Question for those who blame Jerry for Cowboys woes...

[slpybear the bullfan]

Jerry gets lots of blame for the Cowboys lack of success... usually along the lines of, "Jerry needs to quit being the coach and let a real coach come in and take over."

My question is, if you think Jerry is "too active" as an owner, do you give him any credit for the Super Bowl wins? Or do you think he just became "too active" as an owner after he and Jimmy split the sheets?

Personally, I think you can't gripe about how active of an owner he is without also giving some kudos to his three super bowl rings.

Thoughts?

(I also think that talent was the biggest thing that won those super bowls... Talent from high draft pics from being bad, plan B free agency, and the trade with Minn.)

[DaHop72]

Originally posted by slpybear the bullfan
Jerry gets lots of blame for the Cowboys lack of success... usually along the lines of, "Jerry needs to quit being the coach and let a real coach come in and take over."

My question is, if you think Jerry is "too active" as an owner, do you give him any credit for the Super Bowl wins? Or do you think he just became "too active" as an owner after he and Jimmy split the sheets?

Personally, I think you can't gripe about how active of an owner he is without also giving some kudos to his three super bowl rings.

Thoughts?

(I also think that talent was the biggest thing that won those super bowls... Talent from high draft pics from being bad, plan B free agency, and the trade with Minn.) slpy, I'll give him credit for the players that he brought it for JJ. But I think he stayed out of JJ's way until he thought JJ was getting all the credit and that caused the parting of the way for the two of them. I think since then that he has tried to have too big of a part in the day to day scheme of things and has tended to be the puppeteer.

[slpybear the bullfan]

Originally posted by DaHop72
slpy, I'll give him credit for the players that he brought it for JJ. But I think he stayed out of JJ's way until he thought JJ was getting all the credit and that caused the parting of the way for the two of them. I think since then that he has tried to have too big of a part in the day to day scheme of things and has tended to be the puppeteer.

And the Parcell's years?

[DaHop72]

Originally posted by slpybear the bullfan
And the Parcell's years? I think initially the Tuna fought Jerry tooth and nail, but I think the Tuna had pretty much lost his drive and desire at that point in his life and was looking more at the monetary side so he just went with the flow until he left for greener pastures.

[injuredinmelee]

Tell me how Dalls got any better other than at reciever with the pick of Bryant this season over last? WHo makes all the personnel decisions? Who let the second most penalized player over the last five years in the NFL go and picked up THE MOST penalized player in a trade? WHo insisted that they take Quincy Carter? Who insisted they sign T.O.?

[DaHop72]

Originally posted by DaHop72
I think initially the Tuna fought Jerry tooth and nail, but I think the Tuna had pretty much lost his drive and desire at that point in his life and was looking more at the monetary side so he just went with the flow until he left for greener pastures. Your thoughts slpy??

[Bullaholic]

Slpy. I don't blame Jerry Jones for all of the Cowboy's ills, but his stamp is indelibly there. With the exception of Parcells-- who I am still convinced was hired primarily to train Steven Jones in the ways of the front office of the NFL franchise, and who was but a shadow of his former Giant coach tail-kicking self, and who saw Jerry's fat billfold laying on the table---Jerry has not hired a single strong-willed, independent, and capable HC since his acrimonious split with Jimmy Johnson. I don't think he wants to be challenged like that again by any HC he hires. For this reason--I think many independent and highly capable HC coach candidates are not too interested in coming to Dallas. Perhaps in view of the current Cowboy situation, Jerry will swallow his personal pride and open his billfold again to secure the kind of HC and coaching staff that the current Cowboys players desperately need and the long suffering Cowboys fans deserve. Fast and effective changes will have to start with cleaning house in the coaching staff and building from there.

[sinton66]

Problem is it will not get better until Jerry realizes these things himself. I'm sure people have told him this, but nothing will happen until he accepts it for himself.

[IHStangFan]

No....I give him credit for the bowl wins...but not as much as I give Johnson credit. At the same time, I blame Jurrah for not leaving well enough alone and letting his ego get the better of him and his differences w/ Johnson ultimately ending up with Johnson leaving (being run off) as a result....again...largely because Jones wouldn't keep his nose, ego, whatever you wanna call it in check and just let the staff do what they did best....win Super Bowls.

[forum_guy]

am i wrong for having always thought Jerry Jones cares more about making money than winning?

[eagles_victory]

Originally posted by IHStangFan
No....I give him credit for the bowl wins...but not as much as I give Johnson credit. At the same time, I blame Jurrah for not leaving well enough alone and letting his ego get the better of him and his differences w/ Johnson ultimately ending up with Johnson leaving (being run off) as a result....again...largely because Jones wouldn't keep his nose, ego, whatever you wanna call it in check and just let the staff do what they did best....win Super Bowls. Once again I am ready for Terry to see this lol.

[eagles_victory]

Originally posted by injuredinmelee
Tell me how Dalls got any better other than at reciever with the pick of Bryant this season over last? WHo makes all the personnel decisions? Who let the second most penalized player over the last five years in the NFL go and picked up THE MOST penalized player in a trade? WHo insisted that they take Quincy Carter? Who insisted they sign T.O.? What was so bad about T.O. led the league in touchdown catches and the team went 13-3 sure the loss to the Giants hurt in the playoffs but that Giants team beat what was billed to be the best team in history in those same playoffs. Sure some things went south later on but who is to say that is all on T.O.

[Farmersfan]

Jerry needs to hire a strong willed coach who will have the ability to force his will on the players dispite the nature of the owner. Jerry is a hands-on type of guy and I'm pretty sure that isn't going to change. A strong coach will work around that fact. I can guarantee a player didn't go around Jimmy Johnson to get his way and not suffer the consequences. Wade probably TELLS the players to go ask Jerry!!!!

[3afan]

i dont see how Jerry can be blamed for the team's woes of late --- its all on the players ... they are grown men, pro athletes ... its ALL on the players

[CenTexSports]

I did not live in Texas during the JJ era but I think the difference between that team and now can be summed up in one name: Emmit Smith. If the Cowboys had a running game that matched Emmit with a good fullback like he had, then Romo is a better QB.

If LT had come to the Cowboys instead of the Jets, I think you would have seen a much better Cowboy team this year.

Ultimately, Wade will take the blame and the hit for the lack of results.

[steers2]

Originally posted by forum_guy
am i wrong for having always thought Jerry Jones cares more about making money than winning?

I think you are absolutely right

[Farmersfan]

Originally posted by 3afan
i dont see how Jerry can be blamed for the team's woes of late --- its all on the players ... they are grown men, pro athletes ... its ALL on the players




Certainly it's on the players! But there IS a reason these pro teams need coaches. These player already know how to play the game. They truly don't need to be shown how to block or how to tackle when they get to this level. The coaching is to GET THEIR HEADS STRAIGHT! The coaching is to COME UP WITH A GAMEPLAN! The coaching is TO MAKE SURE THE PLAYERD DON"T GET COMPLACENT!
The coaching on this team has failed to do any of the above! And it is unrealistic to think Jerry could fire all the players but he certainly can make a statement and dismiss his head coach!

[Txbroadcaster]

Originally posted by forum_guy
am i wrong for having always thought Jerry Jones cares more about making money than winning?

Really?!! look how much he has spent for players and coaches..JJ makes mistakes but it is not to just make money

[Farmersfan]

Originally posted by Txbroadcaster
Really?!! look how much he has spent for players and coaches..JJ makes mistakes but it is not to just make money




anyone who claims Jerry is all about the money must not have paid attention the past 14 years. If he truly only cared about making money he would have hired a football man years ago and turned over the FOOTBALL part to him. Jerry is smart enough to understand that his ego and his involvement in this team has certainly cost him money in the past and is continuing to do so. But he has said on numerous occasions that the day he stops being involved in this team is the day he no longer owns the team. Besides, this franchise has become the #1 valued franchise in the NFL under his "Failed" guidance. Imagine the value of this franchise IF they had managed to stay in competition for the Superbowl all these years.

[slpybear the bullfan]

Originally posted by injuredinmelee
Tell me how Dalls got any better other than at reciever with the pick of Bryant this season over last? WHo makes all the personnel decisions? Who let the second most penalized player over the last five years in the NFL go and picked up THE MOST penalized player in a trade? WHo insisted that they take Quincy Carter? Who insisted they sign T.O.?

Who orchestrated the Plan B pickups? Who had the stones to make the Minn trade? Who brought in Deion Sanders? Who brought in Charles Haley?

My point is, you can criticize Jerry for some dumb moves... but can you also give him credit for the smart ones?

I can do both. And I think for the most part he gets it right more than he gets it wrong.

[slpybear the bullfan]

Originally posted by DaHop72
Your thoughts slpy??

I think everyone around rejoiced when Parcells was brought here. Everyone talked about how Jerry was "getting out" of coaching and turning it over to the disciplinarian. I think that was waaaaaay overblown. In hindsight its easy to see how that worked out, (it didn't), but I think Jerry gets little credit for the hire now...

I think the Campo, Gailey, and now Wade hires are the worst decisions Jerry has made while he has been here. And unfortunately, because of the short lived Gailey experiment, we are stuck with Wade until at least the end of the season.

My biggest coaching complaint against Jerry was in him not promoting Sean Payton. I think that was a natural fit for the boys.

[slpybear the bullfan]

Originally posted by IHStangFan
No....I give him credit for the bowl wins...but not as much as I give Johnson credit. At the same time, I blame Jurrah for not leaving well enough alone and letting his ego get the better of him and his differences w/ Johnson ultimately ending up with Johnson leaving (being run off) as a result....again...largely because Jones wouldn't keep his nose, ego, whatever you wanna call it in check and just let the staff do what they did best....win Super Bowls.

I do agree that Jimmy gets a ton of credit for those wins. But I do not think they would have kept winning if Jimmy was here. Too many players have gone on to say that they could not keep it up with the atmosphere of domination that Jimmy had on the team.

[Farmersfan]

Originally posted by slpybear the bullfan
I do agree that Jimmy gets a ton of credit for those wins. But I do not think they would have kept winning if Jimmy was here. Too many players have gone on to say that they could not keep it up with the atmosphere of domination that Jimmy had on the team.




I agree! The newness wears off pretty quick for grown men! How does a coach stay dominate over players that just won a Superbowl? A straight disciplinarian is as shortlived in the NFL as a mouse like Wade is. A long term coach needs to be somewhere in between. That's why I like Cowher. He was very disciplined but he also didn't have a problem crying and hugging his boys. His players loved him. But his kind is rare these days.