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ronwx5x
05-27-2010, 10:06 AM
This probably should go in the Donating Members Forum, but I don't have my access yet. If it needs to be moved or deleted, so be it. This is not my opinion but quotes from an official document.

With the discussion going on about the Texas Board of Education revising what would be included in textbooks, I thought it appropriate to show a few examples of what is included in the Texas Declaration of Causes of Secession at the beginning of the Civil War which is now to be taught to our children. At least the framers were honest. For those who think it is all about States' Rights:

"Texas abandoned her separate national existence and consented to become one of the Confederated Union to promote her welfare, insure domestic tranquility and secure more substantially the blessings of peace and liberty to her people. She was received into the confederacy with her own constitution, under the guarantee of the federal constitution and the compact of annexation, that she should enjoy these blessings. She was received as a commonwealth holding, maintaining and protecting the institution known as negro slavery-- the servitude of the African to the white race within her limits-- a relation that had existed from the first settlement of her wilderness by the white race, and which her people intended should exist in all future time. Her institutions and geographical position established the strongest ties between her and other slave-holding States of the confederacy. Those ties have been strengthened by association. But what has been the course of the government of the United States, and of the people and authorities of the non-slave-holding States, since our connection with them?

The controlling majority of the Federal Government, under various pretences and disguises, has so administered the same as to exclude the citizens of the Southern States, unless under odious and unconstitutional restrictions, from all the immense territory owned in common by all the States on the Pacific Ocean, for the avowed purpose of acquiring sufficient power in the common government to use it as a means of destroying the institutions of Texas and her sister slaveholding States. "

The States of Maine, Vermont, New Hampshire, Connecticut, Rhode Island, Massachusetts, New York, Pennsylvania, Ohio, Wisconsin, Michigan and Iowa, by solemn legislative enactments, have deliberately, directly or indirectly violated the 3rd clause of the 2nd section of the 4th article [the fugitive slave clause] of the federal constitution, and laws passed in pursuance thereof; thereby annulling a material provision of the compact, designed by its framers to perpetuate the amity between the members of the confederacy and to secure the rights of the slave-holding States in their domestic institutions-- a provision founded in justice and wisdom, and without the enforcement of which the compact fails to accomplish the object of its creation. Some of those States have imposed high fines and degrading penalties upon any of their citizens or officers who may carry out in good faith that provision of the compact, or the federal laws enacted in accordance therewith.

"In all the non-slave-holding States, in violation of that good faith and comity which should exist between entirely distinct nations, the people have formed themselves into a great sectional party, now strong enough in numbers to control the affairs of each of those States, based upon an unnatural feeling of hostility to these Southern States and their beneficent and patriarchal system of African slavery, proclaiming the debasing doctrine of equality of all men, irrespective of race or color-- a doctrine at war with nature, in opposition to the experience of mankind, and in violation of the plainest revelations of Divine Law. They demand the abolition of negro slavery throughout the confederacy, the recognition of political equality between the white and negro races, and avow their determination to press on their crusade against us, so long as a negro slave remains in these States."

The entire declaration:
http://sunsite.utk.edu/civil-war/reasons.html#Texas

Phil C
05-27-2010, 10:16 AM
The history channel had a documentary of the Civil War which pointed out that the states that joined the Confederacy had the legal right to do so. The North was the aggressor and violated the constitution.

ronwx5x
05-27-2010, 02:00 PM
Originally posted by Phil C
The history channel had a documentary of the Civil War which pointed out that the states that joined the Confederacy had the legal right to do so. The North was the aggressor and violated the constitution. And yet we are now (still?) part of the United States.

turbostud
05-27-2010, 03:12 PM
The Donating Forum has been gone for days. I havent seen it in a long time.

big daddy russ
05-27-2010, 03:19 PM
Originally posted by Phil C
The history channel had a documentary of the Civil War which pointed out that the states that joined the Confederacy had the legal right to do so. The North was the aggressor and violated the constitution.
There's a famous Robert E. Lee quote from when Abe Lincoln was asking him if he'd fight for the Union immediately prior to the Civil War.

Lee said, "I can't, in good conscience, do that to my nation."

He wasn't talking about the Confederacy, he was talking about Virginia.

If you think about the true definition of the word "state" dating back to 1776 (when we named our country), it wasn't a province of a country. It was, and still is, a self-governed territory with boundaries.

When someone talks about the Head of State, they're not talking about Rick Perry, they're talking about Obama.

So when the United States of America was founded, it was founded as a loose central entity that would regulate commerce and provide a common defense for a collection of other nations, much like a free-er version of the Holy Roman Empire.

There are a number of reasons the Civil War was fought, and political history is rarely as simple as "one side was good and the other was evil." Texas is simply teaching another side to history. While slavery was one of the issues leading up to the Civil War (check out the Missouri Compromise and all the deals that Henry Clay made between the North and South), it stems from a larger problem of lack of representation in Congress. Quite simply, the South had 3 million voters to the North's 21 million, so the House of Representatives was largely tilted towards the wishes of an industrialized North rather than the agrarian South. Slavery was simply a smaller consequence of a larger problem. Nowadays, it's seen as the only reason the Civil War was fought.

Interesting topic, one of the ones I enjoy studying most.

ronwx5x
05-27-2010, 03:25 PM
In the Declaration of Causes of Secession for Texas, slavery is the first cause mentioned and is mentioned 22 times in a very short document. This document was an official statement by the government of Texas as to why they elected to secede. This statement alone tells me the primary reason for secession, at least for Texas. If you read the declarations from the other states, slavery is a primary listing of cause in every case.

IrishTex
05-27-2010, 05:31 PM
Originally posted by turbostud
The Donating Forum has been gone for days. I havent seen it in a long time.

Donating Members Forum


It's still there.

turbostud
05-27-2010, 06:20 PM
Originally posted by IrishTex
Donating Members Forum


It's still there.

It doesnt show up on my browser at home or at work. Maybe they gave me the boot.

sinton66
05-27-2010, 09:59 PM
Originally posted by turbostud
It doesnt show up on my browser at home or at work. Maybe they gave me the boot.

Pays to read the announcements.;)

SintonFan
05-27-2010, 10:50 PM
Originally posted by IrishTex
Donating Members Forum


It's still there.

I just dropped the "F" bomb there!:eek: :D

garciap77
05-28-2010, 07:44 PM
Originally posted by SintonFan
I just dropped the "F" bomb there!:eek: :D

:D

LE Dad
05-28-2010, 11:13 PM
Originally posted by SintonFan
I just dropped the "F" bomb there!:eek: :D Join the club:doh:

if you argue with idiot you risk becoming one..:dispntd: :dispntd: