CJ Wilson

[Farmersfan]

I thought I would bring this conversation up now because I don't know what CJ will do in tonights game. Everybody knows that CJ will be a free agent after this season just as most people understand that the Yankees or Red Sox will drive the price up to ridiculous amounts. My question is do ya'll think the Rangers should make a run at CJ regardless of where the price goes? A month ago I was saying that the Rangers should play him whatever it takes to keep him but I'm now having second thoughts on him. So far this post season CJ has been bad. I mean really bad! He is 0-2 in his 3 starts with a ERA of over 8. The Rangers Ace and #1 starter is the 3 worse pitcher in these playoffs. For his career CJ is 1-4 with a 5.40 ERA in the post season. Does everyone think these kinds of post season numbers should earn CJ 100+ million dollar contract? A lot can be said for the fact that the Rangers wouldn't even be in the post season without CJ's outstanding pitching in the regular season but does it really make sense to take someone to the dance who can't dance?
And the biggest question is: Will CJ turn it around and give us some good innings in the World Series? I'm voting that he will. But I also say if he continues on his current path and doesn't have a quality start tonight there is no way I give him a huge contract. Thoughts?

[rholl]

I think Rangers should offer CJ 5 years 85 mil...very comparable to Jered Weaver. He hasnt pitched well in playoffs but he has done a couple of things. He has shown he can handle the July and August heat and he can win in Arlington, this is 2 things that seem to scare off top FA pitchers. I think with back to back World Series appearances and big time TV contract the Rangers can afford a bigger payroll. They are closer to the Oaklands and Astros in terms of total payroll.

[Farmersfan]

I think Rangers should offer CJ 5 years 85 mil...very comparable to Jered Weaver. He hasnt pitched well in playoffs but he has done a couple of things. He has shown he can handle the July and August heat and he can win in Arlington, this is 2 things that seem to scare off top FA pitchers. I think with back to back World Series appearances and big time TV contract the Rangers can afford a bigger payroll. They are closer to the Oaklands and Astros in terms of total payroll.



But wouldn't a 85 million dollar contract bring in a pitcher that can pitch in the regular season AND THE PLAYOFFS? Of course this question is based on CJ not showing up tonight.

[rholl]

Well thats a good point but you can also turn it around to show Highest paid pitchers
CC...Yankees, no longer playing
Santana.. Mets, didnt make playoffs
Halladay...Phillys, no longer playing
Zambrano...Cubs , didnt make playoffs
Zito, Giants...didnt make playoffs

so 3 of the highest paid pitchers teams didnt make playoffs and the other 2 are already out so big money pitchers dont always mean World Series cough cough Cliff Lee and Phillies!!!! LOL

[Tejastrue]

I thought I would bring this conversation up now because I don't know what CJ will do in tonights game. Everybody knows that CJ will be a free agent after this season just as most people understand that the Yankees or Red Sox will drive the price up to ridiculous amounts. My question is do ya'll think the Rangers should make a run at CJ regardless of where the price goes? A month ago I was saying that the Rangers should play him whatever it takes to keep him but I'm now having second thoughts on him. So far this post season CJ has been bad. I mean really bad! He is 0-2 in his 3 starts with a ERA of over 8. The Rangers Ace and #1 starter is the 3 worse pitcher in these playoffs. For his career CJ is 1-4 with a 5.40 ERA in the post season. Does everyone think these kinds of post season numbers should earn CJ 100+ million dollar contract? A lot can be said for the fact that the Rangers wouldn't even be in the post season without CJ's outstanding pitching in the regular season but does it really make sense to take someone to the dance who can't dance?
And the biggest question is: Will CJ turn it around and give us some good innings in the World Series? I'm voting that he will. But I also say if he continues on his current path and doesn't have a quality start tonight there is no way I give him a huge contract. Thoughts?

I tend to defend CJ a little because he's had a few bad breaks go against him so far this post season. As you stated he can erase those memories quickly with a quality start tonight...Don't believe the Rangers will get carried away in the bidding war however, as they feel very comfortable where they are with the farm system. I think they are well prepared to move on without him if it comes down to that...

[Emerson1]

Cliff Lee and Phillies!!!! LOL
Cliff Lee went back to Philly for less money then the Rangers offered and because he has a kid with leukemia that has a doctor there.

[Txbroadcaster]

I dont think the Rangers offer a ton simply because they dont feel they have to. The depth of the pitching in the Rangers right now is stacked...and they showed this year you can make it to the WS without an ace.

[MGAR]

Well thats a good point but you can also turn it around to show Highest paid pitchers
CC...Yankees, no longer playing
Santana.. Mets, didnt make playoffs
Halladay...Phillys, no longer playing
Zambrano...Cubs , didnt make playoffs
Zito, Giants...didnt make playoffs

so 3 of the highest paid pitchers teams didnt make playoffs and the other 2 are already out so big money pitchers dont always mean World Series cough cough Cliff Lee and Phillies!!!! LOL

And....... After the World Series is over they will still be the highest paid pitchers.

[Farmersfan]

Well thats a good point but you can also turn it around to show Highest paid pitchers
CC...Yankees, no longer playing
Santana.. Mets, didnt make playoffs
Halladay...Phillys, no longer playing
Zambrano...Cubs , didnt make playoffs
Zito, Giants...didnt make playoffs

so 3 of the highest paid pitchers teams didnt make playoffs and the other 2 are already out so big money pitchers dont always mean World Series cough cough Cliff Lee and Phillies!!!! LOL



All great examples. but other than Halladay and Cliff Lee none of the highest paid pitchers in the league that you mentioned had the kind of team around them that CJ has. CJ has pitched horribly in this post season and they are still perched on the verge of a World Series Title. How much better would this Rangers team be with Cliff Lee or CC Sabathia or Zambrano? Or any #1 starter that pitches like a #1 when they get to the post season? That is why I say that if CJ doesn't pick it up in the World Series and give the team 2 great starts (if it goes 7) then I don't offer a heck of a lot of money for him either. For 85 million this team could get a really good pitcher that would make the team soooooo much more potent in the playoffs. Just thinking out loud. Good discussion though!

[Farmersfan]

I dont think the Rangers offer a ton simply because they dont feel they have to. The depth of the pitching in the Rangers right now is stacked...and they showed this year you can make it to the WS without an ace.


And I think the culture that Nolan has put in place is such that the great young arms can come into this system and be successful. Before Nolan (or Daniels) the Rangers traded away all their young arms because they couldn't get them to perform in Texas.

[Txbroadcaster]

Also..I dont think Wilson pitched that bad at Detroit in his last game..couple of fluke plays changed that game...It SEEMS he was close to figuring out some stuff..big worry is the Cards are a team stacked to hit lefties.

[coach]

don't sign him and hope cc opts out and sign cc for a true ace.

[Txbroadcaster]

don't sign him and hope cc opts out and sign cc for a true ace.


CC with his size will not last in Texas..he wore down in NY last season...plus he loves NY.

[Farmersfan]

don't sign him and hope cc opts out and sign cc for a true ace.



How much more attractive will the Rangers be after the second straight WS appearance? Beltre has said numerous times that he chose Texas because he felt they gave him the best chance at a ring. And here he is! If the Rangers win it all I think they will have many options open to them that they have not had in the past. No more overpaying just to get players to come here!

[Txbroadcaster]

How much more attractive will the Rangers be after the second straight WS appearance? Beltre has said numerous times that he chose Texas because he felt they gave him the best chance at a ring. And here he is! If the Rangers win it all I think they will have many options open to them that they have not had in the past. No more overpaying just to get players to come here!

problem is..no one is out there..that is why CJ is going to get top dollar....and I think pitchers are still weary of the ballpark and heat.

Now if I was Texas with the deep pockets they now have..I would check into some of the guys like Santana( if finally healthy) and see if Mets want to unload his salary.

[Farmersfan]

CC with his size will not last in Texas..he wore down in NY last season...plus he loves NY.



The Rangers need 1 serious ACE to lead this staff. All the young arms in this system and around the league could really grow here with the quality of this defense to back them up. Cliff Lee was the catalyst that started this whole thing last season. Without him the Rangers probably go out in the first round last season and it's not likely they are here right now. His presence last season set the bar pretty high for these pitchers. I thought early on that perhaps CJ had stepped into that roll with this team but he has lived up to his reputation for being a head case. The guys on the The Ticket called CJ the most arrogant person they have ever met with the least amount to be arrogant about. I thought that was worth sharing....

[Tejastrue]

CC with his size will not last in Texas..he wore down in NY last season...plus he loves NY.

His postseason stats reflect that the last few years...

[Txbroadcaster]

The Rangers need 1 serious ACE to lead this staff. All the young arms in this system and around the league could really grow here with the quality of this defense to back them up. Cliff Lee was the catalyst that started this whole thing last season. Without him the Rangers probably go out in the first round last season and it's not likely they are here right now. His presence last season set the bar pretty high for these pitchers. I thought early on that perhaps CJ had stepped into that roll with this team but he has lived up to his reputation for being a head case. The guys on the The Ticket called CJ the most arrogant person they have ever met with the least amount to be arrogant about. I thought that was worth sharing....

The CJ brag mash up is greatness.

[Emerson1]

The Rangers need 1 serious ACE to lead this staff. All the young arms in this system and around the league could really grow here with the quality of this defense to back them up. Cliff Lee was the catalyst that started this whole thing last season. Without him the Rangers probably go out in the first round last season and it's not likely they are here right now. His presence last season set the bar pretty high for these pitchers. I thought early on that perhaps CJ had stepped into that roll with this team but he has lived up to his reputation for being a head case. The guys on the The Ticket called CJ the most arrogant person they have ever met with the least amount to be arrogant about. I thought that was worth sharing....

I've heard that too. Sounds like he just hates dealing with the media.

CC just built a palace in New Jersey, don't think he is leaving any time soon.

[Tejastrue]

The Rangers need 1 serious ACE to lead this staff. All the young arms in this system and around the league could really grow here with the quality of this defense to back them up. Cliff Lee was the catalyst that started this whole thing last season. Without him the Rangers probably go out in the first round last season and it's not likely they are here right now. His presence last season set the bar pretty high for these pitchers. I thought early on that perhaps CJ had stepped into that roll with this team but he has lived up to his reputation for being a head case. The guys on the The Ticket called CJ the most arrogant person they have ever met with the least amount to be arrogant about. I thought that was worth sharing....

Say the Rangers end up winning the Series...what would justify spending outrageous money to have a "serious ace"... I also think it's time we give some credit to the pitching coach...

[Farmersfan]

Say the Rangers end up winning the Series...what would justify spending outrageous money to have a "serious ace"... I also think it's time we give some credit to the pitching coach...



I know it sounds ridiculous to say that if the Rangers win the WS then they NEED a Ace on the staff. Apparently they are able to win it without that ace. But seriously how long can they get away with their starters only giving them 3 or 4 innings? I think I heard that never in baseball history has a team won the WS without a single starting pitcher going 7 innings. Or maybe they said "no team has ever made it to the World Series without a starting pitcher that went 7 innings"! Either way it is a huge testament to the bullpen and the pitching coach that they have made it this far. And with the talent they have coming up in the system they are positioned to have several good runs at a title over the next decade or so. Should be fun!

[eagles_victory]

I have to agree with Farmersfan imo the Rangers beat the Rays and Tigers just because they had superior lineups and bullpens to both of those teams. I could easily see the same thing happening with the Cardinals. But with the climate of the league and the talent being accumulated in Boston and Philly and NYY always being a player that may notn be the case in most years. Winning World Series's or even making them without good starting pitching is probably the exception and not the rule.