3A VS 4A FOOTBALL: What's the difference

[regaleagle]

Are the top teams in 4A really that much better than the top teams in 3A, esp. now that Lake Travis and Jonathan Gray are gone?

[Lion70]

yes both are tough but highland park is different than Alvarado lol!

[Lion70]

We dominated Kilgore and Pine tree like three years straight and were 3A!

[Emerson1]

Are the top teams in 4A really that much better than the top teams in 3A, esp. now that Lake Travis and Jonathan Gray are gone?
Yes.

[GrTigers6]

I believe there are some teams that could compete well in 4a but as far as across the board I think there is a huge difference because mainly size and facilities

[Rabid Cougar]

Yes. You don't see them playing as much as you used to. When I was at Cameron in the late 70's and early 80's our Non-Distirct schedule was exclusively 4A. (Example: Waco High, Richfield, Belton, Taylor, A&M Consolidated, Belton, Marlin, Austin Westlake, Midway and Connally)

[regaleagle]

Well, we didn't get much imput from others on this board regarding this topic. I for one expected a little more from some of you posters and viewers that have been here for so long and seen the upward movement of quality football in 3A. To say the least, I am disappointed in the nonresponse on this subject from supposed football intellilects. And especially after this realignment period with the additions we have seen dropping down from 4A. I did not post the thread and ask the question because I didn't know the answer or have an opinion, but wanted to see what other members here felt and why. Maybe some statistical data you could pull up somewhere proving some factual power numbers and such across all classifications. Where is the beef?

[Matthew328]

Generally speaking we are talking depth...at the 4A level you've got more teams who on a given night are capable of beating you...you've got to bring your A game a lot more often in district play at the 4A level than at the 3A level...the middle of the road teams in 4A are capable of beating some upper tier teams..you probably can't say the same for 3A...4A teams (especially the bigger schools) generally have no two way players...their special teams play is also superior because they have enough kids who specialize in that aspect of the game..therefore there are fewer mistakes in the kicking game...there's no doubt the top 3A teams can compete with the top 4A's but more often than not the top 4A's will win....

[bigwood33]

I was at the State Championship game this year (I know that you were disappointed but it was a great game!) and then stayed for the Midway v LT game and am sure that either Argyle or Wimberly would have acquitted themselves very well had you played them. I know that comparing scores is dangerous and certainly doesn't prove anything but it IS worth talking about.
This past season, Paris beat Suphur Springs 21-14 who beat Sherman 21-14. Sherman went to the Qtr Finals in 4A and we all know what happened to Paris...got drilled by Celina in week 5, 41-22 and it wasn't that close as Paris had less than 100 yards of total offense and later lost in the 1st round of the playoffs 55-17 to Henderson. I understand that doesn't PROVE anything but it is certainly a nice conversation piece.
In 2010 Brownwood beat Stephenville 49-16 who lost to Aledo twice, 20-3 and 18-10. I have a friend on the Stephenville staff who told me that Brownwood was the best team that they played that year. I'm not saying that Brownwood would have beaten Aledo (who went 16-0) but they (Brownwood) certainly would have played them (Aledo) very well.
The Harris Poll has been around since 1960 and they use a Power Number to determine the relative strength of every team in the state. The number is used to set "lines" for each weeks games and is universal across classification, ie 200 is 200 regardless of classification. You guys (Argyle) would have been favored against everyone in 4a other than probably LT and Aledo and would would have only been about 6-10 point "dogs" to them.
Of course this is just my opinion...just like everyone else on the board :2thumbsup

[Old Tiger]

I know a 2a school that can beat any 4a/5a schools

[bigwood33]

I know a 2a school that can beat any 4a/5a schools
Refugio MAY not be as good next year...and I'll bet that they would have had no interest in playing Cisco again...the Loboe's had them by the short hairs when they ran out of time!

[Gone Fishing]

Refugio MAY not be as good next year...and I'll bet that they would have had no interest in playing Cisco again...the Loboe's had them by the short hairs when they ran out of time!

I saw most of the Refugio- Cisco game waiting for Wimberley- Argyle game. I know beyond a shadow of a doubt any of the 5 teams Wimberley played to get to the finals would have beat the hell out of Refugio and then some!! I agree with bigwood that Argyle or Wimberley (and IMO Cold Spring) could have played with LT and given them more than Midway by far. There is some 3A's every year that can beat most of the top tier 4A's on a given night and can beat most good 4A's every night. Matthew may right "generally speaking" but there are a few exceptions every year in the 3A great programs around. In Wimberleys case for an example,only one player went both ways all the time and only a couple others that went both ways part time, meaning there was a bunch of very very good players standing over there on the sidelines just waiting to get in on their side of the ball or special teams or some subing. We had many good players that could go both ways but didnt have to ( like 5A schools ), but I just don't see that much difference in 4A. A great program in 3A is pretty much equal with a great program in 4A. JMO.

[Sville]

I agree with bigwood that Argyle or Wimberley (and IMO Cold Spring) could have played with LT and given them more than Midway by far.

I almost spit my coffee everywhere when I read this.

There is not a single 2011 3A team than could of stayed within 4 TDs of LT. The Cavs were on another level even for 4A. Matter of fact they were the best team I saw last year regardless of classification. Midway was the best team that Sville played last year including Aledo. Midway's defense was crazy good with size and speed all over the field, out of the four 3A state finalist I saw last year none of them had the total amount of athletes that LT, Midway, Aledo, or Manvel put on the field. IMO the four 3A state finalist wouldn't of even won their regions if playing in 4A last year as well.

I am not saying this to denigrate the top 3A teams or what they accomplished last year rather that I think that there is that big of difference most years in the OVERALL talent of the top 3A's vs. the top 4A's. It is a numbers game plain and simple and why we have classifications.

[toddg]

I almost spit my coffee everywhere when I read this.

There is not a single 2011 3A team than could of stayed within 4 TDs of LT. The Cavs were on another level even for 4A. Matter of fact they were the best team I saw last year regardless of classification. Midway was the best team that Sville played last year including Aledo. Midway's defense was crazy good with size and speed all over the field, out of the four 3A state finalist I saw last year none of them had the total amount of athletes that LT, Midway, Aledo, or Manvel put on the field. IMO the four 3A state finalist wouldn't of even won their regions if playing in 4A last year as well.

I am not saying this to denigrate the top 3A teams or what they accomplished last year rather that I think that there is that big of difference most years in the OVERALL talent of the top 3A's vs. the top 4A's. It is a numbers game plain and simple and why we have classifications.

i agree.

[Rabid Cougar]

I almost spit my coffee everywhere when I read this.

There is not a single 2011 3A team than could of stayed within 4 TDs of LT. The Cavs were on another level even for 4A. Matter of fact they were the best team I saw last year regardless of classification. Midway was the best team that Sville played last year including Aledo. Midway's defense was crazy good with size and speed all over the field, out of the four 3A state finalist I saw last year none of them had the total amount of athletes that LT, Midway, Aledo, or Manvel put on the field. IMO the four 3A state finalist wouldn't of even won their regions if playing in 4A last year as well.

I am not saying this to denigrate the top 3A teams or what they accomplished last year rather that I think that there is that big of difference most years in the OVERALL talent of the top 3A's vs. the top 4A's. It is a numbers game plain and simple and why we have classifications.

I totally agree. There is a HUGE difference in a High level 4 A and high level 3 A. China Spring competes against Midway and Waco High in linemen challanges on an annual basis. We also compete with Waco High and Midway in 7 on 7. Even in 2007 and 2008 when China Spring was highly ranked, we had one maybe two linemen who would have started for Midway and one or two db/wr that would have played. It is the numbers that 4 As have over the 3 As. They can trot out O-Line/ D-Line men two deep that a 3 A maybe can match with one maybe two linemen. They trot out 4 WRs that you maybe have one quality DB to match up with.

[Ville-D]

I agree too, Midway and LT would have been too much for any 3a team (and especially 2a Refugio). I watched the Cisco/Refugio and Wimberly/Argyle games back to back and there would have been no chance at all.

I will say that I too thought the Brownwood team from 2 years ago might have been better than Aledo. I went to the game against Carthage and that changed my mind.

[Matthew328]

Midway and LT were basically really really good 5A ball clubs...don't believe Argyle or Wimberley would have given them much of a game...they would have competed a little better agianst Aledo and Manvel but I think both of them would have rolled as well...Chapel Hill and Alvarado would have stood a better chance against both IMO...thought those 2 were clearly the best 2 3A teams in 2011....

[Saggy Aggie]

Midway and LT were basically really really good 5A ball clubs...don't believe Argyle or Wimberley would have given them much of a game...they would have competed a little better agianst Aledo and Manvel but I think both of them would have rolled as well...Chapel Hill and Alvarado would have stood a better chance against both IMO...thought those 2 were clearly the best 2 3A teams in 2011.... obviously those 2 made it to the finals, but chapel hill got pushed 3 weeks in a row by LV, navasota & WC. You don't think any of those 3 were on alvarados and chs level?


Edit: well, you did say 2 best so that's fair. Just curious how you saw the final standings ending up? Basically how would you rank those 3, chill, Alvarado, wimberley & argyle?

[Matthew328]

Yes they were on their level but watching the film I thought Chapel Hill was the better team.....I did find it odd that Chapel Hill three weeks in a row made mistake after mistake in games where they looked to be better...not sure if it was a lack of focus or what because against Alvarado they played a relatively clean game..

[Pudlugger]

Well here's my 2 cents. In 2000 La Grange opened the season by playing Bay City at home. Bay City won 28-7. Bay City went on to win state in 4A that year and La Grange won State in 3A. Next year 2001 both teams met again in the opener HEB Classic in the Alamo Dome billed as the battle of State Champions. Bay City won 9-0 in a hard fought defensive struggle. Both teams went to the State final in their respective classes and lost in 2001. In my opinion the 4A schools at this level of play will win the majority of the time due to greater depth and a larger talent pool to draw from. However, on occasion a 3A school can be so extraordinary that they could get the win but not often.

[Gone Fishing]

[QUOTE=Sville;1662402]I almost spit my coffee everywhere when I read this.

There is not a single 2011 3A team than could of stayed within 4 TDs of LT. The Cavs were on another level even for 4A. Matter of fact they were the best team I saw last year regardless of classification. Midway was the best team that Sville played last year including Aledo. Midway's defense was crazy good with size and speed all over the field, out of the four 3A state finalist I saw last year none of them had the total amount of athletes that LT, Midway, Aledo, or Manvel put on the field. IMO the four 3A state finalist wouldn't of even won their regions if playing in 4A last year as well.

Of course you almost spit your coffee everywhere! your from Stephenville and ya'll have already put your name on the state trophy coming down to little ol 3A. Also I said they could have played with them, not beat them. I understand the numbers of 4A and 3A, I can count. There are some really good 3A programs, with some good numbers too.

[bigwood33]

To Pudlugger's point, it isn't that the top 3A teams would beat the state champion 4A team but that they could play with them. Those Carthage teams from '08-'10 would have given all of the top 4A teams a good game. Might not have won but certainly would have competed well. Primarily because they were outstanding up front. Those offensive and defensive lines were big, fast, and physical. Unless they decide to play one another, we can only speculate.
This coming season will certainly be interesting. We'll see if Stephenville, Kilgore, and La Marque dominate like some think. La Marque is only 1 year removed from a state runner- up year and Stephenville and Kilgore both made deep runs last season. I suppose they will be the barometer...won't they?

[Matthew328]

Dropping down is always fun to watch...it took Carthage a few years to really get rolling when they dropped....some teams drop down and do better than they did in 4A but still not great..Paris is one example of that...heck Big Spring has done WORSE since dropping down....Jasper dropped and everyone had them pegged to win it and they lost in the semis to Burnet I believe back in 2002....a lot of folks thought West Orange-Stark would roll in their first year....of course there's Brownwood...lots of variables in play....Henderson is the only one I can think of off the top of my head who won it their first year dropping...Everman went to the semis in year one..and won it year 2 and 3...

[bigwood33]

Dropping down is always fun to watch...it took Carthage a few years to really get rolling when they dropped....some teams drop down and do better than they did in 4A but still not great..Paris is one example of that...heck Big Spring has done WORSE since dropping down....Jasper dropped and everyone had them pegged to win it and they lost in the semis to Burnet I believe back in 2002....a lot of folks thought West Orange-Stark would roll in their first year....of course there's Brownwood...lots of variables in play....Henderson is the only one I can think of off the top of my head who won it their first year dropping...Everman went to the semis in year one..and won it year 2 and 3...
Exactly. The difference at the top isn't much so EVEN teams like the ones I mentioned earlier have to play their best or they get sent home early too.

[Ville-D]

What about the 2a teams that made the jump to 3a? Anybody giving them much of a chance?

[Matthew328]

Other than Celina I don't think many have fared all that great...Pilot Point may have done well their first year back a few years ago...

[bigwood33]

What about the 2a teams that made the jump to 3a? Anybody giving them much of a chance?
I doubt it. Melissa is the defending 2A, Div 1 Champs but I don't think they will be as good next season as they are losing a ton! The last 2A team to make the jump to 3A and make a really deep run was Celina in '06. They were the defending 2A Div 1 Champs and went to the 3A div 2 Title game, only to lose to LH in a great game at Floyd Casey Stadium! That Celina team had 2 current Oklahoma State Cowboys (Jamie Blatnik and Caleb Lavey) and 1 current Penn State Nittany Lion (D'anton Lynn) as well as 2 or 3 Div 2 players.

[LIONS#1]

The very best 4a teams in the State last year were Cedar Park and Lake Travis...and that includes Aledo!! CP was driving and had it not been for a couple of marginal calls in that game CP would have won!!

[Old Tiger]

The very best 4a teams in the State last year were Cedar Park and Lake Travis...and that includes Aledo!! CP was driving and had it not been for a couple of marginal calls in that game CP would have won!!CP always plays LT close...They just know what to do defensively against the Cavs.

[Matthew328]

I thought Midway's defense did a similar job on LT...but their offense was just anemic...

[Old Tiger]

I thought Midway's defense did a similar job on LT...but their offense was just anemic...QB played killed Midway in the title game.

[Tejastrue]

Wimberley had a common opponent with LT in 4A Dripping Springs who made it to the third round losing a close one to Calallen. LT winning 54-19 and Wimberley winning 47-26 and that with a new OL that was still learning to play together (week 1). Wimberley would have competed and held their own. I also felt Cedar Park was every bit as good as LT last year.

[Rabid Cougar]

I thought Midway's defense did a similar job on LT...but their offense was just anemic...

Midway doesn't have a quality QB. Kim Mulkey's son is a good baseball player but was basically running for his life during the playoffs. They had a good running back and a WR that will be D1 but didn't have the QB to match. Thier defense was what got Midway to the Championship.

No way LaVega was on the same level as Tyler Chaple Hill. If that was the case, then 4-6 China Spring was too.

[Tejastrue]

Midway doesn't have a quality QB. Kim Mulkey's son is a good baseball player but was basically running for his life during the playoffs. They had a good running back and a WR that will be D1 but didn't have the QB to match. Thier defense was what got Midway to the Championship.

No way LaVega was on the same level as Tyler Chaple Hill. If that was the case, then 4-6 China Spring was too.


Believe La Vega will have most of last year's team returning. Gotta know they'll be hungry and would love to face CH again. Hope it happens. Would definitely try to make the game.

[OldBison75]

In answer to the question on this thread, the top tier 3A teams can compete with most of the upper level 4A teams and in some cases win. But, there are usually a couple of teams in any classification that can be successful against the next classification up. If you limit it to just a few teams at the upper level of each classification, the odds are the 4A teams will be better than the 3A teams. Below the top though, there are many above average 3A teams that can beat most 4A teams.

As to the comments about this year's CH playoff close calls, I can only speak about one of them. In the Navasota game, the Rattlers did not play well at all, partly because of what CH was able to do defensively. However, Navasota never quit and forced several CH mistakes that kept them in the game. When the chips were on the table late in the game, CH became a different team, mistakes went away and they dominated the last half of the fourth quarter. So, I can only say that although the Rattlers had a chance to pull off the upset, Chapel Hill was the better team from top to bottom that night. They overcame all the mistakes and found a way to win after trailing late in the game.

[Ville-D]

Week 3: Stephenville @ La Vega




3
9/21-Friday
@ Waco La Vega (http://www.texasbob.com/stadium/stadium.php?id=149)

7:30pm




Should be a good game.




Believe La Vega will have most of last year's team returning. Gotta know they'll be hungry and would love to face CH again. Hope it happens. Would definitely try to make the game.

[Tejastrue]

Week 3: Stephenville @ La Vega




3

9/21-Friday

@ Waco La Vega (http://www.texasbob.com/stadium/stadium.php?id=149)


7:30pm






Should be a good game.


Absolutely. One I made a note of when I first heard of the possibility.

[Saggy Aggie]

No way LaVega was on the same level as Tyler Chaple Hill. If that was the case, then 4-6 China Spring was too. Did you go the game?


Pretty sure LV was about 1/2 a yard and 50 seconds from sending Chill home in round 2, not to mention a dropped TD pass by one of their WRs and the fact that they had absolutely no kicker at all.


But yeah, definitely not on Chapel Hill's level...

[hookandladder]

Midway doesn't have a quality QB. Kim Mulkey's son is a good baseball player but was basically running for his life during the playoffs. They had a good running back and a WR that will be D1 but didn't have the QB to match. Thier defense was what got Midway to the Championship.

No way LaVega was on the same level as Tyler Chaple Hill. If that was the case, then 4-6 China Spring was too.

The funny thing about Midway's QB situation is that they had a QB move in from out of State and at most camps this last summer he stood out however did not beat out Robertson at QB, kid is big. Wonder what the story is on him , why he could not beat out Robertson.

[Matthew328]

The funny thing about Midway's QB situation is that they had a QB move in from out of State and at most camps this last summer he stood out however did not beat out Robertson at QB, kid is big. Wonder what the story is on him , why he could not beat out Robertson.

kid was highly touted, big kid, big arm...just never seemed to fit in

[cowboyandchrist]

3A top teams can compete with any 4A team. Example, Chapell Hill had 12 college players on this years team, how many 4A or 5A have that many. In 2005, Tatum had 9 D1 players, Carthage 2010 and Brownwood 2010 could compete with any team 4A or 5a. Gilmer 2009, Cureo 2009, and the list goes on. Now can the same teams compete year after year with 4A or 5a and the answer is no, but the top 3A teams evey year can compete. Just my opinion from watching 40 years of High School football at all levels. One more thing to add. The best high school football team to ever take the field, was the 1983 Daingerfield Tigers. 560 offensive plays ran against the Defense for a grand total of 560 feet not yards but feet.

[Lion70]

don't forget the 16pts given up on the entire season. I bet Coach A is still upset about those points lol.

[Rabid Cougar]

Did you go the game?


Pretty sure LV was about 1/2 a yard and 50 seconds from sending Chill home in round 2, not to mention a dropped TD pass by one of their WRs and the fact that they had absolutely no kicker at all.


But yeah, definitely not on Chapel Hill's level...

No they weren't

China Spring was 15 yards and three shots at the endzone of beating LaVega after dominating them for most of the game. LV had no answer to China Spring running game. Was unimpressed with LaVega. A top flight Chapel Hill would have hung half a hundred on CS.

[waterboy]

don't forget the 16pts given up on the entire season. I bet Coach A is still upset about those points lol.
Actually, it was only 8 points, 2 points came against 4A Kilgore in their first game of the season when a ball went over the punter's head through the endzone (Daingerfield 35, Kilgore 2), and 6 points came against 4A semifinalist Carthage (game 3 of the season) when a DB fell down and the safety tipped the ball, landing in their receiver's hands.......but who's counting?:D They shutout 14 of 16 opponents that season, including 13 in a row. I had the pleasure of seeing that team in person. I really think that if that Tiger defense would've "known" they were going to set records they would've prevented those points (somehow). Just my opinion. Gilmer was the 7th ranked team in 3A that year when we played them in the second game of the season and lost 14-0. I told a buddy of mine in the stands at halftime, "Yep, we will likely lose this game, but at least it'll be to the next state champ." That's how good their defense was. You would've had to have seen them in person to understand.

[Lion70]

Too bad no one saved film would love too see that. A feat never again to be broken. Also who beats a team ( Swenny) 42-0 in the State Championship. You know your good and I got the pleasure of having Coach Alexander as my coach @ henderson.

[Old Tiger]

La Vega should be very good next year...If I am still in Waco I will definitely be there to watch. Wish they would play that one at WISD though because La Vega stadium is terrible.

[Old Tiger]

kid was highly touted, big kid, big arm...just never seemed to fit inpolitics had a lot to do with it according to people around Waco.

[waterboy]

Too bad no one saved film would love too see that. A feat never again to be broken. Also who beats a team ( Swenny) 42-0 in the State Championship. You know your good and I got the pleasure of having Coach Alexander as my coach @ henderson.
Can't find any video of the regular season games, but here's a KLTV news story on those '83-'85 Tiger teams. Boy, how times change, lol:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s9owTM9SyH0&feature=player_detailpage

[toddg]

Can't find any video of the regular season games, but here's a KLTV news story on those '83-'85 Tiger teams. Boy, how times change, lol:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s9owTM9SyH0&feature=player_detailpage

i saw the 83' team in person...and yeah...that D was Awsome to just plain Devastating!

[BwdLion73]

I don't know which made me smile the most, the reporter in a cordoroy sports jacket with a plaid flannel shirt or the two mullets in front of the convience store......"Yup were gona win it like 40 to nuttin....yup":clap:

[waterboy]

i don't know which made me smile the most, the reporter in a cordoroy sports jacket with a plaid flannel shirt or the two mullets in front of the convience store......"yup were gona win it like 40 to nuttin....yup":clap:
:spitlol:LOL! Yep, I KNEW somebody would get a kick out of seeing that!:D

[Lion70]

They were kinda country lol. Coach A looked an acted the same. Thanks for sharing.

[j_dog]

Of course, 4a is much tougher than 3a. At least that seems to be true in the case of Jasper. Jasper NEVER made it past QF in 4a, even though they had some VERY good 4a teams. Whereas, in their first three years 3a, they made it to the Semi's twice and finals once. Jasper had several 4a teams over the years that probably would have done at least as well in 3a. Back then they played 5a's in pre-district almost exclusively and won probably some 80-90% of those games. And the amazing thing is that Jasper even now has within maybe 150 the number of students they had then. So yes, 4a is tougher, much tougher in my opinion.

[Matthew328]

Man what was up with all the showboating?? I thought back in the day everyone just handed the ball to the ref when they scored?? LOL

[hsbtex]

I almost spit my coffee everywhere when I read this.

There is not a single 2011 3A team than could of stayed within 4 TDs of LT. The Cavs were on another level even for 4A. Matter of fact they were the best team I saw last year regardless of classification. Midway was the best team that Sville played last year including Aledo. Midway's defense was crazy good with size and speed all over the field, out of the four 3A state finalist I saw last year none of them had the total amount of athletes that LT, Midway, Aledo, or Manvel put on the field. IMO the four 3A state finalist wouldn't of even won their regions if playing in 4A last year as well.

I am not saying this to denigrate the top 3A teams or what they accomplished last year rather that I think that there is that big of difference most years in the OVERALL talent of the top 3A's vs. the top 4A's. It is a numbers game plain and simple and why we have classifications.



Sville...I agree...I still have not stopped laughing! That is good stuff!! And Tejastrue, you do realize our game with Dripping Srprings was 54 to 7...in the third quarter...right?? It was a nailbiter....
Probably only Carthage could have beat us last year... That was for you Cowboyandchrist :)

[bigwood33]

Of course, 4a is much tougher than 3a. At least that seems to be true in the case of Jasper. Jasper NEVER made it past QF in 4a, even though they had some VERY good 4a teams. Whereas, in their first three years 3a, they made it to the Semi's twice and finals once. Jasper had several 4a teams over the years that probably would have done at least as well in 3a. Back then they played 5a's in pre-district almost exclusively and won probably some 80-90% of those games. And the amazing thing is that Jasper even now has within maybe 150 the number of students they had then. So yes, 4a is tougher, much tougher in my opinion.
The example that you give only strengthens the idea that there isn't much difference in the top of 3A and some of the best 4A teams. Those Jasper teams that you mentioned only went 1 round deeper in the playoffs than previously had occurred, other than the championship team...which MAY have been good enough to get to the semi finals or better in 4A...we will never know for sure.

[Tejastrue]

Sville...I agree...I still have not stopped laughing! That is good stuff!! And Tejastrue, you do realize our game with Dripping Srprings was 54 to 7...in the third quarter...right?? It was a nailbiter....
Probably only Carthage could have beat us last year... That was for you Cowboyandchrist :)

It's the only common link I have to go by. We put 47 on them and Cedar Park put 35 and they had chances to beat you guys in two separate games. Im just saying we were much better than DS and we would have held our own. That is all. If that makes you laugh, please, by all means, enjoy it while it lasts. I believe you guys will have to deal with some humility come next fall as will the Yellowjackets. :crying:

[hsbtex]

It's the only common link I have to go by. We put 47 on them and Cedar Park put 35 and they had chances to beat you guys in two separate games. Im just saying we were much better than DS and we would have held our own. That is all. If that makes you laugh, please, by all means, enjoy it while it lasts. I believe you guys will have to deal with some humility come next fall as will the Yellowjackets. :crying:

I was not laughing at your quote Tejas...I was laughing at the one by gone fishing. Cedar Park was the best team we played last year...by far! If they go D2, they would have won it.
And I think we will do just fine in 5A...no humility over here :)

[Tejastrue]

I was not laughing at your quote Tejas...I was laughing at the one by gone fishing. Cedar Park was the best team we played last year...by far! If they go D2, they would have won it.
And I think we will do just fine in 5A...no humility over here :)

I don't agree with everything GF had to say but he makes some good points, especially about the programs. That's just a reflection of how strong we feel about what's going on here. They say 'laughter is the best medicine' so if this reply enables you continuous laughter at remarks by some of the Wimberley faithful then...enjoy. :wave:

[j_dog]

The example that you give only strengthens the idea that there isn't much difference in the top of 3A and some of the best 4A teams. Those Jasper teams that you mentioned only went 1 round deeper in the playoffs than previously had occurred, other than the championship team...which MAY have been good enough to get to the semi finals or better in 4A...we will never know for sure.
I agree that the 2002 3a Jasper team might have done as well or perhaps even better in 4a. They made 4a QF in 2001 with basically the same players. They were loaded. But not the 2003-04 teams; at least not to the same extent. I simply do not believe that those two teams would have had that kind of success in 4a. Jasper OCCASIONALLY made it to QF in 4a, but made it to two semi's and a state finals in three years straight in 3a. I do not see your reasoning. I feel that several 80's and 90's Jasper 4a teams would have probably won state in the current 3a or at least would have made it to the semi's. For 20 years the Jasper teams were salty year after year after year. There were several 5a teams that would not schedule them, and even fewer 4a teams. Most of the 5a teams that they played (and usually beat) were teams that regularly made deep runs in the 5a playoffs. They had a consistency that has eluded Jasper in 3a. Yet they never had as good a three year run as good as Jasper had for 2002-04. But as you say, that is just an opinion. It helps tremendously to be one of the larger schools in a class, rather than being one of the smaller schools as Jasper was for 42 years. I haven't kept track. But how many state championships has Everman won since going back up to 4a? It seemed like they won state every year in 3a.

[bigwood33]

I think some are missing the point. I'm not saying that those Carthage teams of 08-10, as an example, would have won a state championship in 4A but that they would have played at a high level and made deep runs. Had they been matched up with the eventual state champion in the playoffs, they (Carthage) would have competed very well and possibly would have given themselves a CHANCE to win. In the end, they may not have had enough to win but the gap isn't extremely wide.

[Gone Fishing]

Sville...I agree...I still have not stopped laughing! That is good stuff!! And Tejastrue, you do realize our game with Dripping Srprings was 54 to 7...in the third quarter...right?? It was a nailbiter....
Probably only Carthage could have beat us last year... That was for you Cowboyandchrist :)

Opinions is what makes this fun to read. Its not a number game all the time though. In district 3A 26 (now 27) 3 of the teams have 4A type numbers and a 4th is semi close to the numbers. Wimberley with 690 and Navarro with under 500 are the only true 3A numbers of average. Wimberley has won district 9 out of 10 years (I believe and undefeated in most) and the last three years going - State Champion - Semi finalist - Regional finalist (region 1 that year). Its about football programs and once you get to the 3A numbers (700 and up) it can get pretty equal with 4A teams in general. The best of the best each year, yes the 4A final 4 would beat the 3A final 4, BUT I believe IMO that most of the time they could be very competive games and every once in a while the exceptional 3A team could slide a win in on them AND every "blue moon" beat'um all. I watched LT some the last few years (I live close) and this year they were not as good (great) and IMO 4A was down some AND IMO again - Wimberley , Coldspring , and Argle could have played competive with all of them.
Now watch yourself when you spit your coffee all over yourself, It could be hot. Lol.

[Matthew328]

Since moving back to 4A in 2004 Everman has Zero titles..but they've been pretty consistent up until these last two years

2004: 10-3 lost in Reg Semi-Finals (by one point)
2005: 9-4 lost on Reg Semi-Finals (by thee)
2006: 9-4 lost in Reg Semi-Finals (by four)
2007: 14-1 lost in state semi-finals
2008: 14-1 lost in state semi-finals
2009: 11-3 lost in state quarter-finals
2010: 8-3 lost in bi-district
2011: 6-4 lost in bi-district

[Hat42]

Stephenville should win state this fall,should have won 4a last year with the athletes they had and most of them they have back this year. They should average over 50 per game and defense should be very good. I look forward to keeping up with them in 2012. I am a Bearcat fan but have always respected the Jacket program.

[cowboyandchrist]

Opinions is what makes this fun to read. Its not a number game all the time though. In district 3A 26 (now 27) 3 of the teams have 4A type numbers and a 4th is semi close to the numbers. Wimberley with 690 and Navarro with under 500 are the only true 3A numbers of average. Wimberley has won district 9 out of 10 years (I believe and undefeated in most) and the last three years going - State Champion - Semi finalist - Regional finalist (region 1 that year). Its about football programs and once you get to the 3A numbers (700 and up) it can get pretty equal with 4A teams in general. The best of the best each year, yes the 4A final 4 would beat the 3A final 4, BUT I believe IMO that most of the time they could be very competive games and every once in a while the exceptional 3A team could slide a win in on them AND every "blue moon" beat'um all. I watched LT some the last few years (I live close) and this year they were not as good (great) and IMO 4A was down some AND IMO again - Wimberley , Coldspring , and Argle could have played competive with all of them.
Now watch yourself when you spit your coffee all over yourself, It could be hot. Lol.
If anybody thinks that Carthage or Brownwood in 2010 could not have beaten any 4A team including Lake Travis in 2010 did not see them play. I am not saying would have beat them, but I am saying could have beat them. Chapell Hill could have played with any team in 4A, you do understand they had 12 college football palyers on the team.

[toddg]

If anybody thinks that Carthage or Brownwood in 2010 could not have beaten any 4A team including Lake Travis in 2010 did not see them play. I am not saying would have beat them, but I am saying could have beat them. Chapell Hill could have played with any team in 4A, you do understand they had 12 college football palyers on the team.

with all due respect..Lake Travis would have soundly beaten both those teams....they are just in a class by themselves in 4a....and they have proven that without question.

[Old Green]

Sometimes a 3A can be competitive with top 4A's but the number of and players on 4A teams will outnumber 3A players in skill and depth from the bench.
One team that stands out is the Marlin team in 2002. Ennis was the 2 time 4A state Champ on a 26 game winning streak. Marlin beat them 20-12. Ennis made it to the 4A Semi-Finals in 2002. If the cards fall right and the 4A team is not playing up to par, a 3A can win some of the time.

[cowboyandchrist]

with all due respect..Lake Travis would have soundly beaten both those teams....they are just in a class by themselves in 4a....and they have proven that without question.
How many players on Lake Travis played college ball this year or any year they won the SC. You only think they would have beaten those teams soundly, anybody that watched them play knows better. Beat them maybe, beat them soundly very very doubtful. Chapell Hill this year, could have beat them. Chances were 50/50

[zebrablue2]

Stephenville should win state this fall,should have won 4a last year with the athletes they had and most of them they have back this year. They should average over 50 per game and defense should be very good. I look forward to keeping up with them in 2012. I am a Bearcat fan but have always respected the Jacket program.


The two key words, should have, along with one key word----should/// thats why the play the games.... Welcome to the board!!!

[Hat42]

Thank you Sir

[hsbtex]

Opinions is what makes this fun to read. Its not a number game all the time though. In district 3A 26 (now 27) 3 of the teams have 4A type numbers and a 4th is semi close to the numbers. Wimberley with 690 and Navarro with under 500 are the only true 3A numbers of average. Wimberley has won district 9 out of 10 years (I believe and undefeated in most) and the last three years going - State Champion - Semi finalist - Regional finalist (region 1 that year). Its about football programs and once you get to the 3A numbers (700 and up) it can get pretty equal with 4A teams in general. The best of the best each year, yes the 4A final 4 would beat the 3A final 4, BUT I believe IMO that most of the time they could be very competive games and every once in a while the exceptional 3A team could slide a win in on them AND every "blue moon" beat'um all. I watched LT some the last few years (I live close) and this year they were not as good (great) and IMO 4A was down some AND IMO again - Wimberley , Coldspring , and Argle could have played competive with all of them.
Now watch yourself when you spit your coffee all over yourself, It could be hot. Lol.

Laughing...I will watch myself :) I agree, some could be competitive with the top of 4a, but saying they would win, or have a chance to win is a little far fetched. The enrollment numbers are there for a reason, to keep things fair.

[hsbtex]

How many players on Lake Travis played college ball this year or any year they won the SC. You only think they would have beaten those teams soundly, anybody that watched them play knows better. Beat them maybe, beat them soundly very very doubtful. Chapell Hill this year, could have beat them. Chances were 50/50

Cowboy, your east texas tinted glasses are hysterical. Why don't you ladies ever schedule Longview, seeing as they are your big brother over there in east texas? Let's try that first, as a measuring stick.

And surely you remember what we have done to Longview....

[Ernest T Bass]

Stephenville should win state this fall,should have won 4a last year with the athletes they had and most of them they have back this year. They should average over 50 per game and defense should be very good. I look forward to keeping up with them in 2012. I am a Bearcat fan but have always respected the Jacket program.

Negatory. The team that should have won 4a for the last 3 years did win 4a. No one had the kids that Aledo had in 4aD2.

[Emerson1]

Stephenville should win state this fall,should have won 4a last year with the athletes they had and most of them they have back this year. They should average over 50 per game and defense should be very good. I look forward to keeping up with them in 2012. I am a Bearcat fan but have always respected the Jacket program.

Uhhhhhh no. They struggled to beat teams like Waco U and had to come from behind against someone else too. The beat down by Aledo was an accurate reading on who Stephenville was last year.


you do understand they had 12 college football palyers on the team.
That means nothing unless it was D1 guys. Forney had like 8 guys sign a year we went 3-7, but probably 6 of them were to podunk DII and DIII schools. So saying 12 college players isn't the best indicator.

[waterboy]

with all due respect..Lake Travis would have soundly beaten both those teams....they are just in a class by themselves in 4a....and they have proven that without question.
I tend to agree with this statement. There's no argument that Lake Travis has been the most dominant team in the state the last five years in any classification. It'll be interesting to see how they do in 5A. If they win state in 5A this year, or the next, then maybe something can be said about the best team from a lower classification being able to step up a class and compete. There have been a few "special" teams in the last decade in 3A that make you wonder if they could've competed for state at the next level, but chances are they would've gotten beat. After all, they have classifications for a reason. Depth of talent changes the higher you go up the class ladder.

[Matthew328]

How many players on Lake Travis played college ball this year or any year they won the SC. You only think they would have beaten those teams soundly, anybody that watched them play knows better. Beat them maybe, beat them soundly very very doubtful. Chapell Hill this year, could have beat them. Chances were 50/50

2007: Garrett Gilbert, Jr (signed w/Texas)
2007: Paden Kelly, Jr (signed w/Texas)
2007: Trevor Gillette, So (signed w/Rice)
2007: Andy Erickson, So (signed w/Rice)

2008: Garrett Gilbert, Sr (signed w/Texas)
2008: Paden Kelly, Sr (signed w/Texas)
2008: Trevor Gillette, Jr (signed w/Rice)
2008: Andy Erickson, Jr (signed w/Rice)
2008: Michael Brewer, So (signed w/Texas Tech)
2008: Taylor Doyle, So (signed w/Texas)
2008: Conner Floyd, So (signed w/Tulsa)
2008: Austin Williams, So (signed w/Tulsa)

2009: Trevor Gillette, Sr (signed w/Rice)
2009: Andy Erickson, Sr (signed w/Rice)
2009: Michael Brewer, Jr (signed w/Texas Tech)
2009: Taylor Doyle, Jr (signed w/Texas)
2009: Conner Floyd, Jr (signed w/Tulsa)
2009: Austin Williams, Jr (signed w/Tulsa)
2009: Griffin Gilbert, So (signed w/TCU)
2009: Colin Lagasse, So (signed w/SMU)

2010: Michael Brewer, Sr (signed w/Texas Tech)
2010: Taylor Doyle, Sr (signed w/Texas)
2010: Conner Floyd, Sr (signed w/Tulsa)
2010: Austin Williams, Sr (signed w/Tulsa)
2010: Griffin Gilbert, Jr (signed w/TCU)
2010: Colin Lagasse, Jr (signed w/SMU)
2010: Dannon Cavil, So (will sign with a D1 school)
2010: Brock Kenyon, So (will likely sign with a D1 school)

2011: Griffin Gilbert, Sr (signed w/TCU)
2011: Colin Lagasse, Sr (signed w/SMU)
2011: Brock Kenyon, Jr (will likely sign with a D1 school)
2011: Varshaun Nixon, So (will likely sign with a D1 school)

[Matthew328]

FWIW I can't think of a 3A team that would have been able to compete with Lake Travis...two of those state titles Lake Travis pimp slapped Longview who is pretty much universally considered the top team in East Texas..

[Farmersfan]

On a 1 game basis the best 3A teams could compete with a really good 4A teams. but guess what? Put that "best" 3a team in a 10 game 4A schedule and it is no longer a "Best" team. All the comparisons between 4A winners and 3A winners is useless because each team was successful against a different class of competition on a weekly basis. And the argument about the Harris ratings is flawed because, Argyle, for example, was ranked where they were because of their success against 3A competition. If they had played 4A teams every week they would not be ranked anywhere near as high. Winning a State Championship title at any level is about 50% confidence and a 3A team that had tons of success against 3A opponents will have a different confidence against 3A teams than they would if they had played a bunch of 4A teams. A regular season record of 10-0 in 3A could very likely be a 6-4 record against 4A competition and the confidence just wouldn't be there in the 4A playoffs. You guys are comparing the end results of the journey and not considering the journey itself!

[waterboy]

On a 1 game basis the best 3A teams could compete with a really good 4A teams. but guess what? Put that "best" 3a team in a 10 game 4A schedule and it is no longer a "Best" team. All the comparisons between 4A winners and 3A winners is useless because each team was successful against a different class of competition on a weekly basis. And the argument about the Harris ratings is flawed because, Argyle, for example, was ranked where they were because of their success against 3A competition. If they had played 4A teams every week they would not be ranked anywhere near as high. Winning a State Championship title at any level is about 50% confidence and a 3A team that had tons of success against 3A opponents will have a different confidence against 3A teams than they would if they had played a bunch of 4A teams. A regular season record of 10-0 in 3A could very likely be a 6-4 record against 4A competition and the confidence just wouldn't be there in the 4A playoffs. You guys are comparing the end results of the journey and not considering the journey itself!
I can't believe this, but I agree with FF on this. The wear and tear of playing a 4A schedule as compared to a 3A would most definitely take a toll. The depth alone would prove that's the case. I've always said that in 3A, given all things equal with talent, coaching, etc., you still have to have depth AND luck (injuries play more of a part in 3A) to win it all. In 4A, an injury to a starter (luck) doesn't play as much of a factor because of the depth of talent. The guy off the bench is more likely to be closer to the talent of the injured starter, and even better in some cases.

[hsbtex]

I can't believe this, but I agree with FF on this. The wear and tear of playing a 4A schedule as compared to a 3A would most definitely take a toll. The depth alone would prove that's the case. I've always said that in 3A, given all things equal with talent, coaching, etc., you still have to have depth AND luck (injuries play more of a part in 3A) to win it all. In 4A, an injury to a starter (luck) doesn't play as much of a factor because of the depth of talent. The guy off the bench is more likely to be closer to the talent of the injured starter, and even better in some cases.

Waterboy and Farmersfan...I agree. 4a teams can handle the injuries MUCH better than 3a...hence the classifications (to make things fair). 3a competition is very good...but against the majority 3a competition.
And Mathew, thanks for the list. I could help out with that list with D1AA, D2, D3 and jc's (like cowboy is doing)...but didn't want to get into that BEATDOWN with cowboyandchrist. I used the same analysis with Longview...we will wait and see what witty comeback cowboyandchrist has for that one :) I remember hearing how AWESOME longview was (the beast from the east!) that first year we played them in the SC, and after the first quarter (when it was 24 to 3), I was scratching my head, thinking ...really?? It was HYSTERICAL how the cockiness from them seemed to evaporate after the first quarter :)

[hollywood]

On a 1 game basis the best 3A teams could compete with a really good 4A teams. but guess what? Put that "best" 3a team in a 10 game 4A schedule and it is no longer a "Best" team. All the comparisons between 4A winners and 3A winners is useless because each team was successful against a different class of competition on a weekly basis. And the argument about the Harris ratings is flawed because, Argyle, for example, was ranked where they were because of their success against 3A competition. If they had played 4A teams every week they would not be ranked anywhere near as high. Winning a State Championship title at any level is about 50% confidence and a 3A team that had tons of success against 3A opponents will have a different confidence against 3A teams than they would if they had played a bunch of 4A teams. A regular season record of 10-0 in 3A could very likely be a 6-4 record against 4A competition and the confidence just wouldn't be there in the 4A playoffs. You guys are comparing the end results of the journey and not considering the journey itself!

Agree because it's true. Depth is biggest issue with 3A's being as good as 4A's.

[Buckeye1980]

I know the question is 4A and 3A but when the question of differences between classes come up , I will always think of Tatum, winning state in 3A in 2005 and dropping to 2A and winning state in 2006. Not moving up a class and winning state but moving down and winning state, regardless, 2 state titles in back to back years in 2 different classes.

Now on this topic, can 3A compete with 4A? Not every game all the time but some games, any team could beat another. Is LT unbeatable? for the last 5 years , pretty much so. It is all about how another team can match up on ANY given night. Just because CH had 12 college signees, does not mean that they could not have been beaten by a very good 5A team with NO signees. In 2006 , Gilmer got what I feel their best team was beaten in first round by LE, did all the college bound talent help that night? Unfortunatley not.

While on this subject , can a very good college team compete in the NFL? If you want to go by numbers alone, than the college team may have more depth......let the opinions flow.....

[Tejastrue]

On a 1 game basis the best 3A teams could compete with a really good 4A teams. but guess what? Put that "best" 3a team in a 10 game 4A schedule and it is no longer a "Best" team. All the comparisons between 4A winners and 3A winners is useless because each team was successful against a different class of competition on a weekly basis. And the argument about the Harris ratings is flawed because, Argyle, for example, was ranked where they were because of their success against 3A competition. If they had played 4A teams every week they would not be ranked anywhere near as high. Winning a State Championship title at any level is about 50% confidence and a 3A team that had tons of success against 3A opponents will have a different confidence against 3A teams than they would if they had played a bunch of 4A teams. A regular season record of 10-0 in 3A could very likely be a 6-4 record against 4A competition and the confidence just wouldn't be there in the 4A playoffs. You guys are comparing the end results of the journey and not considering the journey itself!



You are talking 'glass half empty' in regards to 3A success. They could easily do well and have all the confidence in the world going into the playoffs. I think most would agree it's about the quality of the numbers instead of quantity. Having depth does not necessarily equate to success. Injuries, especially to key players, affect every team, no matter what classification. There are a ton of 4A schools out there that can be beaten consistently by your better 3A programs.

[Matthew328]

Here's something to consider, very few of the elite 3A programs that have moved up to 4A have experienced big time success at the 4A level...when Forney left 3A they were an elite program...they went 4A and got average real quick..Southlake Carroll when they moved up was good, but they never had the level of success in 3A or 5A that they had in 4A...when Burnet left 3A they were elite...went 4A and became average...4A is much more of a week in week out grind...you are getting tested each and every week

[coachc45]

Here's something to consider, very few of the elite 3A programs that have moved up to 4A have experienced big time success at the 4A level...when Forney left 3A they were an elite program...they went 4A and got average real quick.."Southlake Carroll when they moved up was good, but they never had the level of success in 3A or 5A that they had in 4A"...when Burnet left 3A they were elite...went 4A and became average...4A is much more of a week in week out grind...you are getting tested each and every week

I think you meant to say SLC never had the success in 4A that they have had in 3A and 5A.

[Buckeye1980]

Here's something to consider, very few of the elite 3A programs that have moved up to 4A have experienced big time success at the 4A level...when Forney left 3A they were an elite program...they went 4A and got average real quick..Southlake Carroll when they moved up was good, but they never had the level of success in 3A or 5A that they had in 4A...when Burnet left 3A they were elite...went 4A and became average...4A is much more of a week in week out grind...you are getting tested each and every week


FIVE State Championships in the last 10 years for Southlake in 5A is nort sucessful? You , my friend , have high standards!

[Matthew328]

yes I meant to say Southlake never had the success in 4A that they've had in 3A and 5A.....Southlake has ZERO titles at the 4A level...when they moved up they went through a few less than Southlake like years

[Gone Fishing]

You are talking 'glass half empty' in regards to 3A success. They could easily do well and have all the confidence in the world going into the playoffs. I think most would agree it's about the quality of the numbers instead of quantity. Having depth does not necessarily equate to success. Injuries, especially to key players, affect every team, no matter what classification. There are a ton of 4A schools out there that can be beaten consistently by your better 3A programs.

Agree Tejas....

[cowboyandchrist]

Agree Tejas....
4a Kilgore (Quarter finalist 2011) looses to Carhtage and Gilmer more often than not. I must admit, he got me on the Lake Travis beating Longview. Longview is the best East Texas team we have, they just can not win the last game of the year. They have more talent than you can imagine and just choke when it counts.

[toddg]

if Lake Travis's schedule last year consisted of the 3a end of season top ten teams...they would have gone undefeated.

[Matthew328]

4a Kilgore (Quarter finalist 2011) looses to Carhtage and Gilmer more often than not. I must admit, he got me on the Lake Travis beating Longview. Longview is the best East Texas team we have, they just can not win the last game of the year. They have more talent than you can imagine and just choke when it counts.

They didnt choke they just got beat by a better team

[toddg]

2010 Aledo's offensive line..would have mauled both Brownwood and Carthage's front 7....they were not just big, but in shape and skilled big!

[toddg]

4a Kilgore (Quarter finalist 2011) looses to Carhtage and Gilmer more often than not. I must admit, he got me on the Lake Travis beating Longview. Longview is the best East Texas team we have, they just can not win the last game of the year. They have more talent than you can imagine and just choke when it counts.
4a Kilgore last year was average at best..beating other average 4a teams to get to 4th round last year..got beat handily by an above avg. corsicana, who in turn got their arses handed to them by top 4a team Aledo. the difference between top 3a and top 4a is way bigger than you think..its very big apples and small oranges.

[BEAST]

4a Kilgore last year was average at best..beating other average 4a teams to get to 4th round last year..got beat handily by an above avg. corsicana, who in turn got their arses handed to them by top 4a team Aledo. the difference between top 3a and top 4a is way bigger than you think..its very big apples and small oranges.

Sometimes yes it is, others not so much. Brownwood isnt all that far removed from a semi final and a couple quarterfinal runs in 4A. I think its more about good coaching, good off season, good kids, and a little luck.




BEAST

[Matthew328]

I think in 4A the disparity between Division 1 and Division 2 is much greater...that plays into things as well...Kilgore made their run in a very shaky D2 bracket, that run wouldn't have been quite as cushy in D1

[hsbtex]

Matthew, that was especially true this past year. There was a LARGE difference between division 1 and 2 4A this past year. And about Kilgore...they would have had a tougher time getting out of region 2 3A than the 4a division 2 route they went through. Kilgore was average last year...AT BEST.

And Cowboy, Longview didn't choke...they just didn't like getting hit. You wouldn't think they would "choke" two consecutive years. It was very evident after the first quarter of the first game who the better team was

[Lion70]

Yall do realize Henderson took kilgore behind the woodshed last year. In facts three years in a row.

[cowboyandchrist]

Matthew, that was especially true this past year. There was a LARGE difference between division 1 and 2 4A this past year. And about Kilgore...they would have had a tougher time getting out of region 2 3A than the 4a division 2 route they went through. Kilgore was average last year...AT BEST.

And Cowboy, Longview didn't choke...they just didn't like getting hit. You wouldn't think they would "choke" two consecutive years. It was very evident after the first quarter of the first game who the better team was
Wrong they were out coached, they put more players in the NFL than any other High School in Texas. This year alone there were three players from Longview on the Redskins. Check out the history of Lobo football, they are one of the most talented teams in the state year after year, but always choke in the playoffs.

[Matthew328]

Sorry but Longview got their butts kicked in both games...Lake Travis was FAR superior...

[waterboy]

Sorry but Longview got their butts kicked in both games...Lake Travis was FAR superior...
I agree. Longview did get beat by the better team both times. Although Longview had more talent, LT had the better TEAM. It just goes to show that talent doesn't always equate to winning.

[cowboyandchrist]

Sorry but Longview got their butts kicked in both games...Lake Travis was FAR superior...
Give Longview coach S from Carthage or coach T from Gimer and there would be a new king in 5A football for many years to come.

[toddg]

Wrong they were out coached, they put more players in the NFL than any other High School in Texas. This year alone there were three players from Longview on the Redskins. Check out the history of Lobo football, they are one of the most talented teams in the state year after year, but always choke in the playoffs.

well...they didnt choke in 37'....atleast they have a championship..like in ferris bueller when ferris called camerons car a piece of Shhh! "but i dont even have a piece of Shhh, so i have to envy yours"! oh well.. carry on!

[Lion70]

1937 1A state champs where they wore leather helments your right very impressive. Gotta Love the chokebos.
Death , Taxes, & Longview loses in the playoffs.

[Old Tiger]

Wrong they were out coached, they put more players in the NFL than any other High School in Texas. This year alone there were three players from Longview on the Redskins. Check out the history of Lobo football, they are one of the most talented teams in the state year after year, but always choke in the playoffs.All that talent with no title...shame. Maybe they are top heavy on the talent and don't have it where you need it most, offensive and defefensive line.

[MGAR]

Give Longview coach S from Carthage or coach T from Gimer and there would be a new king in 5A football for many years to come.

Does Surratt know your the president of his fan club? Great coach no doubt but no way I would take him or Traylor over King at Longview.

And to say Longview choked clearly shows you really are clueless. Lake Travis was the better team in those two games, Katy was the better team in 1997.

As far as the original topic title- 3A vs. 4A: What's the difference... Ask lion70, he should know. :1popcorn:

[waterboy]

All that talent with no title...shame. Maybe they are top heavy on the talent and don't have it where you need it most, offensive and defefensive line.
OR, they played against a better TEAM both times..........

Just a thought........:thinking:

As I said, more talent doesn't always equate to winning. LT executed better, played better, were coached better, etc. The better team won both title games. That's hard for some Lobo fans to swallow, but it is the truth. Longview's time will come. We just don't know when.

[MGAR]

OR, they played against a better TEAM both times..........

Just a thought........:thinking:

As I said, more talent doesn't always equate to winning. LT executed better, played better, were coached better, etc. The better team won both title games. That's hard for some Lobo fans to swallow, but it is the truth. Longview's time will come. We just don't know when.

That's the truth...

[Lion70]

OR, they played against a better TEAM both times..........

Just a thought........:thinking:

As I said, more talent doesn't always equate to winning. LT executed better, played better, were coached better, etc. The better team won both title games. That's hard for some Lobo fans to swallow, but it is the truth. Longview's time will come. We just don't know when.

lol 75 yrs and waiting I wouldn't hold my breath for the chokebos.

[Old Tiger]

One thing about the Longview Lobos is there is always next year!

[waterboy]

lol 75 yrs and waiting I wouldn't hold my breath for the chokebos.
I know you hate the Lobos because of some of their fans, but seriously, they did get beat by the better TEAM both of those games. I guess if the Lobos "choked" then the other three teams LT beat in the championship game "choked", too. It's not a matter of choking, in my opinion, when you get beat by the better team. I don't think there's any shame in losing to the better team.

[Lion70]

I know you hate the Lobos because of some of their fans, but seriously, they did get beat by the better TEAM both of those games. I guess if the Lobos "choked" then the other three teams LT beat in the championship game "choked", too. It's not a matter of choking, in my opinion, when you get beat by the better team. I don't think there's any shame in losing to the better team.

Yeah your right about that. Plus I never denied there a great team with great traditon. They just fail and yes LT was better. Other years LObos have been better but they just couldn't get that killer intensity.

[cowboyandchrist]

2010 Aledo's offensive line..would have mauled both Brownwood and Carthage's front 7....they were not just big, but in shape and skilled big!
From what you said I can tell you never saw the 08 or 2010 O-line or D-line of the Dawgs. They were big, strong and fast. The only thing you had that would beat the Dawgs was an all world running back, without him the Dawgs and Brownwood would of sent you home with a loss. In 08 the DAWGS had a pretty good running back of their own.

[cowboyandchrist]

They didnt choke they just got beat by a better team
You are right they did get beat by the better team, twice. The point I tried to make and did not do a very good job of, is the Lobos since 1974 have had state winning teams, that get out played or coached or just plain bad luck. In 1976 Odessa P kicks a 64 yard field goal to beat the Lobos with three future NFL players on the team. Every year they do something crazy. One year they have an all world running back against Lufkin in the playoffs and fumble 7 times. It is always something. Two years ago and I maybe wrong on the year, all they have to do is punt the ball for the win, it gets blocked and they loose. You get my point.

[toddg]

From what you said I can tell you never saw the 08 or 2010 O-line or D-line of the Dawgs. They were big, strong and fast. The only thing you had that would beat the Dawgs was an all world running back, without him the Dawgs and Brownwood would of sent you home with a loss. In 08 the DAWGS had a pretty good running back of their own.

2010 brownwood nor 2010 carthage could beat 2010 Aledo...not even close:devil:

[Ville-D]

2010 brownwood nor 2010 carthage could beat 2010 Aledo...not even close:devil:


:iagree:

Absolutely

[Tejastrue]

2010 brownwood nor 2010 carthage could beat 2010 Aledo...not even close:devil:

When a district consists of the likes of Springtown, Boswell, Azle, Birdville , Brewer and Byron Nelson, etc...LOL , not exactly 'all world' beaters, it sure does help. Not much wearing down a team before the playoffs. All of these teams would have struggled against the better 3A teams for sure, not to mention losing decisively to the best!! As far as the Stephenville folk, the only reason you agree is because you lost and can't deal with the thought that a 3A school just might compete and win, when you guys failed to do so.

[Ville-D]

When a district consists of the likes of Springtown, Boswell, Azle, Birdville , Brewer and Byron Nelson, etc...LOL , not exactly 'all world' beaters, it sure does help. Not much wearing down a team before the playoffs. All of these teams would have struggled against the better 3A teams for sure, not to mention losing decisively to the best!! As far as the Stephenville folk, the only reason you agree is because you lost and can't deal with the thought that a 3A school just might compete and win, when you guys failed to do so.

I agree because I watched all 4 games. Stephenville vs Aledo (2x); Stephenville vs Brownwood and Brownwood vs Carthage. I also watched video of Aledo beat Lake Travis and video of every Aledo playoff game that year. It has nothing to do with the week district they were in... They were far better than any 3a and 4a team that year. I just wish they could have played LT again in the playoffs - maybe LT would have come out on top in the rematch.

Anybody watched all 4 of these teams play that year will agree.

[toddg]

When a district consists of the likes of Springtown, Boswell, Azle, Birdville , Brewer and Byron Nelson, etc...LOL , not exactly 'all world' beaters, it sure does help. Not much wearing down a team before the playoffs. All of these teams would have struggled against the better 3A teams for sure, not to mention losing decisively to the best!! As far as the Stephenville folk, the only reason you agree is because you lost and can't deal with the thought that a 3A school just might compete and win, when you guys failed to do so.

2010 Aledo beat Lake Travis early in that season...destroyed a loaded la marque team in the final..that Aledo team would have beaten all top 3a teams by 4 tds or more...the 4 4a finalist this year would have crushed the 4 3a finalist this year..there is a very big difference between the top 4a and top 3a...who gives a @#$@ what teams are in their district..you probably dont even know where Boswell HS is..Wimberley would have struggled to beat Birdville btw.

[Ville-D]

2010 Aledo beat Lake Travis early in that season...destroyed a loaded la marque team in the final..that Aledo team would have beaten all top 3a teams by 4 tds or more...the 4 4a finalist this year would have crushed the 4 3a finalist this year..there is a very big difference between the top 4a and top 3a...who gives a @#$@ what teams are in their district..you probably dont even know where Boswell HS is..Wimberley would have struggled to beat Birdville btw.

Struggled is putting it nicely...

[Tejastrue]

2010 Aledo beat Lake Travis early in that season...destroyed a loaded la marque team in the final..that Aledo team would have beaten all top 3a teams by 4 tds or more...the 4 4a finalist this year would have crushed the 4 3a finalist this year..there is a very big difference between the top 4a and top 3a...who gives a @#$@ what teams are in their district..you probably dont even know where Boswell HS is..Wimberley would have struggled to beat Birdville btw.

Before you choose to assume (and we all know what that means) I apologize that this may have offended you. I grew up in the North Ft Worth area way before Boswell was 4A and probably before you were in diapers. This is all mere speculation. Ville-D, did you not say that you agree? The only reason I mention about a district is because others here have talked about if a top 3A team was in a 4A district they would wear down over the long haul of the district competition. I believe that Wimberley would have beaten any team in that district, (not counting Aledo) with ease..that is all, Argyle too.... Forgot to mention..thanks for spelling Wimberley correctly..most hot-heads get it wrong..Lol..

[Ville-D]

Before you choose to assume (and we all know what that means) I apologize that this may have offended you. I grew up in the North Ft Worth area way before Boswell was 4A and probably before you were in diapers. This is all mere speculation. Ville-D, did you not say that you agree? The only reason I mention about a district is because others here have talked about if a top 3A team was in a 4A district they would wear down over the long haul of the district competition. I believe that Wimberley would have beaten any team in that district, (not counting Aledo) with ease..that is all, Argyle too.... Forgot to mention..thanks for spelling Wimberley correctly..most hot-heads get it wrong..Lol..


So you are ending the debate about Aledo beating Brownwood and Carthage by saying that Wimberley would have beaten everybody in Aledos district except Aledo? :confused:

Well played... I guess?

[Tejastrue]

So you are ending the debate about Aledo beating Brownwood and Carthage by saying that Wimberley would have beaten everybody in Aledos district except Aledo? :confused:

Well played... I guess?

How am I ending the debate?? Read what I said duffuss, 'with ease', welcome to 3A!! :crazy: FYI, I'll be here for the long haul to defend 3A Football!!

[toddg]

Before you choose to assume (and we all know what that means) I apologize that this may have offended you. I grew up in the North Ft Worth area way before Boswell was 4A and probably before you were in diapers. This is all mere speculation. Ville-D, did you not say that you agree? The only reason I mention about a district is because others here have talked about if a top 3A team was in a 4A district they would wear down over the long haul of the district competition. I believe that Wimberley would have beaten any team in that district, (not counting Aledo) with ease..that is all, Argyle too.... Forgot to mention..thanks for spelling Wimberley correctly..most hot-heads get it wrong..Lol..

i was in cloth diapers in 66' an since Boswell opened in 60-61 that means you grew up in saginaw in the 50's and early 60's...damn you're old! and yes both Birdville and Boswell were pretty good 4a teams and have been for a few years now, the rest of that dist sucked...us 3a schools need to just worry about 3a schools..there is plenty of competition to go around...

[MGAR]

How am I ending the debate?? Read what I said duffuss, 'with ease', welcome to 3A!! :crazy: FYI, I'll be here for the long haul to defend 3A Football!!

You and Chapel Hill both.

[regaleagle]

Gee Wally, I was watching Leave it to Beaver and playing neighborhood football in '66, as was some our our illustrious posters here. Eddie was always getting into trouble, and trying to schmooze Ward and June. Wally was an upstanding guy in high school, and didn't go for Eddie's antics. Gee Wally, why are people like Eddie always trying to make themselves look so good? I don't know Beave. I guess they just want some attention. Don't worry Ville D, you'll get plenty of attention, alright.

[regaleagle]

When I say you, I mean your teams and posters, of course. I'm with Tejastru here. Teams like Wimberley, Carthage, Celina, Gilmer, Brownwood, West Columbia, and yes, even Argyle will not just roll over for the 4a drop downs. And I'm not just talking football here. "What's for supper, Grandpa?" :stirpot:

[Ville-D]

Not sure how this came back around to Stephenville vs the world other than the fact that I have Stephenville as my location... Oh well. Pile on for now, we'll see how things roll next fall.

So, in conclusion we are all in agreement that the 2010 Aledo team would have beaten any of the top 3a teams.

[ronwx5x]

Not sure how this came back around to Stephenville vs the world other than the fact that I have Stephenville as my location... Oh well. Pile on for now, we'll see how things roll next fall.

So, in conclusion we are all in agreement that the 2010 Aledo team would have beaten any of the top 3a teams.

I saw the SC games in 2010 and based only on that one game, I think Aledo would have beaten any 3A team there.

[Gone Fishing]

2010 Aledo beat Lake Travis early in that season...destroyed a loaded la marque team in the final..that Aledo team would have beaten all top 3a teams by 4 tds or more...the 4 4a finalist this year would have crushed the 4 3a finalist this year..there is a very big difference between the top 4a and top 3a...who gives a @#$@ what teams are in their district..you probably dont even know where Boswell HS is..Wimberley would have struggled to beat Birdville btw.

BS and Wimberley would have killed Birdville or the other teams too except one. Wimberley does'nt get the credit as a great great team last year because most of yall have this region IV not as good BS in your head. Wimberley is not in south Texas!!!! The way the crows fly it is about 20 miles from Lake Travis. Our coaches just make the decision to win by 45 - 14 type scores when it easily could have been 70 - 0 or maybe 7 type scores, like many many of you "north and east" teams do. I like the fact that soph and Jrs get valuable playing time and its a good chance that very thing might help them go very deep again next year. I said it before weeks ago and i'll say it again - Wimberley, Coldspring, Argyle, CH and a couple others that I didn't see, would have given the 4 A teams a hell of a game and / or possibly won... AND a couple of you drop down 4A teams that didn't even make it to the show last year, but have already put your names down as SC or deeeeep playoff runs, will have a rude awakening in top tier 3A games that you will play. Trust me, you dont know 3A like you think you do.

[Lion70]

BS and Wimberley would have killed Birdville or the other teams too except one. Wimberley does'nt get the credit as a great great team last year because most of yall have this region IV not as good BS in your head. Wimberley is not in south Texas!!!! The way the crows fly it is about 20 miles from Lake Travis. Our coaches just make the decision to win by 45 - 14 type scores when it easily could have been 70 - 0 or maybe 7 type scores, like many many of you "north and east" teams do. I like the fact that soph and Jrs get valuable playing time and its a good chance that very thing might help them go very deep again next year. I said it before weeks ago and i'll say it again - Wimberley, Coldspring, Argyle, CH and a couple others that I didn't see, would have given the 4 A teams a hell of a game and / or possibly won... AND a couple of you drop down 4A teams that didn't even make it to the show last year, but have already put your names down as SC or deeeeep playoff runs, will have a rude awakening in top tier 3A games that you will play. Trust me, you dont know 3A like you think you do.

I wonder what excuse will be made when the Ville doesn't win state..... But were Stephenville (insert crying now)......

[Tejastrue]

i was in cloth diapers in 66' an since Boswell opened in 60-61 that means you grew up in saginaw in the 50's and early 60's...damn you're old! and yes both Birdville and Boswell were pretty good 4a teams and have been for a few years now, the rest of that dist sucked...us 3a schools need to just worry about 3a schools..there is plenty of competition to go around...

Not quite in Saginaw. South of Blue Mound, just a few miles east of Meacham Field Airport (now called Meacham International). Yes the 60's. Grew up there and stayed until graduation then got the hell out asap!! Old??, I prefer to call it 'aged' as in a fine wine. LOL.. It's fun to debate this. A little chest thumping doesn't hurt. My comments may appear 'over the top' sometimes but it's just how strongly I feel about our football program and where it is headed. I do however hope Wimberley stays 3A for many years to come.

[Matthew328]

Sounds like you grew up near Diamond Hill

[Tejastrue]

Not sure how this came back around to Stephenville vs the world other than the fact that I have Stephenville as my location... Oh well. Pile on for now, we'll see how things roll next fall.

So, in conclusion we are all in agreement that the 2010 Aledo team would have beaten any of the top 3a teams.

Things like your Stephenville logo. Are you guys now called the Superjackets? :wave: Yes we are in agreement that Aledo would have a 50/50 chance to beat any of the top 3A teams of 2010. Give me a healthy Wimberley in that year and I'd say we had a shot. You gotta believe.:D

[Tejastrue]

Sounds like you grew up near Diamond Hill

Yes sir. In those days we had a pretty decent baseball program but football was just well, not very good. I can't recall if it ever has been. Still, I enjoyed being a part of both sports.

[Matthew328]

Snyder's been using that superman logo for about eight years or so

[Ville-D]

Not quite in Saginaw. South of Blue Mound, just a few miles east of Meacham Field Airport (now called Meacham International). Yes the 60's. Grew up there and stayed until graduation then got the hell out asap!! Old??, I prefer to call it 'aged' as in a fine wine. LOL.. It's fun to debate this. A little chest thumping doesn't hurt. My comments may appear 'over the top' sometimes but it's just how strongly I feel about our football program and where it is headed. I do however hope Wimberley stays 3A for many years to come.

I agree it is fun to debate. And I too feel strongly about our program. It is not like we were some bottom feeder 4a team dropping down thinking we were being reborn to dominate 3a. We have been one of the top 4a programs the past several years and I don't think the drop to 3a is going to hurt our program. I guess we will have to wait till week 3 so you 3a gurus can make your decision on our future. But knowing our boys, coaches and community, I think our future is bright.



Things like your Stephenville logo. Are you guys now called the Superjackets? :wave: Yes we are in agreement that Aledo would have a 50/50 chance to beat any of the top 3A teams of 2010. Give me a healthy Wimberley in that year and I'd say we had a shot. You gotta believe.:D

Glad you like the logo, I came up with that last week... Maybe it will catch on. You gotta have a little confidence.

[hsbtex]

Does Surratt know your the president of his fan club? Great coach no doubt but no way I would take him or Traylor over King at Longview.

And to say Longview choked clearly shows you really are clueless. Lake Travis was the better team in those two games, Katy was the better team in 1997.

As far as the original topic title- 3A vs. 4A: What's the difference... Ask lion70, he should know. :1popcorn:

I hope Surratt has Cowboy on his mailing list! I think I just read where Cowboy admitted that we were the better team both years, meaning the east texas tinted glasses I think were just removed :) And no disrespect to Aledo (they were a great team), but they were not the second best team in 4A last year. There is no way their defense could have stopped Cedar Park. They were the biggest, hardest hitting team we played all last year...twice. Glad they are not in our district anymore!

[ccmom]

Ville D, your avatar looks a lot like Snyder's helmet logo. I'm pretty sure Superman copied it from Snyder. ;)

[cowboyandchrist]

2010 Aledo beat Lake Travis early in that season...destroyed a loaded la marque team in the final..that Aledo team would have beaten all top 3a teams by 4 tds or more...the 4 4a finalist this year would have crushed the 4 3a finalist this year..there is a very big difference between the top 4a and top 3a...who gives a @#$@ what teams are in their district..you probably dont even know where Boswell HS is..Wimberley would have struggled to beat Birdville btw.
I again must remind you Chapell Hill had 12 college players, may get beat, but not by 4 TDS. Chapell Hill had the speed and size to run with any 4a team.

[coachc45]

I again must remind you Chapell Hill had 12 college players, may get beat, but not by 4 TDS. Chapell Hill had the speed and size to run with any 4a team.

And I will say this....Chapel Hill struggled to beat a very average Whitehouse team! That was before all the injuries too. 4A to 3A is a big difference, and I'm a 3A guy. Used to think it was a small gap, but then started coaching at John Tyler. Big Difference.

[mwynn05]

if you cant platoon in 4a you dont have a chance

[toddg]

I again must remind you Chapell Hill had 12 college players, may get beat, but not by 4 TDS. Chapell Hill had the speed and size to run with any 4a team.

ill say this..Chapel Hill was a class team with class fans and good luck to those players moving up to the next level!

[Ville-D]

Ville D, your avatar looks a lot like Snyder's helmet logo. I'm pretty sure Superman copied it from Snyder. ;)

It also looks a little like Santa Anna, Schulenburg and Strawn.

But nobody else has the mascot flying through it. Give me some props for creativity. :inlove:

[toddg]

It also looks a little like Santa Anna, Schulenburg and Strawn.

But nobody else has the mascot flying through it. Give me some props for creativity. :inlove:

so whats it look like with a HoneyBee? since they are two entirely different insects! LOL!

[Emerson1]

I again must remind you Chapell Hill had 12 college players, may get beat, but not by 4 TDS. Chapell Hill had the speed and size to run with any 4a team.
That means nothing. Forney had 8 guys sign a year we went 3-7.

[Ville-D]

That means nothing. Forney had 8 guys sign a year we went 3-7.

I believe San Angelo Lakeview had a couple of guys sign too and they were 0-10

[Ville-D]

Done?

[Lion70]

That means nothing. Forney had 8 guys sign a year we went 3-7.

Thats just pathetic. Talk about underachieving.

[Hat42]

TEJASTRUE,,,,,,,,,,,said you were from Boswell ? Hope I got that right. Aledo played them in 1960 when I was a senior and they were playing in their first season . We called them Saginaw then . We beat them 34-6 but it was 6-6 at the half. If I remember right they had no seniors that year.

[Hat42]

I have followed Stephenville for several years and they have a program that stays on top year after year. Had it not been for Aledo the last three years they very well could have won three straight state titles. They return a great deal of last years team and I think they will possibly go undefeated this coming season. They are very well coached and motivated. They have great tradition. I think they will steam roll thru 3a . Great quarterback. A 6ft 4 inch wide receiver who is very good and plays on defense as well. And a young quarterback in the wings who from what I have heard may be the best ever down there. Shame Brownwood and they could not have played as they use to. All said however you still have to play the games and win on the field. But the talent is there.Had they stayed in 4a they would have been a top 5 or 6 program.

[Tejastrue]

TEJASTRUE,,,,,,,,,,,said you were from Boswell ? Hope I got that right. Aledo played them in 1960 when I was a senior and they were playing in their first season . We called them Saginaw then . We beat them 34-6 but it was 6-6 at the half. If I remember right they had no seniors that year.

Not from Saginaw. I lived on the south side of the tracks.:D

[regaleagle]

The beauty of football, and esp. at the high school level, is that the best team doesn't always win, or the team with the best players doesn't always win. I would venture to say that Texas high school football in particular sees more upsets week to week than anywhere else, mainly because the overall quality of the game at the high school level here in Texas has been elevated. Just look at some of the quality teams produced at the 1A level in recent years, and that should be proof enough. And we are talking about differences between 3A and 4A here. Where the top teams are concerned, I don't think there is that much disparity as some here suggest. JMO.

[cowboyandchrist]

The beauty of football, and esp. at the high school level, is that the best team doesn't always win, or the team with the best players doesn't always win. I would venture to say that Texas high school football in particular sees more upsets week to week than anywhere else, mainly because the overall quality of the game at the high school level here in Texas has been elevated. Just look at some of the quality teams produced at the 1A level in recent years, and that should be proof enough. And we are talking about differences between 3A and 4A here. Where the top teams are concerned, I don't think there is that much disparity as some here suggest. JMO.
I agree with you 100%, the last four teams standing in 3A and 4A are very very good and not a whole lot of difference between them. I will use Chapel Hill as a good example. They just got by the last three teams they played, but what people don't say, is all three of those teams were outstanding and the DAWGS played well enough to beat them. Why would it be impossible for them to play just well enough to beat the top 4A team. I am not blind to the fact that in most cases the 4A should beat the 3A for no other reason than depth. Some times the top 3A teams have as much or more depth than the 4A team. Someone on here said Kilgore was in a week Reg and that is why they went 4 rounds deep. So Carthage and Gilmer beating them is not a good example of 3A verus 4A. Another person said 3a would wear down playing a 4A schedule. Carthage played all but one 4a school in non district and then played the district of doom. How many 4A teams would want to play in the district of doom.

[regaleagle]

All I know is Argyle has about 40 players on the sideline each game, and plays at least 25-30 of them regularly every game. Of course, if we have a good lead in the 4th, everybody sees action. That happens alot for us. That's how you build a program. I have no qualms about Argyle matching up against 4a teams, even this upcoming season when we are supposedly in a "rebuilding" mode.

[hsbtex]

I agree with you 100%, the last four teams standing in 3A and 4A are very very good and not a whole lot of difference between them. I will use Chapel Hill as a good example. They just got by the last three teams they played, but what people don't say, is all three of those teams were outstanding and the DAWGS played well enough to beat them. Why would it be impossible for them to play just well enough to beat the top 4A team. I am not blind to the fact that in most cases the 4A should beat the 3A for no other reason than depth. Some times the top 3A teams have as much or more depth than the 4A team. Someone on here said Kilgore was in a week Reg and that is why they went 4 rounds deep. So Carthage and Gilmer beating them is not a good example of 3A verus 4A. Another person said 3a would wear down playing a 4A schedule. Carthage played all but one 4a school in non district and then played the district of doom. How many 4A teams would want to play in the district of doom.

Cowboy...we would have liked to have played in the "district of doom" :) How about you all come play us and Cedar Park??

[Ville-D]

So to sum this up.

Talent and Skill are relatively the same with the first team. The biggest difference mainly comes down to depth.

Agree/Disagree?

[bigwood33]

So to sum this up.

Talent and Skill are relatively the same with the first team. The biggest difference mainly comes down to depth.

Agree/Disagree?
Agree