Brownwood/IP incident update, one more time I guess

[Gsquared]

http://www.timesrecordnews.com/news/2010/nov/16/film-shows-why-game-turned-ugly-on-off-field/

[bobcat1]

Makes sense to me. Sounds like an accurate statement.

[3afan]

interesting

[Looking4number8]

It's good to hear the other side of the story. Trying not to be the homer that I am, the only thing that bothered me about the story is he seems to blame his kids at times. Kind of "threw them under the bus" a little.

Other than that... nice story

[Txbroadcaster]

Originally posted by Looking4number8
It's good to hear the other side of the story. Trying not to be the homer that I am, the only thing that bothered me about the story is he seems to blame his kids at times. Kind of "threw them under the bus" a little.

Other than that... nice story


THANK U..he is basically IMO saying well I dont have control of the program, I did not see anything wrong until I kept being told it was wrong, darn those kids

[themsu97]

I don't know Shipley, but I know Ponder...

he has control...
seen some of the you tube clips but I have coached and been around long enough to know that I am seeing a slanted view...
Not justifying the obvious late hits and cheap shots... but until I see every play then you get a better feel... 5 personal fouls on bwood shows that they have their own problems as well... all teams do...
my question really comes down to why score 88 points? it shows to me that in this situation, neither coach, or team showed class... period... and if you know that they are targeting your kid, pull him off the field and let someone else score or run every route he has toward your sideline and then things are less likely to happen...
just my opinion...

[bobcat1]

Originally posted by Txbroadcaster
THANK U..he is basically IMO saying well I dont have control of the program, I did not see anything wrong until I kept being told it was wrong, darn those kids Come on Terry. You can do better than that. You know all too well you can't see everything on every play until you see film. He apologized for his part and is going to call Shipley later on to clear the air. He didn't have to say anything now did he?

[Txbroadcaster]

Originally posted by bobcat1
Come on Terry. You can do better than that. You know all too well you can't see everything on every play until you see film. He apologized for his part and is going to call Shipley later on to clear the air. He didn't have to say anything now did he?

I just dont like the well I did not see it then..you had as many penalties called agianst you for personal fouls as they did and it SEEMED he was saying wow I was shocked they were mad at during the game and had no real clue as to why until I saw the film.

Not saying that was how he felt, I am saying that it was it seemed like he was saying..OMG NOW I see why they were mad.

[bobcat1]

And I never heard anything about Brownwood's 5 personals until just now. If you knew Scott you would know everything he said in the interview was very forthcoming.

[RoyceTTU]

Originally posted by themsu97
I don't know Shipley, but I know Ponder...

he has control...
seen some of the you tube clips but I have coached and been around long enough to know that I am seeing a slanted view...
Not justifying the obvious late hits and cheap shots... but until I see every play then you get a better feel... 5 personal fouls on bwood shows that they have their own problems as well... all teams do...
my question really comes down to why score 88 points? it shows to me that in this situation, neither coach, or team showed class... period... and if you know that they are targeting your kid, pull him off the field and let someone else score or run every route he has toward your sideline and then things are less likely to happen...
just my opinion...


I applaud Ponder for doing anything and especially admitting some fault. That in itself is way more than I expected him to do and it is obvious he wants to make things better. I totally understand not being able see every play as I can't even do it being in the stands.

My sole blame is still on the refs.

As for this quoted post, nice deflection on the 88 points. I think you will find about 3 - 4 different threads that justifies why the 88 was scored and even find that it isn't even us Brownwood Homers that justify it.

Shipley was a genius for diverting the attention of his players of "getting revenge", and instead had them focus their energy on scoring points. This is a life lesson that in many peoples book is priceless.


Again, what Ponder did, to admit some fault and vow to try to mend things up, is very classy.

[hollywood]

Originally posted by bobcat1
And I never heard anything about Brownwood's 5 personals until just now. If you knew Scott you would know everything he said in the interview was very forthcoming.

I know there was 1 personal foul called on Brownwood, IMO, that was to protect a Bwood player. A Bwood player made a text book tackle on the field near the IP sideline that ended out of bounds. IP coaches were all over this kid an the ref threw a flag I think to give the kid a chance to get out of there. IP coaching staff was way out of control and Ponder admitted it. Shipley lost his cool as well, but unless we were all in that situation, we really don't understand everything that was going on.

[Snotbubbles]

Was any players kicked out by officials?

If not, and Ponder now see's why Shipley was so upset about when he seen the film, someone should of been booted.

What chapter did the game?

I must warn B'wood. Your studs will be targeted here on out. Keep heads on a swivel. Coaches/players/fans read 3A Downlow too.

Comments on another thread like, "I hope we face so and so, cause we are tired of beating Snyder. Need some new teams to beat"---kinda fuels the fire IMO.

[Gsquared]

Originally posted by Snotbubbles
Was any players kicked out by officials?

If not, and Ponder now see's why Shipley was so upset about when he seen the film, someone should of been booted.

What chapter did the game?

I must warn B'wood. Your studs will be targeted here on out. Keep heads on a swivel. Coaches/players/fans read 3A Downlow too.

Comments on another thread like, "I hope we face so and so, cause we are tired of beating Snyder. Need some new teams to beat"---kinda fuels the fire IMO.
I believe FT Worth chapter called the game. There was one ejection. Officials never called time out on them and pulled both teams aside. To me, it looked like the crew never had control in that game.

[Macarthur]

Originally posted by RoyceTTU
I applaud Ponder for doing anything and especially admitting some fault. That in itself is way more than I expected him to do and it is obvious he wants to make things better. I totally understand not being able see every play as I can't even do it being in the stands.

My sole blame is still on the refs.

As for this quoted post, nice deflection on the 88 points. I think you will find about 3 - 4 different threads that justifies why the 88 was scored and even find that it isn't even us Brownwood Homers that justify it.

Shipley was a genius for diverting the attention of his players of "getting revenge", and instead had them focus their energy on scoring points. This is a life lesson that in many peoples book is priceless.


Again, what Ponder did, to admit some fault and vow to try to mend things up, is very classy.

Any time you are in a heated situation, you will generally have a better perspective on things when you have had time to cool down and reflect.

I think he probably feels really bad that it got out of control and his kids and parents had to see that type of behavior from men that are leaders of young men.

[Macarthur]

Originally posted by hollywood
I know there was 1 personal foul called on Brownwood, IMO, that was to protect a Bwood player. A Bwood player made a text book tackle on the field near the IP sideline that ended out of bounds. IP coaches were all over this kid an the ref threw a flag I think to give the kid a chance to get out of there. IP coaching staff was way out of control and Ponder admitted it. Shipley lost his cool as well, but unless we were all in that situation, we really don't understand everything that was going on.

This makes no sense.

[Macarthur]

Originally posted by Gsquared
I believe FT Worth chapter called the game. There was one ejection. Officials never called time out on them and pulled both teams aside. To me, it looked like the crew never had control in that game.

This also occured to me. If this game was so out of control, why didn't the refs do something to get control of this?

[RoyceTTU]

Originally posted by Snotbubbles
Was any players kicked out by officials?

If not, and Ponder now see's why Shipley was so upset about when he seen the film, someone should of been booted.

What chapter did the game?

I must warn B'wood. Your studs will be targeted here on out. Keep heads on a swivel. Coaches/players/fans read 3A Downlow too.

Comments on another thread like, "I hope we face so and so, cause we are tired of beating Snyder. Need some new teams to beat"---kinda fuels the fire IMO.

yes, one of there players were ejected.

Abilene chapter did the game, the same officials that normally do the 5a games.

As for being a target.....We've been #1 since week 1....We've never left the bulls-eye. There is a fineline between being "Targeted" and being a "Target".

Jaxon was for sure "Targeted" by a "a couple of players out of control" because the coach had them "Too geared up".

As for being a "Target", everyone wants to knock us off our pedastool ie...Wylie tried and did it without "Targeting" as well as most other teams we played this year.

[Gsquared]

Originally posted by RoyceTTU
yes, one of there players were ejected.

Abilene chapter did the game, the same officials that normally do the 5a games.

As for being a target.....We've been #1 since week 1....We've never left the bulls-eye. There is a fineline between being "Targeted" and being a "Target".

Jaxon was for sure "Targeted" by a "a couple of players out of control" because the coach had them "Too geared up".

As for being a "Target", everyone wants to knock us off our pedastool ie...Wylie tried and did it without "Targeting" as well as most other teams we played this year.
Ahh Abilene Chapter? Looked like a FT Worth chapter crew, MO wise hahaha. JK

[RoyceTTU]

Originally posted by Macarthur
Any time you are in a heated situation, you will generally have a better perspective on things when you have had time to cool down and reflect.

I think he probably feels really bad that it got out of control and his kids and parents had to see that type of behavior from men that are leaders of young men.

I agree, that's why I applaud Ponder for wanting to reach out to Shipley

[BILLYFRED0000]

Originally posted by Gsquared
I believe FT Worth chapter called the game. There was one ejection. Officials never called time out on them and pulled both teams aside. To me, it looked like the crew never had control in that game.

Yeah that was what I thought too G. If you are calling more than 3 or 4 personals a half you really ought to stop it and get the teams attention. I think 17 falls well into that category. Specially since the coaches were hot and it was obvious.

[RoyceTTU]

Originally posted by Gsquared
Ahh Abilene Chapter? Looked like a FT Worth chapter crew, MO wise hahaha. JK

LOL, the only reason why I know, is my "Old Supervisor", his son was one of the line judges. This was only the 2nd time of the year they had left Abilene.

This crew was also the one that supposadly left the mic on at halftime at the Abilene High v Cooper game. LOL, what a year.

[Ranger Mom]

My favorite part about articles like this are reading the comments at the bottom of them. Quite a few comments from WF Rider folks on there.

[YTBulldogs]

I agree, officials have some responsibilty to control the game. Must be from the start.

Coaches have the most control though. And, when you have coaches yelling at the other from accros the field, a bad situation is going to happen. Coaches are the one that allowed this one to get out of hand by their actions. Players hear them losing control, they will follow suit with their on field actions.

[Macarthur]

Originally posted by Ranger Mom
My favorite part about articles like this are reading the comments at the bottom of them. Quite a few comments from WF Rider folks on there.

They're pretty bitter. :p

[Ranger Mom]

At Midland High vs Arlington Bowie last Saturday, Midland High had 3rd and long and Bowie did something to get a 15 yd penalty....their coach went ballistic and was screaming at the ref, threw his hat and stomped it, and then proceeded to walk out to midfield yelling at the refs....he got a flag and another 15 yd penalty, putting Midland on the 5 yard line with a fresh new set of downs....they scored a TD. 58 seconds left to play when Bowie get the ball back and starts driving down the field. 8 seconds left on clock and they are in Midland territory and throw an interception...game over.

Before all this, Midland was gearing up for a field goal to tie the game up and take it to OT, but that coach gave them an early Christmas gift with back to back 15 yd penalties and 4 downs in the red zone.

I would have been FURIOUS at that coach if I was from Arlington!!!

[RoyceTTU]

Originally posted by YTBulldogs
I agree, officials have some responsibilty to control the game. Must be from the start.

Coaches have the most control though. And, when you have coaches yelling at the other from accros the field, a bad situation is going to happen. Coaches are the one that allowed this one to get out of hand by their actions. Players hear them losing control, they will follow suit with their on field actions.


I agree with you 100%.

Perfect example this year, Brownwood vs. Wylie this year, Brownwood DE blind sided a Wylie player 20 yards behind the play. Both coaches were watching over the player and the ref walks up and speaks to both of them.

2 minutes later both coaches has their kids on the respected sidelines getting an ARSE chewing about how the rest of the game was going to play out. No more incidences after that.

Sometimes the coaches just need a little nudge

[3afan]

Originally posted by RoyceTTU
....

Shipley was a genius for diverting the attention of his players of "getting revenge", and instead had them focus their energy on scoring points. This is a life lesson that in many peoples book is priceless.
...

give us a break ... i'm sure shipley was thinking about 'life lessons'

[RoyceTTU]

Originally posted by 3afan
give us a break ... i'm sure shipley was thinking about 'life lessons'

I never said that "shipley was thinking about life lessons". My statement was simply, it was genius. Shipley could of told his kids to come out and blast them every chance they got and try to put them on their back after every play at any cost.

HE DIDN'T, he refocused their attention for a better cause, "SCORING".

I simply said it was a life lesson, and a good one at that. But of coarse I knew there would be at least one person that would try to twist this in some way that is completely in-coherent.

[Black_Magic]

Originally posted by hollywood
I know there was 1 personal foul called on Brownwood, IMO, that was to protect a Bwood player. A Bwood player made a text book tackle on the field near the IP sideline that ended out of bounds. IP coaches were all over this kid an the ref threw a flag I think to give the kid a chance to get out of there. IP coaching staff was way out of control and Ponder admitted it. Shipley lost his cool as well, but unless we were all in that situation, we really don't understand everything that was going on. This is clearly a statement from someone who does not see the faults of thier own players. I remember this kind of talk a few weeks back from the same person. Im sure there were late hits and maybe dirty play going on if there were that many flags thrown for them. But this is the kind of statement from someone who looks the other way when thier team does it and sees sometimes more than there is when someone els may commit a foul. Big Time Homer Post

[Black_Magic]

Originally posted by RoyceTTU
I never said that "shipley was thinking about life lessons". My statement was simply, it was genius. Shipley could of told his kids to come out and blast them every chance they got and try to put them on their back after every play at any cost.

HE DIDN'T, he refocused their attention for a better cause, "SCORING".

I simply said it was a life lesson, and a good one at that. But of coarse I knew there would be at least one person that would try to twist this in some way that is completely in-coherent. what do you think about having a philosophy that makes sure you come away with the win, protect your players that you feel that are being targeted, Let the officials have a chance to act on what you voiced to them at half time, and make sure those guys who are being targeted are not on the field to be targeted after you have the game secured ( and possibley injured when they dont need to be )? Just Asking.

[hollywood]

Originally posted by Black_Magic
This is clearly a statement from someone who does not see the faults of thier own players. I remember this kind of talk a few weeks back from the same person. Im sure there were late hits and maybe dirty play going on if there were that many flags thrown for them. But this is the kind of statement from someone who looks the other way when thier team does it and sees sometimes more than there is when someone els may commit a foul. Big Time Homer Post

I admit that there were penalties caused by both teams. Every team has players that could have a late hit or personal foul called in every game! But what I was trying to present was, that there were penalties thrown that appeared to be in an effort where the refs were trying to get control of the game. They never did. It's how things happen sometimes. I also want to add that if YOU were not there then YOU have no idea how it all transpired.

[HeavyD]

Originally posted by Black_Magic
what do you think about having a philosophy that makes sure you come away with the win, protect your players that you feel that are being targeted, Let the officials have a chance to act on what you voiced to them at half time, and make sure those guys who are being targeted are not on the field to be targeted after you have the game secured ( and possibley injured when they dont need to be )? Just Asking.

So Bwd should have just sat Shipley and a couple others in the first quarter after multiple late hits? Give me a brake. It would have been different if it was late in the 3rd and Bwd kept running the score up, and that in turn caused the personal fouls, but that's not what happened. The game started out that way, so your post is ignorant.

[Black_Magic]

Originally posted by HeavyD
So Bwd should have just sat Shipley and a couple others in the first quarter after multiple late hits? Did you actualy read what I wrote or did you just read what you wanted to? go back and try again. This time actualy Read what I wrote please.

[Black_Magic]

Originally posted by HeavyD
It would have been different if it was late in the 3rd and Bwd kept running the score up, and that in turn caused the personal fouls, but that's not what happened. The game started out that way, so your post is ignorant. So your saying that in the 3rd quarter the game outcome was still in question and brownwood had not put them away yet? according to the stats I looked like it was in the bag at half.

[wimbo_pro]

Shipley used this "gift" to fire up his team and his town. This is not good for any of us who had hopes of beating them (if we get that far!!). I think you just witnessed Brownwood reaching its peak performance. No betgter time than in the play offs.

[Eagle 1]

I knew this game was going to be "fussed and discussed" for years to come.:)

[Ranger Mom]

Originally posted by Eagle 1
I knew this game was going to be "fussed and discussed" for years to come.:)

OMG!! How many different ways can they say the EXACT SAME THING!!!

I swear, men are more argumentative than us women have ever thought of being.:doh: :doh: :doh:

[Eagle 1]

Originally posted by Ranger Mom
OMG!! How many different ways can they say the EXACT SAME THING!!!

I swear, men are more argumentative than us women have ever thought of being.:doh: :doh: :doh:

Hey the old men have got to have something to talk about at the coffee shop. :D

[Snotbubbles]

Originally posted by Ranger Mom
OMG!!

I swear, men are more argumentative than us women have ever thought of being.:doh: :doh: :doh:

Not now RM, I got a headache.:p

[RoyceTTU]

Originally posted by Black_Magic
what do you think about having a philosophy that makes sure you come away with the win, protect your players that you feel that are being targeted, Let the officials have a chance to act on what you voiced to them at half time, and make sure those guys who are being targeted are not on the field to be targeted after you have the game secured ( and possibley injured when they dont need to be )? Just Asking.

I'm going to be honest I'm at odds on many ideas about how this all transpired. I had a long discussion with my father Saturday evening and still we couldn't really agree much except we wern't in his shoes. I'm going to lay down a few topics we discussed though.

1. Revenge - Shipley accomplished this in the best way imaginable
2. Protecting his son - Jaxon was sat early in the 3rd, only played special Teams
3. Protecting the team - Jaxon was not the only one to recieve cheap shots and the shots didn't happen only in the 1st half. If you have pulled Jaxon and nothing has been fixed, who do you pull out and is 1 player worth anothers possible injuries, IDK. Do you put a JV player out there to get murdered. IMO you never put players on the field to "prevent injury" you only put players in for the experience.
4. Tell your players to let up - We all know playing at 70% will get you hurt as fast as playing 100%.
5. Your starters, due to athleticism, protect themselves better, and score better and more effecient. IMO we accomplished all goals leading into the football game.


As I said before, we talked for a couple of hours and circled around and around, Who knows whos right. Shipley did what he thought was right, and I believe after seeing this article Ponder did what he thought was right and is trying to do what is right after the fact.

[BwdLion73]

Sounds like Ponder is reaching out some, however the remark about I didnt see it at the game is a little strange. I know you can't see everything and are busy doing a lot but you have assist. coachs with you and in the press box. Brownwood apparently did not have a problem seeing then what he now says he saw later on film.
On the discussion about pulling players I think if you have a team that shows no sign of slowing down on the late hits, a group of officials who seem to not be in control and a coach who can't see anything then you cannot slow down yourself.
You have your best conditioned battle harden players in. I would hate to be a parent of little bubba who is a little slower, less experienced and gets to play sometimes late in the 4th quarter when the other team is just hopeing the clock keeps running and have the coach say get in there you are expendable. :thinking:

[marler1972]

.

[Ranger Mom]

That's okay! Listening to the pissing and moaning and hashing and rehashing from the men on here has made my own marriage even better!

I appreciate my husband a lot more than I did 8 years ago, that's for darn sure!!

[RoyceTTU]

Originally posted by BwdLion73
On the discussion about pulling players I think if you have a team that shows no sign of slowing down on the late hits, a group of officials who seem to not be in control and a coach who can't see anything then you cannot slow down yourself.
You have your best conditioned battle harden players in. I would hate to be a parent of little bubba who is a little slower, less experienced and gets to play sometimes late in the 4th quarter when the other team is just hopeing the clock keeps running and have the coach say get in there you are expendable. :thinking:

Exactly, you worded it much better than I did!!!:D

[Ragin Red]

Originally posted by Txbroadcaster
THANK U..he is basically IMO saying well I dont have control of the program, I did not see anything wrong until I kept being told it was wrong, darn those kids
Well I can say from an experience this year that Coach Ponder does have control. Against the STEERS there was a player who got a little out of control and the officials didn't eject the young man but Coach Ponder pulled the young man off the field for the rest of the ball game (approx. a half left). That to me showed he has control. He also needs to make clear during the game, unlike he did in this game versuses Brownwood, that no matter what the sportsmanship of the game is the most important thing and not getting a win.

Keep it clean and safe, there are alot of injuries that can happen we don't need to increase those chances by doing something crazy.

[nobogey72]

Originally posted by RoyceTTU
I never said that "shipley was thinking about life lessons". My statement was simply, it was genius. Shipley could of told his kids to come out and blast them every chance they got and try to put them on their back after every play at any cost.

HE DIDN'T, he refocused their attention for a better cause, "SCORING".

I simply said it was a life lesson, and a good one at that. But of coarse I knew there would be at least one person that would try to twist this in some way that is completely in-coherent.

Genius???? You've got to be kidding me. I'll agree that "hanging" 88 was a much better alternative than retaliating with cheap shots. But, a TRUE life lesson opportunity went by the wayside. How about going in a half time and telling the kids this: Boys I can't tell you how pissed off I am right now. I want to whip that coaches ass but I can't do that. I also want to go out there and hang 100 on them. But, that wouldn't be the right thing to do. It wouldn't be respecting the game of football. We're gonna got out and keep our heads on a swivel and we're gonna play as absolutely hard as we can between the whisltes and then we're gonna get outta here and go to work for next week.

To me, that would have been a "genious" handling of it. And I'm guessing now that the smoke has cleared, if Bob could go back and do it over, that's what he would do. I know Bob and I know what an emotional person he is and I understand that. But that is what would have made it genious, that his young men could have seen him reel in his personal emotions and do the right thing.

Now, Brownwood posters, feel free to jump my ass!!!!

[DaHop72]

Originally posted by nobogey72
Genius???? You've got to be kidding me. I'll agree that "hanging" 88 was a much better alternative than retaliating with cheap shots. But, a TRUE life lesson opportunity went by the wayside. How about going in a half time and telling the kids this: Boys I can't tell you how pissed off I am right now. I want to whip that coaches ass but I can't do that. I also want to go out there and hang 100 on them. But, that wouldn't be the right thing to do. It wouldn't be respecting the game of football. We're gonna got out and keep our heads on a swivel and we're gonna play as absolutely hard as we can between the whisltes and then we're gonna get outta here and go to work for next week.

To me, that would have been a "genious" handling of it. And I'm guessing now that the smoke has cleared, if Bob could go back and do it over, that's what he would do. I know Bob and I know what an emotional person he is and I understand that. But that is what would have made it genious, that his young men could have seen him reel in his personal emotions and do the right thing.

Now, Brownwood posters, feel free to jump my ass!!!! :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: And I'll bet some people didn't think you had it in you bogey.:D

[Old LB]

Originally posted by nobogey72
Genius???? You've got to be kidding me. I'll agree that "hanging" 88 was a much better alternative than retaliating with cheap shots. But, a TRUE life lesson opportunity went by the wayside. How about going in a half time and telling the kids this: Boys I can't tell you how pissed off I am right now. I want to whip that coaches ass but I can't do that. I also want to go out there and hang 100 on them. But, that wouldn't be the right thing to do. It wouldn't be respecting the game of football. We're gonna got out and keep our heads on a swivel and we're gonna play as absolutely hard as we can between the whisltes and then we're gonna get outta here and go to work for next week.

To me, that would have been a "genious" handling of it. And I'm guessing now that the smoke has cleared, if Bob could go back and do it over, that's what he would do. I know Bob and I know what an emotional person he is and I understand that. But that is what would have made it genious, that his young men could have seen him reel in his personal emotions and do the right thing.

Now, Brownwood posters, feel free to jump my ass!!!!
I can understand RoyceTTU's point here, but if the truth were told you are probably right nobogey.

[bclion56]

there's a very simple solution to all of this, don't let them score. Its thats easy. In life stuff happens that you don't like, but don't complain and whine about it if you provoked it yourself which is exactly what IP did. They were warned and they ignored the warning. They have no one to blame but themselves. Coach Shipley did nothing but honor his word.

[Looking4number8]

Originally posted by nobogey72
Genius???? You've got to be kidding me. I'll agree that "hanging" 88 was a much better alternative than retaliating with cheap shots. But, a TRUE life lesson opportunity went by the wayside. How about going in a half time and telling the kids this: Boys I can't tell you how pissed off I am right now. I want to whip that coaches ass but I can't do that. I also want to go out there and hang 100 on them. But, that wouldn't be the right thing to do. It wouldn't be respecting the game of football. We're gonna got out and keep our heads on a swivel and we're gonna play as absolutely hard as we can between the whisltes and then we're gonna get outta here and go to work for next week.

To me, that would have been a "genious" handling of it. And I'm guessing now that the smoke has cleared, if Bob could go back and do it over, that's what he would do. I know Bob and I know what an emotional person he is and I understand that. But that is what would have made it genious, that his young men could have seen him reel in his personal emotions and do the right thing.

Now, Brownwood posters, feel free to jump my ass!!!!

I am not going to "jump your ass" but the thruth is not a single one of us know what was the perfect way to handle it. Could it be the way you say would have gotten more kids hurt, maybe, maybe not. Could your way give our kids a chance to get even more pissed off and throw some punches themself. again maybe, maybe not. None of have any idea what was going threw Shipley, Ponder or any of the kids heads.. all we can do is specualte and second guess. It is over, they threw punches, we threw TD's right or wrong this is what happened..

As for Black Magic statements about pulling the kid to protect him.. that is what IP was trying to do. I guess somebody could beat Snyder by cheap shoting Ward the whole game so you guys would pull him to protect him (cause Ward is a STUD!!!!) No yall would not pull him in the first quarter, thats not an option. Again, I have no idea and dont pretend to have any idea what the right thing to do was and honestly, even though you are coaching, you really dont have any idea either

Now you guys feel free to "jump my ass" I am sure I deserve it. (or you could just pull your starters and let me slide on this one)

[RoyceTTU]

Originally posted by nobogey72
Genius???? You've got to be kidding me. I'll agree that "hanging" 88 was a much better alternative than retaliating with cheap shots. But, a TRUE life lesson opportunity went by the wayside. How about going in a half time and telling the kids this: Boys I can't tell you how pissed off I am right now. I want to whip that coaches ass but I can't do that. I also want to go out there and hang 100 on them. But, that wouldn't be the right thing to do. It wouldn't be respecting the game of football. We're gonna got out and keep our heads on a swivel and we're gonna play as absolutely hard as we can between the whisltes and then we're gonna get outta here and go to work for next week.

To me, that would have been a "genious" handling of it. And I'm guessing now that the smoke has cleared, if Bob could go back and do it over, that's what he would do. I know Bob and I know what an emotional person he is and I understand that. But that is what would have made it genious, that his young men could have seen him reel in his personal emotions and do the right thing.

Now, Brownwood posters, feel free to jump my ass!!!!

Okay, i'll concede to you a bit. Genius is a bit over the top. I'll even come out and say your idea might of worked also.

As for the life lesson going by the wayside, no way your right here.

The kids were taught not to retaliate in means outside of the normal boundaries of the football game.
They were taught to find a way to "get even" within the rules of the game. And they did.
They were taught to keep their word.
Were taught how to protect themselves against an agressive football team.
Were taught how to turn negative energy into winning a football game.
etc.....

As for Bob doing it different, I can't answer that, he's not at my hip. As for how his following(city of brownwood and brownwood faithful), it was perfect because we are even tighter nit group and have hit a new gear in the most important time of the football season.

[Macarthur]

Originally posted by bclion56
there's a very simple solution to all of this, don't let them score. Its thats easy. In life stuff happens that you don't like, but don't complain and whine about it if you provoked it yourself which is exactly what IP did. They were warned and they ignored the warning. They have no one to blame but themselves. Coach Shipley did nothing but honor his word.

The dirty play is unacceptable, but if you put yourself in the shoes of 17 year old kids and you fully know that you can not stop them. They are superior to you in every single way. You CAN NOT stop them. Not to mention that they are pretty aggressive themselves.

I'm not condoning it, but I'm saying I can see where testosterone filled kids would start getting chippy when they realize there's no way to beat them and they are clearly continuing to throw the ball deep and are try and score 200 points if they can.

I think, at some point, it becomes a chicken and egg situation. IP is getting frustrated so they let their emotions get the best of them. BW sees the extra cirricular and desides to push harder on the gas peddle and IP gets even more frustrated and it just continues to escalate.

That's why the refs should have gotten control of the game. And hopefully next time, each coach will have learned from their mistakes.

[Looking4number8]

Originally posted by Macarthur
The dirty play is unacceptable, but if you put yourself in the shoes of 17 year old kids and you fully know that you can not stop them. They are superior to you in every single way. You CAN NOT stop them. Not to mention that they are pretty aggressive themselves.

I'm not condoning it, but I'm saying I can see where testosterone filled kids would start getting chippy when they realize there's no way to beat them and they are clearly continuing to throw the ball deep and are try and score 200 points if they can.

I think, at some point, it becomes a chicken and egg situation. IP is getting frustrated so they let their emotions get the best of them. BW sees the extra cirricular and desides to push harder on the gas peddle and IP gets even more frustrated and it just continues to escalate.

That's why the refs should have gotten control of the game. And hopefully next time, each coach will have learned from their mistakes.
I really have not liked any thing you have posted until now but I agree with that post 100% Very well said!

[Black_Magic]

Originally posted by Looking4number8
As for Black Magic statements about pulling the kid to protect him.. that is what IP was trying to do. I guess somebody could beat Snyder by cheap shoting Ward the whole game so you guys would pull him to protect him (cause Ward is a STUD!!!!) No yall would not pull him in the first quarter, thats not an option. Again, I have no idea and dont pretend to have any idea what the right thing to do was and honestly, even though you are coaching, you really dont have any idea either

Well If some of you guys could read you would have noticed that I said to pull them when the game is secure and you have it well in hand. Guess you just want to overlook that. Typical of you though. So in your rational the starters should never be pulled??? And you think you have an idea???:rolleyes:

[RoyceTTU]

Originally posted by Black_Magic
Well If some of you guys could read you would have noticed that I said to pull them when the game is secure and you have it well in hand. Guess you just want to overlook that. Typical of you though. So in your rational the starters should never be pulled??? And you think you have an idea???:rolleyes:

Watch it!!! I read it and responded accoringly..LOL :D

Hey, did you hear ya'll have a game against Kennedale and we play Bridgeport :D

[91 lion]

Originally posted by Looking4number8
I really have not liked any thing you have posted until now but I agree with that post 100% Very well said!

I was just thinking the same thing about McArthur.

[nobogey72]

Originally posted by RoyceTTU
Okay, i'll concede to you a bit. Genius is a bit over the top. I'll even come out and say your idea might of worked also.

As for the life lesson going by the wayside, no way your right here.

The kids were taught not to retaliate in means outside of the normal boundaries of the football game.
They were taught to find a way to "get even" within the rules of the game. And they did.
They were taught to keep their word.
Were taught how to protect themselves against an agressive football team.
Were taught how to turn negative energy into winning a football game.
etc.....

As for Bob doing it different, I can't answer that, he's not at my hip. As for how his following(city of brownwood and brownwood faithful), it was perfect because we are even tighter nit group and have hit a new gear in the most important time of the football season.

I know what you're saying. Believe me. And I have no clue what Shipley was thinking at the time or is now thinking. As I said in the post "I am guessing....." His comment in the Abilene Paper about "not proud of scoring 88" makes me think he might have done it differently if he had a do-over. I wish I had a bunch of do-overs where I let my emotions dictate over my brain.

[Looking4number8]

Originally posted by Black_Magic
Well If some of you guys could read you would have noticed that I said to pull them when the game is secure and you have it well in hand. Guess you just want to overlook that. Typical of you though. So in your rational the starters should never be pulled??? And you think you have an idea???:rolleyes:

Correct, I missed that part of your first post. I will admit to skimming thru when I get to the computer and there are multiple pages. I should have reread before I mentioned it in my post. My mistake. On a side note, Shipley was pulled from the game for his protection in the late 3rd or early 4th quarter. Maybe sooner, not for sure. Maybe he should have been pulled sooner too... again, I do not pretend to know what the "right thing to do" was

[91 lion]

Originally posted by Black_Magic
Well If some of you guys could read you would have noticed that I said to pull them when the game is secure and you have it well in hand. Guess you just want to overlook that. Typical of you though. So in your rational the starters should never be pulled??? And you think you have an idea???:rolleyes:

Dude, Shipley was pulled....I repeat, Shipley was pulled very early in the 3rd quarter. Our #2 receiver didnt play. We were already playing our 5th and 6th receivers. Yes, Brown played into the 4th but had almost all of his passing yards in the 1st half. We constantly rotate our RBs. We scored on a 96 yard Int return....so really?

You, being a coach and all should know that.

[RoyceTTU]

Originally posted by nobogey72
I know what you're saying. Believe me. And I have no clue what Shipley was thinking at the time or is now thinking. As I said in the post "I am guessing....." His comment in the Abilene Paper about "not proud of scoring 88" makes me think he might have done it differently if he had a do-over. I wish I had a bunch of do-overs where I let my emotions dictate over my brain.

true enough, my arguemnt was simply, he did about as well as I thought he could do under the circumstance, atleast in my eyes. You probably know much better than I, since I've never coached, that during the game, so many emotions, so many things to keep straight, who knows the right answer :confused:

It sure gives us something to throw at one another though :D

[bobcat1]

Originally posted by Macarthur
The dirty play is unacceptable, but if you put yourself in the shoes of 17 year old kids and you fully know that you can not stop them. They are superior to you in every single way. You CAN NOT stop them. Not to mention that they are pretty aggressive themselves.

I'm not condoning it, but I'm saying I can see where testosterone filled kids would start getting chippy when they realize there's no way to beat them and they are clearly continuing to throw the ball deep and are try and score 200 points if they can.

I think, at some point, it becomes a chicken and egg situation. IP is getting frustrated so they let their emotions get the best of them. BW sees the extra cirricular and desides to push harder on the gas peddle and IP gets even more frustrated and it just continues to escalate.

That's why the refs should have gotten control of the game. And hopefully next time, each coach will have learned from their mistakes. Now that is the perspective I was trying to make in the original post when Ponder's class was challenged. I have been where these kids were when I was 16 and 17. I didn't make good decisions then especially when ticked off. What am I talking about, I still screw up at 54 when ticked. :D

[BwdLion_80]

Originally posted by Macarthur
The dirty play is unacceptable, but if you put yourself in the shoes of 17 year old kids and you fully know that you can not stop them. They are superior to you in every single way. You CAN NOT stop them. Not to mention that they are pretty aggressive themselves.

I'm not condoning it, but I'm saying I can see where testosterone filled kids would start getting chippy when they realize there's no way to beat them and they are clearly continuing to throw the ball deep and are try and score 200 points if they can.

I think, at some point, it becomes a chicken and egg situation. IP is getting frustrated so they let their emotions get the best of them. BW sees the extra cirricular and desides to push harder on the gas peddle and IP gets even more frustrated and it just continues to escalate.

That's why the refs should have gotten control of the game. And hopefully next time, each coach will have learned from their mistakes.

I understand what you are saying here, but, the fact remains that most of the late hits, especially the ones on Shipley, were in the first half before the game got out of hand. Granted, there was still some stuff happening later in the game, but the ones that brought out the most attention were a good bit before halftime.

[Macarthur]

Originally posted by BwdLion_80
I understand what you are saying here, but, the fact remains that most of the late hits, especially the ones on Shipley, were in the first half before the game got out of hand. Granted, there was still some stuff happening later in the game, but the ones that brought out the most attention were a good bit before halftime.

I suspect the IP kids knew they were not going to be able to stop them well before it was reflected on the scoreboard.

I played tons of sports and there were times when I knew very quickly that we couldn't hang with some team. Even though the score might not have reflected it at the time.

[Macarthur]

Originally posted by Looking4number8
I really have not liked any thing you have posted until now but I agree with that post 100% Very well said!

Well, you should read more of my posts. :D

[Black_Magic]

Originally posted by RoyceTTU


Hey, did you hear ya'll have a game against Kennedale and we play Bridgeport :D Yep. Just thought I would crash this thread like all the BW posters have been doing to ALL the other threads ALL year long.. ;)

[ASUFrisbeeStud]

You know I'm not really a Brownwood fan but I'm really tired of all this crap. You play football to win, if you can hang 100 on someone, do it. If the other team wants to play dirty, put 100 on them if you can, not many teams are capable of doing it. Shipley is a good coach, he has an amazing team. Ponder is a good coach that had less than an amazing team. Ponder does have a reputation from the past of having some dirty players though, so as far as I'm concerned I wish you would all just shutup about it and move on to something else. I'm really tired of hearing about this one damn game. IP let it go, BW you better pay attention to what's in front of you.

[Macarthur]

Originally posted by ASUFrisbeeStud
You know I'm not really a Brownwood fan but I'm really tired of all this crap. You play football to win, if you can hang 100 on someone, do it. If the other team wants to play dirty, put 100 on them if you can, not many teams are capable of doing it. Shipley is a good coach, he has an amazing team. Ponder is a good coach that had less than an amazing team. Ponder does have a reputation from the past of having some dirty players though, so as far as I'm concerned I wish you would all just shutup about it and move on to something else. I'm really tired of hearing about this one damn game. IP let it go, BW you better pay attention to what's in front of you.

Don't click the thread title. What did you expect to read when you clicked it?

[95mustang]

Originally posted by Macarthur
Don't click the thread title. What did you expect to read when you clicked it? :doh:

[BwdLion73]

Originally posted by Black_Magic
Yep. Just thought I would crash this thread like all the BW posters have been doing to ALL the other threads ALL year long.. ;)

we have to...most of the threads wind up about Brownwood.

:) ;)

[Eagle 1]

Originally posted by BwdLion73
we have to...most of the threads wind up about Brownwood.

:) ;)

Don't feel bad, Goldthwaite has the same problem on the 1A board.
Of course nobody likes to talk about a team unless they are winning.;)

[BwdLion73]

Originally posted by Eagle 1
Don't feel bad, Goldthwaite has the same problem on the 1A board.
Of course nobody likes to talk about a team unless they are winning.;)

Go Eagles:thumbsup:

[Old LB]

Originally posted by Eagle 1
Don't feel bad, Goldthwaite has the same problem on the 1A board.
Of course nobody likes to talk about a team unless they are winning.;)

I played against the 85 Eagles team, we got killed, but that is still one of my favorite games. Lots of hitting going on. Good stuff ya'll got going on down there.

[Eagle 1]

Originally posted by Old LB
I played against the 85 Eagles team, we got killed, but that is still one of my favorite games. Lots of hitting going on. Good stuff ya'll got going on down there.
I graduated in 84, so I played with a few of them guys on the jv team. Good group.
Anyway, I didn't mean to hijack the thread.

[Z-RO]

To me it seems as if Ponder is trying to cover his butt, how ignorant is he to not notice the officials marking 15 yards off every time it happened? Your the head coach of your football team, and your telling me NOBODY on your staff noticed this happening during the game? I'm sorry but this still seems real http://gal.darkervision.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/09/chickenshit.jpg to me.

[hollywood]

Originally posted by ASUFrisbeeStud
You play football to win, if you can hang 100 on someone, do it. If the other team wants to play dirty, put 100 on them if you can, not many teams are capable of doing it. Shipley is a good coach, he has an amazing team.

I agree with the above. Why is it that only in football, everyone thinks that once the score differential is a "certain" variance, say more than 30 points, the team in the lead has to back off and stop scoring? Every other sport you score as many as possible. :thinking:

[Old LB]

Maybe 11 man needs a 45 point rule like 6 man? :D