Greatest College football player EVER!

[lbjacj]

ESPN just said those words talking about Tim Tebow.:confused:
Greatest Ever?
No way!:eek:

[Gobbla2001]

Did they mean most overrated player?

He's still a great, but wayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy overrated...

[Spread It Out]

Top 5 for sure.

[STANG RED]

He's good, but couldnt carry Bo Jackson's jock strap. And theres a few others I can think of as well.

[Booter11]

Vince Young is definitely somewhere in the top 5

[IHStangFan]

Originally posted by STANG RED
He's good, but couldnt carry Bo Jackson's jock strap. And theres a few others I can think of as well. Agreed.

[DDBooger]

Tommy Frazier was better

[sinfan75]

Pretty bold statement considering the company they're puttin him above.

[PhiI C]

If they are in the catagory of greatest football player then they should have some success in the pros barring injury of course. There are a lot of very good college football players who were not good enough for the pros. But the greatest? We will know in a few years after his pro career.

[3afan]

Originally posted by PhiI C
If they are in the catagory of greatest football player then they should have some success in the pros barring injury of course. There are a lot of very good college football players who were not good enough for the pros. But the greatest? We will know in a few years after his pro career.

who cares what he does in the pros - thats irrelevant, all that matters is what he does at UofF

[IHStangFan]

Originally posted by 3afan
who cares what he does in the pros - thats irrelevant, all that matters is what he does at UofF as far as trying to apply the "best COLLEGE football player" title...you are absolutely correct.....but as the above poster was saying, I understand what he was getting at.....that doesn't always mean they will be a success in the pros & isn't that ultimately what it's all about?

Perfect example...I think VY was GREAT in college......as far as I'm concerned....the jury is still out on his pro career.

[gtownpoke]

Barry Sanders was the greatest college player to ever play the game. As great as Reggie Bush was a couple of years (and ESPN was hyping him then too).. Reggie's all purpose yards didn't even beat Barry's rushing yards. Add to that the fact that back when Barry played, they did not count your stats from the bowl game.

[LE Dad]

I don't know who I would put as best EVER but not Tebow. :dispntd:

[bowleghorses]

He is old enough to be a 5 yr. pro...just saying.

[lvbears32]

Archie Griffin...2 heisman trophies. when tebow wins number 2, we can talk

[lvbears32]

and dont forget about Colt McCoy. 44 career wins is most ever. isnt it all about the "W"?

[bigwood33]

Too many people only want to consider offensive players when discussing "greatest ever" status. The other big issue that I have is that we also have a tendency to only focus on players that we can remember. Here is a website that has their top college players. Certainly there can be a debate but I would not argue with what they have very much.

http://www.americasbestonline.net/cfootball100.htm

[carter08]

1. Andre Ware
2. Dave Klinger
3. Kevin Kolb
4. Tim Tebow

[bobcat4life]

Tebow isnt even the greatest Florida Gator of all time...

[IHStangFan]

Originally posted by bobcat4life
Tebow isnt even the greatest Florida Gator of all time... You know ESPN & sports media in general though...they have to have a hero and a story. And once they get it...they latch on and don't give anyone else much love.

Reminds me of the old SNL skits w/ the guys sittin around the table comparing Ditka to a hurricane and to God. LOL.

"God....by a hair" LOL.

[coach]

Originally posted by lvbears32
and dont forget about Colt McCoy. 44 career wins is most ever. isnt it all about the "W"?

yea but then you have to say david greene is the second best of all time....

[coach]

Originally posted by carter08
1. Andre Ware
2. Dave Klinger
3. Kevin Kolb
4. Tim Tebow

yea and here are my top 4....

1. Mark Farris
2. Jamar Toombs
3. Dante Hall
4. Tim Tebow

[Z-RO]

1A. Vince Young
1B. Tommy Frazier

[coach]

the only thing holding vince back is it is real tough to call him the best when he has 0 heismans

[Z-RO]

Originally posted by coach
the only thing holding vince back is it is real tough to call him the best when he has 0 heismans

He was cheated, no way Reggie Bush was the best player that season. Bush's game agaisnt Fresno St won it for him, if you look at Youngs stats for that season you have to consider that he rarely played half of the 3rd qtr in most of those games. He sure did own the team who had 2 heisman winners and was claimed to be the "greatest team ever" ;)

[TheDOCTORdre]

Originally posted by Z-RO
He sure did own the team who had 2 heisman winners and was claimed to be the "greatest team ever" ;)

I kinda hope Tebow wins the Heisman again so we can say the same thing about Colt McCoy after the Horns beat the Gators in the NC

[forum_guy]

if you homers are putting Vince in your top 5, how can Tebow not be?

[Z-RO]

Originally posted by TheDOCTORdre
I kinda hope Tebow wins the Heisman again so we can say the same thing about Colt McCoy after the Horns beat the Gators in the NC

Me to, also have you seen the number of heisman winners in the last 10 years or so that have lost the MNC? Dont like those odds being a Texas fan.

[Z-RO]

Originally posted by forum_guy
if you homers are putting Vince in your top 5, how can Tebow not be?

Because he is over rated...simple answer :)

[coach]

where is the proof that tebow is ovverrated and that vy got cheated out of a heisman...hell you could argue that usc got cheated out of that game considering vy's kneew was down on a touchdown....

[TheDOCTORdre]

The arguement of "greatest" ever will never be cut and dry. There are so many factors you have to determine. What is your definition of greatness? Is it the most accomplished quarterback? The one with the most awards? Most wins? Championships? Stats?

I've always thought of greatness in terms of if I was gonna start a team what quarterback would I want to have start on my team, and then that brought up the point of it all depends on what offense you are gonna run. So there will never be a definitive answer to the question of the greatest.

[coach]

Originally posted by TheDOCTORdre
The arguement of "greatest" ever will never be cut and dry. There are so many factors you have to determine. What is your definition of greatness? Is it the most accomplished quarterback? The one with the most awards? Most wins? Championships? Stats?

I've always thought of greatness in terms of if I was gonna start a team what quarterback would I want to have start on my team, and then that brought up the point of it all depends on what offense you are gonna run. So there will never be a definitive answer to the question of the greatest.

very good post...there is only one sport and one preson that you can claim that he is the greatest ever and thats Michael Jordan

[forum_guy]

Originally posted by coach
very good post...there is only one sport and one preson that you can claim that he is the greatest ever and thats Michael Jordan


Uh oh, this might rile up the Lebron " Nut Riders"..lol

I myself am a Lakers fan and believe when it is all said and done Kobe will end up with as many if not more than championships than MJ and then it will be a toss up of who thinks who is better.

[ivchris]

Earl Campbell.........hands down.

[TheDOCTORdre]

Originally posted by coach
very good post...there is only one sport and one preson that you can claim that he is the greatest ever and thats Michael Jordan

yeah too bad he is a douche bag

[Gobbla2001]

If someone is calling Tebow the greatest college football player ever, then I would say that is overrating him...

He's a robot, yes... he's not the greatest passer ever and not the greatest runner ever...

Good passer? yes... Good runner? yes... Great passer? No... Great runner? No... great leader? Yes, as well as many other a quarterback...

But he is my favorite to watch in big games... the excitment he shows is awesome to me, the passion that just oozes out when I watch the guy... but don't mistake loving watching him play for him being the "greatest" ever...

To me Tebow's career is like the Heisman, the sports media has to emotionalize everything, which is why you hear about that "Heisman Momment" everyone is looking for... So they gave Tebow his "Career Momment", coming out at a press conference and giving that speech about Fla not playing bad again with him as QB or whatever he said...

that "momment" does not make him the greatest college football player ever... though I liked that momment...

[Z-RO]

Originally posted by coach
where is the proof that tebow is ovverrated and that vy got cheated out of a heisman...hell you could argue that usc got cheated out of that game considering vy's kneew was down on a touchdown....

A.Ross had an interception that they never reviewed either! Texas moved the ball on them all night and very could have still scored. If they review that pick that stops one of USC's drives...next excuse please.

[coach]

Originally posted by Z-RO
A.Ross had an interception that they never reviewed either! Texas moved the ball on them all night and very could have still scored. If they review that pick that stops one of USC's drives...next excuse please.

honestly that really didnt help texas...i say they win anyways but i hate when ppl say vy should have won the heisman and then they say tebow is overrated

[Z-RO]

VY should have won the heisman...and Tebow is overrated. yes he is good, but they are not what they (espn) make him out to be...probably has something to do with espn's contract with the SEC.

[big daddy russ]

1. Tommie Frazier, QB Nebraska

Others (in no particular order):
Bo Jackson, RB Auburn
Herschel Walker, RB Georgia
Sammy Baugh, QB TCU
Hugh Green, DE Pitt

-Mid-70's to early-80's were big years for CFB. Also had Joe Montana, Eric Dickerson, Mike Singletary, Dean Steinkuhler (sp?), Ernie Sims, John Elway, Jim McMahon, Steve Young, Doug Flutie, Tony Dorsett, Mike Rozier, Archie Griffin, Earl Campbell, Billy Sims, etc, etc, etc in addition to Jackson, Walker, and Green during that ten-year boon period .

-I'd put Tebow in this discussion and definitely ahead of VY. VY belongs in the Barry Sanders wing of "greatest ever." Neither did a whole heck of a lot the rest of their college careers, but had one abnormally-amazing season that catapults them into the conversation.

-Red Grange is up there, but IMO his legacy is as much from saving the NFL as his college exploits. From what I've read, it seems like Ernie Nevers was a "greater" early-era player than Grange. Nevers and Jim Thorpe were the best pre-Heisman players IMO.

-One overlooked player that I'd put in the conversation is Larry Fitzgerald. Better and "greater" college player than the more well-known Heisman-winner Tim Brown in my mind.

-I think we're in the middle of another talent boon and don't realize it. Tebow, Leinart, VY, Fitzgerald, Reggie Bush, Joe Hamilton, Michael Crabtree, Mike Vick, Ron Dayne, Adrian Peterson, A.J. Hawk, Darren McFadden, Troy Smith, LaVar Arrington, Corey Moore, Ken Dorsey, both Roy Williams, LaDanian Tomlinson, and plenty more will all go down as all-time greats.

[Z-RO]

Originally posted by big daddy russ

-I'd put Tebow in this discussion and definitely ahead of VY. VY belongs in the Barry Sanders wing of "greatest ever." Neither did a whole heck of a lot the rest of their college careers, but had one abnormally-amazing season that catapults them into the conversation.


Your right VY did nothing his sophmore year :rolleyes:

[Txbroadcaster]

Originally posted by big daddy russ
1. Tommie Frazier, QB Nebraska




VY belongs in the Barry Sanders wing of "greatest ever." Neither did a whole heck of a lot the rest of their college careers, but had one abnormally-amazing season that catapults them into the conversation.

.

Vince Rushed for more yards and threw for more yards than Tommie Frazier in his career...

Tommie Fraizer Stats
Record as starter: 33-3 (91.7%)
Passing: 250-509 (49.1%), 4,003 yards, 47 TD, 18 INT
Rushing: 386 carries, 2,263 yards (5.9 ypc), 36 TD

Vince Young's
Record as starter 30-2
Passing 444-718 6,040 44 TDs 28 Ints
Rushing 457 3,127 (6.8 yds) 37 TDs


Fraizer was 33-3 as a starter...Vince was 30-2 as a starter

Friazer was 2-1 in Big Bowl games( one of the was the blood clot year and he did not play the whole game)

Young was 2-0 in BCS Bowl Games


So if you claim Young had just ONE good season..Then what did Fraizer have? Their stats are almost identical

[PHOP]

Archie Griffin Ohio State from 1972-75 and was voted All-America three times.
Griffin is the only player to start in four Rose Bowls, the only player to win the Heisman Trophy twice.He rushed for 1428 yards as a sophomore, 1620 as a junior, 1357 as a senior. The Sporting News named him the 1975 "Man of the Year." He set an NCAA rushing record of 31 consecutive 100-yard games rushing.

Full disclosure I copied the stats from the web - His only negative was that he stunk as a pro!!

VY had a good couple of years whereas Archie had at least 3 - can argue all 4 years. Much different era than the high powered pass and run offenses of today.

[statewide]

Tebow best ever is insane, media is such a joke nowadays.

[trojandad]

Originally posted by Txbroadcaster
Vince Rushed for more yards and threw for more yards than Tommie Frazier in his career...

Tommie Fraizer Stats
Record as starter: 33-3 (91.7%)
Passing: 250-509 (49.1%), 4,003 yards, 47 TD, 18 INT
Rushing: 386 carries, 2,263 yards (5.9 ypc), 36 TD

Vince Young's
Record as starter 30-2
Passing 444-718 6,040 44 TDs 28 Ints
Rushing 457 3,127 (6.8 yds) 37 TDs


Fraizer was 33-3 as a starter...Vince was 30-2 as a starter

Friazer was 2-1 in Big Bowl games( one of the was the blood clot year and he did not play the whole game)

Young was 2-0 in BCS Bowl Games


So if you claim Young had just ONE good season..Then what did Fraizer have? Their stats are almost identical

frazier wasn't even the best player his school had........

[pancho villa]

The broadcasters make me not like Tim Tebow

[BwdLions]

I will not go as far as saying Vince Young was the best college player ever. I don't think anyone can answer that. Once reason is there's no way to fairly compare players from different eras. However, I will say that as far as having one of the greatest seasons ever, Vince Young is right up there for the 2005 season.

[NastySlot]

VY best ever IDK?....but one of the best in my life time....and one of the best i saw.

[DDBooger]

Originally posted by NastySlot
VY best ever IDK?....but one of the best in my life time....and one of the best i saw. I agree, his performances at the Rose Bowl (both) were legendary.

[gtownpoke]

yall are insane if you dont have Barry Sanders at least in your top 5. His single season record still has not been touched... and that was in the late 80's.

[Txbroadcaster]

Originally posted by gtownpoke
yall are insane if you dont have Barry Sanders at least in your top 5. His single season record still has not been touched... and that was in the late 80's.

While his ONE season was truly amazing..I dont know if it qualifies for complete body of work.

[Ex-Tiger2005]

Originally posted by gtownpoke
Barry Sanders was the greatest college player to ever play the game. As great as Reggie Bush was a couple of years (and ESPN was hyping him then too).. Reggie's all purpose yards didn't even beat Barry's rushing yards. Add to that the fact that back when Barry played, they did not count your stats from the bowl game.

I never got to watch his college years but I always hear Barry was the man. It seems every game I listen to they always make a reference towards him! So I cant argue cuz i never saw him play.

[playnhurt]

Walter Payton needs to be on the list.

[Gobbla2001]

Here's the deal with my own opinions on "greatest college football player ever":

It doesn't ALWAYS matter what his career stats were, maybe he didn't play as many years as the other guy with more stats in his category...

If he only had one or two great seasons, during those seasons was he the greatest PLAYER ever?

I mean look at the Texas Tech QB stats, I mean they ALL blow it up... but were they all better players than other QBs in the country with less stats?

[Z-RO]

Originally posted by playnhurt
Walter Payton needs to be on the list.

A stud in the NFL for sure, but what did he do in college?

[TheDOCTORdre]

Originally posted by Z-RO
A stud in the NFL for sure, but what did he do in college?

Although Payton had established himself as one of the state’s top running back prospects, he received no invitations from Southeastern Conference colleges and universities, which were accepting only a few black players at the time.[7] He decided to pursue his collegiate career at the historically African-American, Jackson State University, where his older brother Eddie had played football (turning down a scholarship offer from the University of Kansas, where fellow Chicago Bears running back legend Gale Sayers had played).[4][5]

While attending Jackson State, Payton played alongside many future professional football players, including Jerome Barkum, Robert Brazile, and Jackie Slater. As a member of the Jackson State Tigers, Payton rushed for more than 3,500 yards, averaging 6.1 yards per carry. Also, he broke the NCAA’s scoring record by rushing for 65 touchdowns during his college career. In 1973 and 1974, Payton was selected for the All-American Team and was named Black College Player of the Year.[8] Payton graduated in 1975 with a Bachelor's degree in communication

[playnhurt]

Thanks DOC

He didn't win The Heisman Trophy his senior year because they gave it to someone from a higher profile university. Archie Griffin- Ohio State

I don't think Griffin's stats were as impressive as Payton's that year.

[Emerson1]

Originally posted by coach
the only thing holding vince back is it is real tough to call him the best when he has 0 heismans
The heisman has become pretty much irrelevant. TROY SMITH won a heisman...

[Z-RO]

Originally posted by Emerson1
The heisman has become pretty much irrelevant. TROY SMITH won a heisman...

:fnypost: :2thumbsup

[big daddy russ]

Originally posted by Z-RO
Your right VY did nothing his sophmore year :rolleyes:
Let me rephrase that: His sophomore year wasn't the stuff of all-time greats. His junior year was, and the legend started with his Rose Bowl performance the year before.

One of the top players ever? Definitely. Top five? Nope.



Originally posted by Txbroadcaster
Vince Rushed for more yards and threw for more yards than Tommie Frazier in his career...

Tommie Fraizer Stats
Record as starter: 33-3 (91.7%)
Passing: 250-509 (49.1%), 4,003 yards, 47 TD, 18 INT
Rushing: 386 carries, 2,263 yards (5.9 ypc), 36 TD

Vince Young's
Record as starter 30-2
Passing 444-718 6,040 44 TDs 28 Ints
Rushing 457 3,127 (6.8 yds) 37 TDs


Fraizer was 33-3 as a starter...Vince was 30-2 as a starter

Friazer was 2-1 in Big Bowl games( one of the was the blood clot year and he did not play the whole game)

Young was 2-0 in BCS Bowl Games


So if you claim Young had just ONE good season..Then what did Fraizer have? Their stats are almost identical
Ty Detmer had as many yards as both combined, twice as many Davey O'Brien Awards, and one thing that neither won--a Heisman Trophy.


Say what you want about Frazier's 2-1 postseason record, it was never his fault they lost.

Tommie Frazier
1993-Orange Bowl MVP (National Title Game)
1994-Orange Bowl MVP (National Title Game)
1995-Orange Bowl MVP (National Title Game)



Originally posted by trojandad
frazier wasn't even the best player his school had........
Maybe not, but he was the reason Nebraska turned the corner from a team that couldn't win the big game to a dynasty. Tom Osborne's words, not mine.

And I'd buy Lawrence Phillips as a better pure player.



Any team that wins the National Title isn't a one-man show, no matter what the networks say. They're typically loaded up and down the roster, well-coached, and well-led. Whether it's Tebow, Vince, Leinart, Frazier, or VaTech's duo of Mike Vick and Corey Moore, that leadership has to come from somewhere.

And maybe it's just because I'm on the outside looking in of the whole VY debate, but do you remember that feeling that you got when Texas was down, had to go to the two-minute drill, and he got the ball? I'll admit that he scared me in that second Rose Bowl when he was taking his time, but I EXPECTED something big to happen. That game wasn't going to end like that. I got the same feeling during last year's UT/Tech game, when Harrell and Crabtree got the ball back with time. Back in the day, I got that feeling when Tommie Frazier played.

Though he rarely needed it (especially his senior season), you expected something big. Frazier gave us big things for over three years. That's why he's my number one.

[gtownpoke]

I'm gonna throw Jim Thorpe out there too!! 2 Time All-American.

[sinton66]

Originally posted by bigwood33
Too many people only want to consider offensive players when discussing "greatest ever" status. The other big issue that I have is that we also have a tendency to only focus on players that we can remember. Here is a website that has their top college players. Certainly there can be a debate but I would not argue with what they have very much.

http://www.americasbestonline.net/cfootball100.htm

This is someone's opinion. Can't be taken seriously because Bob Lilly isn't on the list.;)

[Gobbla2001]

Originally posted by big daddy russ
Let me rephrase that: His sophomore year wasn't the stuff of all-time greats. His junior year was, and the legend started with his Rose Bowl performance the year before.

One of the top players ever? Definitely. Top five? Nope.



Ty Detmer had as many yards as both combined, twice as many Davey O'Brien Awards, and one thing that neither won--a Heisman Trophy.


Say what you want about Frazier's 2-1 postseason record, it was never his fault they lost.

Tommie Frazier
1993-Orange Bowl MVP (National Title Game)
1994-Orange Bowl MVP (National Title Game)
1995-Orange Bowl MVP (National Title Game)



Maybe not, but he was the reason Nebraska turned the corner from a team that couldn't win the big game to a dynasty. Tom Osborne's words, not mine.

And I'd buy Lawrence Phillips as a better pure player.



Any team that wins the National Title isn't a one-man show, no matter what the networks say. They're typically loaded up and down the roster, well-coached, and well-led. Whether it's Tebow, Vince, Leinart, Frazier, or VaTech's duo of Mike Vick and Corey Moore, that leadership has to come from somewhere.

And maybe it's just because I'm on the outside looking in of the whole VY debate, but do you remember that feeling that you got when Texas was down, had to go to the two-minute drill, and he got the ball? I'll admit that he scared me in that second Rose Bowl when he was taking his time, but I EXPECTED something big to happen. That game wasn't going to end like that. I got the same feeling during last year's UT/Tech game, when Harrell and Crabtree got the ball back with time. Back in the day, I got that feeling when Tommie Frazier played.

Though he rarely needed it (especially his senior season), you expected something big. Frazier gave us big things for over three years. That's why he's my number one.

these stats... do they really say who the greatest college player of all time is, or do they say who racked up the most stats?

The deal is, with me, is that it's not about the career stats, it's about the title of the honor, "greatest player"...

You mentioned Ty Detmer... the guy was a badass... but was he the best passer etc... ever in college football? Maybe, but there is not a "for SURE"... there have been a lot of passers you can argue were equal but only had two years of starting instead of 3 like Detmer (and a ton of snaps his freshman year)...

I'm not arguing for VY or for Bush or anything, I just don't know why people are so sure that Tebow IS the greatest player of all time or even in the top 5 when honestly he hasn't been as impressive on the field as a few we can think of... I think he's been hyped.... and this comes from a guy that truely enjoys watching him play, esspecially in big games...

[BDB]

Originally posted by Booter11
Vince Young is definitely somewhere in the top 5

I am a BIG UT fan, but all I can say about this statement is ..... WOW!!!!! you been drinking?

[Gobbla2001]

Originally posted by BDB
I am a BIG UT fan, but all I can say about this statement is ..... WOW!!!!! you been drinking?

you are correct...

I don't know, after all of the great players to have played, how one can pick a top 5 much less ONE player...

there are just too many different variables that need to be examined in order to determine the answer to "who is the greatest college football player of all time"...

none of us may have the right answer...

gunna have to start actin' right so I can ask God one of these days...


it sure aint Chris Simms

[eagleqb_14]

i think tebow is a very good football player, but i dont think he'll be a great pick for the NFL he likes to run to much and the NFL defenses Can stop that!

[bandera7]

I think that list is invalid because Tebow isnt even in the top 100...I know its just somebodys opinion but, come on?

I think Tebow could be argued as the top player of all time. VY also has an argument. The fact that you can even say their names in that conversation is a testament to them both.

[forum_guy]

Originally posted by eagleqb_14
i think tebow is a very good football player, but i dont think he'll be a great pick for the NFL he likes to run to much and the NFL defenses Can stop that!

but tebow has done one thing in college vince didn't do and that is mature as a POCKET PASSING qb which I think could translate to the NFL.

[Txbroadcaster]

Originally posted by forum_guy
but tebow has done one thing in college vince didn't do and that is mature as a POCKET PASSING qb which I think could translate to the NFL.

Young matured a ton from his first year to his last year as QB in the pocket..If you dont think so look at what his QB rating was his final year. It is not like they rolled him out every play with a run/pass option. He did a ton of his passing damage in the pocket

[LionKing]

Former OU coach Barry Switzer has stated many times and still says that Earl Campbell was the best High school and College football player he ever seen, and he coached with and against some of the best to ever play college football.

[mustang04]

Everybody is still worrying about heismans, championships, and stats.....does nobody appreciate the foundation of the sport, or of ANY sport, which is just pure athleticism? when i watch sports, i kind of watch it with the mentality that I am observing some of the best specimens of humans in the athletic sense....I know it shouldnt be the only thing to make a player great, but it can play a big part if the player had a decent to outstanding career because sometimes the stats are result of how well the team did as a whole to allow the individual to perform so well

vince young was a good passer, but no, there are those think just because someone has bad form, it makes them a bad passer altogether, even if the qb throws extremely high percentages of completions, PLUS, VY obviously was dangerous with his legs....but I think what makes him one of the greatest players ever is pretty much his performance in the Rose Bowl against USC....for a player to fight critics for most of his college career, step up on the big stage, and perform like he did against a team that had 2 heisman winners and supposedly the best team ever, says alot! and dont forget...its not like alot of other players' good games who may have 140 yds. rushing or 250+ yds. passing and a touchdown o two...no, he threw 267 yds at a 75% completion rate, rushed for 200 more yards with 3 rushing td's, all of this in probably the biggest national championship game ever....I'm sorry but to do that without choking under the pressure is amazing

bash it if yall want, but that's my 2 cents

[bobcat4life]

Originally posted by gtownpoke
I'm gonna throw Jim Thorpe out there too!! 2 Time All-American.
He single handedly beat Harvard in 1911, and Harvard hadn't lost in the 3 years before that. They were simply dominant in that era.

[gtownpoke]

ya I posted that before I read that link too! That guy did it all.

[forum_guy]

Originally posted by mustang04
Everybody is still worrying about heismans, championships, and stats.....does nobody appreciate the foundation of the sport, or of ANY sport, which is just pure athleticism? when i watch sports, i kind of watch it with the mentality that I am observing some of the best specimens of humans in the athletic sense....I know it shouldnt be the only thing to make a player great, but it can play a big part if the player had a decent to outstanding career because sometimes the stats are result of how well the team did as a whole to allow the individual to perform so well

vince young was a good passer, but no, there are those think just because someone has bad form, it makes them a bad passer altogether, even if the qb throws extremely high percentages of completions, PLUS, VY obviously was dangerous with his legs....but I think what makes him one of the greatest players ever is pretty much his performance in the Rose Bowl against USC....for a player to fight critics for most of his college career, step up on the big stage, and perform like he did against a team that had 2 heisman winners and supposedly the best team ever, says alot! and dont forget...its not like alot of other players' good games who may have 140 yds. rushing or 250+ yds. passing and a touchdown o two...no, he threw 267 yds at a 75% completion rate, rushed for 200 more yards with 3 rushing td's, all of this in probably the biggest national championship game ever....I'm sorry but to do that without choking under the pressure is amazing

bash it if yall want, but that's my 2 cents


lol, aren't you the one who already thinks Lebron is the best NBA player ever?

[mustang04]

Originally posted by forum_guy
lol, aren't you the one who already thinks Lebron is the best NBA player ever?

well i think when its all said and done he will be, but like i said, i dont think championships should be the standard used which pretty much what everybody uses who loves jordan....I liked jordan a helluva lot growing up, but in all honesty, if lebron was inserted into the same bulls teams jordan won with, he would win as well.....jordan has the upper-hand on the jumper, and thats about it....he was amazing on defense, but it depends on what aspect of defense you are talking about...sorry but if i was an nba player i'd rather try to drive on jordan than lebron, but at the same time, jordan was a little better at defending around the perimeter, Lebron is one of the best passers EVER, if you disagree then you obviously don't watch many of his games....physically, lebron is way more of a freak...he can be inserted anywhere on the court because he has speed, instincts, SIZE, ups and strength......Yes, jordan was the best thing to happen to basketball, but that doesnt quite mean he was stay the best forever, he was a pioneer

they are two different types of players

[big daddy russ]

Originally posted by Gobbla2001
these stats... do they really say who the greatest college player of all time is, or do they say who racked up the most stats?

The deal is, with me, is that it's not about the career stats, it's about the title of the honor, "greatest player"...

You mentioned Ty Detmer... the guy was a badass... but was he the best passer etc... ever in college football? Maybe, but there is not a "for SURE"... there have been a lot of passers you can argue were equal but only had two years of starting instead of 3 like Detmer (and a ton of snaps his freshman year)...

I'm not arguing for VY or for Bush or anything, I just don't know why people are so sure that Tebow IS the greatest player of all time or even in the top 5 when honestly he hasn't been as impressive on the field as a few we can think of... I think he's been hyped.... and this comes from a guy that truely enjoys watching him play, esspecially in big games...
That's the whole point. Tommie Frazier's my number one even though he was nowhere near the passer that either Detmer or VY was.

[TheDOCTORdre]

Originally posted by mustang04
Yes, jordan was the best thing to happen to basketball, but that doesnt quite mean he was stay the best forever, he was a pioneer


sorry gotta disagree, Bird and Johnson came into the league when it was on a rapid decline and changed the game, without them the league as Jordan knew it when he entered wouldnt have been what it was. Bird and Johnson saved the NBA

[TheDOCTORdre]

Originally posted by big daddy russ
That's the whole point. Tommie Frazier's my number one even though he was nowhere near the passer that either Detmer or VY was.

I take it that you would run the option if you had to start a team and implement an offense then. Thats why its so hard to compare greatest players because so many factors to consider

[mustang04]

Originally posted by TheDOCTORdre
sorry gotta disagree, Bird and Johnson came into the league when it was on a rapid decline and changed the game, without them the league as Jordan knew it when he entered wouldnt have been what it was. Bird and Johnson saved the NBA they might have saved it...but i think jordan would have if they didnt...the nba wouldnt have disappeared if there was no bird or Magic J, look at the NHL, it has managed to stick around haha

[big daddy russ]

Originally posted by TheDOCTORdre
I take it that you would run the option if you had to start a team and implement an offense then. Thats why its so hard to compare greatest players because so many factors to consider
The greatest ever only takes into account what they actually did, not what they might've done on another team. Tommie Frazier started four championship games, was MVP of the game his sophomore through senior years, and was never out of a game.

And I wouldn't run the option. I'll be the first to admit that I'd run the spread. But in that offense on that team, Frazier was king. It's not just his athletic gifts (and there were tons), it was his mental makeup, the way he would answer momentum-changing drives, how he directed the offense, how he got the most out of his considerable abilities, etc, etc.

[TheDOCTORdre]

Originally posted by mustang04
they might have saved it...but i think jordan would have if they didnt...the nba wouldnt have disappeared if there was no bird or Magic J, look at the NHL, it has managed to stick around haha

shut up reggie you are obviously a boy just out of high school who is just jealous of Bird and Johnson, and wishes you could have played like them. You want them to be just like everybody else so you can sleep in your dorm at night and not wonder what you didn't do in HS so that your team could win it all.



:D :D :D

[mustang04]

Originally posted by TheDOCTORdre
shut up reggie you are obviously a boy just out of high school who is just jealous of Bird and Johnson, and wishes you could have played like them. You want them to be just like everybody else so you can sleep in your dorm at night and not wonder what you didn't do in HS so that your team could win it all.



:D :D :D

hahahaha no kidding:D

deja vu i swear

[Txbroadcaster]

Originally posted by big daddy russ
But in that offense on that team, Frazier was king. It's not just his athletic gifts (and there were tons), it was his mental makeup, the way he would answer momentum-changing drives, how he directed the offense, how he got the most out of his considerable abilities, etc, etc.


I agree with you 100%..I just think the exact same thing can be said for what Young did for Texas

Dont forget before he was the starting QB, Texas was labeled a team that could not win the big game and chokers( Kinda like what Neb was labeled before Tommie became starter)

[big daddy russ]

Originally posted by Txbroadcaster
I agree with you 100%..I just think the exact same thing can be said for what Young did for Texas

Dont forget before he was the starting QB, Texas was labeled a team that could not win the big game and chokers( Kinda like what Neb was labeled before Tommie became starter)
Exactly. I'd put VY easily in the top 15 of all-time, probably top ten, and possibly top seven. It's not that I'm discounting Vince's accomplishments in this argument, it's just that Frazier played like an all-time great for three years while Vince did it for a little over a year. The same reason I'll put Tebow ahead of Vince if he can come through with another title this year.

[trojandad]

Originally posted by gtownpoke
I'm gonna throw Jim Thorpe out there too!! 2 Time All-American.

wouldn't you love seeing thorpe suit up today? i know there's a good chance he'd be too slow and smaller than most, but he wasn't the fastest or strongest back then either....one thing about it, if he couldn't run through or around you, he would drop kick you from 50 yards out.....

he obviously had the mind set that he could get it done irregardless of his teammates, he had very few of them to begin with......

[Txbroadcaster]

Originally posted by big daddy russ
Exactly. I'd put VY easily in the top 15 of all-time, probably top ten, and possibly top seven. It's not that I'm discounting Vince's accomplishments in this argument, it's just that Frazier played like an all-time great for three years while Vince did it for a little over a year. The same reason I'll put Tebow ahead of Vince if he can come through with another title this year.


I still think Young did it for longer than as you say a little over a year. His Soph year he rushed for a thousand and threw for a thousand. His Freshman year he was two yards from rushing for a thousand and he threw for over a thousand. Then yes his jr year he exploded in his passing yards and still rushed for 1,000

[bobcat4life]

Originally posted by trojandad
wouldn't you love seeing thorpe suit up today? i know there's a good chance he'd be too slow and smaller than most, but he wasn't the fastest or strongest back then either....one thing about it, if he couldn't run through or around you, he would drop kick you from 50 yards out.....

he obviously had the mind set that he could get it done irregardless of his teammates, he had very few of them to begin with......
Being 6'1 190, He was bigger than all the other backs then. And being an Olympic Medalist proves he was very fast and athletic. He once high jumped 7'11 in jeans.

[Highschoolfan78]

Give me some Floutie Flakes... I'm going with the Hail Mary! That play alone earns him the title of the best in college football haha.

[Booter11]

Vince Young is one of the greatest college players to ever play the game... He was 30-2 as a starter and put up huge #s at Texas... When every dual threat qb coming out of high school is compared to being the next Vince Young, it is saying alot about how good he was

[29-3aFAN]

Originally posted by Booter11
Vince Young is definitely somewhere in the top 5
Agreed.

[trojandad]

Originally posted by bobcat4life
Being 6'1 190, He was bigger than all the other backs then. And being an Olympic Medalist proves he was very fast and athletic. He once high jumped 7'11 in jeans.

....and at 50, drop kicked 50 yard field goals at a halftime exhibition......and beat the best teams in the day with a supporting team that in the next year with basically the same players except for thorpe, won one game.....vince, tebow and the rest had great help.....

[Old Tiger]

Originally posted by gtownpoke
Barry Sanders was the greatest college player to ever play the game. As great as Reggie Bush was a couple of years (and ESPN was hyping him then too).. Reggie's all purpose yards didn't even beat Barry's rushing yards. Add to that the fact that back when Barry played, they did not count your stats from the bowl game. Wrong....Jim Thorpe

[gambler1606]

Originally posted by gtownpoke
Barry Sanders was the greatest college player to ever play the game. As great as Reggie Bush was a couple of years (and ESPN was hyping him then too).. Reggie's all purpose yards didn't even beat Barry's rushing yards. Add to that the fact that back when Barry played, they did not count your stats from the bowl game.

Barry Sanders was the greatest college player. His stats are incredible, considering he played behind Thurman Thomas for 2 years. He carried it over into his pro career with over 15,000 yds rushing!!

[ivchris]

Let's not forget Bruce Matthews,

[BleedOrange]

1. Herchel Walker
2. Bo Jackson
3. Barry Sanders
4. John Elway
5. Vince Young

[blowfish]

Archie Griffin

only 2 time Heisman Trophy winner!