Vanderjagt will sign with the Cowboys

[Buccaneer]

The Cowboys now have a kicker, that likes to get liquored up and run his mouth.

[NateDawg39]

oh please!! He is awsome

[JasperDog94]

Dude, we would have won 2 possibly 3 more games in the regular season with a quality kicker. I'll take em.:)

[Phil C]

As long as he gets results is the main thing.

[JasperDog94]

Originally posted by Phil C
As long as he gets results is the main thing. Hey Phil, just think about all those kicking matchups now. Pretty scary huh?:eek: :eek: :eek:

[Bullaholic]

Vanderjagt can kick better drunk than anybody the Cowboys have had in recent years. His mouth won't be a problem because it will be "covered up" by T.O's.

[NateDawg39]

Good by Dallas Cowboys, Hello Dallas Badboys!!--ya know..because of Owens and Vanderjagt joining together...:)

[cowboyfan8]

yet another ugrade for the Super Bowl champs '07.

[JasperDog94]

Originally posted by cowboyfan8
yet another ugrade for the Super Bowl champs '07. I hope you are right.

But first things first. We need to kick the crap out of the Texans this year.:evillaugh :evillaugh :evillaugh :evillaugh

[DaHop72]

Originally posted by Bullaholic
Vanderjagt can kick better drunk than anybody the Cowboys have had in recent years. His mouth won't be a problem because it will be "covered up" by T.O's. Man, Bull I don't know which is the lesser of two evils.:evil: :evil:

[Adidas410s]

These Cowboys...they are just going down the drain and "tarnishing the star!!!'' :rolleyes: Which btw...to hear a supposed "true Cowboys fan" say that is a load of b/s because ANY true Cowboys fan realizes that our team has ALWAYS had some key player that was mixed up in "less than desireable" extracurricular activities. The star has been tarnished since they put it down on the field. Heck even Landry put up with the antics and actions of his players because he knew they would still be there to compete on Sundays...and thus make him immortal!!! If the team wins...do you REALLY care about what the players do off the field as long as it's not effecting the win/loss column? I think NOT!!!

[Sweetwater Red]

Originally posted by Buccaneer
The Cowboys now have a kicker, that likes to get liquored up and run his mouth.

What's wrong with getting liquored-up ???

[Bullaholic]

Originally posted by Adidas410s
These Cowboys...they are just going down the drain and "tarnishing the star!!!'' :rolleyes: Which btw...to hear a supposed "true Cowboys fan" say that is a load of b/s because ANY true Cowboys fan realizes that our team has ALWAYS had some key player that was mixed up in "less than desireable" extracurricular activities. The star has been tarnished since they put it down on the field. Heck even Landry put up with the antics and actions of his players because he knew they would still be there to compete on Sundays...and thus make him immortal!!! If the team wins...do you REALLY care about what the players do off the field as long as it's not effecting the win/loss column? I think NOT!!!

Well, to avoid posting 5 pages or more, Adidas, just let me say that I am one of those "old" Cowboy fans who go back to 1960 and---Yea, I do care about what players do on an off the field.

[Z motion 10 out on 2]

Is this official yet? I didn't see anything on Dallascowboys.com????

[Maroon87]

This team needs a reality show...or a reality check!:p Vanderjagt is a good kicker...just don't put a microphone in front of him. If Peyton Manning is calling you out on national TV, you must be a jerk.

[Adidas410s]

Originally posted by Bullaholic
Well, to avoid posting 5 pages or more, Adidas, just let me say that I am one of those "old" Cowboy fans who go back to 1960 and---Yea, I do care about what players do on an off the field.

I'm not saying people don't care...but for people to say that NOW the franchise is being tarnished with the players that they are bringing in is ignorant because they have been doing this almost 40 years! I just find it funny that those who are griping now...you never heard much grumblind during the 90's when we were winning 3 Super Bowls!

[Macarthur]

Originally posted by Bullaholic
Well, to avoid posting 5 pages or more, Adidas, just let me say that I am one of those "old" Cowboy fans who go back to 1960 and---Yea, I do care about what players do on an off the field.

As for that tarnished star Adidas is referencing, how did you like Lance Rensel, Rafaiel Septien or Duane Thomas. At least 2 of those 3, I would categorize as worse human beings than TO, but the late sainted Tom & Tex would have never put up with that nonsense, would they?

[Gp83]

Originally posted by Z motion 10 out on 2
Is this official yet? I didn't see anything on Dallascowboys.com????

ESPN just reported that he visited the Cowboys yesterday. But I see it as a good match.:clap:

[Adidas410s]

Originally posted by Macarthur
As for that tarnished star Adidas is referencing, how did you like Lance Rensel, Rafaiel Septien or Duane Thomas. At least 2 of those 3, I would categorize as worse human beings than TO, but the late sainted Tom & Tex would have never put up with that nonsense, would they?

Do you not remember many Cowboys players of the 70's and 80's during the years of Tom & Tex?? They sure put up with it alright...

[Macarthur]

Originally posted by Adidas410s
Do you not remember many Cowboys players of the 70's and 80's during the years of Tom & Tex?? They sure put up with it alright...

Yes, Adidas. That was the point of my post. It was directed to many of the folks I have heard like bullaholic that have "old timers syndrome" when it comes to the Cowboys. For someone to say Tom or Tex wouldn't have put up with that kind of nonsense is comical. They would and did, as long as the guy had talent. It was as true then as it is now.

[Bullaholic]

Originally posted by Macarthur
As for that tarnished star Adidas is referencing, how did you like Lance Rensel, Rafaiel Septien or Duane Thomas. At least 2 of those 3, I would categorize as worse human beings than TO, but the late sainted Tom & Tex would have never put up with that nonsense, would they?

Mac, the Cowboys have had some "problem" players in their past just like every other NFL franchise, but I don't think any rise to the level of potential problems that TO represents. We have the "schism" on the TO issue between old time Cowboy fan opinion and ideas vs new Cowboy opinion and ideas which has gone on for years.

[Macarthur]

Originally posted by Bullaholic
Mac, the Cowboys have had some "problem" players in their past just like every other NFL franchise, but I don't think any rise to the level of potential problems that TO represents. We have the "schism" on the TO issue between old time Cowboy fan opinion and ideas vs new Cowboy opinion and ideas which has gone on for years.

It depends on what you are talking about. If you are talking about them as a person, TO is, I would argue, a far better person than say Rafeiel Septein, Michael Irvin, Tuinei, E. Williams.

If you are talking about as a teammate, you may have a point that we have not seen the likes of TO. But for someone to say that the old Cowboys would not put up with problems if they had talent, is just flat out wrong. You are using selective memory.

Let's not forget, TO, by all accounts, is a good "citizen" in the community. He is a family man. His only issues have been with his teammates. I'm not trying to minimize those, but it's not like were dealing with a drug dealer or murder here. Which, by the way, Leonard Little murdered someone while driving drunk and never missed a game.

[Bullaholic]

Originally posted by Macarthur
It depends on what you are talking about. If you are talking about them as a person, TO is, I would argue, a far better person than say Rafeiel Septein, Michael Irvin, Tuinei, E. Williams.

If you are talking about as a teammate, you may have a point that we have not seen the likes of TO. But for someone to say that the old Cowboys would not put up with problems if they had talent, is just flat out wrong. You are using selective memory.

Let's not forget, TO, by all accounts, is a good "citizen" in the community. He is a family man. His only issues have been with his teammates. I'm not trying to minimize those, but it's not like were dealing with a drug dealer or murder here. Which, by the way, Leonard Little murdered someone while driving drunk and never missed a game.

Well, mac, I may have "old timer's syndrome and "selective" memory but I will tell you that Tom Landry either cut or traded, sooner or later any player he felt was a "problem" to the Cowboys and was backed by Cowboys management in his actions. Every player and member of the Cowboy's organization knew that to be Tom Landry's policy and he "walked his talk" in its application. To contradict that contradicts Cowboy's history.

[Bearkat]

All this talk about TO and Vanderjagt is pointless. If you haven't jumped on the band wagon yet, you better hurry. For those of you that are REAL fans, enjoy the ride with me. Watch out Super Bowl, the COWBOYS are closing in!!!

[football4life]

Sweet! This is awesome!:clap:

[Gp83]

Originally posted by Bearkat
All this talk about TO and Vanderjagt is pointless. If you haven't jumped on the band wagon yet, you better hurry. For those of you that are REAL fans, enjoy the ride with me. Watch out Super Bowl, the COWBOYS are closing in!!!

I'm right on there with ya. I'll never jump off this ride:D

[spiveyrat]

Originally posted by Sweetwater Red
What's wrong with getting liquored-up ???

Nothing, as long as it's not in a bar! :D

[Adidas410s]

Originally posted by Macarthur
Yes, Adidas. That was the point of my post. It was directed to many of the folks I have heard like bullaholic that have "old timers syndrome" when it comes to the Cowboys. For someone to say Tom or Tex wouldn't have put up with that kind of nonsense is comical. They would and did, as long as the guy had talent. It was as true then as it is now.

Gotcha...the wording of the post kinda threw me off though as it sounded like you were saying "all hail Tom and Tex"

[big daddy russ]

This goes back to all the talk about character in the NFL: the players haven't changed, just the attention they get. Ty Cobb was one of the worst human beings to ever walk the planet. Babe Ruth drank like a fish, you-know-what like a rabbit (behind his wives' backs), and swore like a sailor. Hell, in 1931 Ruth made a pass on his best friend's wife. Lou Gehrig never forgave him for that. Bobby Layne is right there with Ty Cobb. Bill Russell, as we now know, was a man-whore and an alcoholic, and there are tons of other stories that we'll never hear.

Why didn't we hear these stories when they were going on?

Because the press didn't cover them back then. There were teammates fighting in the Cowboys, Packers, and every other locker room in the league during any given decade. Bart Starr and Forrest Gregg wound up hating each other. That didn't seem to keep them from winning a few championships and Gregg from doing his job protecting Starr.

It just never got as much press as the whole T.O. deal. Nothing has. He's not my favorite person, but there are bigger, worse targets out there that noone seems to care about. Ray Lewis (even if he wasn't convicted), Jason Williams, etc. etc. And believe it or not, there are and were bigger egos out there.

Joe DiMaggio was a bigger primadonna than T.O. but was revered nonetheless. He's the guy who, when negotiating his contract as a rookie, was told that Lou Gehrig didn't make anywhere near what he was asking. His response?

"Well Lou is severly underpaid," among other things.

These stories just didn't spill out to us until the journalists and people/players involved started authoring books about their experiences.

[WOSgrad]

It appears to be a done deal:

http://lb.dallascowboys.com/news.cfm?id=2865E85A-F275-3BDF-3F546CC1C0FF2A3C

[Macarthur]

Originally posted by Bullaholic
Well, mac, I may have "old timer's syndrome and "selective" memory but I will tell you that Tom Landry either cut or traded, sooner or later any player he felt was a "problem" to the Cowboys and was backed by Cowboys management in his actions. Every player and member of the Cowboy's organization knew that to be Tom Landry's policy and he "walked his talk" in its application. To contradict that contradicts Cowboy's history.

So you admit you are using selective memory?

My point is that Tom did put up with it. If you are denying that, then you're just flat out ignoring the facts. Tom did not get rid of those players as soon as they had problems, as you suggest. He may have gotten rid of them once their usefulness could not outweight the baggage they brought. You are simply in denial. You're letting your admiration of Tom Landry cloud the facts.

Back in Tom's days, the teams actually had more leverage to make players act better. The organizations now have a much more difficult time controlling players due primarily to the union.

[Bullaholic]

Originally posted by Macarthur
So you admit you are using selective memory?

My point is that Tom did put up with it. If you are denying that, then you're just flat out ignoring the facts. Tom did not get rid of those players as soon as they had problems, as you suggest. He may have gotten rid of them once their usefulness could not outweight the baggage they brought. You are simply in denial. You're letting your admiration of Tom Landry cloud the facts.

Back in Tom's days, the teams actually had more leverage to make players act better. The organizations now have a much more difficult time controlling players due primarily to the union.

No mac--I admit that I am an old time Cowboy fan who believes very strongly in the principles and life example set forth by Tom Landry and I don't think any amount of dicussion is going to change that or our indivdual versions of the facts. I do agrre with you, however, about team mangement being the "dog" instead of the "tail" with regard to players back in the Tom Landry era. Wish it was that way now.

[WOSgrad]

For those that think that Coach Landry (who I adore) never put up with "characters," I have three words for you:

Thomas "Hollywood" Henderson

[Macarthur]

Originally posted by Bullaholic
No mac--I admit that I am an old time Cowboy fan who believes very strongly in the principles and life example set forth by Tom Landry and I don't think any amount of dicussion is going to change that or our indivdual versions of the facts. I do agrre with you, however, about team mangement being the "dog" instead of the "tail" with regard to players back in the Tom Landry era. Wish it was that way now.

Hey, I admire Landry as much as anyone. I think he was a great man. All I'm saying is that TO is probably not the worst guy to ever come through this organization, and probably not by a long shot.

[STANG RED]

Just scratch off the stars and put a raiders emblem with a #2 behind it. Because thats what ya got now boys, win or not.

[Bullaholic]

Originally posted by Macarthur
Hey, I admire Landry as much as anyone. I think he was a great man. All I'm saying is that TO is probably not the worst guy to ever come through this organization, and probably not by a long shot.

Well, I guess we'll just have to pull this thread up at the end of next season and see---personally, for the Cowboy's sake, I hope you can still say that, Mac.

[NateDawg39]

All will be fine at the end of the season...well for T.O's sake anyways. I have faith in the Cowboys to get it on track and I expect good things from them the next 5 or 6 years.

[JasperDog94]

When TO left the 49er's they were in shambles. When TO left the Eagles, they went from 4 straight NFC championship games to shambles. Not a good track record for TO.

[Adidas410s]

Originally posted by JasperDog94
When TO left the 49er's they were in shambles. When TO left the Eagles, they went from 4 straight NFC championship games to shambles. Not a good track record for TO.

The 49ers have traded/released ALL of their key players in the past 3 years.

TO...gone!
Garcia...gone!
Peterson...gone!
Streets...gone!
Lloyd...gone!

There are others but those are the ones that come to mind. The Eagles on the other hand were totally blown up by injuries. The majority of their key players were on IR by the end of the season. We may find the Eagles to be VERY good again this season if they stay healthy. The same thing happened to the Carolina Panthers 2 years ago. The year after going to the Super Bowl they have over 10 guys on IR by seasons end and couldn't even field a competitive team.

[Macarthur]

Originally posted by JasperDog94
When TO left the 49er's they were in shambles. When TO left the Eagles, they went from 4 straight NFC championship games to shambles. Not a good track record for TO.

The 49ers were old and in decline when he left. The Eagles were derailed by injuries, especially McNabb. When McNabb got hurt they were still on pace to win the division. I suspect they will be back in the hunt this year. I fail to see how that leaves them in shambles.

I don't argue that he's a knucklehead and can be a major distraction. I just don't think he has destroyed two fanchises like many want to assert.

I also expect Bill Parcells to be able to handle this situation. He is paid $5million per year, you know.

[JasperDog94]

We shall see. Where there's smoke...

[Buccaneer]

TO wants the ball, he wants to win and he wants to be paid. He was a great teammate in 2004 and took a chance to come back and play in the Superbowl. In 2005 the Eagles would not renegotiate his contract he was not getting paid what HE thought he was worth, thus the trouble.

He has now been paid!

[Buccaneer]

Breaking from their recent history of employing young placement specialists who worked for minimum wages, the Dallas Cowboys on Thursday signed unrestricted free agent kicker Mike Vanderjagt, a colorful eight-year veteran who is the NFL's career leader in field goal percentage.

Worst FG PCT in fourth-quarter/OT
Last two seasons
Team FG-FGA Pct.
Redskins 7-12 .583
Bears 8-13 .615
Cowboys 7-11 .636
Chiefs 7-11 .636
Vanderjagt made 13-16 FG in 4th qtr/OT

League sources confirmed for ESPN.com that Vanderjagt, who arrived in Dallas on Wednesday to visit with Cowboys coaches and team officials, signed a three-year contract. Financial details were not yet available, but it is believed the contract averages about $2 million annually.

Adding a kicker of Vanderjagt's profile and price range is out of character for the Cowboys. Under owner Jerry Jones, the team's preference has been to develop its own kickers, often undrafted college free agents, and to invest very little in the position. But the Cowboys went through three kickers in 2005, converted only 21 of 27 field goal tries, and suffered all season at the position.

Dallas lost three games in 2005 by three points or fewer, and that may have swayed the team's thinking in pursuing a more proven and dependable placement specialist.


Mike Vanderjagt was ranked No. 13 in Len Pasquarelli's top 50 free agents.


In Vanderjagt, the Cowboys are getting a kicker whose last effort, a missed 46-yard field goal attempt in the Indianapolis Colts' divisional-round loss to the Pittsburgh Steelers, is not indicative of his career in the league. The veteran kicker, who began his professional career in the CFL after playing at West Virginia University, has never scored fewer than 104 points and has averaged 124.3 points.

Vanderjagt, who turns 36 next week, has converted 217 of 248 field goals, and that 87.5 percent success rate is the best in league history. He has also made 344 of 346 extra point tries.

The only shortcoming in Vanderjagt's game are his kickoffs, on which he has averaged 60.2 yards. The Colts employed a separate kickoff specialist to handle those chores the past two seasons. Vanderjagt has insisted he can kick off, however, and it remains to be seen how the Cowboys deal with that element.