXDAD
Where did you get this info about it being a record low??


it was all over the news...he was allowed to take it again...not as bad second time around...but don't expect VY to be bringing home the pulitzer any time soon.

[DaHop72]

Originally posted by BTEXDAD
Where did you get this info about it being a record low??


Dave Campbell's Texas football mag will often have reports on teams (furnished by the team) that has 10-12 players who run 4.4 to 4.6 forties. When I see that, I just assume the team has some fast players, but I know they aren't that fast. If so, there are several high school teams that have more team speed than the pros. The record low he is talking about is not in the forty, it was on the Wonderlick.

[mustang04]

Originally posted by handNthedirt
it was all over the news...he was allowed to take it again...not as bad second time around...but don't expect VY to be bringing home the pulitzer any time soon.

i dont...nor peyton manning, tom brady, ben roethleberger, drew brees...none of them...cuz they are FOOTBALL PLAYERS....that test shows nothing

T.O. MIGHT bring home the Pulitzer if his new childrens' book has good sales!:D :D

[UTatx]

Originally posted by Emerson1
http://www.usoc.org/11611_32384.htm

I think the 40 has always been overrated. VY ran something like a 4.67 in the combine, but he isn't nearly that slow.

Track speed and football speed are totally different

[44INAROW]

Originally posted by DaHop72
The record low he is talking about is not in the forty, it was on the Wonderlick.

I laugh out loud everytime I see WONDERLICK :D :D

ok, I'll get back to work now :nerd: ;)

[Boosty_Hondo]

Originally posted by 44INAROW
I laugh out loud everytime I see WONDERLICK :D :D

ok, I'll get back to work now :nerd: ;)

lol me to it kinda sounds like trying to hit someone as hard as you can but its not oh well

[maroogreen]

Originally posted by g$$
Wonderlich Test is what you were talking about earlier. Basically an IQ/reasoning test (VY made a 5 then a 15; 40 pt. scale so 20 is considered avg. intelligence).

It's a meat market, thus the guys are paraded around in underwear to get a look at physical appearance/specimen. They are investing lots of $$ in these guys & want all the info. they can get.

IQ/reasoning, etc., is important--especially for a QB, because it shows an ability to quickly evaluate scenarios and select the best one. On the flip side, IQ and reasoning don't go hand in hand, because too much information can be a bad thing and hamper your ability to make decisions. HOWEVER, that being said, some great athletes are purely instinctual--they can't do simple algebra but their minds can break down plays as they are occurring. Why? Who knows? There is more than one type of intelligence.

As far as parading them around in their underwear, I wonder if I can get a copy of that video? :thinking: :D

[pirate4state]

Originally posted by 44INAROW
I laugh out loud everytime I see WONDERLICK :D :D

ok, I'll get back to work now :nerd: ;)

:evillol: :evillol: :evillol: WONDERLICK!!! :devil: :D

[g$$]

Originally posted by BTEXDAD
Where did you get this info about it being a record low??


Dave Campbell's Texas football mag will often have reports on teams (furnished by the team) that has 10-12 players who run 4.4 to 4.6 forties. When I see that, I just assume the team has some fast players, but I know they aren't that fast. If so, there are several high school teams that have more team speed than the pros.

It's the Wonderlich Test (not WONDERLICK). And yes, VY scored the worst ever as mistakenly released to the media. VY & his agent were not able to refute the scores. He made a 5 then a 15 the 2nd time, far below the avg. intelligence of a 20 score on a 40 point scale. Dan Marino also scored very low years ago. Steve Young scored almost perfect. Take it for what you will. I have taken a sample test & it was fairly basic stuff.

[tigerpride_08]

i think the 40 is important in football...and im sure you can tell just from that how fast a person is...just like the baseball players run 60...it's all relevent!!:)

[HM33]

In my opinion, I think that the 40 is a rather good test to have. It shows both explosiveness and speed. The explosiveness comes from the take off. With out it, your take off would suck and in the end thats what matters. Its all about the take off. The speed is of course the running after the take off. I think is good. But it does not mean that the athlete will be good at football. Aparently I'm a horribel football player lol. I am 6' 1"ish 225lbs and I ran a 4.56 last year in the spring and I hardly got to play :(. SO unno. But I do think the test is good for athletisism. :)

[j_dog]

Originally posted by BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END
I was talking about in the 100 foot sprint. :D
and I thought you meant 4 minutes in the 100 meters. :D :eek:

[crabman]

Track speed and football speed are NOT different. Speed is speed. What IS different is the timing methods. In track, a gun is fired, the human body reacts, and starts out of the blocks. In major IAAF track competition, the blocks are wired. Any time of less than 0.12 second reaction time is a disqualification. The human body cannot react that fast. If the time from the shot of the pistol until the foot presses against the starting block is less than 0.12 you are cheating. Ben Johnson did not false start so we can assume his reaction time was slower than 0.12.
Football 40's are measured from the time the runner starts. That means he gets, at minimum, an advantage of 0.12 over a track timing method. Probably closer to 0.15. This would put Ben Johnson's fully electronic 40 at about 4.25 seconds equivalent. The last thing that screws up the timing is the reaction time of a hand timed finish line. Even hitting the stop watch a meter early on the finish will shave time off.
The official conversion rate for hand timed track events to a fully electronic time is 0.24 seconds. One can assume that applies to 40 times also. Take out the hand timed bias and the starting reaction time and a 4.4 becomes a 4.76 under IAAF rules.

Bottom line. 40 times are pretty much worthless except for message board fodder.