So Did Jerry Jones

[Txbroadcaster]

Make the correct decision in keeping Phillips after the 44-6 debacle?

[Bullaholic]

Originally posted by Txbroadcaster
Make the correct decision in keeping Phillips after the 44-6 debacle?

I never speak definitively without full benefit of 20-20 hindsight, TXB,,,:D But to answer the question seriously---it looks like a "Yes".

[Txbroadcaster]

Originally posted by Bullaholic
I never speak definitively without full benefit of 20-20 hindsight, TXB,,,:D But to answer the question seriously---it looks like a "Yes".

LOL I actually asked because I bet there is a larger % of people that will think no Phillips did nothing it was all the talent and nothing else.

[Bullaholic]

Originally posted by Txbroadcaster
LOL I actually asked because I bet there is a larger % of people that will think no Phillips did nothing it was all the talent and nothing else.

I'm hearing most of the NFL pundits give Wade a lot of the credit for the performance of the defense, and I think that is correct.

Sure wish Wade would hire Chris Rock or somebody like that to speak for him at his press conferences, though. :D If the Cowboys win the Superbowl, I'l bet that Wade's first post-game interview statement would be something like--"Well, we played pretty good. We're a pretty good team. We could do some things better, and we're working on that for next year." :D

I think Wade gets more excited when the Cowboys kick a FG, or the other team misses one, than he does when the Cowboys score a TD. He gets both hands up and sort of hops up about 6" or so with an ear-to-ear grin. For Wade that's pure off-the hook pandemonium. :D

[NateDawg39]

I think his defensive mind is what kept them rolling so I think it was a great idea to keep him

[NateDawg39]

Originally posted by Bullaholic
I'm hearing most of the NFL pundits give Wade a lot of the credit for the performance of the defense, and I think that is correct.

Sure wish Wade would hire Chris Rock or somebody like that to speak for him at his press conferences, though. :D If the Cowboys win the Superbowl, I'l bet that Wade's first post-game interview statement would be something like--"Well, we played pretty good. We're a pretty good team. We could do some things better, and we're working on that for next year." :D I didnt know Wade had an account on here :D

[Farmersfan]

Originally posted by Txbroadcaster
LOL I actually asked because I bet there is a larger % of people that will think no Phillips did nothing it was all the talent and nothing else.




The previous 4 or 5 weeks the Cowboys appear to be playing up to their potential for the first time in most of Wades tenure here. Do you keep him around to see """""IF"""" he can keep it up? I think that is kind of like keeping a cheating spouse around hoping they won't do it again. Wade is who he is! He will not be able to maintain a high level of play out of his players over the long haul. Of course that's just my opinion.

[Farmersfan]

Originally posted by Bullaholic
I'm hearing most of the NFL pundits give Wade a lot of the credit for the performance of the defense, and I think that is correct.
D




Would these be the same "pundits" that you denounced earlier for predicting doom on the Cowboys?????

[GrTigers6]

Originally posted by Farmersfan
The previous 4 or 5 weeks the Cowboys appear to be playing up to their potential for the first time in most of Wades tenure here. Do you keep him around to see """""IF"""" he can keep it up? I think that is kind of like keeping a cheating spouse around hoping they won't do it again. Wade is who he is! He will not be able to maintain a high level of play out of his players over the long haul. Of course that's just my opinion. maybe it just takes him three years to get them to listen:D
Seriously I think it took him three years to get the right people in the right places, and or experience, for his defense to work. examples Brooking, Jenkins, Spencer, Ratliff

[Txbroadcaster]

Originally posted by Farmersfan
The previous 4 or 5 weeks the Cowboys appear to be playing up to their potential for the first time in most of Wades tenure here. Do you keep him around to see """""IF"""" he can keep it up? I think that is kind of like keeping a cheating spouse around hoping they won't do it again. Wade is who he is! He will not be able to maintain a high level of play out of his players over the long haul. Of course that's just my opinion.


and case in point that some people even when giving credit will try to still be negative

u say he has not got them to play to their ability

13-3
9-7 where starting QB misses 3 games they lose 2

11-5

seems to be they are playing well since he got here

[ASUFrisbeeStud]

Originally posted by Txbroadcaster
and case in point that some people even when giving credit will try to still be negative

u say he has not got them to play to their ability

13-3
9-7 where starting QB misses 3 games they lose 2

11-5

seems to be they are playing well since he got here

x2

[waterboy]

Originally posted by Txbroadcaster
and case in point that some people even when giving credit will try to still be negative

u say he has not got them to play to their ability

13-3
9-7 where starting QB misses 3 games they lose 2

11-5

seems to be they are playing well since he got here
X3

[bobcat4life]

wade is a great coach, just a quiet guy. He is well deserving of keeping his job. His defense has become one of the top in the league since he got here

[Gobbla2001]

Originally posted by Txbroadcaster
Make the correct decision in keeping Phillips after the 44-6 debacle?

doesn't appear to be the wrong move...

[Trashman]

I have been very critical of Wade Phillips, but you can not argue with success. He has taken the team further in three years than The Tuna did in five.

[NateDawg39]

Originally posted by Trashman
I have been very critical of Wade Phillips, but you can not argue with success. He has taken the team further in three years than The Tuna did in five. Yea but the Tuna did not have the great Brooking and seasoned Ware...and he just didnt have a good vibe imo :thinking:

[Trashman]

Originally posted by NateDawg39
Yea but the Tuna did not have the great Brooking and seasoned War...and he just didnt have a good vibe imo :thinking:

Are you saying Wade is better judge of tallent and has better vibe? :D

[sinfan75]

I'm just gonna say ever since they beat New Orleans they've been on a tear and playin with alot of confidence on both sides of the ball. But geez they need to cut back on the penalties.

[STANG RED]

Originally posted by Trashman
I have been very critical of Wade Phillips, but you can not argue with success. He has taken the team further in three years than The Tuna did in five.
DITTO!
We haven’t seen the Cowboys play with this kind of intensity since the Jimmy Johnson days. Wade is the head coach, and has taken all the heat for the perceived underperformance since he's been there. So now it's time to give him credit for how well they are playing now. Gotta stop some of those dumb penalties though, is my only grip.

[Farmersfan]

Originally posted by GrTigers6
maybe it just takes him three years to get them to listen:D
Seriously I think it took him three years to get the right people in the right places, and or experience, for his defense to work. examples Brooking, Jenkins, Spencer, Ratliff




The Dallas defense:
#9 this season.
#8 in 2008
#9 in 2007
In fact with only a few exceptions the Cowboys defense has been ranked pretty close to #10 almost every single season for the last 15 seasons.

Wade's defensive line:
42 sacks in 09'
59 sacks in 08'
46 sacks in 07'.

The defense gave up:
316 total yards per game in 09'
294 yards per game in 08'
307 yards per game in 07'.
In almost every single category the defense is the same or worst than it was in 08' and 07'.

[Txbroadcaster]

Originally posted by Farmersfan
The Dallas defense:
#9 this season.
#8 in 2008
#9 in 2007
In fact with only a few exceptions the Cowboys defense has been ranked pretty close to #10 almost every single season for the last 15 seasons.

Wade's defensive line:
42 sacks in 09'
59 sacks in 08'
46 sacks in 07'.

The defense gave up:
316 total yards per game in 09'
294 yards per game in 08'
307 yards per game in 07'.
In almost every single category the defense is the same or worst than it was in 08' and 07'.


Your missing the biggest one Points agianst

This year 15 points a game..last year 22 points a game in 07 20 points a game...Parcells last year in 06 21 points a game

That is the biggest thing this year's D has done limit opponent's scoring chances

[Farmersfan]

The Wade Philips Offense:

09' ranked #2. avg 23ppg and 399 yards.
08' ranked 13. avg 23ppg and 344 yards.
07' ranked #3. avg. 28ppg and 365 yards.

Not a lot of difference in the three years of Wade either. I think the reason for the success that Dallas has had in the last 6 games is the maturity, leadership and play of Romo and Felix Jones getting healthy. The Dallas T.O.P. advantage has been huge recently. The confidence of the entire team goes sky high if the offense can produce.
But the overall stats and rankings show this team hasn't changed a bit in Wades 3 seasons here. And I think the 14 penalties and the stupid, mind numbing actions of some of the players in Saturdays game shows that Wade STILL doesn't have control of this team............

[Txbroadcaster]

Originally posted by Farmersfan
And I think the 14 penalties and the stupid, mind numbing actions of some of the players in Saturdays game shows that Wade STILL doesn't have control of this team............

This is the same team that led or were near the top of the league in penalties when Parcells was here, so you just cant lay it at Phillips feet and say he does not have control of the team, unless your going to say the great Parcells did not have control of the team

strange stat..when Dallas commits 10 or more penalties this year they are 4-1

[Farmersfan]

Originally posted by Txbroadcaster
Your missing the biggest one Points agianst

This year 15 points a game..last year 22 points a game in 07 20 points a game...Parcells last year in 06 21 points a game

That is the biggest thing this year's D has done limit opponent's scoring chances



I agree 100%. The Dallas defense is #2 in the NFL in points allowed.
The point differential between points scored and points allowed is not significant until the recent 5 games or so. That is why Dallas is looking like a favorite to win it all. The offense is producing and the defense has stepped up. But again I ask if the recent 5 games is enough in your mind to keep Wade?

[Txbroadcaster]

This year Dallas offense had 892 yards in penalties...

in 08 952

in 07 815


Now under Parcells

iin 06 939

05 739

04 867

The Dallas D

09 767
08 601
07 785

Under Parcells
06 895
05 1,015
04 879


So under Wade the offensive penalties are about the same..BUT the defense which is what Wade runs the D's penalties are WAY WAY WAY better than PArcell's D as far as penalties..and this is with Wade's 3-4 which is considere more aggressive than what PArcells ran.

[Txbroadcaster]

Originally posted by Farmersfan
I agree 100%. The Dallas defense is #2 in the NFL in points allowed.
The point differential between points scored and points allowed is not significant until the recent 5 games or so. That is why Dallas is looking like a favorite to win it all. The offense is producing and the defense has stepped up. But again I ask if the recent 5 games is enough in your mind to keep Wade?

no his overall record is what should keep him.
2 out of 3 NFC East titles..2 out of 3 11 plus win seasons and his 9-7 season was with the starting QB missing 3 games in which they lost 2 of them.

[Farmersfan]

Originally posted by Txbroadcaster
This is the same team that led or were near the top of the league in penalties when Parcells was here, so you just cant lay it at Phillips feet and say he does not have control of the team, unless your going to say the great Parcells did not have control of the team

strange stat..when Dallas commits 10 or more penalties this year they are 4-1




I don't think Parcels had any better control than Wade does. Perhaps that is JJ's fault. But there is one BIG point that everyone needs to consider here. You can't compare Wade's tenure to Parcel's tenure with this team. Parcels took over a horrible team and build them into a Superbowl caliber team. Wade took over a superbowl caliber team his first season and took 3 years to win his first playoff game.

[Txbroadcaster]

Originally posted by Farmersfan
Wade took over a superbowl caliber team his first season and took 3 years to win his first playoff game.


and here we go with this again..What made them a super Bowl Caliber team when he took over?

04 6-10
05 9-7
06 9-7

Where does that say WOW they are going to the SB?


Did Parcells restart the franchise with better talent..NO DOUBT about it. But this whole they were poised to take off or were SB contenders is plain BS from people who try in anyway to discredit Phillips.

[BullsFan]

Originally posted by Txbroadcaster
strange stat..when Dallas commits 10 or more penalties this year they are 4-1

That's because they make penalties when they are playing aggressively and with intensity. They're a little overeager and excited. It's the same reason the defense tries to lateral a turnover instead of just falling on the ball--they're hungry and they wanted the yardage. Sometimes those things can backfire, as with a lost turnover or a stupid penalty. But I'll take that level of play with the mistakes over apathy and lack of effort any day of the week. And apparently it's working out pretty well so far.

However I don't think that's necessarily true in the playoffs, so I hope their level of discipline starts to match the intensity soon.

[Farmersfan]

Originally posted by Txbroadcaster
no his overall record is what should keep him.
2 out of 3 NFC East titles..2 out of 3 11 plus win seasons and his 9-7 season was with the starting QB missing 3 games in which they lost 2 of them.




All those things you mentioned are very impressive................for a average team. This has been a superbowl caliber team for all three seasons and Wade has lead them to a ONE & DONE and COMPLETELY MISSING THE PLAYOFFS in the first two seasons of the 3 he has been here. If you compare THIS team with the 2000 team then Wade is a genius. But if you compare this team to the other Superbowl caliber teams in the league then Wade is a Moron that needs to be a D-Cordinator somewhere. From a talent standpoint the Dallas Cowboys are in the group with Pittsburg, Indi, New England, Philly, and a few others. Now, how does the last 3 seasons look?????

[Txbroadcaster]

Originally posted by Farmersfan
All those things you mentioned are very impressive................for a average team. This has been a superbowl caliber team for all three seasons and Wade has lead them to a ONE & DONE and COMPLETELY MISSING THE PLAYOFFS in the first two seasons of the 3 he has been here. If you compare THIS team with the 2000 team then Wade is a genius. But if you compare this team to the other Superbowl caliber teams in the league then Wade is a Moron that needs to be a D-Cordinator somewhere. From a talent standpoint the Dallas Cowboys are in the group with Pittsburg, Indi, New England, Philly, and a few others. Now, how does the last 3 seasons look?????

Dallas flat out WAS NOT A SB caliber team until AFTER the 07 13-3 season. Your out of your mind if you think people before the 07 season was saying Dallas is a team poised to make the SB

SI 2007 picks
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/football/nfl/specials/preview/2007/scouting.report/

They had Dallas 9-7
http://www.sportingnews.com/blog/rjguipre/90478
10-6 wild card

http://www.yesnetwork.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20070830&content_id=1430270&oid=35007&vkey=9

picked to finish 2nd in NFC East

[Farmersfan]

Originally posted by Txbroadcaster
and here we go with this again..What made them a super Bowl Caliber team when he took over?

04 6-10
05 9-7
06 9-7

Where does that say WOW they are going to the SB?


Did Parcells restart the franchise with better talent..NO DOUBT about it. But this whole they were poised to take off or were SB contenders is plain BS from people who try in anyway to discredit Phillips.



What was the Cowboys record in the season after Parcels left????????? 13-3 if I remember correctly. They were also FAVORED by many to get to the superbowl going into that season and even starting the playoffs. I think they can realistically be called a SB contender in 07'. Most NFL knowledgable people picked Dallas as one of the top 3 teams to start the 08' season. In fact they were favored to beat Seattle in the playoffs in 06' so could actually be called a contender that season also. So it would not be a stretch to call the Cowboys a SB contender in 06', 07', 08' and 09'. So I ask again what has Wade REALLY done?

[Txbroadcaster]

Originally posted by Farmersfan
What was the Cowboys record in the season after Parcels left????????? 13-3 if I remember correctly. They were also FAVORED by many to get to the superbowl going into that season and even starting the playoffs. I think they can realistically be called a SB contender in 07'. Most NFL knowledgable people picked Dallas as one of the top 3 teams to start the 08' season. In fact they were favored to beat Seattle in the playoffs in 06' so could actually be called a contender that season also. So it would not be a stretch to call the Cowboys a SB contender in 06', 07', 08' and 09'. So I ask again what has Wade REALLY done?

Wow..u really do either hate Phillips or your one of those fans that always thinks their team is better than everyone else so when they dont reach what YOU think is their potentiol you point fingers because YOU think they are so loaded and stacked that obviously NO ONE could beat them

in 08 Dallas lost their starting QB for three games..they lose 2 of those..If they had won ONE of those games they are in the play offs even with all the other crap that happened. Sometimes injuries happen and there is nothing that can be done about that.

in 07..You say they were a SB pick going in, I dont..I think most felt they would challenge for NFC east(because most thought the East was down) but would finish around 9-7 to 10-6

not sure how the being favored agianst Seattle makes them a SB contender..it was a 4th seed vs 5th seed they would have had to play chicago the next week and they were rolling that year in the NFC

[Farmersfan]

Originally posted by Txbroadcaster
Dallas flat out WAS NOT A SB caliber team until AFTER the 07 13-3 season. Your out of your mind if you think people before the 07 season was saying Dallas is a team poised to make the SB

SI 2007 picks
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/football/nfl/specials/preview/2007/scouting.report/

They had Dallas 9-7
http://www.sportingnews.com/blog/rjguipre/90478
10-6 wild card

http://www.yesnetwork.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20070830&content_id=1430270&oid=35007&vkey=9

picked to finish 2nd in NFC East



Regardless of what 3 articles out of the 1000's that were written that year say, the Cowboys still went 13-3 in 07'. I would call that Superbowl caliber. In fact the Gaints won it that year and Dallas beat them twice. I don't understand how this is even a arguement.

[Txbroadcaster]

Originally posted by Farmersfan
Regardless of what 3 articles out of the 1000's that were written that year say, the Cowboys still went 13-3 in 07'. I would call that Superbowl caliber. In fact the Gaints won it that year and Dallas beat them twice. I don't understand how this is even a arguement.

What I said was..Dallas was not considered a SB caliber team until the 13-3..going into that season they were considered a solid team, but not one of the top 5 teams in the NFL..Phillips led them to the 13-3..Phillips is the one who has made the play offs 2 out of 3 years and the one year they did not injuries especially to Romo was just as big a reason as to why.

You dont like Phillips..that is fine..but to try to act like he has taken a team that was a top 3-5 team in the NFL and done nothing with them is wrong IMO..he has taken a team that was a solid team and took them a rung higher..will he take them to the next level? Not sure, but I think he has a great chance to

[BullsFan]

Originally posted by Farmersfan
So I ask again what has Wade REALLY done?

He's taken them to a victory in the playoffs, which is more than anyone else has done in 13 years.

[TheDOCTORdre]

why dont ya'll just PM each other :D

[Farmersfan]

Originally posted by Txbroadcaster
Wow..u really do either hate Phillips or your one of those fans that always thinks their team is better than everyone else so when they dont reach what YOU think is their potentiol you point fingers because YOU think they are so loaded and stacked that obviously NO ONE could beat them

in 08 Dallas lost their starting QB for three games..they lose 2 of those..If they had won ONE of those games they are in the play offs even with all the other crap that happened. Sometimes injuries happen and there is nothing that can be done about that.

in 07..You say they were a SB pick going in, I dont..I think most felt they would challenge for NFC east(because most thought the East was down) but would finish around 9-7 to 10-6

not sure how the being favored agianst Seattle makes them a SB contender..it was a 4th seed vs 5th seed they would have had to play chicago the next week and they were rolling that year in the NFC



Perhaps you should give me more indication of what YOU think a SB caliber team is.
Again just because YOU say they weren't SB caliber doesn't make it so. I think a 13-3 record speaks for itself. Any team that can go 13-3 is a contender. Any team that wins their division is a contender. As you put it, Dallas won their division 2 out of 3 seasons. And in 07' the Superbowl champs came in behind the Cowboys in the division. The "TALENT" didn't just cease to exist in the season between those two. Dallas has been a SB caliber team since the 06' season. Perhaps not the caliber of New England or Pitt but still capable of winning it all.

[Txbroadcaster]

Originally posted by Farmersfan
Perhaps you should give me more indication of what YOU think a SB caliber team is.
Again just because YOU say they weren't SB caliber doesn't make it so. I think a 13-3 record speaks for itself. Any team that can go 13-3 is a contender. Any team that wins their division is a contender. As you put it, Dallas won their division 2 out of 3 seasons. And in 07' the Superbowl champs came in behind the Cowboys in the division. The "TALENT" didn't just cease to exist in the season between those two. Dallas has been a SB caliber team since the 06' season. Perhaps not the caliber of New England or Pitt but still capable of winning it all.

again ur trying to find anyway you can to say Wade has not done well

Dallas was not a friggin SB caliber team in 06..they were 9-7 with a 9-7 and 6-10 the years before

What I have said about the 07 season was GOING INTO THE SEASON Dallas was considered a play off team, not a SB caliber team..not until the season played out and they finished 13-3 were they then considered a SB caliber team.

[Farmersfan]

Originally posted by Txbroadcaster
Wow..u really do either hate Phillips or your one of those fans that always thinks their team is better than everyone else so when they dont reach what YOU think is their potentiol you point fingers because YOU think they are so loaded and stacked that obviously NO ONE could beat them




My biggest fear is a regression by this team. We see now (and have at times in the past) that this team is capable of playing outstanding football. (superbowl quality football). So what excuse(s) do we accept for them not to continue to do so? I am through arguing with you about the talent on this team. The fact that they can dominate some of the consistently good teams in the league at times proves the talent is there. It's the lack of execution and leadership that has caused this team to underacheive for several seasons. You can blame that on whoever or whatever you want but I put it on Wade. (and Romo). I don't blame these two because I "HATE" them. I blame them because in my mind that is where the blame should go! Right or wrong. HATE has nothing to do with it. I dislike Wade Philip's coaching style and I think his history proves his style is very lacking. Only time will tell how lacking it will be in Dallas. So far I give him a D and I have shown you the numbers that explain a failing grade!

[Txbroadcaster]

Originally posted by Farmersfan
My biggest fear is a regression by this team. We see now (and have at times in the past) that this team is capable of playing outstanding football. (superbowl quality football). So what excuse(s) do we accept for them not to continue to do so? I am through arguing with you about the talent on this team. The fact that they can dominate some of the consistently good teams in the league at times proves the talent is there. It's the lack of execution and leadership that has caused this team to underacheive for several seasons. You can blame that on whoever or whatever you want but I put it on Wade. (and Romo). I don't blame these two because I "HATE" them. I blame them because in my mind that is where the blame should go! Right or wrong. HATE has nothing to do with it. I dislike Wade Philip's coaching style and I think his history proves his style is very lacking. Only time will tell how lacking it will be in Dallas. So far I give him a D and I have shown you the numbers that explain a failing grade!

You give a coach who in three seasons has won 33 games a D..and then you say you dont hate him..sorry your either a stupid fan which I dont think you are or you have preconcieved notions about him and you just cannot except he has coached this team better than you thought he would.

The talent level between a play off team and a super bowl caliber team most of the times minuscle. I think Phillips has done an amazing job putting players like Spencer, Carpenter, Jenkins, Sensabaugh, Ratliff in positions to make plays.

I also think bringing in DeCamillias as the SP coach was HUGE and directly led their success the last month of the season because the SP team does a wonderful job of putting teams in bad spots.

Lack of execution hits EVERY team..even ones that win the SB or they would go unbeaten every year. Lack of execution can be problems within or can also be simply match up problems.

And no you have yet to give a stat that shows Phillips has not coached well in Dallas, you have simply shown you cannot accept he has succeded with a style you dont like

[Pick6]

Originally posted by Txbroadcaster
your either a stupid fan

TXB, I'm kinda leaning towards this one out of the two choices that you gave for him.

[Farmersfan]

Originally posted by Txbroadcaster
again ur trying to find anyway you can to say Wade has not done well

Dallas was not a friggin SB caliber team in 06..they were 9-7 with a 9-7 and 6-10 the years before

What I have said about the 07 season was GOING INTO THE SEASON Dallas was considered a play off team, not a SB caliber team..not until the season played out and they finished 13-3 were they then considered a SB caliber team.



Wow! It's one big circle for you isn't it? Look! All I have been trying to say all along is that this team has been very talented since Wade has been here as the coach. You disagreed! Now you claim they WERE a SB caliber team during Wades first season here. Which is it? They either WERE or they WEREN'T. Here's the deal. A SB caliber team isn't always the most talented team but it must have talent or it can't compete but the most talented teams aren't always SB caliber. Talent can be coached down and fail to perform on the field for one reason or the other. The Cowboy teams from 6 years ago were just bad teams that could not compete. The last 3 or 4 seasons they have had the talent to compete but it has failed to materialize at the most important times. I lay that at Wade's feet. You can put it where you want.

I am going to stop talking about the past "Failures" of this team and try to be excited about the next several weeks. But understand that each week's success going further cements my comments about Wade's past performance. Talent is talent! Not getting it to perform previously is a failure of the coach.

[SintonPirateFan]

I've said it before, but Wade Phillips reminds me of the old guy in the mall parking lot who can never remember where he parked his car.


But Lovie Smith looks like the guy that can't remember which mailbox is his....

[Txbroadcaster]

Originally posted by Farmersfan
But understand that each week's success going further cements my comments about Wade's past performance. Talent is talent! Not getting it to perform previously is a failure of the coach.

So your basically saying what I have said..you CANNOT accept Wade and his style has been succesful..your basically saying, hey even if Dallas wins the SB it proves Wade is a bad coach

So Beliechek has been a bad coach the last 3 years?

And I have not gone into a circle about my argument..I never said Dallas had no talent..I said you overvaule the talent they had by claiming they were SB caliber when they had 3 seasons of 6-10,9-7,9-7 before the last 3 years

[Trashman]

I think the biggest difference in this team and teams in years past is the fact that all the rats have been eliminated from the locker room. Tank Johnson, TO and Pacman Jones. Those guys disappeared and all of a sudden the team is playing together and getting along, and yes Brooking helped.:D

[Txbroadcaster]

Originally posted by Trashman
I think the biggest difference in this team and teams in years past is the fact that all the rats have been eliminated from the locker room. Tank Johnson, TO and Pacman Jones. Those guys disappeared and all of a sudden the team is playing together and getting along, and yes Brooking helped.:D

I would also add Greg Ellis..he played for himself and no one else and whined at every chance he could.

[TheDOCTORdre]

you guys forget to mention health, look at how all has stayed healthy this year even when we had an injury that looked like it could do substantial damage to the offensive line, Doug Free came in and did so much more than I ever thought coming in for Columbo. Also as far as defensive performance goes, the secondary has been a week point for Dallas for a long time, and now we have a legit secondary that can shutout recievers and allow the front 7 to rush/blitz ect. That has nothing to do with Wade under-coaching their potential in he past or Wade doing a great job of coaching them now, that is just the dynamic of what happens when you get the right people/talent in the right places as far as secondary perormance goes.

[Farmersfan]

Originally posted by Txbroadcaster
So your basically saying what I have said..you CANNOT accept Wade and his style has been succesful..your basically saying, hey even if Dallas wins the SB it proves Wade is a bad coach

So Beliechek has been a bad coach the last 3 years?

And I have not gone into a circle about my argument..I never said Dallas had no talent..I said you overvaule the talent they had by claiming they were SB caliber when they had 3 seasons of 6-10,9-7,9-7 before the last 3 years



I don't think that's anywhere close to what I said TX! If you can't win a argument with FACTS then it becomes a exercise in futility and only opinions and weak minded people (like Pick 6) will resort to personal attacks. I know you are better than that.
The statement I made was that IF the Cowboys can continue to win this season in the playoffs then it only proves that they underachieved the past two seasons. The level of Talent hasn't changed that much. You said yourself they were a SB caliber team in 07'.
And don't get ridiculous with comments about Beliechek!

Career post season Wins:

Belechek 15-3 .833%
Philips. 1-4. .200%

[Trashman]

Originally posted by Txbroadcaster
I would also add Greg Ellis..he played for himself and no one else and whined at every chance he could.

Good point TXB! I completely forgot about that rat.:D

[Farmersfan]

Originally posted by TheDOCTORdre
you guys forget to mention health, look at how all has stayed healthy this year even when we had an injury that looked like it could do substantial damage to the offensive line, Doug Free came in and did so much more than I ever thought coming in for Columbo. Also as far as defensive performance goes, the secondary has been a week point for Dallas for a long time, and now we have a legit secondary that can shutout recievers and allow the front 7 to rush/blitz ect. That has nothing to do with Wade under-coaching their potential in he past or Wade doing a great job of coaching them now, that is just the dynamic of what happens when you get the right people/talent in the right places as far as secondary perormance goes.



All very good points! But until the last 5 games the defense has been the exact same defense it has been for two years. I posted the numbers earlier. TX mentioned special teams and I think that area has improved a lot this season but the rest of the team has been the same. What made them "Turn it on" about 4 games ago?????

[Farmersfan]

Originally posted by TheDOCTORdre
you guys forget to mention health, look at how all has stayed healthy this year even when we had an injury that looked like it could do substantial damage to the offensive line, Doug Free came in and did so much more than I ever thought coming in for Columbo. Also as far as defensive performance goes, the secondary has been a week point for Dallas for a long time, and now we have a legit secondary that can shutout recievers and allow the front 7 to rush/blitz ect. That has nothing to do with Wade under-coaching their potential in he past or Wade doing a great job of coaching them now, that is just the dynamic of what happens when you get the right people/talent in the right places as far as secondary perormance goes.




And if I remember correctly the 13-3 2007 team also led the NFL in fewest injuries. Health can make a big difference.

[Txbroadcaster]

Originally posted by Farmersfan
I don't think that's anywhere close to what I said TX! If you can't win a argument with FACTS then it becomes a exercise in futility and only opinions and weak minded people (like Pick 6) will resort to personal attacks. I know you are better than that.
The statement I made was that IF the Cowboys can continue to win this season in the playoffs then it only proves that they underachieved the past two seasons. The level of Talent hasn't changed that much. You said yourself they were a SB caliber team in 07'.
And don't get ridiculous with comments about Beliechek!

Career post season Wins:

Belechek 15-3 .833%
Philips. 1-4. .200%

No actually I said that EXPERTS felt AFTER the season had developed and they were on their way to a 13-3 team that they were at that point a SB caliber team

I have said ON THIS SITE I thought Dallas that year played above their talent and had some things break just perfect for them ( Lion, Buffalo wins) to get to 13-3, IMO they were a 10-6 team that won 3 "crazy" games they probably should have lost but strange bounces, plays went their way which allowed them to get the win.

I always believe there are 3-4 of those type games every season..usually even the great teams win 2 out of 4 of those( one of the main reason teams dont go unbeaten and one of the main reason most great teams go 12-4 IMO.

That year Dallas won every one of those( Buffalo and Detroit games come to mind)

I personally NEVER said the 07 team was SB caliber in talent I said the expert start viewing them as that as the season went along

[Pick6]

Originally posted by Farmersfan
If you can't win a argument with FACTS

Funny, FF acting like he uses facts to make a point.

[Farmersfan]

Originally posted by Txbroadcaster
No actually I said that EXPERTS felt AFTER the season had developed and they were on their way to a 13-3 team that they were at that point a SB caliber team

I have said ON THIS SITE I thought Dallas that year played above their talent and had some things break just perfect for them ( Lion, Buffalo wins) to get to 13-3, IMO they were a 10-6 team that won 3 "crazy" games they probably should have lost but strange bounces, plays went their way which allowed them to get the win.

I always believe there are 3-4 of those type games every season..usually even the great teams win 2 out of 4 of those( one of the main reason teams dont go unbeaten and one of the main reason most great teams go 12-4 IMO.

That year Dallas won every one of those( Buffalo and Detroit games come to mind)

I personally NEVER said the 07 team was SB caliber in talent I said the expert start viewing them as that as the season went along



I yield to your superiorness TX!
I'm tired of the same things being said over and over again. Suffice it to say that a good team should be well coached if the Coach is worth his weight in beans.

[Txbroadcaster]

Originally posted by Farmersfan
Suffice it to say that a good team should be well coached if the Coach is worth his weight in beans.


and 33 wins in 3 season IMO shows a good team is being coached by a good staff

[waterboy]

Absolutely! The Cowboys have been MUCH healthier this year, especially on the O-line. They also have more depth this year that can fill in for injured players on that O-line and elsewhere. To say that injuries didn't have a LOT to do with the Cowboys' lack of success last year is idiotic. There's enough parity in this league, at least in the top 10 to 12 teams, that injuries can play a big part in the success of a supposedly Super Bowl caliber team. Honestly, I don't think this team was SB caliber last year because of injuries, lack of depth, internal personality problems that prevented a "team" concept of which lead to lack of leadership. This year is different in that they have actual leadership on the field, play with a "team" concept, and have had a LOT fewer injuries. I don't think you can blame any ONE person on this "team's" success or failure. If you HAVE to have a scapegoat, though, the head coach is usually the one who has to play that role, whether warranted or not. Sometimes even good coaches have less than desirable results.

All I really know for sure is that I ain't playing the blame game, and that I will enjoy watching the Cowboys win or lose. I'm a LOT more relaxed now as a fan than I used to be......:thumbsup:

[Farmersfan]

Originally posted by waterboy
Absolutely! The Cowboys have been MUCH healthier this year, especially on the O-line. They also have more depth this year that can fill in for injured players on that O-line and elsewhere. To say that injuries didn't have a LOT to do with the Cowboys' lack of success last year is idiotic. There's enough parity in this league, at least in the top 10 to 12 teams, that injuries can play a big part in the success of a supposedly Super Bowl caliber team. Honestly, I don't think this team was SB caliber last year because of injuries, lack of depth, internal personality problems that prevented a "team" concept of which lead to lack of leadership. This year is different in that they have actual leadership on the field, play with a "team" concept, and have had a LOT fewer injuries. I don't think you can blame any ONE person on this "team's" success or failure. If you HAVE to have a scapegoat, though, the head coach is usually the one who has to play that role, whether warranted or not. Sometimes even good coaches have less than desirable results.

All I really know for sure is that I ain't playing the blame game, and that I will enjoy watching the Cowboys win or lose. I'm a LOT more relaxed now as a fan than I used to be......:thumbsup:



Injuries are normally something that a coach has very little control over. But a coach does have control over the quality of his backups and all those other things you stated. Personality problems should be dealt with and attitudes should be controlled by the coach. A good coach will enable his on field and locker room leaders to be leaders. To be fair though, Wade might have had his hands tied by the Jonesmiester.

[Farmersfan]

Originally posted by waterboy
All I really know for sure is that I ain't playing the blame game, and that I will enjoy watching the Cowboys win or lose. I'm a LOT more relaxed now as a fan than I used to be......:thumbsup: [/B]



And I truely don't have a problem watching the Cowboys lose if they play well and just get beat. It's when I see undisciplined, sloppy, uninterested play that drives me crazy. Hopefully we won't see anymore of that for a while.....

[Gobbla2001]

Originally posted by Farmersfan
But a coach does have control over the quality of his backups

true, but depends on where you're coaching... I seriously doubt Bum's son has 50%+ of the control over the quality of his backups...

[Txbroadcaster]

Originally posted by Gobbla2001
true, but depends on where you're coaching... I seriously doubt Bum's son has 50%+ of the control over the quality of his backups...

You know that brings up a good point

people trash Jerry Jones as a GM..but then say how talented Dallas is..so does he not get credit for that?

And in today's NFL world..only coaches with GM controls have the ability to mess with roster because of all the salary cap rules and stuff

[waterboy]

I think Wade was a beneficiary of sorts by inheriting a team that had enough talent to be a winner, but I don't think he's had any real control over personnel issues since he's been here. I'm sure he's had "some" input, but personnel issues have been a Jerry Jones controlled part of the team since the exodus of Jimmy Johnson. Sometimes, I think it would be better if JJ would step back and let the coaches decide on personnel issues, but I can't see that happening since he controls the "purse strings". JJ has had more failure than success, in my opinion, on personnel issues that were his decisions and his alone over the years. Otherwise, it probably wouldn't have taken this long between playoff wins.