Trouble In the Middle East

[Bullaholic]

There is much unrest in the Middle East during the last couple of weeks. First, the Tunisia uprisings and overthrow of the government, then rumblings in Yemen, and now rioting in a major Middle eastern country, Egypt. Things are de-generating and evolving in many of these Middle Eastern nations, and I am sure the U.S and other western powers are concerned and keeping a watchful eye on the directions that these countries take.

Egypt Unrest (http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2011/01/28/clashes-erupt-in-cairo-elbaradei-told-to-stay-put-cnn-camera-confiscated/?hpt=T1&iref=BN1)

[DDBooger]

It's very easy to support these uprisings in Iran (a country viewed widely as an enemy). However, watching nations descend into revolution over lack of democracy will test our commitment to freedom. Many of these dictators have been backed by the U.S. for decades. Mubarek is and has been considered an ally.

[MUSTANG69]

Originally posted by DDBooger
It's very easy to support these uprisings in Iran (a country viewed widely as an enemy). However, watching nations descend into revolution over lack of democracy will test our commitment to freedom. Many of these dictators have been backed by the U.S. for decades. Mubarek is and has been considered an ally.

What position do you think the U.S. should take. I am not trying to start an arguement. I am really interested in what you think without playing the blame game.

[DDBooger]

Originally posted by MUSTANG69
What position do you think the U.S. should take. I am not trying to start an arguement. I am really interested in what you think without playing the blame game. There is no blame game. Foreign diplomacy has been identical from Democrat and Republican administrations the last 30 years. Egypt has been our counterbalance to more unfriendly middle-eastern nations. They were the first to acknowledge Israel and since have been rewarded with large U.S. support (defense contracts subsidized by us). Yet, it really comes down to choosing our bad guy in contrast to another bad guy.

Regionally, and this scares the **** out of the world is that in developing nations, males under 30 make up most of the population. Couple that with poverty, oppression and tear gas canisters with "made in the U.S.A." stamped on them is a scary thing.

Good thing about Egypt is that the uprising is guided by El Baradai. He's not a mullah or religious figure. However, as this spreads, the circumstances are not the same. Yemen is loaded with fundies if this spreads to Saudia Arabia, then you have the worlds largest reserves of oil under unstable circumstances. We don't have enough troops to settle this, nor do other countries have the stomach to be involved in something like that.

Oh and one more thing. Egypt cooperates with Israel in quarantining Palestine. Rumors have spread that the checkpoint is now OPEN. Should Israel be drawn in, talk about escalation.

[MUSTANG69]

Originally posted by DDBooger
There is no blame game. Foreign diplomacy has been identical from Democrat and Republican administrations the last 30 years. Egypt has been our counterbalance to more unfriendly middle-eastern nations. They were the first to acknowledge Israel and since have been rewarded with large U.S. support (defense contracts subsidized by us). Yet, it really comes down to choosing our bad guy in contrast to another bad guy.

Regionally, and this scares the **** out of the world is that in developing nations, males under 30 make up most of the population. Couple that with poverty, oppression and tear gas canisters with "made in the U.S.A." stamped on them is a scary thing.

Good thing about Egypt is that the uprising is guided by El Baradai. He's not a mullah or religious figure. However, as this spreads, the circumstances are not the same. Yemen is loaded with fundies if this spreads to Saudia Arabia, then you have the worlds largest reserves of oil under unstable circumstances. We don't have enough troops to settle this, nor do other countries have the stomach to be involved in something like that.

Oh and one more thing. Egypt cooperates with Israel in quarantining Palestine. Rumors have spread that the checkpoint is now OPEN. Should Israel be drawn in, talk about escalation.

OK., but what do you think the U.S. should do in the future? That was my question.

[DDBooger]

Originally posted by MUSTANG69
OK., but what do you think the U.S. should do in the future? That was my question. Unless we want another Lebanon, embrace the change or risk having a group like Hezbollah fill the void.

[MUSTANG69]

Originally posted by DDBooger
Unless we want another Lebanon, embrace the change or risk having a group like Hezbollah fill the void.

I take this to mean a noninterference attitude in our foreigh policy.

[Pendragon13]

Trouble in the Middle East?:eek: I never heard of such..

[Bullaholic]

One thing I think the US really needs to do in foreign affairs is cease supporting every individual coming to power just because they appear to be sympathic to our causes. We have bought our support for many, many years and are continuing to do so, much to our detriment in the long run in many cases. Countries should be allowed to elect or determine their form of government without our undue influence, and we should learn to stay out of foreign internal affairs, and deal only with the party or indvidual who come to power in each of these countries. If they prove not to be our friends, and choose to threaten us militarily, then they should be advised of the penalties for carrying out such threats directly or covertly, and suffer those penalties accordingly. On the economic side of things---if any country threatens us economically to the degree of oil sanctions, etc., that threaten to cut our economic jugular, then we would also be obliged to deal with such a serious threat unreservedly with all options on the table. The US needs to get out of the nation-building and nation-restoration business---now.

[DDBooger]

Originally posted by MUSTANG69
I take this to mean a noninterference attitude in our foreigh policy. Yup. Bull gave a great retort.

[MUSTANG69]

Originally posted by DDBooger
Yup. Bull gave a great retort.

I think I might actually agree with you.:thinking:

[bobcat1]

First get our troops and civilians out. We should leave them to each other and problem solved, but if we just have to do something; make a new great big sand pit out of that place or build a retaining wall around those wars and fill it with wild pigs.

[MUSTANG69]

Originally posted by bobcat1
First get our troops and civilians out. We should leave them to each other and problem solved, but if we just have to do something; make a new great big sand pit out of that place or build a retaining wall around those wars and fill it with wild pigs.

:clap:

[Phil C]

The thing is we can't police the world. We are powerful but not that powerful. I know it sounds harse but we just can't do it.

[Phil C]

Do any of you feel these events are going to be used the the oil companies as an excuse to raise gasoline prices?

:(

[Blastoderm55]

Originally posted by Phil C
The thing is we can't police the world. We are powerful but not that powerful. I know it sounds harse but we just can't do it.

Exactly. We're spread too thin. I think we need to stop sacrificing American lives to try and be the world's moderator. Let Russia do some policing. I think they lay the hammer down after the act of terrorism in their nation.

[sinfan75]

I'll bet Israel's "Locked And Loaded"!:D

[garciap77]

Originally posted by Blastoderm55
Exactly. We're spread too thin. I think we need to stop sacrificing American lives to try and be the world's moderator. Let Russia do some policing. I think they lay the hammer down after the act of terrorism in their nation.

I don't think we are trying to be the world's moderator. I believe it's more about the money!:(

[Blastoderm55]

Originally posted by garciap77
I don't think we are trying to be the world's moderator. I believe it's more about the money!:(

Yeah, but its always packaged and sold to us as spreading freedom and democracy.

[garciap77]

Originally posted by Blastoderm55
Yeah, but its always packaged and sold to us as spreading freedom and democracy.

I bought into!http://yoursmiles.org/psmile/military/p0249.gif (http://yoursmiles.org/p-military.php?page=2) Now they want to take my benefits! Oh well!:(

[orange machine]

Two words BIBLE PROPHECY

As a Christian and someone who studies prophecy this is not hard to believe. Muslims are taking over the world case and point and if one studies prophecy you will find that these muslim folks are going to come against Israel in a big way. If you take a look at the nations around Israel they are all growing more and more muslim and anti Israel. Turkey which was once a great friend of Israel is turning there back just like the United States. The only reason Turkey hasnt just out right said blow Israel up to Iran President Ahmadinigad is because Turkey will get the blow back from a nuke sent by the Persians or Iranians. Ahmadinigad is going all around to these different countries recruiting them to come againt Israel just as the Bible said. Folks the battle line has been drawn weather one wants to admitt it or not, this stuff going on in Egypt is just part of the power struggle associated with Islam and Muslims and for Bible prophecy to be right Israel will be surrounded by this Muslims then the battle will take place just as the Bible proclaims. The battle of Gog and Magog or Armagedden is right on the horizon. Dont be ignorant to what is happening in the world and where we stand. If you want to know Gods time clock watch Israel and watch what takes place in and around her.

I did not post this to upset people one way or the other or try to start a debate. I say this because we are leaving in the most hated and evil times in the worlds history and its only going to get worse and its getting worse very quickly. Some will say that wars and bad things have always happend, but one cannot deny that history proves that things are way worse and are getting more worse daily. If anyone is interested in going more in depth PM me and we can discuss these issues.

By the way the good news is Jesus is coming soon!!!!!!!!!!!!!

:clap:

[big daddy russ]

Originally posted by DDBooger
Unless we want another Lebanon, embrace the change or risk having a group like Hezbollah fill the void.
Great reference. A mere half century ago, Beirut was the crown jewel of the Middle East. Nowadays, they still haven't been able to rebuild and once-affluent European and Asian tourists have migrated away because Beirut remains a war-torn shell of its former, beautiful self.

A lot of parallels between the modern day Middle East and the pre-WWI Balkans.

We could sit here and talk for hours about all the strained relationships in the Middle East. How Saudi Arabia doesn't really have any good friends, spits out more organized terror cells than anywhere, and yet is a strategic ally of the western zionists. How Hezbollah has single-handedly built the educational and and logistic infrastructure in the poor areas of Lebanon and Syria even though they're a full-fledged terrorist organization. Whether or not it's scary that Syria and the Kingdom are repairing burned bridges. How Egypt's crumbling dictatorship may signal the beginning of a regional war with worldwide implications (see Balkans-WWI). How Egyptian and Tunisian turmoil could spill into Libya. How the ouster of al-Gaddafi could send us even further down the wormhole. How the unrest and general sentiment we're being shown draws parallels to the French Revolution of 1789. How that's not a good thing. How Jordan and the UAE are kind of stuck in the middle of it all. How Israel is scared of everyone (with good reason), won't admit it has nukes, and doesn't mind speaking loudly AND carrying a big stick. How Ahmadinejad secretly wishes Iran was Israel. How regional leaders (Ahmadinejad, Ayatollah Khamenei, Sultan Qaboos bin-Said, Sheikh Khalifa, the late Jordanian King Hussein, and possibly Hamid Karzai---more on that later) have such great beards, but Conan O'Brien's Irish genetics ruin his chances of ever having a truly great one. How the bulk of the military power in the region lies close to the Suez Canal, but the central/eastern part of the region seems to attract most of the attention. How I'm always confused if I should consider Afghanistan part of the Middle East, Sub Asia, both, or none of the above.

Let me know when World War 3 starts.

[orange machine]

Big daddy that was well put :clap:. WW3 is close and it will revolve around Israel. Alot of people want the United States to stop being the police of the world, but what alot of people don't realize is that the United States is what has kept the world from going totally crazy. Hide and watch once the United States stops policing the world and especially Iraq because Iraq is where Babylon is the Antichrist will arise on the world stage.

[orange machine]

I havent watched the news in a few days whats going on with this issue?

[Football DAD]

I don't believe war is going to be an issue. We're not going to war over this. Just let the smoke clear. Just watch Israel, watch play. The military in Egypt's military is key. If they keep control and don't let some crazy Islamic group take control it will be alright

[mlb04stangs]

We do try to b world police, and it is for the fact of money, but also we want everyone to b like us. The Muslim world is trying to bring sharia law to all these countries that are not Muslim and everyone is mad about that, but whats the difference between that or us going all over the world forcing democracy on other nations? Nobody should force views or a way of life on anybody. And as far as Armageddon that fight doesn't happen until after Christ returns and it says in the Bible that he will not return until the temple has been rebuilt where the Dome of the Rock stands, so the day that goes down and they have a chance to rebuild it will be the day it all starts.

[BwdLion73]

...and to top it all off I heard Anderson Cooper got thumped on!

At least I think so ,this winter storm has knocked out my Satt. to Dish and everything. I'm resorting to my propane powered dial up system. In addition I think the water line to my Ice maker has frozen! I'm starting a cube rationing program now for my adult beverages.

[garciap77]

Originally posted by BwdLion73
...and to top it all off I heard Anderson Cooper got thumped on!

At least I think so ,this winter storm has knocked out my Satt. to Dish and everything. I'm resorting to my propane powered dial up system. In addition I think the water line to my Ice maker has frozen! I'm starting a cube rationing program now for my adult beverages.

:eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek:

[orange machine]

Originally posted by BwdLion73
...and to top it all off I heard Anderson Cooper got thumped on!

At least I think so ,this winter storm has knocked out my Satt. to Dish and everything. I'm resorting to my propane powered dial up system. In addition I think the water line to my Ice maker has frozen! I'm starting a cube rationing program now for my adult beverages.

Heck with the middle east we got real problems in Brownnwood.:D

[Phil C]

Now the followers of the President of Eygpt are rioting against the other rioters!

:eek:

[BEAST]

Originally posted by Phil C
Now the followers of the President of Eygpt are rioting against the other rioters!

:eek:


So now we have rioting rioters roiting rioters?:eek:




BEAST

[bobcat1]

Originally posted by BEAST
So now we have rioting rioters roiting rioters?:eek:




BEAST Leave them to themselves. There will only be 50% of a problem to deal with later.:D

[BEAST]

Originally posted by bobcat1
Leave them to themselves. There will only be 50% of a problem to deal with later.:D

True. Much like the street gangs. Crap, even give them guns and ammo. Make them stay in there area and let them beat each other up so we dont have too.




BEAST

[mwrams]

we could move all the Israelis to New Jersey and let the Arabs have Israel. Then we could bring our troops home and invade Mexico and take their oil instead. We don't need the middle east! Problem solved!

[LoboesWT]

Blasphemy, Unrest in the Middle East. Nothing but a bunch of liars out there. We should all be ashamed, spreading this rumor!:D

I have a great solution. How about we pull out of the Middle East, shut down news coverage, and let them handle it on their own for say 6 months to a year. Then return and re-introduce ourselves as the USA to the new government (whatever it may be) and propose a trading system for their oil.

[garciap77]

Originally posted by mwrams
we could move all the Israelis to New Jersey and let the Arabs have Israel. Then we could bring our troops home and invade Mexico and take their oil instead. We don't need the middle east! Problem solved!

:eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek:

[bobcat1]

Originally posted by LoboesWT
Blasphemy, Unrest in the Middle East. Nothing but a bunch of liars out there. We should all be ashamed, spreading this rumor!:D

I have a great solution. How about we pull out of the Middle East, shut down news coverage, and let them handle it on their own for say 6 months to a year. Then return and re-introduce ourselves as the USA to the new government (whatever it may be) and propose a trading system for their oil. In!

[Bullaholic]

I am going to re-state my view once again. Over the year's I have been a very strong supporter of a strong America. However, after having lived history for some 63 years, I firmly believe that the US has done nothing but postpone the inevitable in many countries after spending billions and billions of our dollars.
I think we need to modify our foreign policy to be very protective of America without being the active controller of many nation's future governing systems and let things take their natural course of self-determination, and deal with the ruling parties. I will make an exception of genocide, however. I think we need to partner with other nations to actively prevent the wanton and malicious slaughter of innocent human beings in great numbers, without becoming involved in other nation's governing processes---go in--stop genocide and get out whereever it is occuring, and make a clear statement that genocide will not be tolerated anywhere in the world and that perpetrators will be punished harshly for war crimes against humanity.

[YTBulldogs]

I seen yesterday, a kid about 14, 15 chunk a fire bomb thingy about 60 yards in the air. Man, we could use him here.

[LoboesWT]

Originally posted by Bullaholic
I will make an exception of genocide, however. I think we need to partner with other nations to actively prevent the wanton and malicious slaughter of innocent human beings in great numbers, without becoming involved in other nation's governing processes---go in--stop genocide and get out whereever it is occuring, and make a clear statement that genocide will not be tolerated anywhere in the world and that perpetrators will be punished harshly for war crimes against humanity.

I believe that is our current policy that has gotten us where we are today. Our interference wheter it be through partnering or direct intervention has lead to the Anti-American sentiment felt through much of the world.

[YTBulldogs]

Originally posted by LoboesWT
I believe that is our current policy that has gotten us where we are today. Our interference wheter it be through partnering or direct intervention has lead to the Anti-American sentiment felt through much of the world.

Yup. These countries were born to act like this. Been this way since Jesus. It's all they know and we ain't gonna correct it. Might waste zillions trying though. Think this money could correct our budget/debt issues?