The Coursening of our Society and Sports

[vet93]

After watching the incident in Detroit, the fight between South Carolina and Clemson and hearing about at least two fights breaking out this past week in the Texas High School playoffs I have real concerns about the future of athletics and the direction we seem to be taking. Trash talking, poor sportsmanship, thug mentality and elevation of personal success/gratification over team success has seemed to permeate our playing fields at all levels. Whenever this subject is discussed it seems that there is always people who will say that this type of behavior is part of the game and makes the game more interesting. I disagree, I don't believe that course/vulgar behavior needs to be part of our sports in order to make them entertaining. I think that you can violently execute your game plan in any sport and still remain a good sport. If you need to hype yourself up by talking trash or being a poor sport in order to play well, then you are showing nothing more than a lack of discipline. I am perfectly aware that tempers can flare in the heat of battle, but their is a difference between that and trying to humiliate an opponent by talking trash etc...I also believe that this is a societal problem not just a sports problem. I feel like the fans are also adopting a thug mentality by throwing batteries, pouring beer and screaming obscentities in the faces of athletes. This behavior is just as unacceptable and needs to be dealt with harshly. The only thing that I believe that will stop this stuff is if people at the grass roots level put their foot down and say enough is enough. We must begin to teach our young people what class and character truly are. We need to honor our athletes for showing class and character as well as showing athletic skill. We need to realize that we all have a stake in the direction that our society/sports are headed and that we must take a stand against anti-social thug behavior. If this trend continues, I worry what type of environment my youngest son (now 2 weeks old) will have to play in. What are your thoughts?

[shellman54]

Truthfully, I feel that if Artest is suspended for the rest of the season, then Detroit should play in front of an empty stadium for the rest of the season. Will they do this? Of course not, because they would be losing their precious revenues. Were there any arrests made and held up? Doubtful. It looked more like a Kid Rock concert than a basketball game, although you wouldn't know it, there are as many low dressed women at one as there is at the other. Which brings me to my next point. How the NFL and everyone else can be so hypocritical, blaming ABC and Terrell Owens for bringing sex into their homes when a woman shows her BACK, but cameramen during the game show bouncing breasts and crotch shots left and right.

[PPHSfan]

I blame the parents.

[big daddy russ]

Amen, VWG. Someone on here (I think it's JasperDog94) has an awesome quote by Darrell Royal on his signature. "When you get to the endzone act like you've been there before."

[TheDOCTORdre]

I got to say vet you hit the nail right on the head, the atmosphere in today in sports and society is taking a turn to the worst. Violence and poor sportsmanship is on the rise. Trash talking can make the game fun as long as it is in a good clean matter that disrespects neither party involved, and encourages healthy competition, but what we see nowadays is trash talking that is meant to harm another person and to verbally attack them, and is scarcely ever in the spirit of sportsmanship. Its amazing to think that such things that were considered as questionable behavior even 5 years ago is now considered appropriate and as we keep pushing the envelope to see how much we can get away with it will only get worst.

[vet93]

Good point....unfortunately many of these athletes are raised more by their peer groups than by their parents.


Originally posted by PPHSfan
I blame the parents.

[TheDOCTORdre]

Originally posted by big daddy russ
Amen, VWG. Someone on here (I think it's JasperDog94) has an awesome quote by Darrell Royal on his signature. "When you get to the endzone act like you've been there before."
That quote is so true but I always get a chuckle out of it, because the thought always used to run through my mind "Dre you never have been in the endzone before"

[KTJ]

Originally posted by vet93
Good point....unfortunately many of these athletes are raised more by their peer groups than by their parents.


Hence, the blame on the parents.

Fortunately, I haven't had any bad encounters when I referee basketball--yet. But when I do.....grrrrr!!!

[handNthedirt]

It's competition, its violent, always has been, always will be.....it's society that has changed. I don't condone the fighting amongst the athletes, but look at what time of year it is: playoffs in HS, and rival week in NCAA, when everything you've worked so hard for all year is on the line, tempers flare and all rational thought goes out the window. HS Playoffs, win or go home. Rival week, win and earn bragging rights for a year, or lose and look forward to a humiliating year full of hearing the opposition's diarrhea of the mouth. If you haven't been in a game type situation like that, you have no idea what you're talking about. Go buy another mini-van and don't allow your kid(s) to play any other sports other than soccer. As far as the crowd getting involved, for one, it's idiots that can't handle their alcohol that are jeopordizing the future sale of alcohol at those events, and two, they need to strengthen security, as well as stiffening the penalty for acting uncivilized at a public event.

[vet93]

I have played in my fair share of playoff games and against rivals that liked to make comments about my ancestory and I never took a swing at any of those guys and acted like a complete idiot. Most of the time we would let the scoreboard do the talking for us. I believe that your mentatiliy is part of the problem....it is not about strengthening security...it is about strengthening character in our society. Increasing security only puts bars around the fans and players it doesn't address the root problem.


Originally posted by handNthedirt
It's competition, its violent, always has been, always will be.....it's society that has changed. I don't condone the fighting amongst the athletes, but look at what time of year it is: playoffs in HS, and rival week in NCAA, when everything you've worked so hard for all year is on the line, tempers flare and all rational thought goes out the window. HS Playoffs, win or go home. Rival week, win and earn bragging rights for a year, or lose and look forward to a humiliating year full of hearing the opposition's diarrhea of the mouth. If you haven't been in a game type situation like that, you have no idea what you're talking about. Go buy another mini-van and don't allow your kid(s) to play any other sports other than soccer. As far as the crowd getting involved, for one, it's idiots that can't handle their alcohol that are jeopordizing the future sale of alcohol at those events, and two, they need to strengthen security, as well as stiffening the penalty for acting uncivilized at a public event.

[99IHSMustang]

I as well have seen an increase in violent acts at games and not just at the professional level or college level. It doesn't even surprise me anymore when you hear about parents getting in a fight at a pewee football game or baseball game. The fact that it probably doesn't surprise most people is what scares me. How can parents set a good example for there children when they can't control their anger? I fear that as this type of behavior is accepted throughout sports, going to any type of game will no longer be entertaining. Especially if the guy or woman next to you could possibly be the one that could cause an altercation such as the latest basketball incident. When will it stop? Not until we have more harsh punishment for those including the athletes whom may cause incidents like this to occur. The direction in which our society is taking a turn is for the worse. I can't imaging how difficult it must be for those parents who have children and try to raise them without letting outside influences affect their young minds.

[Rabbit'93]

Vet I agree with what your saying (grass roots). The only problem is in youth sports these days, you have parents who are more into the game than the kid. You have parents fighting each other, fighting w/ umps-officials, and in one case a parent argued with an 8 yr old. Parents don't understand sportsmanship so they pass that on to their children. Coaching my sons in youth sports I've seen incidents w/ over-zealous parents. This just opens another can of worms.

[JasperDog94]

Originally posted by TheDOCTORdre
Trash talking can make the game fun as long as it is in a good clean matter that disrespects neither party involved, and encourages healthy competition... Can you please give me an expamle of "trash talking" that "encourages healthy competition" and is "good" and "clean"?

[Bullaholic]

Oh my, Vet93......your post brings to mind so many comments that I have made on this subject for a lot of years---so I will try not to be too "verbose". First, we must "Walk our Talk" 100% of the time as parents and guardians. Young people are very analytical of those that they look up to, and lose trust immediately if they see any sign of hypocrisy in a role model or parent. It is this leadership by example that will insure that our young men and women imprint on the proper value set for selection of role models with the proper set of values and code of behavior, and it will act as an internal compass to tell them how to conduct themselves and lives in any situation. If enough parents will maintain high standards of personal conduct, and accept the responsibilty and great challenge to see that these high standards are related to our kids with love and understanding, then the problem of improper behavior and attitudes should decline in our society.

[vet93]

Bullaholic...I agree 100%....Right now anyway....I have noticed that too many parents are too lazy in teaching and training their kids. It takes a trememdous amount of effort to model good behavior and discipline poor behavior....it is much easier to let the "culture" raise their children. If parents worried less about self-esteem and more about self-discipline we would be in much better shape.


Originally posted by Bullaholic
Oh my, Vet93......your post brings to mind so many comments that I have made on this subject for a lot of years---so I will try not to be too "verbose". First, we must "Walk our Talk" 100% of the time as parents and guardians. Young people are very analytical of those that they look up to, and lose trust immediately if they see any sign of hypocrisy in a role model or parent. It is this leadership by example that will insure that our young men and women imprint on the proper value set for selection of role models with the proper set of values and code of behavior, and it will act as an internal compass to tell them how to conduct themselves and lives in any situation. If enough parents will maintain high standards of personal conduct, and accept the responsibilty and great challenge to see that these high standards are related to our kids with love and understanding, then the problem of improper behavior and attitudes should decline in our society.

[TheDOCTORdre]

Originally posted by JasperDog94
Can you please give me an expamle of "trash talking" that "encourages healthy competition" and is "good" and "clean"?
Ever lined up against anybody and they were like give it your best shot theres no way you're gonna get past me or theres no way you can hang with me

[PPHSfan]

Originally posted by TheDOCTORdre
Ever lined up against anybody and they were like give it your best shot theres no way you're gonna get past me or theres no way you can hang with me

The best players, knock you down, help you up, and knock you down again.

They never say anything about the other players ability, or their momma.

[Bullaholic]

Originally posted by PPHSfan
The best players, knock you down, help you up, and knock you down again.

They never say anything about the other players ability, or their momma.

Kinda reminds me of PPHSfan, when he replies to my posts.....:D