Gun Control [Archive] - Texas DownLow Forum

Blastoderm55

10-02-2006, 04:49 PM

I'm sure most of you will see this topic with my name and think to yourselves, "there goes that hippy dem trying to spread his propaganda again." And that is fine, but bear with me. With the recent surge in violence taking place in our communities (http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/metro/stories/MYSA100206.01B.teacherdeath.2a84521.html) and, even worse, our schools (http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/A/AMISH_SCHOOL_SHOOTING?SITE=TXCOR&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2006-10-02-12-58-26), how can we as a nation further ignore the danger of having guns so easily accessible for thugs and maniacs? Steps have been made toward getting weapons into the right hands, such as the Brady Bill and proper safety training, but it does nothing to prevent a person from obtaining a firearm through nontraditional means with the sole intention of harming others.

Opponents of gun control argue on behalf of their rights to bear arms, for leisure as well as protection? I'd love to see statistics on just how many guns are used to defend a home in relation to how many gun are used for crime and murder.

This is a very hot topic. Lets keep it as non-political as possible.

Cameron Crazy

10-02-2006, 04:50 PM

Man thats not any good!!

PPHSfan

10-02-2006, 04:52 PM

Go away hippie.:D

Gun cuntrol is being able to hit a moving target while ridin a horse.

I don't know about you, but I have never heard of a murderer who said they would not have done it if it were against the law to have a gun.

It's against the law to drive 90 on the freeway, but peace lovin hippies do it all the time.

mistanice

10-02-2006, 04:56 PM

The US has probably the highest murder rate by guns than any other developed country. I wonder why.

Blastoderm55

10-02-2006, 04:58 PM

Originally posted by PPHSfan
Go away hippie.:D

Gun cuntrol is being able to hit a moving target while ridin a horse.

I don't know about you, but I have never heard of a murder who said they would not have done it if it were against the law to have a gun.

It's against the law to drive 90 on the freeway, but peace lovin hippies do it all the time.

I saw that one coming. :D

As for the criminal element, while its true that the crime would be committed regardless of the legality of the gun possession, WOULD the crime also have been committed had the gun not been available period? Would the criminal resort to a baseball bat, knife, or other object to gain advantage over his/her victim? Would these spineless nothings be able to stand man to man and fight someone over their wallet or purse? I think the gun element makes crime easier.

As for doing 90, that's not my cup of tea. I'm not a NASCAR fan. :)

SWMustang

10-02-2006, 05:00 PM

I don't think you'll make the problem go away by outlawing guns. Most guns are not acquired through the proper channels anyway. I can't for the life of me figure out what kind of parents let their kids have access to guns. I have two young kids and I've chosen not to have firearms in my house. That's my choice - I don't think it's right for the government to make it for me.

whtfbplaya

10-02-2006, 05:03 PM

I typed about 300 words and lucky for me I just erased them all, (I would have got in trouble). If your mind works that way more power to ya!:doh:

PPHSfan

10-02-2006, 05:04 PM

Tell you what I will do.

You make it so methamphetamine is not "available" to my kids. And I will help you destroy every gun on the planet. Until then, you must realize that Gun Control won't work.

whtfbplaya

10-02-2006, 05:04 PM

SWMustang

10-02-2006, 05:04 PM

Originally posted by whtfbplaya
I typed about 300 words and lucky for me I just erased them all, (I would have got in trouble). If your mind works that way more power to ya!:doh:

which way are you talking about?

whtfbplaya

10-02-2006, 05:05 PM

Originally posted by SWMustang
which way are you talking about?

NOT FOR!:D

mistanice

10-02-2006, 05:18 PM

Originally posted by Blastoderm55
I saw that one coming. :D

As for the criminal element, while its true that the crime would be committed regardless of the legality of the gun possession, WOULD the crime also have been committed had the gun not been available period? Would the criminal resort to a baseball bat, knife, or other object to gain advantage over his/her victim? Would these spineless nothings be able to stand man to man and fight someone over their wallet or purse? I think the gun element makes crime easier.

As for doing 90, that's not my cup of tea. I'm not a NASCAR fan. :)

I agree. If guns were harder to attain, then homicide would decline. On the same note, the absence of firearms doesn't reduce the motivation to kill. Still, were guns less available, many heated arguments would result in aggravated assaults rather than murder.

I saw an analysis of over 20,000 homicides and aggravated assaults in Chicago, and it suggested that attacks with knives are five times less likely to result in death than attacks with guns. It also pointed out that the US has over 10,000 handgun homicides comparded with less than 100 (yes 100) in other industrialized nations such as Canada, England, and Japan, where guns are much harder to get.

Blastoderm55

10-02-2006, 05:22 PM

Originally posted by PPHSfan
Tell you what I will do.

You make it so methamphetamine is not "available" to my kids. And I will help you destroy every gun on the planet. Until then, you must realize that Gun Control won't work.

Drugs and guns go hand in hand. Meth is a tricky drug. Pharmacies and markets are no longer offering the cold medicines that are used to create Meth over the counter, but the problem persists.

PPHSfan

10-02-2006, 05:25 PM

Originally posted by Blastoderm55
Drugs and guns go hand in hand. Meth is a tricky drug. Pharmacies and markets are no longer offering the cold medicines that are used to create Meth over the counter, but the problem persists.

In football that is what we call the veer. You didn't challenge me. You stepped to the side and pitched the ball.

DaRaiderz

10-02-2006, 05:26 PM

Originally posted by Blastoderm55
This is a very hot topic. Lets keep it as non-political as possible.

How can you possibly start this post and end it with the final line listed above? Of course its going to get political. While we're at it, lets talk about the Houston Texans and keep the conversation as non-football related as possible.

Outlawing or trying to regulate gun sales even further will do nothing but make it harder for law abiding citizens to purchase a firearm. Period. Right now I could tell you at least five different places you can go and purchase all kinds of illegal substances. Guns would be no different.

Its all a moot point though because all laws passed in this country boil down to one thing, money. I'm all up in arms today anyway about the Port Act just passed that will try to keep me from playing poker online. They can't tax it, so they outlaw it. That's a whole different subject though. Its about the money. The NRA is one of the richest, most powerful and influential lobbyist groups in Washington DC. They throw enough money at politicians to keep any further gun control off of the books. ESPECIALLY with the guy currently in the White House.

Blastoderm55

10-02-2006, 05:33 PM

Originally posted by PPHSfan
In football that is what we call the veer. You didn't challenge me. You stepped to the side and pitched the ball.

I didn't realize we were competing against each other. :rolleyes: Yes, meth is a problem. You want to fix it? Go after the production labs and prosecute the makers, not the junkies who need their fix. Too much time is spent on the users as opposed to the providers. Put the good guns of the law to proper use. If some joe wants to fry his brain in his basement, let him sign his death certificate. Leave him alone and go after the scum who distribute this mess to our youth and lead them to theft and violence in their attempts to obtain more of the smack.

SWMustang

10-02-2006, 05:35 PM

Originally posted by DaRaiderz
[B]. I'm all up in arms today anyway about the Port Act [B]

Pun intended?

Gobbla2001

10-02-2006, 05:40 PM

Originally posted by Blastoderm55

I'd love to see statistics on just how many guns are used to defend a home in relation to how many gun are used for crime and murder.

I think almost every gun in almost every home is being used for protection and HAS been used...

A lot of crimes involving guns involve a suspect and a victim that know each other...

If I knew my victim keeps a gun in the corner of their room, I'd be less-likely to go over there and start chit...

You wanna rob a house? you gunna rob the old grandma whose children visit her once a week, or are you gunna rob Ted Nugent's house?

you decide...

if you try to rob Ted Nugent's house you are a dumbass and woulda done something stupid gun or not...

leave my guns alone....

Blastoderm55

10-02-2006, 05:43 PM

Originally posted by Gobbla2001
I think almost every gun in almost every home is being used for protection and HAS been used...

A lot of crimes involving guns involve a suspect and a victim that know each other...

If I knew my victim keeps a gun in the corner of their room, I'd be less-likely to go over there and start chit...

You wanna rob a house? you gunna rob the old grandma whose children visit her once a week, or are you gunna rob Ted Nugent's house?

you decide...

if you try to rob Ted Nugent's house you are a dumbass and woulda done something stupid gun or not...

leave my guns alone....

Not trying to take away your guns, Gobbla, just trying to keep them away from those with malicious intentions.

Another bizarre (http://www.caller.com/ccct/local_news/article/0,1641,CCCT_811_5036981,00.html) gun story from yesterday.

Gobbla2001

10-02-2006, 05:46 PM

plus... if some 6'2 250 man comes in a grandma's house with a baseball bat or a gun what's the grandma gunna do? beat him with a lamp? mop? pan? hell no, but she can pick up a shot-gun waste-high and blow his head all across the wall...

but we don't want that because she'd have nightmares the rest of her life, so we better make sure she can't have a gun...

Gobbla2001

10-02-2006, 05:49 PM

I'd love for the guns to be in the right hands too, and out of the wrong ones... but what are the right ones and what are the wrong ones?

I get pulled over for going 78 in a 70, am I a 'wrong-hand' man?

mistanice

10-02-2006, 05:54 PM

Originally posted by Gobbla2001
I'd love for the guns to be in the right hands too, and out of the wrong ones... but what are the right ones and what are the wrong ones?

I get pulled over for going 78 in a 70, am I a 'wrong-hand' man?

only if you caused a wreck and someone died.

Gobbla2001

10-02-2006, 05:59 PM

Originally posted by mistanice
only if you caused a wreck and someone died.

good reason to not let me have a gun right there...

do I get to have a car though?

BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END

10-02-2006, 06:02 PM

Originally posted by PPHSfan
Go away hippie.:D

Gun cuntrol is being able to hit a moving target while ridin a horse.

I don't know about you, but I have never heard of a murderer who said they would not have done it if it were against the law to have a gun.

It's against the law to drive 90 on the freeway, but peace lovin hippies do it all the time.

Finally, something that we agree on in politics....

mistanice

10-02-2006, 06:06 PM

Originally posted by Gobbla2001
good reason to not let me have a gun right there...

do I get to have a car though?

I'm sure after being convicted of manslaughter you're license would be suspended. SO i guess not.

mistanice

10-02-2006, 06:07 PM

Originally posted by BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END
Finally, something that we agree on in politics....

have you ever noticed we registered the same month/year, and both live in cs?

Gobbla2001

10-02-2006, 06:09 PM

suspended? so that's not forever I see...

l

bulldogman06

10-02-2006, 06:09 PM

Gobbla, if they take away our guns, the next thing to go will be cars. Maybe we should make more restrictions on guns, but we cannot take them away. That would be the most blatant disregarding of the constitution yet.

Gobbla2001

10-02-2006, 06:10 PM

Originally posted by mistanice
have you ever noticed we registered the same month/year, and both live in cs?

yah, but did you notice he's the great cornholio???

mistanice

10-02-2006, 06:10 PM

Originally posted by Gobbla2001
suspended? so that's not forever I see...

l

Well you didnt specify, were you under the influence?

Gobbla2001

10-02-2006, 06:11 PM

Originally posted by bulldogman06
Gobbla, if they take away our guns, the next thing to go will be cars. Maybe we should make more restrictions on guns, but we cannot take them away. That would be the most blatant disregarding of the constitution yet.

well it's not that they'll take away the guns etc... is that this whole gun-control deal will not be done the right way... and until there is a right way a lot of us are gunna be against it...

mistanice

10-02-2006, 06:11 PM

Originally posted by Gobbla2001
yah, but did you notice he's the great cornholio???

Yeah, he's also an All american, and im a measley letterman. boo.

BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END

10-02-2006, 06:12 PM

Originally posted by mistanice
have you ever noticed we registered the same month/year, and both live in cs?

Wow, stunning revelations on the downlow....

bulldogman06

10-02-2006, 06:13 PM

Originally posted by Gobbla2001
well it's not that they'll take away the guns etc... is that this whole gun-control deal will not be done the right way... and until there is a right way a lot of us are gunna be against it...

There cannot be a right way because a right way to you and I could be a wrong way for someone else, so it can never happen the "right way"

mistanice

10-02-2006, 06:13 PM

Originally posted by BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END
Wow, stunning revelations on the downlow....

we're meant to be together forever.

Gobbla2001

10-02-2006, 06:13 PM

Originally posted by mistanice
Well you didnt specify, were you under the influence?

yes, and in 40 days it will be suspended for 90 days... oh wait, the story you mean?

I dunno, what I'm really trying to get to is who exactly is considered 'not right' to have a gun...

bulldogman06

10-02-2006, 06:14 PM

Originally posted by BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END
Wow, stunning revelations on the downlow....

Haha, whats weirder is that "The great cornholio" and I live in the same dorm room. on the same floor.

Gobbla2001

10-02-2006, 06:14 PM

Originally posted by bulldogman06
There cannot be a right way because a right way to you and I could be a wrong way for someone else, so it can never happen the "right way"

well I think most honest gun-owning NRA worshipin' folks have a 'right way' in their minds, and they'll buy it if it's the 'right way', you know what I mean???

Gobbla2001

10-02-2006, 06:15 PM

Originally posted by bulldogman06
Haha, whats weirder is that "The great cornholio" and I live in the same dorm room. on the same floor.

in the same bed? :(

bulldogman06

10-02-2006, 06:16 PM

Originally posted by Gobbla2001
well I think most honest gun-owning NRA worshipin' folks have a 'right way' in their minds, and they'll buy it if it's the 'right way', you know what I mean???

Yea, I know it, but will the other people like it?

mistanice

10-02-2006, 06:16 PM

Originally posted by Gobbla2001
yes, and in 40 days it will be suspended for 90 days... oh wait, the story you mean?

I dunno, what I'm really trying to get to is who exactly is considered 'not right' to have a gun...

oh I see. Well i say we base it on income brackets, due to the fact that the majority of homicides by guns are committed by poor people. These aren't my assumptions, but straight facts. Would that be the right way to go about it?

bulldogman06

10-02-2006, 06:16 PM

Originally posted by Gobbla2001
in the same bed? :(

Ahh, not the same room, just the same dorm. on the same floor. hes farther down the hall from me

Gobbla2001

10-02-2006, 06:17 PM

Originally posted by mistanice
Well i say we base it on income brackets, due to the fact that the majority of homicides by guns are committed by poor people. These aren't my assumptions, but straight facts. Would that be the right way to go about it?

ohhhh... well that's okay who gives a damn about them poor folk anyway...

HELL no, poor folk gotta hunt for their food...

seriously though, that's silly...

Gobbla2001

10-02-2006, 06:18 PM

Originally posted by bulldogman06
Ahh, not the same room, just the same dorm.

you sound sad

bulldogman06

10-02-2006, 06:20 PM

Originally posted by Gobbla2001
you sound sad

nope, i dont want to room with a homo. hahaha

mistanice

10-02-2006, 06:21 PM

Originally posted by Gobbla2001
ohhhh... well that's okay who gives a damn about them poor folk anyway...

HELL no, poor folk gotta hunt for their food...

seriously though, that's silly...

I know, i was just kidding. :rolleyes:

big daddy russ

10-02-2006, 06:22 PM

It'd never happen either way. I know how my extended family would react and I know how most of my friends would react. The South would rise again and IHStangFan would be the first to sign up.

Personally, I don't like it. Just because a few people die in car wrecks doesnt' mean I'm going to let them take away my car. Just because someone gets attacked by a shark doesn't mean I'm not going to take my future son surfing. And just because everyone freaks out about everything doesn't mean I will.

BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END

10-02-2006, 06:45 PM

Originally posted by bulldogman06
nope, i dont want to room with a homo. hahaha

Sounds like you have a hard time living with yourself.

PPHSfan

10-02-2006, 08:00 PM

Blaming gun laws on the problems with murder is like blaming bad spelling on pencils.

mistanice

10-02-2006, 08:12 PM

Shakespeare once said "How oft the sight of means to do ill deeds, makes ill deeds done"

Snyder_TigerFan

10-02-2006, 08:15 PM

Originally posted by PPHSfan
Blaming gun laws on the problems with murder is like blaming bad spelling on pencils.
:thumbsup: True...True!

luvhoops34

10-02-2006, 08:23 PM

Making guns illegal will then result in only criminals having guns.....

Under the constitution of the United States of America we have the right to bear arms. That means you can own a gun if you want to or if you don't want to then fine. I would NEVER tell somebody they should own a gun if they didn't want one and I sure wouldn't appreciate a do gooder, bunny hugger telling me I can't own one. The guns that I own are not your problem or your business.

I may be a grandma, but nobody better mess with me because I stay locked and loaded 24/7. And if I was threatened, I wouldn't hesitate to use my gun(s).

Oh and remember folks, you can never own too many guns.:)

SintonFan

10-02-2006, 08:30 PM

Originally posted by mistanice

I saw an analysis of over 20,000 homicides and aggravated assaults in Chicago, and it suggested that attacks with knives are five times less likely to result in death than attacks with guns. It also pointed out that the US has over 10,000 handgun homicides comparded with less than 100 (yes 100) in other industrialized nations such as Canada, England, and Japan, where guns are much harder to get.
.
Where is that "study" or analysis? To poke the first hole in your argument, do you know that the US is now the world's 3rd most populist nation? Doesn't Canada have about 1/100th the population of the US? So comparing 10,000 to 100(if that is true) might be a little misleading.
The area with the highest gun death rates(or is it gun crime?) in the US also has the strictest gun laws. Guess where that is? Washington DC.:p

sinton66

10-02-2006, 08:35 PM

I'll give yall the benefit of some sage "old man" wisdom. The only thing that has kept this nation as free as it is for as long as it has been is the private ownership of guns. You can parade your laws, you can parade your courts, you can parade whatever you want, this is the very simple truth. If you outlaw guns, only the police, the military, and outlaws will have them, and the rest of us will be at ALL of their mercies. Only the strong survive.

lostaussie

10-02-2006, 08:37 PM

Originally posted by sinton66
If you outlaw guns, only the police, the military, and outlaws will have them, and the rest of us will be at ALL of their mercies. then we will be just like Mexico. thats not who i want to be like!!!!!!

mistanice

10-02-2006, 08:44 PM

Originally posted by SintonFan
.
Where is that "study" or analysis? To poke the first hole in your argument, do you know that the US is now the world's 3rd most populist nation? Doesn't Canada have about 1/100th the population of the US? So comparing 10,000 to 100(if that is true) might be a little misleading.
The area with the highest gun death rates(or is it gun crime?) in the US also has the strictest gun laws. Guess where that is? Washington DC.:p

I found the study in a book that I have called "Deviant Behavior." in it was a reference to the study that was in a book by James D. Wright, Peter H. Rossi and Kathleen Daly.

Name of this piece of work is Under the Gun: Weapons, Crime, and Violence in America

fireman1

10-02-2006, 09:37 PM

ok this is how I see it (a 19 year old) we can argue day and night about this subject but the fact is that no one is right in this situation if the average joe who works a regular 9 to 5 every day happens to lose his cool one day and goes to his job and shoots his boss for a reason only he knows, how did he get a gun in the first place he was perfectly sane when he purchased the gun he had to go through a background check like everyone else so there is no way that you can predict who will use thier firearm as protection, hunting, or for violence so until people can start telling the future this topic is going to be open and we all have the right to bear arms and no one will take that freedom away from me

CenTexSports

10-02-2006, 09:49 PM

Outlawing something always works doesn't it? Look at prohibition. A classic example of how the government had our best interest in mind.

Oh yeah, I don't own a gun but I don't want my right to own one taken away (my dad has hundreds and I expect to get my share of his inheritance).

BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END

10-02-2006, 10:03 PM

Originally posted by CenTexSports
Outlawing something always works doesn't it? Look at prohibition. A classic example of how the government had our best interest in mind.

Oh yeah, I don't own a gun but I don't want my right to own one taken away (my dad has hundreds and I expect to get my share of his inheritance).

I was going to sit back and watch this unfold, but I feel like I have to interject. The Right to Bear Arms was made with the idea that us Americans will have means to defend ourselves against our government when under oppression and tyranny. Keeping that in mind, I find it cowardly to want to give up our guns because they are in the hands of people who misuse them. A murder is a murder, whether or not it is with a gun, a knife, a baseball bat, or any other WEAPON. A gun is a weapon, and anything in the hands of a person determined to commit harm to another is and can be a weapon. There are obvious laws against committing harm to others, and those who break these laws are punished. What more do you want? Everyone to give up their guns in hopes that it will reduce the number of murders? Look at it like this, say you are strolling into your house one day to find a man sexually assaulting your wife and kids, he has a knife, and a gun is propped against the door. Are you going to grab the gun and defend yourself and your family when he lunges at you or stop him dead in his tracks? Would that show you the true worth of having a gun? Would you be proud that you had a gun to defend yourself? There are ruthless people in the world, but the people who are responsible should not be held accountable for the negligent and harmful actions of others. The proposition of outlawing the possession of weapons is punishing the innocent, taking away our certain unalienable rights as citizens of the United States, and contradicting the flexible document created by our forefathers called the Constitution. Benjamin Franklin once said, "A man willing to give up his civil rights in return for protection does not deserves to have none." Taking away a weapon is not going to reduce a the number of murders or crimes committed, but only translate to more gruesome murders and painful deaths to the unfortunate victims. You can reduce the number of guns, but you cannot reduce the number of criminals or the actions they commit by taking guns away.

sinton66

10-02-2006, 10:13 PM

Well said, Gary. :clap: :clap:

Snyder_TigerFan

10-02-2006, 11:28 PM

Very well said BBDE.

Originally posted by fireman1
...if the average joe who works a regular 9 to 5 every day happens to lose his cool one day and goes to his job and shoots his boss for a reason only he knows, how did he get a gun in the first place he was perfectly sane when he purchased the gun he had to go through a background check ...

So you take away his gun...that's not going to stop him. He'll drive his car through the building and run over everyone he can. BTW....that was the longest sentence I've seen in a while.;)

Blastoderm55

10-03-2006, 10:10 AM

Two more innocent victims (http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/A/AMISH_SCHOOL_SHOOTING?SITE=TXCOR&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2006-10-03-08-16-52) have passed away after yesterday's attack in Pennsylvania. I wonder how the Amish feel. They seclude themselves from our torrid society, and then just happen to be on the receiving end of an attack from a nutjob. An attack that likely wouldn't have happened had he not had access to a gun. Actually, multiple guns. I know you hunters love your rifles and shotguns, but what is a civilian doing with an automatic handgun? Insanity. Poor children.

Boosty_Hondo

10-03-2006, 10:12 AM

I kind of agree with this cause all of the recent school shootings something needs to be done

Snyder_TigerFan

10-03-2006, 10:31 AM

Making guns illegal will fix everything. Just like making drugs illegal does. :rolleyes:

Boosty_Hondo

10-03-2006, 10:33 AM

lol that is true but there should be some kinda of restrictions on them that have sever punishments

BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END

10-03-2006, 10:33 AM

Originally posted by Blastoderm55
Two more innocent victims (http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/A/AMISH_SCHOOL_SHOOTING?SITE=TXCOR&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2006-10-03-08-16-52) have passed away after yesterday's attack in Pennsylvania. I wonder how the Amish feel. They seclude themselves from our torrid society, and then just happen to be on the receiving end of an attack from a nutjob. An attack that likely wouldn't have happened had he not had access to a gun. Actually, multiple guns. I know you hunters love your rifles and shotguns, but what is a civilian doing with an automatic handgun? Insanity. Poor children.

First of all, automatic weapons are illegal. There are laws in place to protect the lives of innocent people, but laws are always going to be broken. You cannot completely control society and the people in them, and by taking away from the people who have done nothing wrong what have you accomplished? You are not going to stop people from committing lucrative acts by taking away one of their possible weapon choices. If you don't want the right to own a gun, move to Australia, because I guarantee you I'm not going to give up my personal rights to pacify pessimistic people who try to use unreasonable methods to try to solve a problem. Instead of taking away the right to own guns, why don't we try to take a look at the direction that our society is moving in and try to fix that first? Fix the problem at its root. Just because you chop off a mesquite tree smooth to the ground doesn't mean it won't grow back.....

Gobbla2001

10-03-2006, 10:38 AM

Blasto, you got the article to the Jasper dragging?

Post that one... no mas trucks with chains in the back because a couple of nut-jobs got ahold of those two things...

you think they're the only ones to purposely commit crimes with trucks???

How about knives???

Lots of people have been stabbed to death by serial killers... killed in gruesome ways... have any of those articles? No more knives, we must rip apart our food with our own bare hands... we must kill the deer by breaking their necks...

oh, wait, but that would require the use of hands, which have been (please insert more links here) used in strangling plenty of victime... no more hands for the American people, we need all of them by 5 p.m. so no more folk get strangled and/or murdered by other means requiring the use of hands...

what's a civilian doing with an automatic hand-gun? good question

but if he didn't have that automatic hand-gun, a semi-automatic 30.06 would have suited the fella just fine... hell, a sawed-off shot-gun for that matter... but those are illegal so no one uses those... or do they???

outlaw saws btw...

Gobbla2001

10-03-2006, 10:42 AM

without guns it would be tougher to kill someone (overall that is), and without man's hands, it would be pretty damn tough to pull that trigger or even get the gun...

but without man's brain, it would be impossible for man to purposely pull a trigger etc...

so why don't we just go to the root of the problem (one is responsible for their own actions, not their gun's actions)...

everyone, mass suicide to rid the country of brains...

(and PPHSfan, if you remember, I used the "pencil" analogy in my signature on the pig for about a year or so, great memories)

Blastoderm55

10-03-2006, 10:42 AM

Originally posted by BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END
First of all, automatic weapons are illegal. There are laws in place to protect the lives of innocent people, but laws are always going to be broken. You cannot completely control society and the people in them, and by taking away from the people who have done nothing wrong what have you accomplished? You are not going to stop people from committing lucrative acts by taking away one of their possible weapon choices. If you don't want the right to own a gun, move to Australia, because I guarantee you I'm not going to give up my personal rights to pacify pessimistic people who try to use unreasonable methods to try to solve a problem. Instead of taking away the right to own guns, why don't we try to take a look at the direction that our society is moving in and try to fix that first? Fix the problem at its root. Just because you chop off a mesquite tree smooth to the ground doesn't mean it won't grow back.....

Agreed. Once again, I never claimed to be for the outlawing of guns. Controlling whose hands they end up in however seems to be something that should be very high atop our list of priority. Of course laws will be broken. However, the alarming rate at which is occurs here in comparison to other "civilized" nations is just that: alarming. I realize this problem isn't something that can be fixed easily, due in part to plain human nature. People get angry and our instinct, in some twisted cases, is to kill. But are we supposed to just fall asleep in our rocking chairs every night clinging to Ole Betsy just to feel like we have a chance of pulling the trigger before someone else pulls their's on us?

In totally unrelated news, Chuck Norris just walked by my door. :D Well, he looked like him at least. :D

Blastoderm55

10-03-2006, 10:44 AM

Originally posted by Gobbla2001
without guns it would be tougher to kill someone (overall that is), and without man's hands, it would be pretty damn tough to pull that trigger or even get the gun...

but without man's brain, it would be impossible for man to purposely pull a trigger etc...

so why don't we just go to the root of the problem (one is responsible for their own actions, not their gun's actions)...

everyone, mass suicide to rid the country of brains...

(and PPHSfan, if you remember, I used the "pencil" analogy in my signature on the pig for about a year or so, great memories)

So, your solution is to set loose a bunch of rage infected zombies after people in attempts of eradicating all their hands and brains? Sounds good to me. :D

Gobbla2001

10-03-2006, 10:44 AM

Originally posted by Blastoderm55
Controlling whose hands they end up in however seems to be something that should be very high atop our list of priority

I just want to know whose hands should they not be in???

Gobbla2001

10-03-2006, 10:45 AM

Originally posted by Blastoderm55
So, your solution is to set loose a bunch of rage infected zombies after people in attempts of eradicating all their hands and brains? Sounds good to me. :D

it's a start

AP Panther Fan

10-03-2006, 10:51 AM

I am thinking that schools need to take a more pro-active approach to protecting children (even in the small towns).

We seem to be able to find money for athletics, computers etc....perhaps we should be buying metal detectors, locks etc...and enforcing some strict rules on who enters a school.

Blastoderm55

10-03-2006, 10:53 AM

Blasto, you got the article to the Jasper dragging?

Post that one... no mas trucks with chains in the back because a couple of nut-jobs got ahold of those two things...

you think they're the only ones to purposely commit crimes with trucks???

Lemme find a link. Ok. Frankly, acts like ]this (http://www.cnn.com/US/9806/27/dragging.death.02/index.html) are nothing more than home-grown terrorism. Klan ties or not, a murder committed in this fashion is committed in hopes of sending a message. A gun would have killed him just fine, but these killers had something to say with their slaughter.

How about knives???

Lots of people have been stabbed to death by serial killers... killed in gruesome ways... have any of those articles? No more knives, we must rip apart our food with our own bare hands... we must kill the deer by breaking their necks...

oh, wait, but that would require the use of hands, which have been (please insert more links here) used in strangling plenty of victime... no more hands for the American people, we need all of them by 5 p.m. so no more folk get strangled and/or murdered by other means requiring the use of hands...

A knife can't be fired from a long distance. A victim has a chance to react to a knife. Yes, in many sad cases, people have died because of knives but they don't have the destructive power of a firearm. As for hands, well, if I'm ever to be murdered, I hope the killer at least has the cojones to tango in man to man combat. A gun shot to the head execution-style would just leave a bad taste in my mouth.

what's a civilian doing with an automatic hand-gun? good question

but if he didn't have that automatic hand-gun, a semi-automatic 30.06 would have suited the fella just fine... hell, a sawed-off shot-gun for that matter... but those are illegal so no one uses those... or do they???

outlaw saws btw...

The thing with handguns is that they're so easy to conceal. Its more difficult to walk into a 7-11 with a 12 gauge. I know its done, but at least people can say to themselves "Wow, I wonder if that guy is coming in to buy bullets."

Blastoderm55

10-03-2006, 10:58 AM

Originally posted by Gobbla2001
I just want to know whose hands should they not be in???

Criminal background = no gun for you.
Low SAT scores = no gun for you.
Bad vision = no gun for you without corrective lenses.
Low sperm count = train with a Daisy for a few years first.
Lost limb due to gun shot wound = anger management training for 5 years then apply again for permit.
On welfare = take the permit, turn in your Lone Star Card.
Recently fired = See Lost limb due to gun shot wound.
Under 18 = go shoot with your daddy, you're not going to shoot on your own.

I think that's a start.

Gobbla2001

10-03-2006, 11:02 AM

Lemme find a link. Ok. Frankly, acts like ]this are nothing more than home-grown terrorism. Klan ties or not, a murder committed in this fashion is committed in hopes of sending a message. A gun would have killed him just fine, but these killers had something to say with their slaughter.

Homegrown terrorism, murder, what's the difference in the big scheme of things? someone is dead...

A knife can't be fired from a long distance. A victim has a chance to react to a knife. Yes, in many sad cases, people have died because of knives but they don't have the destructive power of a firearm. As for hands, well, if I'm ever to be murdered, I hope the killer at least has the cojones to tango in man to man combat. A gun shot to the head execution-style would just leave a bad taste in my mouth.

a box-cutter on a 747 can kill 3k people...

I do understand your point about a gun being fire from a long distance etc... but if it is hand guns you're talking about, those aren't as lethal at long distance and are not as accurate at longer distances...

but to preview the next quote, you can't conceal a knife easily (9/11)???

The thing with handguns is that they're so easy to conceal. Its more difficult to walk into a 7-11 with a 12 gauge. I know its done, but at least people can say to themselves "Wow, I wonder if that guy is coming in to buy bullets."

sawed-off twelve guages are the way they are so that they ARE easy to conceal, you just need a coat, not even a trench-coat and you can conceal a sawed-off shot-gun...

Gobbla2001

10-03-2006, 11:03 AM

Originally posted by Blastoderm55
Criminal background = no gun for you.
Low SAT scores = no gun for you.
Bad vision = no gun for you without corrective lenses.
Low sperm count = train with a Daisy for a few years first.
Lost limb due to gun shot wound = anger management training for 5 years then apply again for permit.
On welfare = take the permit, turn in your Lone Star Card.
Recently fired = See Lost limb due to gun shot wound.
Under 18 = go shoot with your daddy, you're not going to shoot on your own.

I think that's a start.

I hope to God you're not serious... Low SAT scores?

Blastoderm55

10-03-2006, 11:04 AM

Originally posted by Gobbla2001
I hope to God you're not serious... Low SAT scores?

It keeps a gun out of my stupid hands. :D Though I'm more a danger to myself than to others. :p

Gobbla2001

10-03-2006, 11:07 AM

Originally posted by Blastoderm55
It keeps a gun out of my stupid hands. :D Though I'm more a danger to myself than to others. :p

but seriously, were you serious???

Blastoderm55

10-03-2006, 11:09 AM

Originally posted by Gobbla2001
Homegrown terrorism, murder, what's the difference in the big scheme of things? someone is dead...

In the big picture, there is no difference.

a box-cutter on a 747 can kill 3k people...

I do understand your point about a gun being fire from a long distance etc... but if it is hand guns you're talking about, those aren't as lethal at long distance and are not as accurate at longer distances...

but to preview the next quote, you can't conceal a knife easily (9/11)???

With the technology available to the FAA, 9/11 should have never happened. With news coming up recently of videos featuring the hijackers sizing up their task, the proverbial ball continues to be dropped.

sawed-off twelve guages are the way they are so that they ARE easy to conceal, you just need a coat, not even a trench-coat and you can conceal a sawed-off shot-gun...

Got me there. I've never seen a sawed off shotgun, but I know that ever since Columbine I get nervous when I see weirdos in trenchcoats. I remember my friends and I were nearly expelled for wearing ours (not black, just Russian surplus coats we bought at a surplus shop during our senior trip to D.C) to school, nearly a year after the events on 4-20-99.

BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END

10-03-2006, 11:10 AM

Alright guys, let's just face it. I'm right, and you should all take a deep breath, re-read my posts, absorb it, and move on with your lives. :D

Gobbla2001

10-03-2006, 11:11 AM

okay... whether 9/11 should have happened or not was not the question but answers like those will always be the answers so I honestly throw in the towel... not because I cannot win an arguement, but because I cannot stop arguing one thing to go to a different arguement...

must be a Dodgers fan...

Blastoderm55

10-03-2006, 11:11 AM

Originally posted by Gobbla2001
but seriously, were you serious???

To an extent, yes. I think a "common sense" test should be administered. I know plenty of people who can't do crap when it comes to book smarts, but ask them for help with a motor or appliance and they can tell you everything as if they've memorized the schematic. So while it wouldn't necessarily be an aptitude test, it would be an exam to make sure you're not dumb enough to look into the barrel if a bullet doesn't come out when fired.

Blastoderm55

10-03-2006, 11:13 AM

Originally posted by BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END
Alright guys, let's just face it. I'm right, and you should all take a deep breath, re-read my posts, absorb it, and move on with your lives. :D

Hey, I enjoy discussions like this. I know its only time before PPHS comes around to yell at me and my dirty hippy self. :p

BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END

10-03-2006, 11:14 AM

Originally posted by Blastoderm55
Hey, I enjoy discussions like this. I know its only time before PPHS comes around to yell at me and my dirty hippy self. :p
Yeah, me too, but I'm in class and you are both distracting me.

Blastoderm55

10-03-2006, 11:16 AM

Originally posted by Gobbla2001
okay... whether 9/11 should have happened or not was not the question but answers like those will always be the answers so I honestly throw in the towel... not because I cannot win an arguement, but because I cannot stop arguing one thing to go to a different arguement...

must be a Dodgers fan...

But box-cutters aren't allowed on an airplane. People broke the law with ill-will on their mind, and the security failed to stop them. I'm not trying to dodge your question; I think you pose great questions. I think the examples you bring up just further illustrate that laws will always be broken. However, unless we are more vigilant in protecting ourselves, those who intend to break the law will never face a roadblock.

Blastoderm55

10-03-2006, 11:17 AM

Originally posted by BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END
Yeah, me too, but I'm in class and you are both distracting me.

Your prof is going to think you're viewing "adult material." :p

BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END

10-03-2006, 11:20 AM

Originally posted by Blastoderm55
Your prof is going to think you're viewing "adult material." :p

Who says I'm not doing that, too? Just kidding

Blastoderm55

10-03-2006, 11:24 AM

Multitasking. Good job.

mistanice

10-03-2006, 11:31 AM

Originally posted by Blastoderm55
But box-cutters aren't allowed on an airplane. People broke the law with ill-will on their mind, and the security failed to stop them. I'm not trying to just your question; I think you pose great questions. I think the examples you bring up just further illustrate that laws will always be broken. However, unless we are more vigilant in protecting ourselves, those who intend to break the law will never face a roadblock.

Correct. Laws will always be broken. In fact, it's a good thing that laws are broken because if we lived in a perfect society, how would we know what's right and what's wrong. We need criminals to help civilized people understand that some behavior is just not acceptable. In a utopian world, the things we didn't adhere to in our current society would then be an everday occurence. So here's a big thanks to all the criminals.

Ranger354

10-03-2006, 01:55 PM

Malicious intent should be delt with. Bring back public hangings. We have far too many jails, prisons and people occupying them. The court systems is bogged down with persons waiting to be delt with.

Why should I pay for a person to spend 10 years waiting on death row. Get it over with. Why do you sentence someone to LIFE in prison? Why do we ( Joe Public) have to pay for that person the rest of his/her life.

I understand that there are individuals that leave the Prison system with a better attitude and are better person. Hell, I worked with a man for three years that spent time in the Unit in West Houston north of Sugar Land. He said that he was sorry he committed burglury and never want to go back there again. He was a very nice person and just needed to be given a chance.

Don't try to take away or control my guns until you deal with the other problems first.

Malicious, hateful, deadly crimes should be punnished accordingly. Any person that commits a sex crime against a child under a certain age has NO rights in our society. Get a Rope!

16 year old boys that kill someone can be tried as an adult, but a 16 year old boy that has sex with a teacher is a juvenile???? We need to make that a little more clear......

These little gang bangers that drive around and shoot people from cars should be put on public display on the end of a rope! That will put a dent in the criminal population and show the others that the BS is got to stop!

We have created a haven (The US) for criminals, terrorist, thugs. We are SO simpathetic to those that have been put in jail or prison. Hell, most of them have cable! And have more rights then you and I. AND WE PAY FOR IT!

My father spent 25 years as a District Attny. Our family had our lives threatened many times. I used to carry a shotgun in my truck 24/7. ( to high school too!) Now that was almost 30 years ago and times were a little different then.

I try to teach my children that anything can be dangerous if not used prperly. Guns, knives, scissors, roach/ hornet spray.

Did anyone else watch the Cowboy game? See that Hulk of a man put his foot on the other players head? You can't tell me that he didn't know that was wrong. 5 game suspension is too light. Maybe he could play next year if I were coach. Give me that money back too!

Sorry that I have rambled on.

Gobbla2001

10-03-2006, 02:01 PM

Ranger, you're way off here...

the only reason you should be able to hang someone is if they are eating picante sauce made in New York City...

NEWWW YORKKKK CITTTY?

Blastoderm55

10-03-2006, 02:03 PM

I totally see where you're coming from Ranger. Though I'm not for such brutal capital punishment, I'm all for gathering up all violent criminals and using them in our military. They'll get real training, NO PAY, and if we go to battle, at least its them putting their lives on the line as opposed to promising young people and those who contribute to society as law-abiding citizens.

Blastoderm55

10-03-2006, 02:05 PM

Originally posted by Gobbla2001
Ranger, you're way off here...

the only reason you should be able to hang someone is if they are eating picante sauce made in New York City...

NEWWW YORKKKK CITTTY?

Get a rope...

Gobbla2001

10-03-2006, 02:06 PM

Originally posted by Blastoderm55
I totally see where you're coming from Ranger. Though I'm not for such brutal capital punishment, I'm all for gathering up all violent criminals and using them in our military. They'll get real training, NO PAY, and if we go to battle, at least its them putting their lives on the line as opposed to promising young people and those who contribute to society as law-abiding citizens.

we can use 'em as crash test dummies...

Blastoderm55

10-03-2006, 02:07 PM

That too. Or replacements for animal testing. :D

mistanice

10-03-2006, 02:09 PM

Originally posted by Ranger354
Malicious intent should be delt with. Bring back public hangings. We have far too many jails, prisons and people occupying them. The court systems is bogged down with persons waiting to be delt with.

Why should I pay for a person to spend 10 years waiting on death row. Get it over with. Why do you sentence someone to LIFE in prison? Why do we ( Joe Public) have to pay for that person the rest of his/her life.

I understand that there are individuals that leave the Prison system with a better attitude and are better person. Hell, I worked with a man for three years that spent time in the Unit in West Houston north of Sugar Land. He said that he was sorry he committed burglury and never want to go back there again. He was a very nice person and just needed to be given a chance.

Don't try to take away or control my guns until you deal with the other problems first.

Malicious, hateful, deadly crimes should be punnished accordingly. Any person that commits a sex crime against a child under a certain age has NO rights in our society. Get a Rope!

16 year old boys that kill someone can be tried as an adult, but a 16 year old boy that has sex with a teacher is a juvenile???? We need to make that a little more clear......

These little gang bangers that drive around and shoot people from cars should be put on public display on the end of a rope! That will put a dent in the criminal population and show the others that the BS is got to stop!

We have created a haven (The US) for criminals, terrorist, thugs. We are SO simpathetic to those that have been put in jail or prison. Hell, most of them have cable! And have more rights then you and I. AND WE PAY FOR IT!

My father spent 25 years as a District Attny. Our family had our lives threatened many times. I used to carry a shotgun in my truck 24/7. ( to high school too!) Now that was almost 30 years ago and times were a little different then.

I try to teach my children that anything can be dangerous if not used prperly. Guns, knives, scissors, roach/ hornet spray.

Did anyone else watch the Cowboy game? See that Hulk of a man put his foot on the other players head? You can't tell me that he didn't know that was wrong. 5 game suspension is too light. Maybe he could play next year if I were coach. Give me that money back too!

Sorry that I have rambled on.

I guess we could do that, to protect our rights to bear arms, we could just do away with the 8th ammendment, and permit cruel and unsual punishment. :rolleyes:

Gobbla2001

10-03-2006, 02:09 PM

Originally posted by mistanice
I guess we could do that, to protect our rights to bear arms, we could just do away with the 8th ammendment, and permit cruel and unsual punishment. :rolleyes:

we already use cruel and unusual punishment... some people have phobias in regards to needles etc...

Blastoderm55

10-03-2006, 02:13 PM

Coincidence. One of the men from the Amish community outside of town just walked by. I wonder if he had any way of knowing what transpired in Pennsylvania. :(

pero chato

10-03-2006, 03:05 PM

Originally posted by Blastoderm55
Coincidence. One of the men from the Amish community outside of town just walked by. I wonder if he had any way of knowing what transpired in Pennsylvania. :(

I was visiting my relatives in Penn a few months ago and we went out to the Amish community to shop. Apparently there are different degrees, if you will, of how much they allow certain elements and modern conveniences into their homes and lives. For example, there are phones on several street corners in the community for their use, they just don't have them in their houses. Also some buggies are equipped with radios/cd players.
Newspapers are allowed and so on...but not sure about TVs--wouldn't think so.

Ranger354

10-03-2006, 03:13 PM

So let me get this straight.

Just suppose:

You are the father or a bright young 16 year old daughter.

She is raped and murdered by a man.

How do you feel? Does he deserve to live? Did he commit cruel and unusual punishment to your daughter?

Chew on that a while........ Think about what rights he gave your daughter. What rights he should have now. What rights you have as a parent.

Hopefully none of you will ever have to be put in that situation. But it could happen to any of us.

He gave up his 8th amendment rights when he committed the crime. End of story!

mistanice

10-03-2006, 03:18 PM

Originally posted by Ranger354
So let me get this straight.

Just suppose:

You are the father or a bright young 16 year old daughter.

She is raped and murdered by a man.

How do you feel? Does he deserve to live? Did he commit cruel and unusual punishment to your daughter?

Chew on that a while........ Think about what rights he gave your daughter. What rights he should have now. What rights you have as a parent.

Hopefully none of you will ever have to be put in that situation. But it could happen to any of us.

He gave up his 8th amendment rights when he committed the crime. End of story!

I see where you're getting at, and agree with you to some degree. Now think about the same scenario, what if the murderer was your cousin. Do you apply the same conclusion?

Snyder_TigerFan

10-03-2006, 03:37 PM

Originally posted by Ranger354
So let me get this straight.
Just suppose:
You are the father or a bright young 16 year old daughter.
She is raped and murdered by a man.
How do you feel? Does he deserve to live? Did he commit cruel and unusual punishment to your daughter?
Chew on that a while........ Think about what rights he gave your daughter. What rights he should have now. What rights you have as a parent.
Hopefully none of you will ever have to be put in that situation. But it could happen to any of us.
He gave up his 8th amendment rights when he committed the crime. End of story!

...and if you take away my gun, then I can't take care of his "rights".:)

Originally posted by mistanice
I see where you're getting at, and agree with you to some degree. Now think about the same scenario, what if the murderer was your cousin. Do you apply the same conclusion?

Yes

Maroon87

10-03-2006, 03:42 PM

We don't have a gun problem. We have a society problem.

UPanIN

10-03-2006, 03:53 PM

Originally posted by Blastoderm55
I'm sure most of you will see this topic with my name and think to yourselves, "there goes that hippy dem trying to spread his propaganda again." And that is fine, but bear with me. With the recent surge in violence taking place in our communities (http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/metro/stories/MYSA100206.01B.teacherdeath.2a84521.html) and, even worse, our schools (http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/A/AMISH_SCHOOL_SHOOTING?SITE=TXCOR&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2006-10-02-12-58-26), how can we as a nation further ignore the danger of having guns so easily accessible for thugs and maniacs? Steps have been made toward getting weapons into the right hands, such as the Brady Bill and proper safety training, but it does nothing to prevent a person from obtaining a firearm through nontraditional means with the sole intention of harming others.

Opponents of gun control argue on behalf of their rights to bear arms, for leisure as well as protection? I'd love to see statistics on just how many guns are used to defend a home in relation to how many gun are used for crime and murder.

This is a very hot topic. Lets keep it as non-political as possible.

While we're at it we'll just outlaw cars, trucks & buses also. This will keep them out of the hands of thugs and maniacs cause there are just too many people killed by these machines.
:doh: :doh: :hand: :hand: :mad: :mad:

HPLJ6L

10-03-2006, 03:53 PM

The damn gun got fran just this weekend. Killed his whole season. Now his only hope of staying alive is to down the big steer.
We know there are no snowballs in Connie Rice's Bedroom, so it's time to pour out a little liquor for Dennis.
Rest in Peace Coach Fran.

big daddy russ

10-03-2006, 03:55 PM

Originally posted by mistanice
I see where you're getting at, and agree with you to some degree. Now think about the same scenario, what if the murderer was your cousin. Do you apply the same conclusion?
Absolutely.

The punishment fits the crime whether it's a complete stranger or my little brother. Just because you have strong feelings towards someone doesn't take away the fact that they destroyed someone else's life.

Blastoderm55

10-03-2006, 04:05 PM

Originally posted by UPanIN
While we're at it we'll just outlaw cars, trucks & buses also. This will keep them out of the hands of thugs and maniacs cause there are just too many people killed by these machines.
:doh: :doh: :hand: :hand: :mad: :mad:

Its sad to see how ruffled your feathers get in reference to the outlawing of guns, so much to the point that you actually visualize a statement that I never made. :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

Once again, I never said I was in favor of outlawing guns. Controlling who gets to own them, however...

And Maroon87, your comment probably makes the most sense of anything any of us have said. This is definitely an indictment of our society as a whole. The glorification of violence. The promotion of advancement at the expense of others. The idea that people can get away with crimes they committed. Its a very sad state in which to be.

BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END

10-03-2006, 04:07 PM

mistanice

10-03-2006, 04:16 PM

Originally posted by Blastoderm55
Its sad to see how ruffled your feathers get in reference to the outlawing of guns, so much to the point that you actually visualize a statement that I never made. :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

Once again, I never said I was in favor of outlawing guns. Controlling who gets to own them, however...

And Maroon87, your comment probably makes the most sense of anything any of us have said. This is definitely an indictment of our society as a whole. The glorification of violence. The promotion of advancement at the expense of others. The idea that people can get away with crimes they committed. Its a very sad state in which to be.

There's another aspect of glorification that alot of us fail to realize. That's the glorification of success. Society instills in us from a young age to be the best we can be. Starting from elementary we're pounded with many success stories, we're asked what we want to be when we grow up, etc. I feel like they really downplay on how we are supposed to legitiamtely attain these goals. Also, some people don't have the same opportunities as others due to the structure of society... and that too, puts a strain on people. When someone is lost on how to succeed in life, or when they believe there's an easier way to achieve high goals they turn to deviance and are more likely to committ crime (robbery, theft,murder.)

Maroon87

10-03-2006, 04:31 PM

Originally posted by BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END
I get where you're coming from, there does need to be an improvement on the methods of the way a person can attain a gun, but not outlaw them or take them away.

Exactly. I've got several friends who have extensive firearms collections (and yes that includes semi-automatic and assault type firearms) but these are the types of guys who have never been in any serious legal trouble and have taken every gun and hunting safety course known to man. They're just gun enthusiasts, the same way some people are car enthusiasts. Don't penalize them because the laws are too lax and weirdos are taking advantage.

SWMustang

10-03-2006, 04:52 PM

Originally posted by mistanice
There's another aspect of glorification that alot of us fail to realize. That's the glorification of success. Society instills in us from a young age to be the best we can be. Starting from elementary we're pounded with many success stories, we're asked what we want to be when we grow up, etc. I feel like they really downplay on how we are supposed to legitiamtely attain these goals. Also, some people don't have the same opportunities as others due to the structure of society... and that too, puts a strain on people. When someone is lost on how to succeed in life, or when they believe there's an easier way to achieve high goals they turn to deviance and are more likely to committ crime (robbery, theft,murder.)

I don't know that any of those amish kids were killed because of the glorification of success. In some of the "meaner" neighborhoods in Houston I don't think those kids are being bombarded with success stories. During my numerous visits to those areas I got just the opposite impression - that the cards are stacked against them and they'll never amount to anything - which you alluded to in your "structure of society" comment.

Blastoderm55

10-03-2006, 04:57 PM

Originally posted by SWMustang
In some of the "meaner" neighborhoods in Houston I don't think those kids are being bombarded with success stories. During my numerous visits to those areas I got just the opposite impression - that the cards are stacked against them and they'll never amount to anything - which you alluded to in your "structure of society" comment.

Hence why many of those stricken by poverty turn to a life of crime in hopes of obtaining a life that they wouldn't otherwise achieve.

Ranger354

10-03-2006, 05:18 PM

If my cousin had committed the crime he would have to suffer the same concequences as anyone else. If it wasn't my daughter, but was infact your daughter and my cousin was the "BAD MAN" he should STILL get treated the same way.

If you get arrested for DWI. You should get the same punishment if you are a Court Judge, a Senator, a Teacher, a Mechanic, or however. No special treatment!

I still can believe that a President got a BJ in the oval office and didn't get run out on a rail. Society turned its' cheek. They didn't like it, but know one made an everlasting statement saying "This just isn't going to be tollerated"! It is not just the Dems or the Reps.

We are to blame. Society as a whole is to blame.

Why should a man get a job making minimum wage when he can sell some crack and make ten times the money in a matter of minutes.

Hang that crack dealer and lets see how many want to sell crack tomorrow! (That will get some responses I know)

mrescape43

10-03-2006, 07:23 PM

Gun control is Bull droppings. Guns don't kill. Criminals do.

LHPfactory

10-04-2006, 08:00 AM

Originally posted by Blastoderm55
Steps have been made toward getting weapons into the right hands, such as the Brady Bill and proper safety training, but it does nothing to prevent a person from obtaining a firearm through nontraditional means with the sole intention of harming others.

Opponents of gun control argue on behalf of their rights to bear arms, for leisure as well as protection? I'd love to see statistics on just how many guns are used to defend a home in relation to how many gun are used for crime and murder.

Im a police officer , Drugs are illegal, however, I can easily make adope arrest every day!. Criminals use "non traditional" means to obtain drugs, guns, etc. Show me drug control that works then i would be more willing to listen to you. If you out law guns, only criminals and the government would be armed. Makes the public easy picking for the criminal. But dont worry cause we will be on our way to "secure the scene for processing", of course the thug will be gone 99% of the time and damage is done. Believe me I know, I was a cop in Houston for 5 years and I am one in Austin now. The statistics you mentioned above are low because of the of an armed law abiding public. The piece of trash who shot the little girls in the Amish shool this week was reported to have a clean history, I agree, we have a problem in this society, world, etc, however, new laws will not fix that porblem. Only a change of the heart of man kind will. Until that is accomplished we need to enforce the laws we have with very harsh punishment for violent criminals (which is not happening). There was a time when crime was low and laws were few and everyone had a gun or two. Most law enforcement agencies operate on what is community oriented policing, which is supposed to be proactive rather than reactive. The key is the community, with out it law envorcement can only be reactive. People have become so reliant on call 911 and sit on your hands the government agency assigned to this problem will fix it. The rugged individual is gone!.... Im not gonna wait for the police to come save me when someone is breaking in to my home, cause sad to say , by the time they arrive, the suspect has completed his crime and the damage is done. Yeah we ususlly catch the suspect in time, but the victim(s) are still victims. Disarming the law biding public is not the answer!