On MLK Day...A Rooney Rule Discussion

[crzyjournalist03]

With today being the observed holiday of Martin Luther King Jr.'s birthday, I thought that it would be appropriate to start a discussion on the NFL's Rooney Rule.

In case you're not readily familiar with the rule, it states that when teams are interviewing head coaching positions, they must interview at least one minority candidate.

In theory, I think that it's a good rule. But I also believe that there are situations like we've seen over the last couple of weeks where teams basically make a mockery of the rule, like the Redskins and Seahawks, who both already knew the guy that they had in mind for the position.

I don't know of anybody on earth who actually believes that Leslie Frazier had a shot at the Seahawks job. Heck, I doubt the Vikings would have granted permission for him to interview until after their season was over if they really thought he had a chance at it.

So here's my proposed alteration to the rule, and I'd like some feedback both ways on it:

If a team only wishes to interview one candidate (as in the cases we saw earlier this month and have seen before), then they do not have to comply with the Rooney rule. However, if a team interviews more than one candidate for the position, then the Rooney rule would apply.

This would ensure that minority candidates are given a fair chance at jobs that they interview for without forcing teams to find a "token" minority candidate to talk to when they already know they're giving the job to someone else.

[Txbroadcaster]

good addition..I dont blame teams that have someone in mind already...Teams today almost HAVE to at least have one person in mind before they make a move because you dont want to not have at least someone in mind before making a move.

[bobcat4life]

I agree. Whats the point if the team already has the one person in mind? If they interview more than one person, then I understand, but what is the point if there is already a person in mind?

[Astrosdawg07]

Honestly I'm not sure the rule does any good. If they are forced to interview black coaches more than likely they still won't get the job. When ones mind is already made up, it pretty hard to change that mindset in an interview.

[TheDOCTORdre]

does the rooney rule apply when their isa head coach in waiting?

[STANG RED]

The spirit of the rule is great, but it has no real effect. And I guarantee every team that fires their HC, already has someone in mind to talk to first, and already has, before even firing the HC to begin with. If one they happen to have in mind happens to be a minority, it just makes it appear the Rooney Rule has had some effect. It's all in the perception folks.
But it does give those minority coaches an opportunity to get their interview skills polished up a bit. And it gives them some good exposure, which may help them somewhere down the road. So in this sense, it's a good rule.

[Emerson1]

Sounds racist to me. I'd be embarrassed if I was black the the only reason I was even interviewed was because of this.

[Astrosdawg07]

Originally posted by Emerson1
Sounds racist to me. I'd be embarrassed if I was black the the only reason I was even interviewed was because of this. :iagree:

[bobcat4life]

Originally posted by Astrosdawg07
:iagree: +1

[kaorder1999]

Racism will never die as long as rules like this are in place....

When Seattle tabbed Carroll to be their new head coach Tony Dungy was super pissed that Seattle made the hire without "properly going through the interview process to satisfy the Rooney rule" and he goes on and on about how execs SHOULD NOT be able to pretty much name their man without throroughly interviewing candidates no matter their race.

Fast forward to this week......

Dungy goes on record saying that if he were to have gotten the Seattle exec job he would definitly of hired the black DC at Minnesota. So.....its ok for him to do it but when other NFL teams do it, they are wrong

[bobcat4life]

Originally posted by kaorder1999
Racism will never die as long as rules like this are in place....

When Seattle tabbed Carroll to be their new head coach Tony Dungy was super pissed that Seattle made the hire without "properly going through the interview process to satisfy the Rooney rule" and he goes on and on about how execs SHOULD NOT be able to pretty much name their man without throroughly interviewing candidates no matter their race.

Fast forward to this week......

Dungy goes on record saying that if he were to have gotten the Seattle exec job he would definitly of hired the black DC at Minnesota. So.....its ok for him to do it but when other NFL teams do it, they are wrong for the most part, black people are the most racist group in this day & age

[Trashman]

Originally posted by STANG RED
The spirit of the rule is great, but it has no real effect. And I guarantee every team that fires their HC, already has someone in mind to talk to first, and already has, before even firing the HC to begin with. If one they happen to have in mind happens to be a minority, it just makes it appear the Rooney Rule has had some effect. It's all in the perception folks.
But it does give those minority coaches an opportunity to get their interview skills polished up a bit. And it gives them some good exposure, which may help them somewhere down the road. So in this sense, it's a good rule.

I agree, totally. Although some will say the rule is racist, and they may have a point, but for now the rule is needed.:thinking:

[PHS Wildcats]

I'm a black guy and I think the Rooney rule is BS! I see the point but it doesn't make sense. Why interview someone when you know you are not interested in that coach at all. If you already have someone you want to hire, then I say hire him and let it be.

[Pendragon13]

The way I see it, teams should hire the guy they think will do the best job within their system regardless of race. If they hire a white coach over a black coach who is much better...their loss and some other teams gain.

[mwynn05]

its kind of a slap in the face to the black guys i would think

[crzyjournalist03]

Something to remember guys...this rule isn't only about "black" coaches.

It applies to all minority coaches.

[STANG RED]

Originally posted by PHS Wildcats
I'm a black guy and I think the Rooney rule is BS! I see the point but it doesn't make sense. Why interview someone when you know you are not interested in that coach at all. If you already have someone you want to hire, then I say hire him and let it be.

But dont you think this at least gives the minority coach an opportunity to get some exposure that he might not get otherwise? Even if he has no real chance of getting the job, if he has an impressive interview, by word of mouth, he'll get another shot somewhere else, or maybe even to the same job at some point in the future.
It would only be a BS rule, if a team were forced to hire a minority coach.

[JasperDog94]

Does the reverse apply? If a team already wanted to hire a minority coach (say Coach Dungy) would they also have to interview white coaches? If the answer is no then the rule is racist in nature. How about we let teams hire the best man for the job? If they choose to overlook quality guys, they will suffer on the field.

[JJWalker]

I would like to see the wording of the actual rule itself.

The word "Minority" really has a broad connotation.

Did the NFL mean "Black" or did it mean "Minority".

Interviewing an old guy could be considered a minority interview in theory.

How about just interviewing a woman for the job?

If I were an owner in the NFL, I would pay a few minority candidates to come in and interview for my head coaching job. A woman, a racial minority, an old person, a sexual minority, and a kid (an actual minor). Then I would hire the person I actually wanted to run my team. However, my bases would be covered.

[crzyjournalist03]

The wikipedia page for it actually has a lot of helpful information and some links on it:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rooney_Rule

[ziggy29]

There are different dynamics at the college level, but in the NFL all that matters to a team is winning. I don't think any team would pass on a minority candidate if they thought the minority candidate would give them the best chance of winning.

I have mixed feelings about the Rooney Rule as with other affirmative action-type plans. It's an improvement over segregation, Jim Crow and legal discrimination, but in reality the real payoff will come when women and minorities can achieve great success and we don't need to call attention to their race or gender.

But the bottom line is it can force teams to interview people they have no intention of considering, and if I were looking for a coaching gig I wouldn't want to be called in to interview for a position I had no chance of landing.

And in reality, I don't think it should apply to "promotions from within."

[STANG RED]

You guys are completely missing the point. The rule just says they have to interview a minority. Other than that, they are free to hire who ever they want. And there are a few exceptions listed. If they give the job to an assistant already part of the team, the rule does not apply.
All you have to do is research it a little bit, to educate yourself on its wording and intent. I suggest some of you do just that.

[JasperDog94]

Originally posted by ziggy29
...the real payoff will come when women and minorities can achieve great success and we don't need to call attention to their race or gender. It is my opinion that this will never happen for several reasons.

One is that minority status is all some people see. They are told that minorities will never have the same advantages as everyone else, when in reality I know many minorities that have it much better than poor whites I know.

Another reason is that some people have made millions (and continue to do so) basing everything they do off of race, age or gender. They have a vested interest in keeping things the way they are, all the while acting as if they want things to change.

The last reason comes down to politics...and since I do not wish to be benched or banned, I won't go there.

[BIG BLUE DEFENSIVE END]

I would also like to take this time to talk not only about the Rooney Rule, but Affirmative Action as well.

When you start disregarding the merits and qualifications for a particular job, whether it be a head coach in the NFL or an office worker, I think that it is wrong. We can never escape the chains of racist thoughts if we have laws that remind us that racism is still here. When I see a person, I don't care what color or sexual orientation they are, I care about a handful of things, among these being integrity and honesty. This isn't just talking about employment, this is talking about interpersonal relationships. I don't judge someone based on the color of their skin, I judge them by their actions. Any person is equally likely to be a drug addict, rapist, thief, murderer, etc., regardless of the color of their skin. In regards to employment, a person's skill set, education, and experience aren't influenced at all by the color of their skin, but instead by what they've done with the opportunities that have been placed in front of them. I think the Rooney Rule and Affirmative Action promote racism against white men if nothing else, because they're the ones who lose opportunities because they're not minorities. I'm not saying that if a minority candidate is more deserving he shouldn't get the job and if it's because of being a minority or a female proper action shouldn't be taken, but to scare businesses into hiring minority candidates who are less qualified, or to force NFL teams to interview candidates who are less desirable or even less qualified...well, that's just ridiculous and counterproductive. I think both practices should be done away with.

[crzyjournalist03]

Well BBDE, if it's any consolation, most studies on census data agree that Caucasians will be a minority within the next twenty years or so. At that point, everybody will be a minority, so it won't make a difference!

[PHS Wildcats]

Originally posted by crzyjournalist03
Well BBDE, if it's any consolation, most studies on census data agree that Caucasians will be a minority within the next twenty years or so. At that point, everybody will be a minority, so it won't make a difference!

true:D

[JJWalker]

Great coaches are a minority group.

[cookiemonster]

What is funny to me is that these same people fighting for equality among coaches would not fight for the same equality among players.