Carthage

[oldtownag]

Stormy! :2thumbsup

[Dawgs]

F7 Tornado!

[Aesculus gilmus]

F7 Tornado!

That wind smells like dog breath!

Excuse me, Dawg breath.

[Dawgs]

That wind smells like dog breath!

Excuse me, Dawg breath.

Lol!!

If you ask any Carthage fans the UIL should hand over the trophy now. I'm not sure what the heck to think. To this point in the season this is the most dominant Carthage team ever. Pretty much everybody that sees them in person thinks this is the best team ever. Let's see what happens.

[lostaussie]

I didn't think that. And you guys are certainly very good. But Argyle, La Vega and a couple others are going to have something to say about a ring. Good luck to ya. DI is going to be fun around the 4th 5th and 6th rounds.

[Dawgs]

I didn't think that. And you guys are certainly very good. But Argyle, La Vega and a couple others are going to have something to say about a ring. Good luck to ya. DI is going to be fun around the 4th 5th and 6th rounds.

I should have been more clear. I actually should have said district opponents. Kilgore and Henderson where very surprised how good Carthage was. But since you say that, what Carthage team have you seen that was better? For sure that was the worst beating Carthage ever gave Gilmer. It has to have been atleast 15 years since Gilmer was dominated like that in a half of football. You are right. La Vega and Argyle will certainly have something to say about the championship. Those are 2 games I wanna see.

[lostaussie]

First of all you dominated as "your words not mine" for basically a quarter maybe a little over. We had the lead when quarter 4 started albeit not for long. Then the wheels ran off. Although the score may not have been as bad last year, that game was never really in doubt. This year it was for the better part of the game. Now, with that said, I know how we have played, and we have some obvious holes, but the night we played I didn't see anything about Carthage that OVERLY impressed me. Just a good solid Carthage team that you basically field year in and year out. Now.to be fair, I have only seen one game. Don't take me wrong, you guys are good and I'm pulling for you. Good coaches, good kids and great tradition. What's not to like. All I'm saying is that it's not going to be as easy as some would like to believe.

[Aggie98]

They're not bad, lol.

Gilmer led them 28-13 at the half and Carthage scored 35 unanswered. Kilgore led them 20-15 in the 2nd quarter and guess what.... Carthage scored 35 unanswered. It's easy to say "the wheels came off" for Gilmer and Kilgore, but Carthage was standing there holding the lug wrench.

[slingshot]

Carthage is the obvious favorite in D1 this year. They are the defending champs (darn it... ), they are incredibly well coached, they have the 'right mix' of athletes, they have Ingram. That being said... a bigger, faster, stronger team like LaVega could give them serious trouble as could a technically near-perfect executing team like Argyle. Guarantee neither of those squads is intimidated in the least by Carthage.

[Dawgs]

First of all you dominated as "your words not mine" for basically a quarter maybe a little over. We had the lead when quarter 4 started albeit not for long. Then the wheels ran off. Although the score may not have been as bad last year, that game was never really in doubt. This year it was for the better part of the game. Now, with that said, I know how we have played, and we have some obvious holes, but the night we played I didn't see anything about Carthage that OVERLY impressed me. Just a good solid Carthage team that you basically field year in and year out. Now.to be fair, I have only seen one game. Don't take me wrong, you guys are good and I'm pulling for you. Good coaches, good kids and great tradition. What's not to like. All I'm saying is that it's not going to be as easy as some would like to believe.
That's fair. We can agree to disagree. Took Carthage a little while to get going at Jeff Traylor. But holding the Buckeyes scoreless in the 2nd half, with minus 1 rushing yard and 50 total yards of offense is what I consider dominant. Forcing 4 turnovers and scoring 2 defensive TDs is dominant. Allowing only 83 yards rushing on 28 carries is not too shabby. And outscoring the Buckeyes at any point in any game 35-0 is unheard of. If you weren't overly impressed, I can understand. To be honest Carthage's season has really took off since that 2nd half against Gilmer. Beating Kilgore by 30 and Henderson by 25 is a little more than what the average Carthage teams have done in the past. Just my opinion but this is far more than a "good solid Carthage team". They have never been this dominant this early. Closest season we have had like this is 2013. If they progress at the same rate as past seasons I find it hard to see ANY team staying within 2 scores. That includes Argyle and LV.

I know most Buckeye fans pull for Carthage, and vice versa. Gilmer is my 2nd favorite team. I have no doubt both will be playing in December.

[Dawgs]

Carthage is the obvious favorite in D1 this year. They are the defending champs (darn it... ), they are incredibly well coached, they have the 'right mix' of athletes, they have Ingram. That being said... a bigger, faster, stronger team like LaVega could give them serious trouble as could a technically near-perfect executing team like Argyle. Guarantee neither of those squads is intimidated in the least by Carthage.

I disagree. There is absolutely no way La Vega is a bigger, faster, stronger team. If LV cannot pass the ball they cannot stay within 2 scores. And Carthage is a near-perfect executing team with better athletes and a better scheme than Argyle. I'm 100% sure neither team is intimidated by the Dawgs. But I think that will change about midway thru the 3rd quarter when they play the Dawgs, and I have no doubt both those games will be played. Carthage will be there. I just don't see a team in R3 that will stay within 21 of Carthage. I honestly believe Carthage has already beat the 2nd and 3rd best teams in R3 by 30 and 25. 2017 Carthage would boat race 2016 Carthage. So other teams in D1 have better improved tremdously since last year, or Carthage won't play a close game the rest of the season. I think a lot of people are going to be very surprised at some of the Carthage scores in the playoffs.

[Dawgs]

They're not bad, lol.

Gilmer led them 28-13 at the half and Carthage scored 35 unanswered. Kilgore led them 20-15 in the 2nd quarter and guess what.... Carthage scored 35 unanswered. It's easy to say "the wheels came off" for Gilmer and Kilgore, but Carthage was standing there holding the lug wrench.
It's unheard of for Gilmer, Kilgore, and Henderson to get beat like that by other 4a teams. Carthage average margin of victory over those 3 top 15 teams is 25 points. "Wheels came off" is pretty funny. The wheels have fell off for all 3? That's convienant. Lol. Heck even Henderson was leading 7-6 after the 1st quarter. I agree with you Aggie, Carthage was holding the lug wrench with a big smile on their face, lol.

[Dawgs]

They're not bad, lol.

Gilmer led them 28-13 at the half and Carthage scored 35 unanswered. Kilgore led them 20-15 in the 2nd quarter and guess what.... Carthage scored 35 unanswered. It's easy to say "the wheels came off" for Gilmer and Kilgore, but Carthage was standing there holding the lug wrench.

Carthage also outscored Henderson 36-3 before the Lions scored a TD against Carthage's 2's in the 4th.

[cowboyandchrist]

We will all know if this is the best Dawg team when the playoffs start. I truly believe this 2017 Dawg team is way ahead of any Dawg team in the past.
Never has the second teamers seen so much playing time against really good football teams.
In my opinion, the Dawgs have the best three linebackers in all of 4A, the best running back in any classification, D line that has shut down the run and has had Q B ‘s running for their life. The Dawg secondary have averaged 2 INT’s per game and I believe the defense has scored in every game but one.
The O line has allowed 3 sacks all season and that is throwing nearly 30 times a game and run block as good as any we have had.
Last but not least, the first year QB has done an outstanding job, he has a cannon and is very accurate. He threw two 70 yard TD’s to D Bowens and the ball traveled 47 yards and hit him in stride.
So yeah, I think this Dawg team will build through the playoffs like a mega storm.
I feel the wind picking up early this year and major clouds starting to form.
God Bless coaches, players, and fans.
Let’s Go Dawgs!!!!!!!

[Dawgs]

We will all know if this is the best Dawg team when the playoffs start. I truly believe this 2017 Dawg team is way ahead of any Dawg team in the past.
Never has the second teamers seen so much playing time against really good football teams.
In my opinion, the Dawgs have the best three linebackers in all of 4A, the best running back in any classification, D line that has shut down the run and has had Q B ‘s running for their life. The Dawg secondary have averaged 2 INT’s per game and I believe the defense has scored in every game but one.
The O line has allowed 3 sacks all season and that is throwing nearly 30 times a game and run block as good as any we have had.
Last but not least, the first year QB has done an outstanding job, he has a cannon and is very accurate. He threw two 70 yard TD’s to D Bowens and the ball traveled 47 yards and hit him in stride.
So yeah, I think this Dawg team will build through the playoffs like a mega storm.
I feel the wind picking up early this year and major clouds starting to form.
God Bless coaches, players, and fans.
Let’s Go Dawgs!!!!!!!

C&C you get some grief from time to time for being a homer, but you are right about 1 thing for sure. Never has Carthage 2nd team seen so much playing time against good teams. Crazy how much they have played this season. I never remember it like this. Especially not early in the season.

[oldtownag]

Carthage has a good team this year. Coaches are proven in the playoffs.

However, we are still dealing with teenagers. Anything can happen.

[coach]

Carthage has a good team this year. Coaches are proven in the playoffs.

However, we are still dealing with teenagers. Anything can happen.

As long as they don't run into that buzzsaw in Fairfield, they should be alright.

[lostaussie]

Carthage has a good team this year. Coaches are proven in the playoffs.

However, we are still dealing with teenagers. Anything can happen.

I agree 100%

[Caveman]

I should have been more clear. I actually should have said district opponents. Kilgore and Henderson where very surprised how good Carthage was. But since you say that, what Carthage team have you seen that was better? For sure that was the worst beating Carthage ever gave Gilmer. It has to have been atleast 15 years since Gilmer was dominated like that in a half of football. You are right. La Vega and Argyle will certainly have something to say about the championship. Those are 2 games I wanna see.

No, you only have to go back to 2010 when Argyle put a lickin on Gilmer in the playoffs. I remember the Gilmer players lined up on the 45 yd line across the field staring at Argyle during warm-ups. I can't tell you how much that pissed off those kids and when the game started they came out with fire in their eyes.

[Dawgs]

No, you only have to go back to 2010 when Argyle put a lickin on Gilmer in the playoffs. I remember the Gilmer players lined up on the 45 yd line across the field staring at Argyle during warm-ups. I can't tell you how much that pissed off those kids and when the game started they came out with fire in their eyes.

Big brother was there the next week to put a lickin on Argyle.

[Dawgs]

Carthage has a good team this year. Coaches are proven in the playoffs.

However, we are still dealing with teenagers. Anything can happen.

Ok, I can agree in theory. I totally agree with the old cliche that these are just teenagers and anything can happen. But when has that ever been the case with a Surratt coached team in the playoffs? We have a 10 season sample size. I cannot think of 1 game Carthage should've won, that they didn't. I don't even remember any close calls of getting truly upset. Most of the time Carthage wins games they shouldn't win. Only game I truly think Carthage should've won was in 2012 against EC, but that was in no way an upset. So while I agree in theory, I doubt that something strange will happen to this years Carthage team.

[Aesculus gilmus]

No, you only have to go back to 2010 when Argyle put a lickin on Gilmer in the playoffs. I remember the Gilmer players lined up on the 45 yd line across the field staring at Argyle during warm-ups. I can't tell you how much that pissed off those kids and when the game started they came out with fire in their eyes.

You must not have seen the Navasota win over Gilmer in the 2012 state championship game. I'd say Gilmer was dominated about 3 1/2 quarters in that one. Buckeyes actually had a 3-0 lead, but lost 39-3. It was not just a lickin, but an outright butt-kickin.

As for that first-ever meeting with Argyle in 2010, I got the sense in the week before that game in Ennis that our coaches were vastly underestimating the Eagles because you had lost to Pleasant Grove in 2009. But no one ever underestimated them again after that day in Ennis.

[speedbump]

Ok, I can agree in theory. I totally agree with the old cliche that these are just teenagers and anything can happen. But when has that ever been the case with a Surratt coached team in the playoffs? We have a 10 season sample size. I cannot think of 1 game Carthage should've won, that they didn't. I don't even remember any close calls of getting truly upset. Most of the time Carthage wins games they shouldn't win. Only game I truly think Carthage should've won was in 2012 against EC, but that was in no way an upset. So while I agree in theory, I doubt that something strange will happen to this years Carthage team.

If things fall right you guys can finally get some payback. They are living on tons of heart and Ricebird pride this year but at some point that won't be enough. Do it now though. It's going to be a lot tougher the next three or four years.

[Dawgs]

If things fall right you guys can finally get some payback. They are living on tons of heart and Ricebird pride this year but at some point that won't be enough. Do it now though. It's going to be a lot tougher the next three or four years.
Carthage 9th and 10th graders this year are some of the most talented groups to come thru. There are 8 sophomores on varsity. 1 was injured, but before that 5 were starters. The injured player is Keaontay's little brother. I think he has 4 D1 offers already. Carthage 9th grade teams haven't been beaten in 2 years. Dawgs won't slow up anytime soon. We could see a 4-peat. The only question will be next year. But Carthage will have a very experienced QB, and plenty of returning starters. But in 2019 and 2020? Go ahead and tell the UIL to send the trophy on over to ETX. Hahaha.

But for real I would love to see the Ricebirds every year. They always play hard. I like the way they play ball, and have a ton of respect for yalls program. No D1 players, no big hype. Just hard nosed football. You can win a buncha games like that.

[regaleagle]

Let me just point out a team that I believe is being left out of this conversation.......Kennedale. After watching and comparing Argyle's team this season to other Argyle teams of the past, it is my opinion that this season's offense is the best offense Argyle has ever assembled, but perhaps not the best "team". That 2013 team was absolutely loaded for bear with athletes on both sides of the ball and on both lines, but the D was really something special. AND tons of speed at all positions on that team. This year's team is lacking the size, speed, and dominance on D that team had, IMHO. You must remember I've seen every team and been to every SC game Argyle has ever played. Argyle is at this very juncture in their season still a work in progress to improve their D......by rotating players, honing skill sets and techniques, perhaps even moving players from one position to another. I see Kennedale as a beast to be slain......a real beast of a team with power, speed, physicality, techinique, and this year......a passing game.......well, enough of one to keep the defense honest. Just ask WOS fans if they felt "comfortable" at any time in that game.....even discounting all the high snaps. They saw the game.....saw the beast.....I don't think they would like to face them again this season. The point is that Argyle is not a "given" to make it to the semifinals, much less the finals.....in my mind. They will have to improve in some areas first to get to Jerryworld. Right now, Carthage is the odds-on favorite to win it all in Division 1 and should be......right now. Lots of season left and things can change.......that's what makes Texas High School Football so great.......there are no guarantees.

[regaleagle]

Let's consider this.......if Argyle were to play Kennedale next week, or in two weeks......who would you take in the Pick em contest, huh?

[Dawgs]

Let's consider this.......if Argyle were to play Kennedale next week, or in two weeks......who would you take in the Pick em contest, huh?

Argyle. It's been a longtime since a wing-t or slot-t team has won a championship at this level. It takes a somewhat balanced offense to win championship at this level IMO. When was the last time a team running that offense won state? LH is 2006 and 2007? Don't get me wrong Kennedale has an awesome program, but I just can't see a team running that offense winning a title. Just my opinion though.

[lostaussie]

Just a question? What about Midlothian Heritage? Aren't they unbeaten also?

[regaleagle]

Just a question? What about Midlothian Heritage? Aren't they unbeaten also?

Absolutely......and had a deep run last season without losing much to graduation. They must be considered as part of the mix in D-1 playoff contenders. They fall in that Region II with Kennedale, Van, and others......but they look pretty strong to contend for the Region Championship. They've got a big game this week with an under-the-radar Dallas Carter team that will also be in the playoff mix and should test Heritage in this game.

[lostaussie]

So is Argyle in Reg. 1?

[d0tc0m]

So is Argyle in Reg. 1?


Yes. And the prohibitive Region I favorite. That semifinal matchup with whoever comes out of Region II is going to be a doozy, though.

[Dawgs]

Carthage out gained Bullard 427 - 94 yards in the 1st half. Carthage lead at the half 34-0. Keaontay Ingram played 1-1/2 quarters, and had 11 carries for 161 yards and 2 TD. Mekhi Colbert added 116 yards rushing and 1 TD in the 1st half. Final score 41-7. 2nd team played the whole 2nd half with a running clock.

This is the 2nd week in a row Carthage could've beat a team 80-0. Carthage has out scored opponents 362-149. That's an average score of 45-19. The 2nd team has played most of the 2nd half in many games, and I think they have played in every game. Keaontay is year to play a full game. Usually out before the 1st half is finished. This team could be averaging 60 - 70 points a week easily. That's just not Surratt's style. Never has been. I honestly think they could've had a shot at breaking the scoring title if they would've played closer games and Surratt would have had to keep scoring.

For some perspective Carthage in 2015 thru 8 games had outscored opponents 239-190. That's an average score of 30-24.

Carthage in 2016 thru 8 games had outscored opponents 292-191. That's an average score of 37-24.

The 2015 team won the R3 championship and the 2016 team won the state championship.

[cowboyandchrist]

Dawg you forgot to add that Bullard was minus 36 yards rushing until the second team entered the game. Tha Dawg’s defense is getting ready to hit second gear.

[Caveman]

It's unheard of for Gilmer, Kilgore, and Henderson to get beat like that by other 4a teams. Carthage average margin of victory over those 3 top 15 teams is 25 points. "Wheels came off" is pretty funny. The wheels have fell off for all 3? That's convienant. Lol. Heck even Henderson was leading 7-6 after the 1st quarter. I agree with you Aggie, Carthage was holding the lug wrench with a big smile on their face, lol.

Man you must have alzheimers. Check out the score 2010 Gilmer v Argyle and the next year as well. I guess since they cut your educational budget in Carthage everyone forgot how to do research. LOL.

[Dawgs]

Man you must have alzheimers. Check out the score 2010 Gilmer v Argyle and the next year as well. I guess since they cut your educational budget in Carthage everyone forgot how to do research. LOL.

It's happens, but very rarely. Yes in 2010 Argyle did smoke Gilmer 41-14. But big bro was there the next week to put a beat down on the Eagles 44-27. In 2011, Argyle beat Gilmer by 16. So like I said it happens but rarely do the Buckeyes get beat by 20. Navasota beat them 39-3 in the 2012 state championship game. So like I said it's unheard of. It's happened about 3 times in the last 15 years or so. The other teams that did it played or won state championships. Carthage also beat Gilmer by 17 in 2010, and 18 in 2016. But we are talking about Argyle, Carthage, and a prime Navasota when they were on their run. That's pretty good company. So I stand by my statement that pretty much nobody does that. Nobody except the elite teams from D1 anyway. And it has to be a down year for Gilmer to get beat at all, much less by 20 points.

And in my post I referenced Henderson and Kilgore as well. For any 4a team to beat those 3 powerhouse programs all by 20+ is unheard of. That is impressive no matter how you slice it.

[waterboy]

I can agree with Dawgs. It's a rare thing to beat 3 programs of that caliber in a single year, especially by those point spreads. Carthage is definitely the real deal this season.

I also know as somebody who's team has been very deep in the playoffs many times, including six championship game appearances, and three titles, that it's hard to gauge just how good a team is until you get to the 4th through final round. One region may be comparatively "down", while another region might be on the "up". That's why I'm always more cautious with predictions.

Carthage is the defending state champion, has the pedigree, the coaching, and all the ingredients. That doesn't mean they will win it all, but their chances are very good at a repeat. Lots of football left however, and a lot of teams will have a say in whether that happens or not.

[Dawgs]

I also know as somebody who's team has been very deep in the playoffs many times, including six championship game appearances, and three titles, that it's hard to gauge just how good a team is until you get to the 4th through final round. One region may be comparatively "down", while another region might be on the "up". That's why I'm always more cautious with predictions.

Agree. No question R3 DI is down. That's why we won't know how good Carthage is until late in the playoffs unless an upset happens. And make no mistake, if Carthage does not win the R3 title it will be a very big upset. But nobody knows how Carthage will matchup with R1 or R4. I am fairly confident against Carthage vs any R2 team. We know a little more about those teams. But nothing is for sure. Even though we were decimated with injuries in 2015, I wouldn't have thought in a 100 years that La Vega would've woodsheded Carthage like that. So you just don't know.

[toddg]

Agree. No question R3 DI is down. That's why we won't know how good Carthage is until late in the playoffs unless an upset happens. And make no mistake, if Carthage does not win the R3 title it will be a very big upset. But nobody knows how Carthage will matchup with R1 or R4. I am fairly confident against Carthage vs any R2 team. We know a little more about those teams. But nothing is for sure. Even though we were decimated with injuries in 2015, I wouldn't have thought in a 100 years that La Vega would've woodsheded Carthage like that. So you just don't know.
IMO, the only team in R2 that would give Carthage a problem would be Kennedale.

[Dawgs]

IMO, the only team in R2 that would give Carthage a problem would be Kennedale.

I agree. But I just don't think the offense Kennedale runs matches up well with Carthage. The only thing is that Carthage does not see that offense much. I guess GW and Kilgore are the closest Carthage sees. But I do think Kennedale has the defense to slow Carthage down. Even though they didn't win I was impressed with them in the WOS game. That would be a very interesting game. But might not be a exciting game for fans. And the only way it happens is in Jerry World. I just think it would be more of a defensive game with both teams trying to control the clock. Most people like to see teams playing wide open. A Carthage vs Argyle or a Carthage vs Van would be a more exciting game IMO. Think about a Kennedale vs La Vega. Game might last 2 hours, hahaha. Both teams only running the ball and playing high level defense. Don't get me wrong a still like to watch a good defensive game, but these high powered offenses are fun to watch too.

[bleedgreen]

I agree. But I just don't think the offense Kennedale runs matches up well with Carthage. The only thing is that Carthage does not see that offense much. I guess GW and Kilgore are the closest Carthage sees. But I do think Kennedale has the defense to slow Carthage down. Even though they didn't win I was impressed with them in the WOS game. That would be a very interesting game. But might not be a exciting game for fans. And the only way it happens is in Jerry World. I just think it would be more of a defensive game with both teams trying to control the clock. Most people like to see teams playing wide open. A Carthage vs Argyle or a Carthage vs Van would be a more exciting game IMO. Think about a Kennedale vs La Vega. Game might last 2 hours, hahaha. Both teams only running the ball and playing high level defense. Don't get me wrong a still like to watch a good defensive game, but these high powered offenses are fun to watch too.

I'll bookmark this and come back later about Kennedale.