I hate to say I told you so............ [Archive]

Farmersfan

05-17-2011, 08:03 AM

But I TOLD YOU SO!!!!!

I've been telling certain people on here for a couple of years that the Dallas Cowboys were one of the most talented teams in the NFL in recent years and they were underachieving badly due to a lack of leadership on and off the field. I got constant arguements from those same people that the talent on Dallas isn't what some people believe it is. Well now we have a list as voted on BY THE NFL PLAYERS THEMSELVES. I know some of you will actually think you are better informed and know more about it than the players themselves but.......really? On the ticket this morning they were discussing this NFL Network Player poll. Apparently the ticket did get a sneak peak at the entire liste and it was revealed that the Cowboys are tied for second most players on the list with Indy and the Ravens with 6 top 100 players in the NFL. Only the Packers had more with 7. Packers, Indy and Ravens went deep into the playoffs last year. What did our Cowboys do? And the icing on the cake is that our beloved Tony Romo was voted the #79th best player in the league and the #9 QB by his fellow players.

Will this be the big fat serving of broiled crow that it should be or will we get a bunch of lame arguements and disagreements? I would bet my money on the arguements..................let'r rip boys! :D :D :D

http://top100.nfl.com/

SintonFan

05-17-2011, 08:06 AM

That means Romo was voted top ten!
Sweet!:clap: :clap: :clap:

Txbroadcaster

05-17-2011, 08:10 AM

I dont think ANYONE has claimed Dallas did not have talent..What some of us have said is with the talent Dallas also had HUGE holes.

So Dallas has 6 out of 22 starters in top 100...that leaves 16 players plus special teams..so how do those 16 rank will decide how good the team is

I think #9 is about right for Romo after the injury..of course you have always claimed he was far far worse..and he was actually 72 not 79

Txbroadcaster

05-17-2011, 08:17 AM

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-top100-2011/09000d5d81fc5575/Top-100-Tony-Romo?module=HP_cp2

trojandad

05-17-2011, 08:17 AM

Originally posted by SintonFan
That means Romo was voted top ten!
Sweet!:clap: :clap: :clap:

i have nothing personal against romo, i hope he succeeds, but i just dont see him as having the drive, he has tons of talent but he has the matt schaub disease, when he screws up on the field he only seems to be just so upset....

remember the fits elway would throw after a pick? or marino? how about staubach? its just got to hurt a bit to get that needed change to happen IMO....

Txbroadcaster

05-17-2011, 08:22 AM

Originally posted by trojandad

remember the fits elway would throw after a pick? or marino? how about staubach? its just got to hurt a bit to get that needed change to happen IMO....

So a player must throw a fit? funny thing is if Romo did that IMO people would claim he was being a baby...Joe Montana was not known as a screamer or for throwing fits...and honestly you mention Staubach, he was not really known for showing his teammates up by yelling at them.

Farmersfan

05-17-2011, 08:24 AM

Originally posted by Txbroadcaster
I dont think ANYONE has claimed Dallas did not have talent..What some of us have said is with the talent Dallas also had HUGE holes.

So Dallas has 6 out of 22 starters in top 100...that leaves 16 players plus special teams..so how do those 16 rank will decide how good the team is

I think #9 is about right for Romo after the injury..of course you have always claimed he was far far worse..and he was actually 72 not 79

Somehow I knew you would flip flop.................................

Now it's the bottom of the talent pool for Dallas that doesn't measure up? I think you have proven my point.

SintonFan

05-17-2011, 08:24 AM

Originally posted by trojandad
i have nothing personal against romo, i hope he succeeds, but i just dont see him as having the drive, he has tons of talent but he has the matt schaub disease, when he screws up on the field he only seems to be just so upset....

remember the fits elway would throw after a pick? or marino? how about staubach? its just got to hurt a bit to get that needed change to happen IMO....

I don't know...
I've been reading all these stories about him LEADING these off-season practices. Sounds like a good thing to me.:nerd:

Txbroadcaster

05-17-2011, 08:28 AM

Originally posted by Farmersfan
Somehow I knew you would flip flop.................................

Now it's the bottom of the talent pool for Dallas that doesn't measure up? I think you have proven my point.

huh? please explain how I flip flopped? Please show me where I have said Dallas had no talent?

speaking of

Ratliff and Romo already named...so who are other four??

Ware is a given as is Witten and prob Austin as well..so who is the last one?

Farmersfan

05-17-2011, 08:30 AM

Originally posted by SintonFan
I don't know...
I've been reading all these stories about him LEADING these off-season practices. Sounds like a good thing to me.:nerd:

Was this before or after he failed to qualify for the PGA?

Seriously, I see Romo getting better as time goes by in his leadership role. I just wonder if it's too late. Does he really have the respect of the other players?

SintonFan

05-17-2011, 08:31 AM

Originally posted by Farmersfan
Was this before or after he failed to qualify for the PGA?

Seriously, I see Romo getting better as time goes by in his leadership role. I just wonder if it's too late. Does he really have the respect of the other players?

From what I have been reading, it does sound like he has their respect.

Farmersfan

05-17-2011, 08:33 AM

Originally posted by Txbroadcaster
huh? please explain how I flip flopped? Please show me where I have said Dallas had no talent?

speaking of

Ratliff and Romo already named...so who are other four??

Ware is a given as is Witten and prob Austin as well..so who is the last one?

I say McBriar and probably either Guroude or T. Newman.

Txbroadcaster

05-17-2011, 08:38 AM

Originally posted by Farmersfan
I say McBriar and probably either Guroude or T. Newman.

forgot about McBriar..not sure if his ability will be recognized or not

but it wont be McBriar and another unless Austin is left off

right now we KNOW

Ratliff and Romo

99.9% sure

Witten and Ware( he will be a top 15 if not top 10)

95%
Austin

So that leaves one spot

Farmersfan

05-17-2011, 08:46 AM

Originally posted by Txbroadcaster
huh? please explain how I flip flopped? Please show me where I have said Dallas had no talent?

Please show me where I said that you said "Dallas had no talent"?

Txbroadcaster

05-17-2011, 08:48 AM

Originally posted by Farmersfan
Please show me where I said that you said "Dallas had no talent"?

Your saying I flip flop..so then how I am I doing that in the discussion of talent?

Farmersfan

05-17-2011, 08:50 AM

Originally posted by SintonFan
From what I have been reading, it does sound like he has their respect.

Not to open the Romo vs Kitna debate again but how much impact on the Romo respect factor do you think Kitna's success last season had? I know the diehard Romo excuse makers won't admit it but a 100 year old Kitna performed just about as good with this team as Romo was when he got hurt. Have you heard of any players pulling for Kitna to stay as the starter? (as silly as that is)

SintonFan

05-17-2011, 08:54 AM

Farmersfan

05-17-2011, 08:59 AM

Originally posted by Txbroadcaster
Your saying I flip flop..so then how I am I doing that in the discussion of talent?

You have said 1000 times that Dallas WASN'T a top talented team. You have debated the validity of almost every Pro Bowl selection on this team in recent years. It is a flip flop to now say you weren't referring to the top talent on the team but rather the bottom talent on the team. The facts are that the "other 16" and the backups on this team aren't any better or worst than MOST other teams in the league. If almost any other team in the league has better backups then they likely don't have better starters or if they are better at one spot they aren't better at another. It all washes out in the end. All players in the NFL can play at a pretty high level. The top of the talent pool is where the difference is made. And Dallas has the second most players at the top of the talent pool according to the players.

trojandad

05-17-2011, 09:02 AM

Originally posted by Txbroadcaster
So a player must throw a fit? funny thing is if Romo did that IMO people would claim he was being a baby...Joe Montana was not known as a screamer or for throwing fits...and honestly you mention Staubach, he was not really known for showing his teammates up by yelling at them.

first, did i say they MUST throw a fit? i said there were qb's that obtained much higher success than romo has that seem to be more emotional about his screw ups than romo, schaub, and a few others are....and the "baby" comment doesnt fly, nobody considers any of those successful qb's "babies" because of emotions......geez

second, i never said staubach showed anyone up, remember his pass to jackie brown in the super bowl and brown missed and staubach twirled around with his head in the air in disgust? that was a sign the game meant something to him, he didnt chew him out, he showed a sign that it meant something to him, and staubach had a zillion of them, i worshipped the guy so much i changed my passing style in high school to emulate his.....

third, montana throws his arms straight about his head in the TD signal every td pass, along with a ton of reactions to dropped passes, etc, dont tell me he didnt have visible emotions....

lastly i never said only emotional qb's succeed, brady is as meek as a mouse (hes gettin louder the more he loses though), i said it was my opinion.....when i was qb'ing and a guy came into the huddle from the sideline giggling and joking id send his butt back to the sideline, there was nothing "cheery" about the beating id have to take some games and if they wanted fun, go home and have a party....just never figured out how one plays football successfully without emotions....

you heard "emotions" and assumed dressing teammates down, your usually better with not assuming that much, espaecially when your points werent said by me in the first place.....i wish both romo and shaub played with more visible signs that losing bothered them, sometimes they remind me of cutler in the 2nd half of the nfc championship game.....again, to the ones that what to read, IMO and only my opinion.....

Txbroadcaster

05-17-2011, 09:03 AM

Originally posted by Farmersfan
Not to open the Romo vs Kitna debate again but how much impact on the Romo respect factor do you think Kitna's success last season had? I know the diehard Romo excuse makers won't admit it but a 100 year old Kitna performed just about as good with this team as Romo was when he got hurt. Have you heard of any players pulling for Kitna to stay as the starter? (as silly as that is)

here is the problem I had with all the Kitna love( and I think he is great as a back up)

in 9 starts he had 4 GREAT games( 95 rating or abover)

he had 3 TERRIBLE( and I cannot emphasis how terrible the starts were) none being higher than a 64 rating.

in two starts he was solid..not great not terrible

but this perception has been created that he came in and played great from the first snap till then end, when he was just what he is an older QB that can get hot at times then go really cold at times.

now Romo before he got hurt..never had a game where his rating was below 78 and he had two above 124

so no I dont think Kitna performed as good as Romo, I think Kitna performed admirally as the back up QB othing more nothing less

Txbroadcaster

05-17-2011, 09:06 AM

Originally posted by trojandad
first, did i say they MUST throw a fit? i said there were qb's that obtained much higher success than romo has that seem to be more emotional about his screw ups than romo, schaub, and a few others are....and the "baby" comment doesnt fly, nobody considers any of those successful qb's "babies" because of emotions......geez

second, i never said staubach showed anyone up, remember his pass to jackie brown in the super bowl and brown missed and staubach twirled around with his head in the air in disgust? that was a sign the game meant something to him, he didnt chew him out, he showed a sign that it meant something to him, and staubach had a zillion of them, i worshipped the guy so much i changed my passing style in high school to emulate his.....

third, montana throws his arms straight about his head in the TD signal every td pass, along with a ton of reactions to dropped passes, etc, dont tell me he didnt have visible emotions....

lastly i never said only emotional qb's succeed, brady is as meek as a mouse (hes gettin louder the more he loses though), i said it was my opinion.....when i was qb'ing and a guy came into the huddle from the sideline giggling and joking id send his butt back to the sideline, there was nothing "cheery" about the beating id have to take some games and if they wanted fun, go home and have a party....just never figured out how one plays football successfully without emotions....

you heard "emotions" and assumed dressing teammates down, your usually better with not assuming that much, espaecially when your points werent said by me in the first place.....i wish both romo and shaub played with more visible signs that losing bothered them, sometimes they remind me of cutler in the 2nd half of the nfc championship game.....again, to the ones that what to read, IMO and only my opinion.....

Actually I took your exact words remember the fits elway would throw after a pick? or marino? how about staubach?

BILLYFRED0000

05-17-2011, 09:06 AM

Well for what it is worth. A quarterbacik under one of the Greatest Coaches in NFL history has said that Romo is not the problem and is a superbowl caliber quarterback. And he should know since he has rings himself.

That would be legendary Roger Staubach under Tom Landry. So Farmers just let it drop on romo

Farmersfan

05-17-2011, 09:08 AM

Originally posted by SintonFan
Considering Phillip's style of coaching...
I'm not sure Romo was the problem.
BTW, not making an excuse here. Just a little discussion.

I'm not sure I understand what it is you are saying. Did Phillips limit Romo's opportunities? Was the discipline worst and there fore the line play worst? See the numbers show us the line play was actually worst with Kitna yet he got his numbers. The defense went WAY downhill after Phillips left yet Kitna got 5 more wins. Dez got hurt so the offense lost their #1 option and yet Kitna completed bascally the same percentage and yardage average. Kitna played under worst conditions, with a weakened offense and a much weaker defense and still got numbers that are basically compariable to Romos. Perhaps the coaching change enabled that but the numbers don't support that theory. I think this next season will tell tons about this whole debate. If Romo doesn't set the world on fire with his numbers then I think everyone will know how the cow eats the cabbage in Dallas....

Txbroadcaster

05-17-2011, 09:08 AM

Originally posted by Farmersfan
You have said 1000 times that Dallas WASN'T a top talented team. You have debated the validity of almost every Pro Bowl selection on this team in recent years. It is a flip flop to now say you weren't referring to the top talent on the team but rather the bottom talent on the team. The facts are that the "other 16" and the backups on this team aren't any better or worst than MOST other teams in the league. If almost any other team in the league has better backups then they likely don't have better starters or if they are better at one spot they aren't better at another. It all washes out in the end. All players in the NFL can play at a pretty high level. The top of the talent pool is where the difference is made. And Dallas has the second most players at the top of the talent pool according to the players.

and I still say Dallas is not a top talented TEAM..does not mean they dont have top talent on the roster, it means as a TEAM position by position Dallas has to many holes for the talent to overcome

Txbroadcaster

05-17-2011, 09:09 AM

Originally posted by Farmersfan
I'm not sure I understand what it is you are saying. Did Phillips limit Romo's opportunities? Was the discipline worst and there fore the line play worst? See the numbers show us the line play was actually worst with Kitna yet he got his numbers. The defense went WAY downhill after Phillips left yet Kitna got 5 more wins. Dez got hurt so the offense lost their #1 option and yet Kitna completed bascally the same percentage and yardage average. Kitna played under worst conditions, with a weakened offense and a much weaker defense and still got numbers that are basically compariable to Romos. Perhaps the coaching change enabled that but the numbers don't support that theory. I think this next season will tell tons about this whole debate. If Romo doesn't set the world on fire with his numbers then I think everyone will know how the cow eats the cabbage in Dallas....

already proved more than once the Dallas D was not worse once Kitna was the QB and in fact became a turnover machine

trojandad

05-17-2011, 09:10 AM

Originally posted by Txbroadcaster
Actually I took your exact words remember the fits elway would throw after a pick? or marino? how about staubach?

sorry you cant see it, but i never talked of dressing anyone down when i said emotions.......you really amaze me at timeswith the liberties you sometimes take with facts and assumptions, especially in the field your in, but weve had this talk before, so moving on...:D

Txbroadcaster

05-17-2011, 09:14 AM

Originally posted by trojandad
sorry you cant see it, but i never talked of dressing anyone down when i said emotions.......you really amaze me at timeswith the liberties you sometimes take with facts and assumptions, especially in the field your in, but weve had this talk before, so moving on...:D

first I never said YOU said anything about Staubach dressing down a player, I was just making the point he was not known for it which IMO falls in line with someone saying he throws a fit.

2nd..I have seen Romo many times celebrate a TD and get pissed over a turnover, it proves nothing.

Farmersfan

05-17-2011, 09:18 AM

Originally posted by Txbroadcaster
here is the problem I had with all the Kitna love( and I think he is great as a back up)

in 9 starts he had 4 GREAT games( 95 rating or abover)

he had 3 TERRIBLE( and I cannot emphasis how terrible the starts were) none being higher than a 64 rating.

in two starts he was solid..not great not terrible

but this perception has been created that he came in and played great from the first snap till then end, when he was just what he is an older QB that can get hot at times then go really cold at times.

now Romo before he got hurt..never had a game where his rating was below 78 and he had two above 124

so no I dont think Kitna performed as good as Romo, I think Kitna performed admirally as the back up QB othing more nothing less

It is a little odd how the season averages could be so close if the ups and downs between the two were so lopsided........ Perhaps you need to research how AVERAGES work TXB. Just sayin'

trojandad

05-17-2011, 09:18 AM

Originally posted by Txbroadcaster
first I never said YOU said anything about Staubach dressing down a player, I was just making the point he was not known for it which IMO falls in line with someone saying he throws a fit.

2nd..I have seen Romo many times celebrate a TD and get pissed over a turnover, it proves nothing.

you just cant hear yourself, one more time will be as futile as the rest, done trying.....

ronwx5x

05-17-2011, 09:18 AM

Whether the Cowboys have underachieving talent or bad talent, the bottom line is they have not been the winners they have been expected to be. All the bickering and debate on this board will not change their recent history. What the Cowboys need is leadership who understand what it takes to win and have the fortitude to take the necessary actions. None of us will be part of that process.

I have followed the Cowboys since the middle 60's and I assure you I don't have the necessary solution(s) to enable them to get back to perenniel greatness. Let's hope someone in the organization does. We need another Tex Schramm!

Farmersfan

05-17-2011, 09:19 AM

Originally posted by Txbroadcaster
already proved more than once the Dallas D was not worse once Kitna was the QB and in fact became a turnover machine

Turnovers do not a defense make. They got worst in every other stat..................

SintonFan

05-17-2011, 09:23 AM

Originally posted by Farmersfan
I'm not sure I understand what it is you are saying. Did Phillips limit Romo's opportunities? Was the discipline worst and there fore the line play worst? See the numbers show us the line play was actually worst with Kitna yet he got his numbers. The defense went WAY downhill after Phillips left yet Kitna got 5 more wins. Dez got hurt so the offense lost their #1 option and yet Kitna completed bascally the same percentage and yardage average. Kitna played under worst conditions, with a weakened offense and a much weaker defense and still got numbers that are basically compariable to Romos. Perhaps the coaching change enabled that but the numbers don't support that theory. I think this next season will tell tons about this whole debate. If Romo doesn't set the world on fire with his numbers then I think everyone will know how the cow eats the cabbage in Dallas....

I think the lack of discipline overall when Phillips was HC had more to do with the team's play than whether or not Kitna or Romo commanded more discipline(respect or the like).
You are right about this year. But I don't think Romo has to set the "world on fire" to be much more successful.

Farmersfan

05-17-2011, 09:23 AM

Originally posted by BILLYFRED0000
Well for what it is worth. A quarterbacik under one of the Greatest Coaches in NFL history has said that Romo is not the problem and is a superbowl caliber quarterback. And he should know since he has rings himself.

That would be legendary Roger Staubach under Tom Landry. So Farmers just let it drop on romo

So what about what all those other players said? Or is Roger the only one that counts?