Moore, Oklahoma (prayers needed)

[YTBulldogs]

Ok 3ADL'ers. Our neighbors in Oklahoma need our prayers right this minute.

GOD be with these folks in Moore, Ok. Same town that took a major hit back in May, 1999. This one just now, is projected wider and reported stronger. F5 and 2 miles wide, some remarked chasing it and the speed produced.

I seen two schools (one the air chopper knew to be a elementary school), totally destroyed, as was the other school. And, it's reported the kids were in lock down and took the full force, head on. God please spare as many life's as possible. The hospital also sutained major damage.

Sad, sad, sad. GOD speed.

Go to work 3ADL'ers. Power of prayer needed.

[Macarthur]

Yes, it's a bad one. :(

[Macarthur]

The pics coming through now are heartbreaking. Devistating.

[YTBulldogs]

I'd be shocked if the death toll isn't really high.

[Tejastrue]

Prayers for comfort for all those affected. To be honest..it is times like these that cause me to question God's existence...but now is not the time to ponder.

I hope you are wrong YTB.

[Gsquared]

I hope all those kids got out of that school ok. Can't imagine how scared those babies were

[YTBulldogs]

Prayers for comfort for all those affected. To be honest..it is times like these that cause me to question God's existence...but now is not the time to ponder.

I hope you are wrong YTB.

I do too Tt. But, when you see nothing but mud where grass, trees, bushes and even cement once was, it frightens me the pending outcome.

http://news.yahoo.com/huge-tornado-hits-oklahoma-city-suburb-kills-37-002317470.html

[Roughneck93]

Just devastating.

Prayers sent.

[regaleagle]

I do disaster relief work on properties damaged, and I've seen some bad ones. But this looks to be absolutely one of the worst, most dangerous storms I've seen in my 25 yrs. being associated with these types of scenarios. I pray to God that those affected by this natural disaster will be sustained in their grief and time of need by the Great Almighty and those that willingly give of themselves in an effort to help ease the anguish and pain of those that have suffered losses.

[Farmersfan]

I've had some major discussions with some other people on other forums about the kind of irrational logic that would let a person think God was omnipotent and benevolent and still pray to that God after something like this happens. Someone posted this chart and I thought it was perfect.


598

[Rabid Cougar]

People have been praying to a deity for as long as there have been human beings. Doesn't matter what religion or denomination. We are talking thousands of years. Lots of bad things have happened over those thousands of years and people continue to find comfort and solice in praying. Lots of people, such as yourself and those you mention on other sites, question them and ask "Why bother?" Yet people have continued to pray. I would have to say that that there has to be some rational logic to this practice because people who pray to that deity, whatever religion or denomination, seem to over come those who question them.......for thousands of years.

[Macarthur]

People have been praying to a deity for as long as there have been human beings. Doesn't matter what religion or denomination. We are talking thousands of years. Lots of bad things have happened over those thousands of years and people continue to find comfort and solice in praying. Lots of people, such as yourself and those you mention on other sites, question them and ask "Why bother?" Yet people have continued to pray. I would have to say that that there has to be some rational logic to this practice because people who pray to that deity, whatever religion or denomination, seem to over come those who question them.......for thousands of years.

Well, as I'm sure you know that just because lots of people believe things doesn't make them so. There are many of examples throughout history of the majority of people being wrong about an issue, slavery for example.

IT could fall into several of these areas.

http://io9.com/5974468/the-most-common-cognitive-biases-that-prevent-you-from-being-rational

The problem I have, which is somewhat similar to FF, is that everywhere you turn is the comment thoughts and prayers for Moore. I have no problem with that. I'm sure many of the folks in Moore appreciate that. However, IMO, a much more effective and REAL way to help these folks is to send money to the red cross. To me, simply typing the words 'thoughts and prayers' and maybe even follow through with that prayer, are soon forgotten once we get back into our daily routine. What could have a measurable impact for these folks is to send money.

As to the point of logic, FF is right about how many folks view these things. I'll give you a first hand example. On facebook, I saw some pics and comments by folks that had experience with the West explosion. The pics and comments were about crosses and angles that were undisturbed in the houses that were affected by the explosion. The house is devistated, but the cross is still on the wall. The comments were to the effect of how that was a sign or a miracle. Really? What about the people who were blown to pieces? What type of a sign is that? Would God really blow people to pieces, but take the care and effort to make sure a cross was not disturbed on a wall? That is a perfect example of people not being rational. There's also some confirmation bias in that (link above).

[MUSTANG69]

The problem I have, which is somewhat similar to FF, is that everywhere you turn is the comment thoughts and prayers for Moore. I have no problem with that.

First you say you have a problem then you say you don't. Which is it? I don't really care what your answer is. If you don't want to pray then don't. Don't badmouth those that do want to pray. I guess you probably have a problem with those that pray and send money.

[buff4ever]

I've had some major discussions with some other people on other forums about the kind of irrational logic that would let a person think God was omnipotent and benevolent and still pray to that God after something like this happens. Someone posted this chart and I thought it was perfect.


598

There is so much wrong about your chart, that perfect is the last word I would use to describe it. Lots of things wrong in the thinking behind that. Maybe hard for some non-believers to comprehend the answers to those questions, but not so hard for those that understand the bible a little better.

Lots of discussion on this topic that can't be done on here for length and for difficulty for even some believers to accept as a possibility.

[Macarthur]

First you say you have a problem then you say you don't. Which is it? I don't really care what your answer is. If you don't want to pray then don't. Don't badmouth those that do want to pray. I guess you probably have a problem with those that pray and send money.

Okay, I can see how I worded that is awkward.

I don't have an issue with praying. But if all you are doing is praying, are you really helping the people in Moore, or are you making yourself feel better?

[MUSTANG69]

Okay, I can see how I worded that is awkward.

I don't have an issue with praying. But if all you are doing is praying, are you really helping the people in Moore, or are you making yourself feel better?

I'm sure there are people on the DownLow who can only offer prayer because of their financial situation. This does not mean they care less and they do believe they are helping. Why fault them for that? They are not as fortunate as some of us are who can afford to donate money, food or other supplies. I donated food and water that is being taken to Moore, OK by a local trucking company. This way I know where it is going.

[hollywood]

There is so much wrong about your chart, that perfect is the last word I would use to describe it. Lots of things wrong in the thinking behind that. Maybe hard for some non-believers to comprehend the answers to those questions, but not so hard for those that understand the bible a little better.

Lots of discussion on this topic that can't be done on here for length and for difficulty for even some believers to accept as a possibility.

This

[Macarthur]

I'm sure there are people on the DownLow who can only offer prayer because of their financial situation. This does not mean they care less and they do believe they are helping. Why fault them for that?

And you are inflating my point into something it is not. I would never begrudge someone whose only means is to send any sort of spirtual strength they could.

[Tejastrue]

The fact that some are using this thread to promote their anti-religious viewpoints is not only disrespectful of the thread's intent but also exposes the tendency or signs of being self-righteous. Can't you guys show a little consideration and step down from your soapbox on this one?

[MUSTANG69]

But if all you are doing is praying, are you really helping the people in Moore, or are you making yourself feel better?

I am not inflating anything. You are the one questioning the motives of people who are praying. People do believe prayer helps. As I said before, if you don't believe that then don't pray. The only way to prove this is to die and then you only prove it to yourself.

[Macarthur]

I am not inflating anything. You are the one questioning the motives of people who are praying. People do believe prayer helps. As I said before, if you don't believe that then don't pray. The only way to prove this is to die and then you only prove it to yourself.

I didn't question the motives of EVERYONE that prays. That's where you are making my argument something it's not.

[Farmersfan]

I would have to say that that there has to be some rational logic to this practice because people who pray to that deity, whatever religion or denomination, seem to over come those who question them.......for thousands of years.



Actually, they tend to burn or stone those who question them until their societies evolve to a point where they aren't allowed to do that anymore. Religions have prospered in our history through coercion and fear and nothing else. Once people are allowed to think freely they soon find that religion starts to unravel. And isn't this what we are living through right now. A unraveling? I would say yes.
But to the point of the flow chart: I have to say that it is more apropo than you give it credit for. It is the inevitable result of linear thinking. To come to any other conclusion requires a certain measure of intellectual dishonesty with yourself. We would never accept the kind of actions from another human that we not only accept but embrace from our God figure. Is there ANY rational reason that you would accept for a man to stand by and not help a child from being killed when it was within that man's ability to prevent it? If you say there is then you are lying to yourself. Any man who stood by and let a bunch of children die when he could have saved them without much effort at all would be seen as the lowest of the low of our species. Yet the Christian God that is defined by Biblical scripture to be benevolent and omnipotent did exactly that. There is no rationalizing that away. NONE!

[BwdLion73]

The fact that some are using this thread to promote their anti-religious viewpoints is not only disrespectful of the thread's intent but also exposes the tendency or signs of being self-righteous. Can't you guys show a little consideration and step down from your soapbox on this one?

:iagree: ...but I bet it does not happen. My cousin works for the Moore Fire Department.

[buff4ever]

Actually, they tend to burn or stone those who question them until their societies evolve to a point where they aren't allowed to do that anymore. Religions have prospered in our history through coercion and fear and nothing else. Once people are allowed to think freely they soon find that religion starts to unravel. And isn't this what we are living through right now. A unraveling? I would say yes.
But to the point of the flow chart: I have to say that it is more apropo than you give it credit for. It is the inevitable result of linear thinking. To come to any other conclusion requires a certain measure of intellectual dishonesty with yourself. We would never accept the kind of actions from another human that we not only accept but embrace from our God figure. Is there ANY rational reason that you would accept for a man to stand by and not help a child from being killed when it was within that man's ability to prevent it? If you say there is then you are lying to yourself. Any man who stood by and let a bunch of children die when he could have saved them without much effort at all would be seen as the lowest of the low of our species. Yet the Christian God that is defined by Biblical scripture to be benevolent and omnipotent did exactly that. There is no rationalizing that away. NONE!

You try hard to not acknowledge the hints I threw out and the basis of the bible and christianity. Your mind is too made up to argue with on this board, it would take back and forth in person to even get you to acknowledge anything but what you want. Not that you would buy in with your mindset, but to get you to even acknowledge the other side.

[Tejastrue]

:iagree: ...but I bet it does not happen. My cousin works for the Moore Fire Department.

I hear you Bw73. Have you been in contact with your cousin? There is no way to prepare for a disaster of this magnitude, not physically or mentally. Hope he or she is staying strong. I know it takes a special breed for this line of work.

[BwdLion73]

I hear you Bw73. Have you been in contact with your cousin? There is no way to prepare for a disaster of this magnitude, not physically or mentally. Hope he or she is staying strong. I know it takes a special breed for this line of work.)

We just know that he is ok. My son said during the aftermath that I should call him...I told my son I thought he had enough to do right now. ;)

[Farmersfan]

The fact that some are using this thread to promote their anti-religious viewpoints is not only disrespectful of the thread's intent but also exposes the tendency or signs of being self-righteous. Can't you guys show a little consideration and step down from your soapbox on this one?


Sorry Tejastrue! I wasn't aware that only certain "viewpoints" were able to be promoted on this thread. I stand corrected.....................

[Bullaholic]

Sorry Tejastrue! I wasn't aware that only certain "viewpoints" were able to be promoted on this thread. I stand corrected.....................

Big diff between a viewpoint and a dogmatic agenda supported by mostly hyperbole, FF.

[Farmersfan]

You try hard to not acknowledge the hints I threw out and the basis of the bible and christianity. Your mind is too made up to argue with on this board, it would take back and forth in person to even get you to acknowledge anything but what you want. Not that you would buy in with your mindset, but to get you to even acknowledge the other side.



It's amazing how the problem seems to lie with me instead of the tremendously ambiguous nature of your infallible belief system buff4ever............... But ok! Sorry I tried to shed some light on a ridiculous practice. Seems to me if Christians want their religion to continue they will need to FIX these complete contradictions in their dogma. As time goes by people are less likely to adhere to a ideology that isn't logical and succinct. The first 2000 years of fear and coercion are quickly wearing off and people are starting to ask the difficult questions. If Christianity can't kill the nay sayers they are forced to try and answer the questions and are finding it impossible to do so. But again, the problem must lie with me! Sorry for that.

[Tejastrue]

Sorry Tejastrue! I wasn't aware that only certain "viewpoints" were able to be promoted on this thread. I stand corrected.....................

Typical, predictable, response. It's all about the timing FF. Someone was just trying to show compassion for a tragic event in a way familiar to so many on here. I guess it was just too close to being a call for a group prayer that the micro minority were offended and just had to intervene. It worked..the thread's purpose was short lived. Congrats.

[Farmersfan]

Typical, predictable, response. It's all about the timing FF. Someone was just trying to show compassion for a tragic event in a way familiar to so many on here. I guess it was just too close to being a call for a group prayer that the micro minority were offended and just had to intervene. It worked..the thread's purpose was short lived. Congrats.


The day that any person could possibly consider uttering a prayer as a show of compassion in a tragic event should be behind us as a society Tejastrue. Those people in Oklahoma need more from Christians than just prayers. I think this is the whole point. Of course someone told me yesterday that these calls for prayers like this in the face of tragic events serve another purpose. They really aren't meant to actually help the victims. They are meant to allow Christians to actually feel like they have done their part. The fundamental tenants of Christianity require helping people and what better way to help than to actually enlist the aid of the Al'mighty Creator? I was simply pointing out that the same dogma that they use to justify doing this not only indicates the creator already knows what these victims need and what people are going to ask for in their prayers before the prayer are even said but also that these events are part of his overall plan to begin with. So the apparent self righteous arrogance of a Christian to pray and think God will alter his plan because of those prayers is amazing. And then to make me the bad guy for pointing these things out is amazing.
Let me ask you a question: Do you believe a call for prayers on this forum actually helps those people in Oklahoma IN ANY WAY?

[DKfromDUB]

Do you believe a call for prayers on this forum actually helps those people in Oklahoma IN ANY WAY?

Praying for help is all that some people can do. And FF, I pray for your hardened heart. I don’t know how you could look at that precious child in your profile pic and not feel like there is something Greater out there...

[Manso/V8]

The day that any person could possibly consider uttering a prayer as a show of compassion in a tragic event should be behind us as a society Tejastrue. Those people in Oklahoma need more from Christians than just prayers. I think this is the whole point. Of course someone told me yesterday that these calls for prayers like this in the face of tragic events serve another purpose. They really aren't meant to actually help the victims. They are meant to allow Christians to actually feel like they have done their part. The fundamental tenants of Christianity require helping people and what better way to help than to actually enlist the aid of the Al'mighty Creator? I was simply pointing out that the same dogma that they use to justify doing this not only indicates the creator already knows what these victims need and what people are going to ask for in their prayers before the prayer are even said but also that these events are part of his overall plan to begin with. So the apparent self righteous arrogance of a Christian to pray and think God will alter his plan because of those prayers is amazing. And then to make me the bad guy for pointing these things out is amazing.
Let me ask you a question: Do you believe a call for prayers on this forum actually helps those people in Oklahoma IN ANY WAY?

You seem to be a frustrated and tortured soul, and an unhappy person.

Would you be offended if we started a thread calling for prayers for you?

[Rabid Cougar]

The day that any person could possibly consider uttering a prayer as a show of compassion in a tragic event should be behind us as a society Tejastrue. Those people in Oklahoma need more from Christians than just prayers. I think this is the whole point. Of course someone told me yesterday that these calls for prayers like this in the face of tragic events serve another purpose. They really aren't meant to actually help the victims. They are meant to allow Christians to actually feel like they have done their part. The fundamental tenants of Christianity require helping people and what better way to help than to actually enlist the aid of the Al'mighty Creator? I was simply pointing out that the same dogma that they use to justify doing this not only indicates the creator already knows what these victims need and what people are going to ask for in their prayers before the prayer are even said but also that these events are part of his overall plan to begin with. So the apparent self righteous arrogance of a Christian to pray and think God will alter his plan because of those prayers is amazing. And then to make me the bad guy for pointing these things out is amazing.
Let me ask you a question: Do you believe a call for prayers on this forum actually helps those people in Oklahoma IN ANY WAY?



Yes.

[Bullaholic]

I will never understand why some people take great offense when others want to wish other people in trouble or despair well through prayer or kind thoughts. Survivors and the stories of triumphs of the human spirit in times of tragedy are buoyed time and time again by thoughts of compassion as well as the material contributions by all races, religions, nationalities, and creeds. Somebody is going to have to explain to me the downside of these compassionate expressions of concern and caring. Many, many survivors are alive today only because they held steadfast to their religion, love for their families, or belief in the compassion of their fellow man.
Man has been a spiritual being since his creation and this is documented in the writings and archaeological finds of every culture since the dawn of man.

[Macarthur]

I will never understand why some people take great offense when others want to wish other people in trouble or despair well through prayer or kind thoughts. Survivors and the stories of triumphs of the human spirit in times of tragedy are buoyed time and time again by thoughts of compassion as well as the material contributions by all races, religions, nationalities, and creeds.

FF can speak for himself, but I'd like to address this. I think you misuse the term offended. I'm not offended by anyone praying. The people I know that are not of faith are not offended by people praying. And we know that praying gives people great comfort. I have no issue at all with this.



Somebody is going to have to explain to me the downside of these compassionate expressions of concern and caring. Many, many survivors are alive today only because they held steadfast to their religion, love for their families, or belief in the compassion of their fellow man.

Here's where it gets cloudy, IMO. Where I start to struggle with this is the mindset that God can provide. People are fond of saying God gives me everything. God will provide. Well, the reality is that you provide. YOU work for your money and all that can buy. When it comes to real TANGIBLE help that these people need, PEOPLE provide that. Money provides that. Not God (of course this is my opinion). This is where I think people not of faith struggle with these, in our eyes, symbolic means of support. There were far too many people that simply said a prayer for the people in Moore when if they would have taken 1 minute to send a text to the red cross, they could have provided $10 that would really provide some tangible help.

I hope that makes sense.

[Macarthur]

You seem to be a frustrated and tortured soul, and an unhappy person.

Would you be offended if we started a thread calling for prayers for you?

Those prayers seem a bit hollow when directly below it is a chick bouncing a cup off her ass. ;)

[Tejastrue]

Those prayers seem a bit hollow when directly below it is a chick bouncing a cup off her ass. ;)

I think Manso has had at least one prayer answered.

[Manso/V8]

Those prayers seem a bit hollow when directly below it is a chick bouncing a cup off her ass. ;)

Nothing wrong with appreciating God's handiwork.

Good Lord, at least acknowledge the talent!

[Tejastrue]

Let me ask you a question: Do you believe a call for prayers on this forum actually helps those people in Oklahoma IN ANY WAY?


Is it just Christianity you have a problem with or are you just plain anti-religious. In answering your question...I can't say whether prayers are helping the Oklahoma victims. I can't speak for them. If it has not, how has this adversely affected anyone? Okay maybe one.

[Farmersfan]

Praying for help is all that some people can do. And FF, I pray for your hardened heart. I don’t know how you could look at that precious child in your profile pic and not feel like there is something Greater out there...



Well I certainly appreciate your feeling that your prayers can fix my hardened heart. but isn't this the whole issue? If you claim to be a Christian then you have no choice but to acknowledge that I am as God made me. A failure to accept this is to ignore some of the other fundamental tenants of the religion that we are discussing. Perhaps it is God's intent that you fix me with some type of logic or inspiration? I have to say that simply insulting me with innuendos about how I'm flawed isn't getting the job done! Your god probably isn't happy with you right now.....

And just in case your mind doesn't understand logic let me lay it out: It is estimated that so far in the existence of the human race that 107,602,707,791 humans have been born into existence. I certainly love my grandchild as much as anybody could but I also understand that there have been BILLIONS of others born, raised and died previous to her on this rock. It's the most natural thing in the world and to apply some type of supernatural value to that is moronic. And just for the record I have never said there isn't something greater out there. I have also never said that no God has ever existed or still exists. All I have ever said is that we have no evidence of the existence of a God and in fact the only resource FOR the existence of a God contradicts that very idea at every turn...................................

[Manso/V8]

Well I certainly appreciate your feeling that your prayers can fix my hardened heart. but isn't this the whole issue? If you claim to be a Christian then you have no choice but to acknowledge that I am as God made me. A failure to accept this is to ignore some of the other fundamental tenants of the religion that we are discussing. Perhaps it is God's intent that you fix me with some type of logic or inspiration? I have to say that simply insulting me with innuendos about how I'm flawed isn't getting the job done! Your god probably isn't happy with you right now.....

And just in case your mind doesn't understand logic let me lay it out: It is estimated that so far in the existence of the human race that 107,602,707,791 humans have been born into existence. I certainly love my grandchild as much as anybody could but I also understand that there have been BILLIONS of others born, raised and died previous to her on this rock. It's the most natural thing in the world and to apply some type of supernatural value to that is moronic. And just for the record I have never said there isn't something greater out there. I have also never said that no God has ever existed or still exists. All I have ever said is that we have no evidence of the existence of a God and in fact the only resource FOR the existence of a God contradicts that very idea at every turn...................................

What?

[DKfromDUB]

Well I certainly appreciate your feeling that your prayers can fix my hardened heart. but isn't this the whole issue? If you claim to be a Christian then you have no choice but to acknowledge that I am as God made me. A failure to accept this is to ignore some of the other fundamental tenants of the religion that we are discussing. Perhaps it is God's intent that you fix me with some type of logic or inspiration? I have to say that simply insulting me with innuendos about how I'm flawed isn't getting the job done! Your god probably isn't happy with you right now.....

And just in case your mind doesn't understand logic let me lay it out: It is estimated that so far in the existence of the human race that 107,602,707,791 humans have been born into existence. I certainly love my grandchild as much as anybody could but I also understand that there have been BILLIONS of others born, raised and died previous to her on this rock. It's the most natural thing in the world and to apply some type of supernatural value to that is moronic. And just for the record I have never said there isn't something greater out there. I have also never said that no God has ever existed or still exists. All I have ever said is that we have no evidence of the existence of a God and in fact the only resource FOR the existence of a God contradicts that very idea at every turn...................................

First, God has not charged me to “fix” anyone. God has instructed all believers to spread His Word. My prayer is that He fixes you, but that will only happen if you chose to believe. It is a choice. But by Grace are ye saved thru faith. It is a gift from God, not of man. All you have to do is accept it. I can’t do anything to you.

God did make you, but the choices you have made in your life make up the person that you are today. You were not born with the ideas that you have been conveying here on this board. You have chosen to believe what you will.

And as far as you not seeing any evidence of God, I see him every day. Your grandchild was a gift from God, the gift of life. To think that all of this, the earth, the trees, the animals, everything that is here on this planet, just happened by chance is moronic.

[Farmersfan]

First, God has not charged me to “fix” anyone. God has instructed all believers to spread His Word. My prayer is that He fixes you, but that will only happen if you chose to believe. It is a choice. But by Grace are ye saved thru faith. It is a gift from God, not of man. All you have to do is accept it. I can’t do anything to you.

God did make you, but the choices you have made in your life make up the person that you are today. You were not born with the ideas that you have been conveying here on this board. You have chosen to believe what you will.

And as far as you not seeing any evidence of God, I see him every day. Your grandchild was a gift from God, the gift of life. To think that all of this, the earth, the trees, the animals, everything that is here on this planet, just happened by chance is moronic.



No arguments here DK! If my goal was to get where you are at right now I certainly made a lot of wrong decisions in the past. Now how you can believe your omniscient God sat back and allowed that to happen but still wants my salvation is beyond me. At no point in my life have I EVER made a decision based on an intent to move away from God. I have never consciously rejected God. There is a difference regardless of whether you want to think so or not. Not accepting a load of nonsensical garbage about a fictional character isn't the same as not accepting something that is known to be true and real. This is where you whole "Free Will" concept falls apart. If God presented himself to the world in some undeniable way I'm thinking about 99.99999% of the world's population would embrace him without hesitation. Only a very few really backwards and warped individuals would reject the known entity. Christianity had subsisted for 2000 years on the assumption that a lack of believe is equivilent to a rejection of God. This was the only way the Church could survive. But that's another long debate. but thanks for your comments.

[Farmersfan]

Is it just Christianity you have a problem with or are you just plain anti-religious. In answering your question...I can't say whether prayers are helping the Oklahoma victims. I can't speak for them. If it has not, how has this adversely affected anyone? Okay maybe one.




I have a problem with any ideology that isn't founded in logic and reason Tejastrue. Anything that is self contradictory in it's nature should be re-examined and rejected. We do this in every single aspect of our existence except for one......................

[Tejastrue]

I have a problem with any ideology that isn't founded in logic and reason Tejastrue. Anything that is self contradictory in it's nature should be re-examined and rejected. We do this in every single aspect of our existence except for one......................


I personally find no logic or reason in what you are trying to do here. I guess it may be therapuetic and self-serving...a quest perhaps.

[Farmersfan]

I personally find no logic or reason in what you are trying to do here. I guess it may be therapuetic and self-serving...a quest perhaps.



What is your purpose in opposing my point of view? Do you find logic in that?

[Farmersfan]

You seem to be a frustrated and tortured soul, and an unhappy person.

Would you be offended if we started a thread calling for prayers for you?



And you seem like a indoctrinated lemming with no ability for linear thinking! And I would embrace a prayer thread if it's for a Red Lamborghini! Can you make that happen please? Thanks..................:dispntd:

[Tejastrue]

What is your purpose in opposing my point of view? Do you find logic in that?


I believe I've already said why I thought you should have left this thread alone. Methinks it was a logical suggestion.

[Ville-D]

Troll much?

[Farmersfan]

I believe I've already said why I thought you should have left this thread alone. Methinks it was a logical suggestion.



Yes you did Tejastrue. And if it seems like I'm being disrespectful then I apologize. You guys send your prayers to Oklahoma and I'll send my invisible bubble of love and compassion right along with it! Sorry, cheap shot...............:p

[Tejastrue]

Yep..that's how it works. In case you didn't know and may choose to join us...we all sit around a campfire singing kumbayah. To top it off the prayers are sent via flying carpet and magic lamp (optional). No reason to go stealth with your love and compassion. :dispntd:

[Manso/V8]

And you seem like a indoctrinated lemming with no ability for linear thinking! And I would embrace a prayer thread if it's for a Red Lamborghini! Can you make that happen please? Thanks..................:dispntd:

LOL! You crack me up. I'm indoctrinated? In what? You don't think I have any ability for linear thinking? Do you even know what that is? What makes that hilarious is that you have been all over the place on this thread........a very, very poor example of linear thinking.

What is your deal? You constantly look for an argument.........ok, that's fun in some places, but why do that on a thread about a very tragic event?

I'm gonna hold off on the Red Lamborghini. I think it would be ill-advised for you to be driving that kind of car (or really any vehicle) until you get some of these frustrations worked out. I am afraid you might start thinking about somebody praying for Moore victims, or maybe Tony Romo, go non-linear and drive over folks in Farmersville.

[Farmersfan]

LOL! You crack me up. I'm indoctrinated? In what? You don't think I have any ability for linear thinking? Do you even know what that is? What makes that hilarious is that you have been all over the place on this thread........a very, very poor example of linear thinking.

What is your deal? You constantly look for an argument.........ok, that's fun in some places, but why do that on a thread about a very tragic event?

I'm gonna hold off on the Red Lamborghini. I think it would be ill-advised for you to be driving that kind of car (or really any vehicle) until you get some of these frustrations worked out. I am afraid you might start thinking about somebody praying for Moore victims, or maybe Tony Romo, go non-linear and drive over folks in Farmersville.



I'll say one more point and be done with this if you think this thread isn't the appropriate place. Several people have asked me why I persist in my attack (bad term to use) on Christianity. Let me explain. I'm not specifically attacking Christians. I'm attacking the mindset that allows Christians to place their unsubstantiated beliefs on the same level as scientific evidence and knowledge. Someone on here said that humans are spiritual creatures. And we have indisputable facts that indicate that this human spirituality caused men to create about 10,000 or more different versions of Gods or Creators throughout our history. As time has gone by every single one of these Gods that mankind worshiped over the long history of our species has been determined to be nothing but imagination and superstition. WE KNOW THIS! YOU know this. So here comes the part that requires you use linear thinking, ready? How do you justify maintaining a idea that YOUR GOD is the exception to the 10,000 other Gods and superstition figures that have come and gone in the long history of mankind's existence? You know beyond a shadow of a doubt that men always have invented Gods to be used to fill in all the gaps in their knowledge and you have mountains of evidence that support the idea that is exactly what has been done once again with the Christian God and yet with all this knowledge you still persist in your primitive superstition. Here is the kicker to this question, I don't think most Christians truly believe what they propose to believe. I think the majority are fighting against the 2000 year history of religious dogma being hammered into society's subconscious. The rest of the world has pretty much already shed these shackles and the Christian majority in this country is dwendling at an ever increasing rate. It is this thought that drives me when I get into these kinds of discussions. Whether you agree or not isn't important. What is important is that other people who have closet doubts might read my limited writing skill and get the feeling that it is ok to question the standard or the norm when the standard doesn't fit. The less it becomes the norm the more people who are going to be comfortable coming to terms with the fact that it really doesn't make sense and if it doesn't make sense then it probably isn't the truth. So my "agenda" is to make it just as socially acceptable to believe in NON-BELIEF as to not. That only happens if people stand up and make some noise. So I have been making noise.
But have a great weekend and again I apologize if I stepped on any toes.

[44INAROW]

I think this thread has run it's course............... I think we're all just going to have to agree to disagree :)