Bad news Phil....

[Bandera YaYa]

...just heard that the women's soccer league is no more...they went belly up, according to Tom Brokaw. It said that there just wasn't a big enough audience for it on TV and it wasn't surviving. That's really sad. And they were supposed to go Washington for a big tournament this weekend and now they aren't. It's not fair to the millions of little girls that play in small towns like ours and large cities, that may really love the sport and what if they want to play professionally some day? Some of the posters on here will love this....hope they don't have daughters or granddaughters or nieces that love to play soccer because they won't be able to participate in a sport they love, BUT son and grandsons and nephews will be able to play the sports they love to play....girls always get the raw deal! :mad:
You know, girls support guys in their sports, always.....why isn't it the other way around, too??

<small>[ September 16, 2003, 06:20 PM: Message edited by: Bandera YaYa ]</small>

[Chief Woodman]

It is just as much womens fault as anything. Not trying to be mean, but if enough women went to these and every game every time in every city was a sellout crowd, things would change. Not one single man would have to attend, just women. MONEY TALKS. Please understand...I am not trying to be mean or rude...but the girls can change it if it is important enough to them.

[crzyjournalist03]

The WNBA has been around for a while and seems to be doing OK...womens' sports can survive...basketball, tennis, even ice hockey in the olympics

Don't be surprised if MLS folds soon too...it's just soccer, not women.

[Bandera YaYa]

Good point Chief. Women need to stop attending men's sports and spend that time watching women's sports!! Good idea!! :p

[Phil C]

Terrible news! What scares me is if the WNBA could be next. I hope the soccer league can find a sponser so it can continue. Also we need a women's pro softball league. Come on everyone! Let's support women's soccer and volleyball and softball!

[crzyjournalist03]

If there were a professional women's softball league that was publicized like the WNBA is, then I think it would have a chance to succeed. Softball players are extremely athletic, and they face pitches that are the equivalence of 120mph fastballs in big league games.

[Bandera YaYa]

I wish Bill Gates would adopt them!!! Anyone know him??? :D

[sinton66]

heh heh, if they aren't green , he wouldn't know they exist! wink

[slpybear the bullfan]

No Phil.. it is just soccer that is the problem, not because it is Women's soccer. Of course, what do you expect? The USSR and the Communist WARSAW pact folded years ago. It is just taking it a while to catch up with its marquee sport. wink

Well, If anyone looks at the ratings the WNBA gets then they will realize that they are next on the block.

I am all in favor of the women sports. Heck, I was that way before I had a daughter of my own. I have listened to a lot of commentary on this on talk radio. You would be suprised at some of the stats.

Here are some links for ya'll to check out... the first is a really good article to start with...

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2003/06/18/national/main559287.shtml

http://www.onlineathens.com/stories/061503/spo_20030615064.shtml

http://www.bet.com/articles/0,,c1gb7441-8260,00.html

This one was written by a woman?

http://www.dadi.org/ds_wnba2.htm

[Phil C]

I agree YaYA it would be nice for Bill Gates to donate money to keep the Women's Pro Soccer League going and also to start up a Women's Pro Sofball League too. Also the WNBA needs help too. But one of the issues is that the women's pro sports does not attract enough 30 and over men. Come on guys. Let's get with it. We must not neglect our responsibility! Let's go support those events! Our attendance and ticket purchases are very important. It is time for the Boomers and Generation X to support our women. Next year encourage friends that live near these events to attend and write the television stations to show these women's events on tv and live and not just replay. Let's do it guys. And for some of us that live a long distance let's make a sacrifice to attend attend at least one of the events next year. Maybe Sinton 66 and some of us can go watch San Antonio WNBA Starz play next year and then go to see a women's pro soccer match in Atlanta or somewhere if they get a sponsor. Come on Guys! Let's get with it!!!

[trojandad]

Phil, years ago when me and my child bride were in Italy, there was a ladies pro basketball game and we went. It was horrible quality. I asked a friend with me why he liked coming to these games with such lacking quality and he said "who cares how good they play, they're women". They fill seats for women's basketball there but it isn't a negative in these countries to appreciate pro athletes for their form as much or more than for any skill (in other words, Bandera Ya Ya would have a cow if living over there &lt;smirk&gt;). He also told me later that he believed women's sports never worked in America because America was much more concerned with winning and losing more than countries like Italy and France where women's sports flourish.

Most guys won't sound critical in this area because they don't want to have the "sexist" or "womanizer" label. But the answer is in looking at men's sports. High school doesn't draw what college does, and college doesn't draw what the pros draw. But the high school groups don't create the overhead that the pros do, so they don't have to say "come on, attend our games just because". The WUSA didn't fold because they lost money, they folded because they weren't making the kind of return they wanted, BIG difference.

Once women's pro sports get to the point that they are more like high school athletes and are just thankful for who attend, they will continue to fail, in my opinion, while blaming it on non attendance. If our culture minimizes the guys for going to see bouncing Bettys and continues to ask us to close our eyes to lesser talent like the Emporer's New Clothes, eventually a little kid will always show up to remind us the Emporer (or Emporess) is butt naked. Just my take. Bracing myself for the Ya Ya sexist label. LOL

By the way, in fairness, I don't think either of those Italian teams had a sports bra on any player. Ask me if I wanted to go back. &lt;smirk&gt; Of course, I almost got thrown in jail for knockin an Italian dude's lights out for pinchin my wife's caboose. So it goes both ways over there.

[Phil C]

The thing is that the women's soccer and wnba and possible softball league need our support and their quality of play is excellent. You can tell that by the olymphic resutls they have had and women's volleyball isn't bad either and they should have a pro league for them too and probably wouldn't have to build expensive gyms. So let's get with it guys. I am not trying to replace football or any other men's sports guys but let's support the women too. For example Sinton 66 should have his enthusiasm for women's soccer at 85% of the interest he has for high school football. That would be enough. If enough guys do that the attendance and tv viewing will take care of it. I want to have pro women's soccer, basketball, softball and volleyball to be a success. Let's get with it guys. We can do it!

[Phil C]

I also do this on a small scale for the girls sports in Sinton. I attend baseball and basketball and football for the guys but I also attend the girl's volleyball, basketball and softball games as much as possible and if we had a girls' soccer team I would go there too.

[Bandera YaYa]

Phil, you rock! :)
I don't know about you, Trojandad....child bride?????? eek!

[trojandad]

"should" and "ought to" just isn't gonna get it here in the US tho, buddy. When people go to sporting events, they aren't comparing to other females, they're comparing to the entire sports menu provided, which includes male sports, such as THE GREATEST BASKETBALL TEAM EVER......sorry, got possessed there for a minute.

How was it said, in NON COMMUNIST countries (lol), we go because we want to, not because we oughta. Let's use the examples of countries where women sports work and take their lead, IF we want these sports, that is.

[trojandad]

Oh ye of little literary skills......

Is a loving description from a very famous 18th century author of the only love of his life......

[Phil C]

That is my point Trojan. It isn't just the oughta and musta which are very important. But the over 30 men have to develope the want too. That is why you must develope your passion for women's sport at 85% of your passion for hs football. It is a mental state and it must be worked on. You must develope the enthusiasm and desire and passion for women's sport until you get it! Don't give up or get discouraged! A good start is to go to all of your hs girls volleyball, basketball, and softball that you can! Be enthusiastic in your support. You must take the time and make yourself want to go! You can do it! Do it now! Oh and take the time and watch the girls play soccer too and if there is no women's soccer team there should be one located at a college near you. Work on your mentality and it will come! Develope the attitude I want to attend and support and watch women's sports! You can do it! We are all Americans and we have the old CAN DO spirit!! Let's go!!

[trojandad]

Phil, you went from "shoulda" and "ought to" to "have to" (I'm just quoting, my friend"). I'm not against women's athletics, I raise money like crazy each year for them locally, we bought our softball team a pitching machine last year and didn't buy the boys a baseball machine even tho both needed it, I'm for getting people, men, women or otherwise, in the seats.

But Phil, ask any man over 30, ask their wives, their girlfriends, their mothers, anyone, they'll all tell you, men over 30 don't HAVE TO do anything. We're gonna get more of them in the stands when they WANT to. Feed their want and they'll come. "Build it and they'll come" only works in movies.

[Phil C]

That is right Trojan! You have to make yourself want too. That is what I mean by getting in the right mental state. You must work on wanting too and develope the enthusiam and desire! Let's get with it guys and get the old want too to support, attend and watch women's sports! Do it today!!

[slpybear the bullfan]

Phil, I really enjoy your posts...

BUT...

I already have things that I like and enjoy doing. I reaaaallllyyyy can make my opinions up all on my own.

If I don't like soccer or WNBA (or the NBA for that matter) or coconut or modern art... then I don't think I need to WORK to EVOLVE my opinions.

Here's the deal... if the WNBA is really that good then I am sure lot's of fans will start coming and they won't be in trouble. The sport has to be good enough for people to want to come... not to have people need to "develop" an appreciation for it...

Example: My daughter plays soccer. I really dislike the sport. But I am the biggest homer for her team when it plays. I will go to her games... but I dare say that will be the only soccer game I make anytime soon.

[PhiI C]

Sly please try though :)

[slpybear the bullfan]

Sorry Phil, I am big boy now. wink

[crzyjournalist03]

slpybear the bullfan:
Phil, I really enjoy your posts...

BUT...

I already have things that I like and enjoy doing. I reaaaallllyyyy can make my opinions up all on my own.

If I don't like soccer or WNBA (or the NBA for that matter) or coconut or modern art... then I don't think I need to WORK to EVOLVE my opinions.

Here's the deal... if the WNBA is really that good then I am sure lot's of fans will start coming and they won't be in trouble. The sport has to be good enough for people to want to come... not to have people need to "develop" an appreciation for it...

Example: My daughter plays soccer. I really dislike the sport. But I am the biggest homer for her team when it plays. I will go to her games... but I dare say that will be the only soccer game I make anytime soon.How in the world could you even suggest that people don't like coconut? GREATEST FRUIT WE EVER HAD!!! wink :D :p

[Birdman]

No offense but I have plenty of "entertainment" options on my plate already. I attend tons of high school events, both boys and girls, because I enjoy watching young people compete. When it comes to paying to watch professionals of any sport, I am very particular as my budget does not allow me to "support" them all. I make about one NFL game every two years. Too expensive. I attend about 6 Astro games a year (thanks to some occasional freebies!) We live in a capitalistic society. Put a product on the field/court and let us decide if it is worth our money to support it. Personally I loath watching soccer and NBA basketball. I will not support either with my cash. If enough others do, more power to them. I love minor league baseball and would love to see another team in my area. Problem is that our area did not support them when they were here, so they went elsewhere. I feel no moral obligation to support any professional whether they be athlete or other type entertainer. Supply and demand. If they aren't buying, the product is going to disappear.

[slpybear the bullfan]

Birdman:
Personally I loath watching soccer and NBA basketball. YES!!! Thank you Birdman... finally someone that understands me...

[slpybear the bullfan]

crzyjournalist03:

slpybear the bullfan:
Phil, I really enjoy your posts...

BUT...

I already have things that I like and enjoy doing. I reaaaallllyyyy can make my opinions up all on my own.

If I don't like soccer or WNBA (or the NBA for that matter) or coconut or modern art... then I don't think I need to WORK to EVOLVE my opinions.

Here's the deal... if the WNBA is really that good then I am sure lot's of fans will start coming and they won't be in trouble. The sport has to be good enough for people to want to come... not to have people need to "develop" an appreciation for it...

Example: My daughter plays soccer. I really dislike the sport. But I am the biggest homer for her team when it plays. I will go to her games... but I dare say that will be the only soccer game I make anytime soon.How in the world could you even suggest that people don't like coconut? GREATEST FRUIT WE EVER HAD!!! wink :D :p Well, I love the taste but hate the texture...

I know... Strange... I am the same way about apples..

[trojandad]

Birdman and Slpybear, you said it more direct than I did. For years I heard how much more supportive that European men were than American men on supporting women pro sports. But after I saw that game, I saw. The guys in the audience were cat calling the whole game, sounded like a NYC construction worker convention. And the girls all had no under support and a couple actually changed out of sweaty jerseys on the sidelines and temporarily flashed the guys in the stands. I finally understood that most guys there paid their money for a temporary peep show.

This would offend the YaYa's of the world, as I'm sure it would the dads among us with daughters playing in such leagues. So the choice is simple, use sex to attract an undesirable but paying crowd or change rules to draw more people with superior competition. Choice is very simple. Grown people won't be shamed into coming to any sport, be it men, women, soccer, martians, anyone.

[sinton66]

Heh heh, even if they flash their goodies, I'm still not going! wink