Cingular services...

[lepfan]

I was just told today that Cingular does not want me as a customer anymore! It seems that I am costing them money...

I now have 4 new "Cingular" phones and must switch by the 16th of this month!!!! They should have mentioned this back when we renewed our contract...not to mention the 4,000 something rollover minutes I won't ever get to use!!!!

I am not a happy camper! Where is our 3ADL Cingular rep? I forget who that is.

[District303aPastPlayer]

umm... what? i dont get it

[lepfan]

When we moved from Central Texas to Kansas we kept our Cingular phones...and service--Houston Cellular...They flagged our account because we are over 50% usage on " ??" towers...(we are not using Cingular towers...we are using other provider's towers) They say for each phone line (we have 4) that has 50% or more usage on another providers tower it cost Cingular anywhere from $1.000 to $3,000 a month. I would say that we are using other towers 99.9% of the time. (sounded a little wacky to me)

[District303aPastPlayer]

so they are telling you to switch companies? i'd tell em to stick it and stick with them

[lepfan]

Yes they are...I feel a bit like a bride left at the alter!!!! After like alomst 10 years with them and this is what I get!!!! (ya see...Kansas is still causing me problems ;) )


They are terminating me on June 16th!

[District303aPastPlayer]

Originally posted by lepfan
Yes they are...I feel a bit like a bride left at the alter!!!! After like alomst 10 years with them and this is what I get!!!! (ya see...Kansas is still causing me problems ;) )


They are terminating me on June 16th!

can they do that?

[Highschoolfan78]

cingular frustrated my family.. we had to deal with the head people in the big cities and needless to say 14 hours later we were with verizon... I havent had a problem yet with verizon

[ILS1]

They are terminating me on June 16th! [/B]

Ask them can YOU charge them $150 early contract termination fee. You know they would've done it to you,if you were the one who was cancelling the service in the middle of a contract!!!! Plus,Kansas is the home of Sprint/Nextel.





:D

[spiveyrat]

A contract is a contract. If you have to stick to it, so should they. I too have been with Cingular for around 10 years and am starting to get a bad taste in my mouth with them. I noticed a few months ago that I could get a "company discount" through Cingular. So I renewed my contract through the "company discount" in order to save $15/month on my plan. Well, I got my bill and the discount wasn't on there. I called Cingular to get them to correct the mistake and they told me it was no mistake. My company hadn't "met it's quota" so I didn't get the discount but "this one time" she would give me the discount. Funny, online, I saw a rate of $55/month. I didn't see anything advertised (or in small print) about a fluctuating rate. Nor did the operator who set me up say anything about it either. If this happens again next month, I'll be talking to a manager about it and threatening them with me leaving Cingular and going to Verizon. I would hate leaving them as well because I have over 2000 rollover minutes. But if you advertise something, you better back it! :mad:

[Adidas410s]

Originally posted by lepfan
When we moved from Central Texas to Kansas we kept our Cingular phones...and service--Houston Cellular...They flagged our account because we are over 50% usage on " ??" towers...(we are not using Cingular towers...we are using other provider's towers) They say for each phone line (we have 4) that has 50% or more usage on another providers tower it cost Cingular anywhere from $1.000 to $3,000 a month. I would say that we are using other towers 99.9% of the time. (sounded a little wacky to me)

Disclaimer: I used to work for Cingular...but no longer do. This is a pretty through explanation of the situation. Read this and understand WHY they are doing this...and that it's not a company trying to screw you over.

Cingular, nor any other FOR PROFIT company, is not in the business of chartiable donations...they are in the business of making a profit for their shareholders.

Consider this scenario, let's say you are paying $100/month before taxes and using 2000 minutes (DT, m2m, n/w) each month between all 4 of your lines. You are paying them $.05/minute for each minute that you talk. If you are using another company's tower Cingular is paying that company anywhere from $.50/minute to sometimes over $2.50/minute for each call that a Cingular customer places using their cell service. Let's say that you are using a Western Wireless tower (they are Cingular's biggest roaming partner). Cingulay pays them between $.50 and $.75/minute depending where you are. I'm not sure of the rate in your area. We'll assume it's the $.50/minute. Assuming that 100% of your calls are on this network...Cingular pays $1000 in roaming charges and only receives $100 in revenue. Obviously these aren't specific numbers...but it gives you a good idea of the scenario. Let's say that you have lived in Kansas for 2 years...then you have cost them roughly $20,000 for them to keep your account active...when they are not even the ones providing you any service at all. If nothing else, I would be glad that they kept your account active as long as they have.

To tell the story behind what has brought all of this up. First off, one of the lines in your agreement that you signs states that if 50% of your usage is in a non-Cingular area, Cingular reserves the right to terminate your service after upon notification of the account holder. This isn't something new that they just came up with...it's always been in their terms...and it is with any other cell provider who allows you to roam onto other companies networks without billing you a per minute rate for it. Now the story of what brought this up... Cingular's CEO, Stan Sigman, is from Hereford, TX. Sometime in late 2004/early 2005, he went home for his ## High School Reunion. Well many of his former classmates said, "Stan, we live over here in small town, Texas and get poor service on our Cingular phones." Well it occured to him that sounds about right because Cingular only has legal rights to build towers in Lubbock and Amarillo but not in the surrounding counties throughout the Panhandle. So he started wondering, "Why the heck do we have customers with our service that live in areas where we do not provide them any service...and how much money are we losing in roaming charges on these customers?" Thus...you can see how this all came about.

As far as any "legal ramifications," there are none. Cingular has not done anything wrong here. You are the one in violation of the agreement that you signed with the company. As I said, this isn't something new that they just "snuck in" on you, it's been part of their standard terms as far back as I could find a copy of an old contract...1997 or so (which was before there was a Cingular). So for you to think that you are getting screwed by a big corporation...think again. You have actually been the one screwing them. To get into the legal verbage on the contract, they could also choose to charge you a termination penalty for each line for being in violation of the agreement that you signed...but they are not doing so. They are simply cutting their losses, as any good business would do.

On a personal note, I left Cingular in March of this year once I got a job in the Metroplex and I added my phone onto my parent's family plan. They live in a non-Cingular area in Graham, TX. 2 weeks after I leave the company, they received this notice that we were being disconnected in mid-May. Since this determination was made before my phone (used almost exclusively on Cingular networks) was added onto the account...I changed the account into my name and then relocated to a different market so as to generate a moderately difficult paper trail for them to follow should they want to pursue it. That, and we took my little brother's phone and restricted it so that he doesn't use 3000 n&w minutes...and now I am using over 50% of the usage on our plan, so we should no longer incur any problems.

[Adidas410s]

Originally posted by spiveyrat
A contract is a contract. If you have to stick to it, so should they.

Where is Cingular in violation of the agreement that both parties agree to in this situation?

[pirate4state]

Originally posted by Adidas410s
So for you to think that you are getting screwed by a big corporation...think again. You have actually been the one screwing them. :D You've been sticking it to the "man" :D

Screw it! Get Sprint or Nextel.

[spiveyrat]

Originally posted by Adidas410s
Where is Cingular in violation of the agreement that both parties agree to in this situation?

If it's in the agreement, then there is no violation.

What's your take on my situation?

[Adidas410s]

Originally posted by spiveyrat
If it's in the agreement, then there is no violation.

What's your take on my situation?

read my novel above. It makes perfect sense from a business stand point. Quite frankly, I'm surprised that they didn't catch onto this sooner. Consider how much money they have lost since Cingular started in 1999. Let's say that this applies to .5% of their customer base. For the first 5 years, I'll use 30 mil as the customer #...and then 50 mil for the last two years (post AT&T buyout). We'll also assume that they are losing, on average, $500/customer/month.

Using those figures...you do the following equations:

Pre-AT&T
150,000 (.5% of customer base) X $500 (per month loss/customer) X 12 months X 5 years = $4.5 billion in lost revenue...or $900 million per year.

Post-AT&T
250,000 X $500 X 12 months X 2 years = $30 billion in lost revenue...or $15 billion per year.

While I don't know their revenue figures before the AT&T merger, I do know that Cingular's revenues are roughly $8-9 billion per quarter...or about $35 billion/year in the first 12 months following the merger. With the addition of a few million more customers...it is likely closer to $40 billion for 2006. Just think about how staggering of a loss they have been taking...:eek: :eek:

[lepfan]

Adidas...after talking with them...I totally understand! I just wish they would have told me this back when I renewed my contract and bought 4 new phones. I do think I have cost them a lot of $$$$ with my services. OOPS:rolleyes:

[Cameron Crazy]

A friend of mine had the same problem and switched to Verizon he likes it alot. And adidas410s use to be a cingualr rep!

[lepfan]

Just think when I am no longer a Cingular customer and I am not costing them thousands of dollars a year ....your rates could go down... (yea right , like that is going to happen ;) )

[Cameron Crazy]

LOL im glad i dont have one and have that kind of problem hope everything gets cleared up!

[Adidas410s]

Originally posted by lepfan
Adidas...after talking with them...I totally understand! I just wish they would have told me this back when I renewed my contract and bought 4 new phones. I do think I have cost them a lot of $$$$ with my services. OOPS:rolleyes:

Until the last month or two...I don't think many people in the stores were aware of this. It actually started out in West Texas, where I was working, and is called Project Amarillo (because of Hereford's proximity to there). I had a lot of convos with our regional offices (they were trying to find me a job outside of retail once I finished school) and got wind of this project. I had actually read this little blurb a few years ago in the contract (I got bored one day and read it all) and thought....hmm that is interesting! We have a lot of customers in West Texas that don't live in Cingular areas. I would have customers drive in from San Saba, Brady, Menard, Ft Stockton, Big Lake, Munday...you name it. All those areas....zero Cingular coverage.

[lepfan]

Originally posted by Cameron Crazy
LOL im glad i dont have one and have that kind of problem hope everything gets cleared up! I am sure the problem will be cleared up...on June 16th....when they cut my phone service. I am going today to talk to Alltel.

[pirate4state]

Originally posted by Adidas410s
Until the last month or two...I don't think many people in the stores were aware of this. It actually started out in West Texas, where I was working, and is called Project Amarillo (because of Hereford's proximity to there). I had a lot of convos with our regional offices (they were trying to find me a job outside of retail once I finished school) and got wind of this project. I had actually read this little blurb a few years ago in the contract (I got bored one day and read it all) and thought....hmm that is interesting! We have a lot of customers in West Texas that don't live in Cingular areas. I would have customers drive in from San Saba, Brady, Menard, Ft Stockton, Big Lake, Munday...you name it. All those areas....zero Cingular coverage. Makes you wonder why these people get a Cingular phone if there is no coverage in their area?!? :doh: :confused:

[lepfan]

Originally posted by pirate4state
Makes you wonder why these people get a Cingular phone if there is no coverage in their area?!? :doh: :confused: we were in a Cingular coverage area when we got our phones....we moved 2 years ago to a non cinvular area and were getting a better deal (package) with Cingular than we could have gotten with Alltel (local provider)...that is why we are in this pickle...I guess I should be glad it lasted as long as it did!

[pirate4state]

Originally posted by lepfan
we were in a Cingular coverage area when we got our phones....we moved 2 years ago to a non cinvular area and were getting a better deal (package) with Cingular than we could have gotten with Alltel (local provider)...that is why we are in this pickle...I guess I should be glad it lasted as long as it did! Ha/ha....I wasn't referring to you, but to the people in:
We have a lot of customers in West Texas that don't live in Cingular areas. I would have customers drive in from San Saba, Brady, Menard, Ft Stockton, Big Lake, Munday...you name it. All those areas....zero Cingular coverage. ;)

[Adidas410s]

Originally posted by pirate4state
Makes you wonder why these people get a Cingular phone if there is no coverage in their area?!? :doh: :confused:

because there is cell service in those areas...but not Cingular-owned service. They are roaming off of smaller, regional providers who Cingular has to pay a per-minute roaming rate to for every minute a Cingular phone is used on their tower. Of course, Cingular could pass this on to the customer...but people became so fed up with where they could/couldn't use their phones that Cingular created their "no roaming" nation plan. In theory, it was better for Cingular to absorb the roaming costs because they would pick up enough new subscribers (and thus increase revenues) that the revenues would offset the roaming costs...both overall and on a per customer basis.

[Cameron Crazy]

Is alltell any good?

[spiveyrat]

Originally posted by Adidas410s
read my novel above. It makes perfect sense from a business stand point. Quite frankly, I'm surprised that they didn't catch onto this sooner. Consider how much money they have lost since Cingular started in 1999. Let's say that this applies to .5% of their customer base. For the first 5 years, I'll use 30 mil as the customer #...and then 50 mil for the last two years (post AT&T buyout). We'll also assume that they are losing, on average, $500/customer/month.

Using those figures...you do the following equations:

Pre-AT&T
150,000 (.5% of customer base) X $500 (per month loss/customer) X 12 months X 5 years = $4.5 billion in lost revenue...or $900 million per year.

Post-AT&T
250,000 X $500 X 12 months X 2 years = $30 billion in lost revenue...or $15 billion per year.

While I don't know their revenue figures before the AT&T merger, I do know that Cingular's revenues are roughly $8-9 billion per quarter...or about $35 billion/year in the first 12 months following the merger. With the addition of a few million more customers...it is likely closer to $40 billion for 2006. Just think about how staggering of a loss they have been taking...:eek: :eek:

Your novel above doesn't address my situation. Could you please re-read?

[Gobbla2001]

I use cingular and I am getting tired of their chit..... I've had Verizon, and I was tired of their chit... my parents use t-mobile and sometimes get tired of their chit (they're too relaxed to really raise too much hell about something)... I've known people with Sprint and every other company that was tired of their chit...

Basically you're gunna get tired of everyone's caca, but that's just how it smells in this business, no matter where you turn...

[SintonFan_inAustin]

My PDA uses Cingular . i must be costing them alot of money :D . i am all over south texas but always have good reception but my sprint phone is usually roaming between Freer and Fal

[Adidas410s]

Originally posted by spiveyrat
Your novel above doesn't address my situation. Could you please re-read?

Sorry...I read what you said as THE situation. In regards to your situation, I am not as familiar with the business contract discounts. There are so many types of discounts that are available for business between plans, equipment, accessories, pda's, blackberrys, smartphones, etc. It's a crazy world that I didn't mess with too much. As far as getting your company discount added on to your plan...it is probably a 5 digit code (called a Foundation Account Number...or FAN) that needs to be inserted on your account to have the discount applied. In some situations, there are set rate plans that are set up for companies when the account is listed under the business name.

I guess this is the biggest question...is the account in your name, your social, etc? If so then the FAN # that I mentioned is what would be put on your account as your account is an IRU (Individual Revenue User)...there are (to my knowledge) no stipulations regarding the application of those to an account. If your account is under the company's name, tax ID, etc...then you are referred to as a CRU (Corporate Revenue User) and that is something that can only be handled through the business. If the account is in your name, find out what your FAN # is and stop by a Cingular-owned store. Take an employee ID, pay stub, etc (anything to verify employment with them)...take that along with the FAN # and they can apply that to your account...and it will give you the appropiate % discount off of your MRC (monthly recurring charges...aka rate plan price). Let me know if you have any problems. Worst case scenario, I can get the info and fax it to a store manager and Abilene and have him apply it to the account once you find that FAN #.

[Adidas410s]

Originally posted by SintonFan_inAustin
My PDA uses Cingular . i must be costing them alot of money :D . i am all over south texas but always have good reception but my sprint phone is usually roaming between Freer and Fal

Once you get S or E of the I-35 Corridor (Austin to San Antonio) then you are pretty much on Cingular's network anywhere you go in Texas.

[spiveyrat]

Originally posted by Adidas410s
Sorry...I read what you said as THE situation. In regards to your situation, I am not as familiar with the business contract discounts. There are so many types of discounts that are available for business between plans, equipment, accessories, pda's, blackberrys, smartphones, etc. It's a crazy world that I didn't mess with too much. As far as getting your company discount added on to your plan...it is probably a 5 digit code (called a Foundation Account Number...or FAN) that needs to be inserted on your account to have the discount applied. In some situations, there are set rate plans that are set up for companies when the account is listed under the business name.

I guess this is the biggest question...is the account in your name, your social, etc? If so then the FAN # that I mentioned is what would be put on your account as your account is an IRU (Individual Revenue User)...there are (to my knowledge) no stipulations regarding the application of those to an account. If your account is under the company's name, tax ID, etc...then you are referred to as a CRU (Corporate Revenue User) and that is something that can only be handled through the business. If the account is in your name, find out what your FAN # is and stop by a Cingular-owned store. Take an employee ID, pay stub, etc (anything to verify employment with them)...take that along with the FAN # and they can apply that to your account...and it will give you the appropiate % discount off of your MRC (monthly recurring charges...aka rate plan price). Let me know if you have any problems. Worst case scenario, I can get the info and fax it to a store manager and Abilene and have him apply it to the account once you find that FAN #.

After arguing for a little while, I got the discount. What I don't understand is why they post these rates on the website and then tell me when I call about an incorrect bill that my discount is tied to some sort of "quota" that my company didn't meet. To me, if they advertise a special price through my company and I sign a contract, then they should honor that price every month at least until the the contract expires. Is there something wrong with my thinking here?

[Adidas410s]

Originally posted by spiveyrat
After arguing for a little while, I got the discount. What I don't understand is why they post these rates on the website and then tell me when I call about an incorrect bill that my discount is tied to some sort of "quota" that my company didn't meet. To me, if they advertise a special price through my company and I sign a contract, then they should honor that price every month at least until the the contract expires. Is there something wrong with my thinking here?

You are signing a contract to get a discounted price on a phone in exchange for agreeing to use Cingular as your provider for 12 or 24 months. The corporate discount is totally seperate from your contract with Cingular. Your company and Cingular established an agreement that (and I'm guessing here) states that X amount of revenue will be generated by the company and/or it's IRU's (employees using their own plans) and in exchange Cingular would give a % discount off of the monthly service of the company's account as well as their IRU accounts.

That is what this sounds like. Typically, there aren't quotas tied to business contacts but it definitely possible that there is one for this account and that the company failing to meet a monthly/quarterly/yearly revenue quota is certainly a possibility.

[lepfan]

I don't know how alltel's service is...most do have it up here though....I do know they do not have all the perks like cingular...like the rollover.....

[DaHop72]

Originally posted by lepfan
I don't know how alltel's service is...most do have it up here though....I do know they do not have all the perks like cingular...like the rollover..... In West Texas it tends to really pull a big vacuum.:D